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Thanks so much AEK. We still feel her loss. May she rest in peace. Sailing is a wonderful way to enjoy the world and nature. It has been a side focus for me since I was a child. So I understand her love of the sea and being a captain.
Sawston is a facility and building. You appear not to understand how businesses work at a very basic level. The company has contracts and has described the relationship in the financials. Advent is a contractual party, they are a Contract Development and Manufacturing Organization (CDMO). They are under contract to develop and run NWBO’s factory, Sawston. They have also leased a small section to fulfill NWBO’s obligation under the regional development authority’s financing agreement for Sawston, to provide access also to some of the high tech facilities they are developing. Advent will provide those services on behalf of the company but the company is not a CDMO, so selling those services to other companies would be a distraction as it would divert personnel and capital to supporting other companies. That is for Advent.
Project finance structures often break up responsibilities and risks to ensure a product has modular functions and the project can continue when risks become challenges. Modularity also provides business flexibility. But the rights including the right to terminate such contracts, rests with NWBO, because they own these various rights and contracts and Advent owns a contract that is terminable at will by NWBO.
The relationships and nature of complex businesses like this takes a little basic business sophistication, but not a huge amount. NWBO doesn’t make widgets. It makes a highly complex, personalized vaccine for cancer patients. Advent had the personnel and expertise to facilitate that work and it was able to do so at NWBO’s own facility, which is not typical of such entities. Obviously this is due to LP getting their previous CDMO to spin off their London entity to maintain that expertise and keep it inexpensively available. But NWBO doesn’t need to enter the CDMO business. That would defeat the purpose of modular development, which helps to restrict costs and risks to separate entities that can also potentially create cross subsidization as well. We see some of the benefit there from the beneficial financing arrangement with the UK regional development authority. Effectively they required there be a community development angle to financing the facility. Advent has been engaged by NWBO to fulfill that role.
I know she was a well known, a well regarded presence on Wall Street and a licensed money manager. I know no one, who had any credibility, accused her with facts of posting intentional falsehoods or pumping articles when she was alive.
She wrote columns that were published under her name.
You post under pseudonyms, professionally, and throw stones at good people. That’s not an honorable profession
https://www.wsj.com/articles/joan-e-lappin-made-mark-on-wall-street-when-women-were-scarce-11667576481
https://www.heraldtribune.com/story/news/local/sarasota/2022/10/27/joan-lappin-trailblazing-wall-street-analyst-and-self-made-woman/10606530002/
https://www.dignitymemorial.com/obituaries/new-york-ny/joan-lappin-10982573
Joan’s articles were her honest commentary. You can characterize anyone negatively, but like I said, she is long dead and you were here bashing long before Joan even appeared on the scene. Didn’t she die of cancer?
These guys come off as children who try really hard to post with the tone of old crotchety, grumpy men suffering from digestive problems and severe, uncomfortable constipation. Always grumpy, always complaining, but never actually invested.
You didn’t “reference old pumping articles”, you referenced an elderly woman who was a successful investment manager on Wall Street, and made an irrelevant smear about her even though she had passed away. And you’re still doing it. She has been dead for some time now. It was disgusting and dishonorable.
They follow similar patterns with these microcap drug and cell therapy companies.
The stench of such behavior should disgust every reader and forever poison any possibility of reading such a poster again without thinking of their horrid behavior as a person posting here.
Yeah, it’s just a large part of what they do, disrupt the positive narratives, misdirect and suggest “bad things”… non-stop. They never show anything or prove anything. Sometimes they put forth a convincing lie and act like it is true until someone spends the time to dig and debunk the lie. Those work for a while because it can take quite a bit of effort to completely debunk some flat out lies.
They are just constantly trying to change whatever we are discussing that is positive to numerous random, intentionally misleading and confusing topics for newbies. It’s a campaign of constant disruption and misdirection.
You’re funny. A comedian!
Unless they qualify for one of the U.K. programs, u can’t imagine they’d have any other deal, unfortunately, to cover their costs. There is travel insurance but not sure if that would work if they already have been diagnosed. But maybe if they moved permanently to the UK.
I am not a social media company. I don’t do “interviews” and I can see you and PM are the same now.
Joan? Now you’re attacking a dead woman? LearningNothing, must be rough, having to post here without being an investor non-stop for years. You need to make-up narratives and fake points and get more and more outrageous just to get noticed.
Not Advent development, Sawston costs and development. Sawston is a company asset. It will likely go the typical accounting route, but looks like the company is not asking for the full 250,000 up front and is asking for some up front and the selling on a per dose basis to make it more manageable for patients from one of the patient posts. Thus it would likely not look like a lot up front given how there are not many patients likely going this route even in the U.K. it’s quite expensive. But even so, the company appears to have made an effort to make the up front costs less. Once it is licensed for marketing, then, the costs could probably be covered by various potential U.K. programs.
I did not tell anyone to bank on preapproval revenues. The company is commercially licensed and allowed to provide DCVax-L, through that program. Do you deny those facts? You think they made it up? Well, it is easily proven.
We also know that numerous persons diagnosed with Glioblastoma in the UK have posted that they intend to get DCVax-L as soon as they can raise the necessary funds, and we have seen their GoFundMe pages. Do you think those are not real? They come up fairly regularly. I do not believe they are contrived or manufactured to deceive anyone. But let me know if you think those are made up? Please point to the ones and be specific that you think are not real.
I never told you there was anything to see at the current time. I do know there are rules in the U.K. So I could not tell you if those impact in any way their ability to recognize revenues prior to approval. But the relationship between the companies is laid out in the financials, I am not here to educate you. Not my job. Children should not be playing with daddy’s money, until they know a bit more. You know where the financials are.
I’ve actually said before, if they are doing experiments running batches with Flaskworks, they may in fact not be charging some for their DCVax-L, but I did not say anything about revues, at this time. You can go ahead and read the financials for the basics of the relationship. But if you’re trying to claim that Advent is the real company deriving income from sales, well that is false. It’s just a CDMO service provider. Big role, and an important one. But NWBO owns the rights to income and the IP for DCVax-L. That I need to keep explaining this to you bodes poorly for your understanding of basic details of this kind of situation. Poor Man indeed.
I did not say there was great revenue in there at all. Show me where I said that. I said their contractual relationship, payments and fees are discussed in the financials.
If you can’t read the annual and quarterly financials son, there’s not much I can do for you. You might consider going back to school.
You all claim this but it’s again your false narratives about people. You’ve again just outed yourself for multiple ID’s. The name of that board is not even consistent with my ID it’s a general term. You guys are so ridiculous and stupid and intentionally frightened of prosecution.
Were you the one who tried to get them in trouble for specials income? You seem very focused on it. Advent is just a contractor. There are upfront contract fees for running the company’s production lines and for personnel to get the licensing and to maintain Sawston, all of which is in the financial reporting.
They have a straight forward CDMO arrangement except that the CDMO does not have its own facilities, it runs facilities owned by and created on behalf of NWBO.
There is no “social media company that represents NWBO”. Quit it with the false narratives Poor Man. You just outed yourself. I agree with Sky.
Unrelated. When you’re unable to understand complexity and everything is “simple”, I can understand why you get frustrated. Children behave the same way. It does take a bit of mental maturity to realize things don’t operate the way you think. Best regards and hope you can overcome this challenge of yours.
You were saying?
Both agencies (MHRA and FDA) have rules for electronic data formatting and likely also have requirements for multiple formats with portions apparently printed. This is the stuff the company’s printers are dealing with. Even a large application with all of that data, almost 2 million pages is just a matter of delivery. Whether it is terabytes of data or palates of printed additional companies of documents, generally those processes when you tell a firm to go ahead and deliver, assuming they have printed the documents already, are just a matter of transport and transmission. Fast data links are certainly used, so even multiple terabytes can likely be delivered within a relatively short period of time, and physical delivery might require a large delivery truck but I expect they likely used printers in the DC Area and in London. There are likely very specialized printers that work on such applications and have this down to a very careful routine, upon completion of final review and the decision to print and submit the application.
I doubt complete delivery takes longer than a single day, and yes, probably minutes to hours really for the different parts that may need to be delivered. But it’s a basic logistics matter and not really something we can answer from our vantage point. It depends on the circumstances of which we are not fully aware or plugged into. But your assumptions seem reasonable to me.
Your summary says you have very poor reading comprehension. But, that is to be expected given your regular commentary.
Your ridiculous and false exaggerations are well known, and ultimately irrelevant.
This is just a comment by SEC. The Hedge funds are suing the SEC about rules already put in place, thankfully. But let’s hope it is enough. Some of those rules may only impact stocks on major markets and investments of a certain size, which may unfortunately leave microcaps still at the mercy of short hedge funds and short traders, ganging up to manipulate valuations.
Nonetheless, it is likely that even then such rules should help as many companies may not be able to really distinguish microcap trading and may apply the rule to all of their trading. Let’s hope.
“SEC hits back after Hedge Funds sue SEC over new short selling rules: “
Lack of selling, on a friday when news is anticipated, and the stock going up is probably a sign that even shorts are being careful at the moment. I agree it doesn't mean anyone knows there is actual news prematurely, but people know what the PR's said, the timing announced, which was a slight extension on previous timing, and hopefully should be quite accurate. That suggests that an application could be submitted at any time now. So yeah, selling volume could be tight. Low volume can be an indication that there is not a lot of appetite to sell, and if green in that context, that there is probably a bit more buying interest than selling interest.
That indicates reasonable anticipation of news to me. Obviously the news has not hit yet, so the volume buying is likely pending such news. And even with such news, sometimes shorts can push a stock down when it should go up, which even happens on FDA approval frequently. Shorts trying intentionally to frustrate longs is kind of a thing. So I try not to assume too much from price movements because often they don't match reality, because someone is trying to foment a false reality to take advantage of an imperfect market.
But being up almost 5% on fairly reasonable average half-day volume, on a day when no news has hit, it's probably suggestive of anticipation and some FOMO.
I think a weaker NWBO makes that harder. Harder to get the treatment out to more people and more conditions, harder to scale up, harder to reach scale, harder to discount for patients that actually can’t afford it. I’m not saying it has to be exhorbitant, but it is not penicillin either. There is no reason it should be offered below the cost of other treatments when it is so much more complex to manufacture and actually get licensed, and when it does better for patients and literally costs the system far less than other drugs that do less and have more side-effects. It’s like shooting yourself in the foot from day one and then saying hey, we’re going to beat you all. It is not so easily done when you do that and it likely means the company will get bought cheaply and some other company will do what they misguidedly chose not to do. I hope that’s not the case, but I do worry that trying to be cheap, rather than economically consistent with their competitors and the demands of the system of regulation is maybe not the best approach.
I still think they come out at half or less the price of competing drugs that do less ver time.
I’m ran into this challenge when I was a kid. I had a product that lasted 6 times longer than a competitive retail product from larger firms. Small business with some friends. The product not only lasted longer but performed better. But, we did not know that would be the case. We charged half the cost to get started as the original product. Eventually I had to leave for other better things perhaps, and the people I left did not really know how to run it. I sold it for cheap and they did not have the knowledge to understand or run the business.
Had I made the money I think I probably could have at the earlier stages rather than sticking with the initial pricing, like I said, I was just a kid, I probably could have either 1) sold it for many times what I got; or 2) hired better people to run it rather than selling it.
It’s a small example. When you’re already economically pressed, best to stop adding more pressure. Plus I think BP is not likely to want to do great deals if the goal is to give this away at as cheap a price as possible.
There are basic notions about return on capital, and when you have a better product, that is more complicated to make, not underpricing compared to competing products if you want your business to survive. Not saying they are underpricing, but what I am saying is price predictions by shareholders on websites are likely not so great when they assume the company can’t even get licensed when the same folks say it has a better product at a cheaper price already than other licensed products. Those ideas are contradictory. If it’s a better product, that costs less because of how it is administered and lack of side-effects but is complicated to make compared to existing products, why exactly does it need to be even cheaper to qualify for a license? That makes no sense.
This is not an argument against your point. Makes total sense. My point is rather some of the points many have made, suggesting these are the reasons they “can’t get approved”, don’t make any real economic or regulatory sense. The purpose of automation initially should be to accelerate their access to market and earning back capital and getting on a self-sustainable footing that makes them a real drug company. And if they are just going to sell, then getting the best price for the company.
Older patients actually did better on DCVax-L, not worse, than the same patients in the ECA.
According to the JAMA paper, DCVax-L showed improved survival compared to controls across subgroups including older age, significant residual disease, and recurrence. The largest relative improvement was seen in patients aged =65 years (HR 0.63 for DCVax-L vs. controls) and those with significant residual disease after resection (HR 0.65).
Actually, the UK market is not so tiny, given the economics here. Based on some past decisions regarding which patients and types of brain tumors, revenues could be reasonably high enough to reach a pretty decent market cap initially, IMHO. This notion that the UK is so small it doesn’t mean anything is the short team promoting their idea, to extend their time manipulating this stock, that approval in the UK should not affect the price or demand for the stock. That’s BS, IMHO. I have seen some predictions that put the market cap reasonably quite high compared to now, if they get a broad approval especially. We saw with the Hospital Exemption that they got a broad range of brain tumors included in that approval after substantial due diligence by the regulator. It appeared to not even have been expected by the company at the time.
Additionally the MHRA and FDA tend to be very much in sync. Therefore approval in the UK should provide the market with further assurance that approval in the U.S. and other relevant markets has a likelihood of success. That alone also should bump the price substantially.
The problem is, IMHO, Citadel and similar market makers setting the price with their market power in order to smooth relations with their hedge fund customers, greasing the wheels for more trades and revenue from those parties.
As for pricing strategy, going below market is typically not a good strategy for breakthrough products. Honestly, they’d get highest pricing if their results included the poly-iclc results, IMHO. That combination sets a benchmark impossible for current treatments to match, and is way beyond other drugs from large manufacturers commanding much higher rates directly from the regulators/insurers in respective countries. I am a bit of a skeptic that setting the lowest price possible benefits the market, patients and the company in the long-run. There has been way too long a runway here and there is no guarantee they will get a quick pass to agnostic status. I think DCVax-L should command a premium price, and the end result is the company can make it available more to patients without insurance and can then afford to go into markets that do not command the highest prices earlier, and faster. The focus should be on developing the platform and ensuring its economic success; not on achieving some imaginary special lowest pricing. They are already very competitive and even with premium pricing, I expect it still is way more advantageous to get a drug with few side effects to none, can be distributed in a community care context and has the impact that DCVax-L has on the survival time and quality of life for patients.
Gene therapy is far more radical and new. DCVax-L is not a cellular modification, or gene modification. They don’t use IPS cells and or manufactured cell inputs. There were a lot more safety concerns for those other treatments. Not saying it will be as fast as others suggest here, but u also don’t think it is as complex an issue.
All the best to you too Eagle! Yes, sometimes you just have to take a stand.
We have another.
Alter ego of one of our regulars, no doubt.
Not true. For Direct some patients that were affected that they analyzed, there was tumor necrosis, which I believe was substantial. For a number of the Glioblastoma patients of which we know of, for DCVax-L, yes there were initial swelling which appeared to be misidentified as recurrence under the pre-immunotherapy standard for recurrence. But for those patients that went on to living substantially longer that have made their charts public or spoken of their own experiences, we know that their tumors actually ultimately shrank and at least the most famous patient, disappeared. We don’t have scans of those long-lived patients, but u expect something similar will be found, either necrosed tissue or no tumor at all.
Because it is an exaggeration of the law. It is hysteria and the Epoch Times is a delusional paper. The WSJ editorial page is not a reliable source either. The news reporting is not bad, but the editorial page is ideological. So there is an interest in whipping up anxieties about such things.
And Presidents do not pass laws. It is merely a bill proposal regardless of what it says at this time. It is hysteria served on a platter to people thrive on such nonsense. No one is going to take away or steal anyone’s patent rights. We don’t live in a communist country and Joe Biden isn’t a Marxist Leninist. They are manipulating people.
Articles like that are just partisan nonsense intended to stir people into a tizzy about “Marxist Communists”… When you see it is based on an article from The Epoch Times, that is about all you need to know that it is not worth your time. That’s not a real news source for US news.
No, we’re both critiquing the ability of the regulators to keep up with technology and the ability of market makers to basically manage pricing rather than responding to market demand or lack thereof. It does not necessarily prevent companies from ultimately becoming successful, but yes, the market making has been corrupted when there is little basis for setting the price and they can do so on their own, pre commercialization. The issue is especially true and bad with pre-commercialized microcap biotechs. And as a society, we will maybe become most aware of the issue in this segment. Regulators will then, with the substantial and required help of Congress, which is typically the most recalcitrant part of the system, work to address the newer challenges. I expect they will need to start getting software.
Alter ego?