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Raven is not just like "every company" starting somewhere. The last company I can remember (I'm sure there are others that I don't know of) that was advertised in the USA today was Rocket City (RCAU). Posters on the RCAU made the same sorts of arguments you are making. Have a look at how that one has done since.
Some people have a sense of justice and some don't, I guess.
So it doesn't bother you when insiders and promoters get stock at fractions of a penny, pump it up with massive advertising and bogus trading activity and then dump the stock on gullible investors? Oh I get it, you weren't one of those gullible investors and in fact made a profit on the runup. Well then, congrats. As long as you weren't hurt, it's all good.
Sub-$1. All part of the plan, I'm sure. What's your next big pick, Joe?
The stock could go to $5 and it would change nothing. There's no getting around the fact that this is stock promotion first and foremost. You don't advertise in USA Today for any reason other than to dump stock. See you at 10c.
No. A drop through support like this isn't good for trader morale. Where do you think RVNG is headed?
Yeah, sure. Yet another new ihub member who only posts here or on the RSPG board. Btw, that promotion looks to have run its course; the stock has been more than cut in half recently. If RSPG is any guide, maybe RVNG will just flatline for a long while before tanking into oblivion.
Why does someone on EDGX keep crossing the market? Afraid what might happen if market forces were allowed to work?
What does an obscure water company have to do with this gold mining company and why have so many of the bullish posters here also posted on the RSPG board? I'd say the most likely explanation is that both stocks are both promoted by the same promoter. RSPG took a long time but it's beginning to show its true colors. RVNG, with it's negative working capital, should be much, much quicker.
Actually, I did. A detailed response, in fact, but it was deleted. You see, I didn't have anything nice to say about your post and some people here seem to think that if you don't have anything nice to say, you shouldn't say anything.
Back to your post. Truly, Grn, it's a real mess and I mean that in the nicest possible way. You may be a TA wiz but please refrain from using words like valuation. It hurts your credibility (don't just me on this, run some of these ideas of yours by someone in the know and you'll see what I mean) and it's like fingernails on chalkboard to read. And if you insist on paraphrasing Barron's, Dow Theory, etc please provide links. That way we can all decide if you are accurately presenting the information.
Note to Frankie: Please don't delete. He asked for a reply.
Another big dip again. Will they rescue it?
Btw, nice news today. They find a new vein and are already mining it. These guys don't waste any time. Delineation is for wimps!
Yes, a naked short sell will result in a fail-to-deliver. However, there are other causes of fails. Reg SHO focuses on fails, not on naked shorting. Here are some instructive comments by the DTCC on the "naked shorting" controversy.
http://www.dtcc.com/news/press/releases/2006/clarifies.php
While DTCC does not know the reasons for a fail to deliver (this is only known by the broker-dealer and the marketplace), as the SEC has pointed out, "There are many reasons why NSCC members do not or cannot deliver securities to NSCC on the settlement date. Many times the member will experience a problem that is either unanticipated or is out of its control, such as (1) delays in customer delivery of shares to the broker-dealer; (2) an inability to borrow shares in time for settlement; (3) delays in obtaining transfer of title; (4) an inability to obtain transfer of title; and (5) deliberate failure to produce stock at settlement which may result in a broker-dealer not receiving shares it had purchased to fulfill its deliver obligations."
http://www.dtcc.com/news/newsletters/dtcc/2005/mar/naked_short_selling.php
"Frankly, we believe that the allegations are attempting to purposely mislead those who are not familiar with this program. A number of small OTCBB and so-called pink sheet companies have contended that this practice is driving down the price of their shares and driving them out of business.
According to their own 10K and 10Q reports financial auditor's disclosure statements, many of these firms have admitted that factors raise substantial doubt about the company's ability to continue as a going concern. They have had little or no revenue, according to their financial reports, and substantial losses, for periods of seven or eight years. One of these companies has been cited for failing to file financial statements since 2001. Another has been cited by the SEC for press releases that misled investors on expanding business contracts that didn't exist. They will do anything they can do that takes people's attention off that kind of record, especially if they can convince a law firm to take the case on a contingency basis, which is what has happened."
"With all thy getting, get understanding."
--Proverbs
I smell a big short squeeze. otcbb.com shows 1.46 mill shorts in the June report. How much is short now?
A better question is: How much private stock has been dumped since that time? You don't do tv and print ads, faxes, mailers, emails and pumper websites just for the fun of it.
Also, here is one fact that is indisputable. Raven has no money, and that was true before they spent hundreds of thousands to acquire their interest in La Currita. Now they are on the hook for all the expenses of that property. Where is the cash for all this going to come from?
What a bunch of gibberish.
Despite this stock's bargain price, solid vol, pretty consolidation pattern, and not to mention handsome gains
How is it a bargain? Because the stock price is under $2? By that logic, CMKX was an even better bargain at 0.001. And as far as the handsome gains are concerned, unless you know of a way to go back in time and buy RVNG at 70c, what good is that to anyone right now trying to decide what to do with this stock? Pigs, as they say, get slaughtered.
No more searching for the undervalued stock exhibiting huge potential based on technical anylysis
How, exactly, do you evaluate whether a stock is "undervalued" using technical analysis? Oh and by the way, Dow Theory has to do with market averages, not individual stocks.
Instead we should consider only growth stocks that hopefully we'll be able to liquidate in say ten yrs. Besides, I do have too much excitement in my life and I'd prefer to tie up my money for the long-term.
There are many, many ways to trade the markets. Your assertion that we either have to play it your way or tie up our money for ten years is a beautiful example of the either/or fallacy.
* Raven has no cash, virtually no assets, and considerable debt.
* Raven owns a fractional share of a tiny property and a tiny mill.
* Raven's partner purchased the property for a tiny fraction of Raven's current value.
* Raven's partner, Tara, has its own issues.
* Raven issued mountains of dirt cheap stock.
* Raven is involved with a notorious stock promoter who has a long history with the SEC.
* Raven has a money raiser/promoter as CEO.
* Raven's press releases are not up to industry standards and questionable at best.
* Someone has spent a very large amount of money to advertise the stock with mailers, emails, fax blasts, newspaper ads and tv spots.
* It is a FACT that OTC companies that are involved with this type of activity generally perform very poorly.
* Despite all the promotion, the stock has stagnated badly.
* The stock is clearly being manipulated by someone using EDGX. If this is accumulation--as some would like to believe--this is the world's dumbest trader at work.
All the T/A in the world isn't gonna save you.
You're wasting your time as those sample numbers are complete fantasy. As you pointed out in an earlier post, 3 meters OVER WHAT? They haven't done any drilling. They haven't done any trenching. So what the heck is it? Most likely some kind of channel or chip samples and these are completely unreliable and practically meaningless. You look for a a rock or two with visible gold and *bingo*, your sample in grams/ton goes into the stratosphere.
Look at a few press releases from reputable mining companies. No self-respecting company reports the numbers this way. Raven is a complete joke.
Lol, spamming Rayat's latest stock distribution strategy. You sure know how to pick the vaporware.
"They" did? Looks to me like the stock closed red. Also, if you follow the trading closely, I think you will discover that the MM's are basically followers. The stock drifts lower, sometimes dramatically as we saw earlier today, unless the EDGX bidder steps in to prop up the market. They do it eod so that the working crowd will not freak out by the large intraday drop. I don't know why anyone would be encouraged by this kind of trading action.
Raven rescued by another eod jam. Someone on the EDGX ecn has been deliberately crossing the stock to force it higher. The trading in this stock is a complete joke.
Outstanding post here about BRE-X with some very thoughtful comments about Mexico. Tara Gold, Raven's partner at La Currita is mentioned.
http://www.stockhouse.com/bullboards/viewmessage.asp?stat_num=15245515&all=0&t=0&archive....
As an aside, it comes from the Exmin (v.EXM) board. I'm a shareholder and extremely bullish on the company. See, I'm not just a hater.
Grn,
No, it isn't circular. It's simply an observation that may or may not be true. Only a fool would fail to at least acknowledge the suspiciousness of these circumstances.
La Currita has been mined and explored for decades yet somehow as soon as a Raven representative steps on the property they find bonanza grade samples. And just days after a massive multi-media advertising blitz. ROFL. You only find that kind of serendipity in the otc market.
There was no volume all day and the price was sagging. Then someone jammed it eod to give it a positive close for the day. It's clear that despite all the news releases, tv and print advertising, faxes, emails, mailers and who knows what else, this stock is dead dead dead unless they come in to save it. Even the Ameritrade crowd knows this is a dog. SSSsssssss Can you hear it? That's the sound of money seeping out of this balloon filled with nothing but hot air.
Oh really?
1. There is no working mine in Canada (unless you count the promoters working out of Scamcouver)
2. The Mexican mine is hardly the stuff dreams are made of. From Raven's website:
The La Currita mine was in steady production from 1983 until 1998 and is estimated to have produced about 200,000 tons. Available production records from 1993 to 1998 show that 129,000 tons a with an averaged grade of 2.33 g/t Au and 191 g/t Ag (5.27 Aueq) were produced during this period.
A troy ounce is ~31.1 grams. 129,000 tons x 2.33 g/t Au x 1oz/31.1g = 9,664oz Au
129,000 tons x 191g/t x 1oz/31.1g = 792,250oz Ag
So this wonderful gold mine produced 9,664oz of gold and 792,250oz of Silver over a six-year period. (Note that this was 10 years after startup.) That's about 1,600oz of gold per year and 132Koz of Silver. At today's prices that's $2.7mm per year of revenue. That's before costs, profit is much less; the mine was shutdown because it was unprofitable. And Raven only owns 25% of it.
Very unimpressive.
I am rapidly losing respect for all the promoters and pumpers. Is this it?
Sliver,
Who are these "analysts"? Can you give us the name of one of these analysts or even the name of the firm? What other stocks have these analysts recommended?
Well, I can't say I'm impressed with the amount of buying this morning. One day after a NY Times full-page ad AND a massive mailer campaign, the stock has done nothing on very little volume. I'm sure the ECN bids will appear soon and cross the market, though. They're getting desperate.
I got the mailer today as well. I've received hundreds over the years and this one most closely matches the one I got from GHLT last year. Like the GHLT mailer, this one is illegal. There is no contact information for the distributing party; no phone number, mailing address, or even an email address. The mailer directs all inquiries to Raven's investor relations department. There is no disclosure of who paid for the mailer nor how much compensation was received.
BTW, GHLT is down 99.5% in one year and now trades at 5 cents.
Think about it. The big advertising push was today, yet the stock did nothing until this silly end-of-day push. Our little promoter friend jumped in one the bid with those big ECN orders. It's so manipulated, it's a joke.
I'm beginning to think that this is a complete scam--that they won't even bother to complete their deal with Tara Gold. Why does a company with massive funding requirements and no cash spend (through third parties, of course) millions upon millions in stock promotion and advertising to prop up the stock?
Are they planning to run full-page ads in the NY Times, USA Today, LA Times, Chicago Tribune, etc every day? If not, then why all the selling into this massive promotion?
Raven is rotten.
Is this drop all part of the plan?
The SEC's Edgar database.
Learn it, know it, live it.
http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1332052/000101376207000424/form10qsb.htm
Your Company (as of 3/31):
Assets:
72K Cash
Liabilities:
583K
Exploration Expenses since inception:
$30K
Adjusting for the 5-1 and 2-1 stock splits, the company sold 64,200,000 shares for $6,420 ($0.0001 per share) and 10,400,000 for $50,200 ($0.005).
That's 74+ million shares of stock currently worth $120 million and all they got for it was a measily $56,620.
Keep buying. The stock won't completely fall apart until the promoters have been able to dump their shares.
Hey Geo,
You buying hand over fist? If 1.80 was a super-strong buy, surely you must like it at 1.56.
Keep pumping. Your stock is losing momentum.
I really have no idea what your point is. You were the one who made the grandiose comments about the favorable T/A and I responded to that. I really don't care whether you or anyone else reads my posts or not; I have my own reasons. I stand by everything I've posted on this stock. Let's see if any of you are still around to eat crow when it gets hammered.
Nice post, Peter. I would add that all this talk of T/A is really silly. T/A has some merit for real markets, but most otc stocks, especially promotions like this one are anything but real. If you don't know what I'm talking about, you really need to read an SEC complaint against an otc promoter. This isn't some nebulous naked shorting nonsense. It happens all the time. And it ain't rocket science.
Put yourself in the shoes of a promoter. You'd want to dump as much stock at the highest price possible. To do that, you'd try to create as much buzz about the stock as possible and do whatever you could to give investors the impression that your stock is hot and demand. So here's what you do. You flood the world with mailers, spam and fax blasts. You trade the shares back and forth to give the impression of volume. You relentlessly buy the stock and take out all offers. Once market makers see that the game is on, they'll happily cooperate. You run the stock day after day on larger and larger volume to attract the momentum buyers. Soon, every gullible otc investor can't resist being in on the story. When the frenzy is at its peak--when everyone thinks the stock can only go higher--you let out some shares and take some profits. When the weak hands have been flushed out, you start buying again and the dip buyers come in. You take the stock to new highs. Now everyone is feeling emboldened; everyone loves the story and the T/A looks great. Any dip will be bought aggressively. Now it's time to unload. As the stock sells off, bargain hunters come in, only this time they don't know what they're bargaining for. You sell, sell, and sell some more. You made trading profits on the way up and you dumped all that cheap stock you were given. It's time to move on to the next one. Market makers and shorts make money. Nimble momentum traders escape with their profits. And everyone else is left holding the bag.
That's the way it works, folks.
Sorry, Frankie. I think my post was very relevant, though. The big cheerleader here ...
thinks gold is mined by the ton,
thinks having a 300t/d mill (a tiny mill by industry standards) is a big deal,
doesn't seem to know that Raven has only a fraction interest in the property,
keeps making the claim of a 5mm+ short position despite all evidence to the contrary, and
has given factually incorrect information about shorting otc stocks.
If you look at his/her posting history you will note numerous bullish posts on some of the most manipulated, worst-performing otc stocks this year. There's a pattern here somewhere.
You have no idea what you're talking about.
I think you and everyone else is missing the point. You add value by the drill. Raven hasn't done any drilling. All they've done is acquired an option on a property. Nothing, I repeat, NOTHING has happened since that acquisition to indicate that this is a $100mm++ property. It may turn out that way, but it will require time and millions of dollars in drilling to get there.
Here's a lesson in Stock Trading 101: It's not enough to know that a stock is moving; you have to know WHY it's moving.
There are hundreds of gold story stocks out there competing for investor attention. Why is Raven so hot? Why did it trade 12 million in a single day? The answer is simple: promotion. It has nothing to do with gold. It could have been oil sands, chinese solar, russian oil or any number of other themes. I've been trading otc stocks for ten years and have seen too many of these deals to count. This type of promotion ends very badly. The only question is how far it has left to go. You could see 2, maybe even 3, but that would just be a golden opportunity to short more. This stock will be 25c within six months.
So, yes, the fundamentals do matter. Feel free to ignore them at your peril. When they are done with it, when the momentum is gone, you better hope that you're not still in it because it will be VERY difficult to sell. A word to the wise. Put your offer in well below the market price. Market makers in the otc market are not required to honor their bids/offers and will pull the rug on you when everyone is panicking.