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Disagree. Per GE, it had control of 46% of Arcam on WED. THe Morgan 11% buy came the next day so probably was not included in the 46%. Simple math says that GE now controls about 57%, granted some might be revocable but given the weak pps why would they. You decide which is the more valid figure, but I guarantee GE's control of shares is higher than the filings indicate. You decide. Are the filings or flaggings as Twenton prefers a better indicator than GE??? You decide. And on what basis does he assume Morgan buys are not for GE??. We just don't know or does he claim he does???? If I were GE and could buy below the tender, I would be but not in my own name to avoid manipulation. ANd guys like me haven't tendered yet. Was going to, but with the extension I'm delaying. As are the filings, laggard indicators like I've said all along.
Is this on top of the 46% ge already controlled. Since it was bought on Thu and the 46% was announced on wed, probably was. In which case GE now has 57% ish and counting which might seal the deal if GE will be happy with operational control and not necessarily the 75%.
Pure speculation. Given the speed with which GE moved from SLM to concept laser, is it possible ge changed its mind during the tender and prefers concept or was it just a plan B??. What are the differences between the two company's technology and would GE be able to transition to using concept's machines vs slm's?????? Interesting issue and says a lot that it easily moved from SLM and raised the Arcam offer which surprised me.
Its close. A while ago, if I recall Rene correctly, he indicated that Arcam could produce about 30 a quarter which would equate to 120 a year and that its about a 3 month turn around time. THat may have been improved with expansion, not sure. With GE money, it can easily expand. Without GE money, arcam may be at the extent of its resources which is why the board approved the deal. We don't know.
Tender expiration extended to November 10. Haven't seen anyone comment on this. Now lets see how the pps acts, would love to see 33s or 34.
Question for you 3d experts. What is the difference between SLM and concept laser, Is the technology better/worse?. Can you guys see GE switching its laser needs from slm to concept. That would really hurt SLM and Elliot as understand that GE is SLM's biggest customer. If Elliot doesn't tender, it gets stuck with simply holding. Will Elliot tender at 300 despite the fact its basis may be over that level. Will Ge take less than 75% as difference from 46% to 75% still great and GE is competing with the guys who think 50 and 90 is fair????? at THIS time. GE will not be irrational like these guys
Agree, except many might enjoy pissing GE off and won't be selling for a loss, all at a substantial gain just not as good as 34/35.
Charlie why provide all that regulatory noise which doesn't answer the issue Trader raised and I did earlier??.
We all know what ADRs or ADS, as Ge specifies, are and what they represent which is what all the regulatory noise you posted explains.
The issue is whether after GE takes its 40, 50% or more, the Ads will trade effectively or become zombie like because of low float and low interest. None of those regulatory provisions address that question. Just like all that regulatory noise on tenders did not address the question of how many shares did GE have control over and hence towards its ownership goals. That regulatory noise does not reflect that GE now has 46% per them. Less generic regulatory cites and more addressing the question at hand would be appreciated. IMHO
Yes, but that depends on whether the change of ownership was for cash (get money) or stock (get stock in the buying company.) THis one is for just cash and you don't end up with GE stock. Mergers are usually for stock, tenders for cash. Big difference.
On the ownership question, I agree that 100% is best but it won't get thanks to Elliot. I contend that with 50% and operational control it has control over patents, technology direction and specifications. THat is what ge wants, the rest is gravy. Which is why I've said ge will accept 50%. But with the lowered threshold to just 75% i'm not sure. I am also surprised with 46% control in the stock that GE raised its price. But they must really want Arcam. Boy were they right that they had other choices in the laser realm. Heck less than 24 hrs, they got a new laser candidate where Elliot can't interfer. Elliot is nicely stuck. Already deeply under water and if ge decides to end using SLM lasers Elliot and slm are really in trouble. I love it.
As I've said before, GE will take care of itself with operational control. Whether it will also take care of competitor needs depends on whether this buy was solely strategic or also for profit, in which case it will consider competitors as well as its own needs.
Maybe, but not necessarily. The flaggings are already off as usual. GE says it controls 46%. The flaggings or filings as I prefer, don't show that.
What makes you think Morgan Stanley bought all that stock for one person??. May have. May also have been for multiple parties which will not give anyone a flagging requirements. You know what they say about assumptions???? Assumptions on what others are doing such as Morgan, assumptions on ownership percentage and assumptions on what ge will do, etc, etc etc.
They will not become GE shares, where did you get that idea??? GE will either buy you out though the tender, and its price or you will continue to own the Arcam shares and participate in whatever number of shares trade You will not get ge shares regardless.
The basic question is given reducing the ownership level to only 75%, will they accept 50% or is the 75% a solid deal killer.
Hey tam how do you know???. Where is your documentation or support.
All we know is that GE, by name, did not buy any. But all the transactions were from brokers/banks and their client could have been GE or not. We don't know. Yet you conclude???? Conclusions and assumptions can be dangerous.
Cannot agree that Elliot is a factor. In your post its postulated that Elliot will have influence with the Arcam board, that it will interfere with ge's influence over arcam and that ge will pay to have them removed. Went so far as to suggest Elliot could remove Rene.
Yet a salient detail is missed. Why and how could Elliot have major influence over the Arcam board, the operation of Arcam on any material factor when Elliot only owns 10%, GE owns almost 20% and the remainder of stockholders have been solidly behind Rene and the other board members. Elliot is merely an extortionist/obstructionist and has no interest in arcam's operations and has only 10% of the stock. Ge has almost 20%, 40% with tendered shares, It is a major buyer and has a significant interest in operations. Who do you think will have the most influence/control over Arcam and its operations.
Buying back stock at an inflated price after just selling all doesn't make much sense to me. Being under water is never nice, myself i'm above water on all shares, just sorry I didn't get 34/35 on all given the weak pps now.
Elliot, et all, with their circa 10% will have no effect on the Arcam board or ge which has 20% bought, 40% potential tender as of the end of the last period and the other stock holders who have a lot more support for Rene than Elliot.
Does anyone agree with the speculation that arcam should have focused on the speculative injection molding and avoided aerospace and that would have been a better move. Just like speculating on competition and the lack of bulk orders was flawed, the benefit of avoiding aerospace and going into a different market is flawed and speculative. I give Rene credit for having better judgment than someone might have on the outside and just says stuff. After all, the biggest order arcam has gotten has been in the aerospace field and arcam's single biggest customer is in the aerospace area. Meanwhile, arcam's medical contract subsidiary is its worst performer. I'll take arcam's realty, not the mere speculation of an outsider.
I would accept your conclusion a lot easier if I know what the total GE percentage ownership was. If they did not improve on 30%, not surprised, with 40% a little more questionable and at 50% would expect them to execute. Especially true with Arcam which had 40% of the company at the expiration vs SLM's 30%. THey can have a lot of control, and put money, people, technology into arcam with 50% ownership and they will have control of patents, development, technology and all the other aspects you said were important. And at this point don't overestimate the importance of EBM. As far as I know, and if i'm wrong please correct, GE has more laser based parts in development than ebm. But they already have a laser company, Morris and Arcam is the only ebm play in town. So I hope that they will take arcam and with this low pps i'm tendering and may buy back.
5 yeas is too long once large scale production begins, but it hasn't yet which is why ge doesn't need the machines it bought till 2017.
Don't know about that particular wave tech company Will check on it and give my 2 cents. Liked optt till it fell apart. But its a perfect example of talking a lot but never getting the orders or money.
Arcam is a question mark short term and we don't have the evidence as its a Swedish company and vey closed mouth. For example, to meet the demand we expect will it require massive dilution to get the money for expansion. Is it too dependent on GE. Companies dependent on one customer can get hurt. The board knows a lot more than we do and they think this is a good deal. That worries me. And the last two quarters were poor. More worrisome, so far only GE is actually planning on using EBM parts. Many others are testing/experimenting, but not yet planning on putting EBM parts on airplanes. At least I don't know about them. So might be a while and arcam may well be helped by GE's money, clout, technology and people. Arcam keeps saying its biggest limitation is people and GE can supply it with better compensation and name recognized and if it takes the technology to USA language will be helped.
As I've said before, I hedged. Had a lot of shares, sold 2/3 at 34/35 which were new highs, sold some more per limit orders all above tender and now have some remaining shares which I will get killed on short term if the tender does not go though but because I've held long, still above water not like those that speculated by buying into the tender. But won't be 34/35.
We shall see how it plays out. But assuming arcam trades ok after the tender, and it goes down further as I suspect, will be buying more to cash in on arcam's future assuming it trades adequately. when many were saying the pps was going to 10 and below, I bought a lot at ll and hold long term at 15.
Cleos, agree partly, disagree partly.
I agree that GE will be happy with a big percentage of the company, well short of 90%, especially if its 50%, but think it could be happy with 40% and buying more gradually. You are also right that an option is to continue buying the printers but then they might not have a total say in the design and technology. Won't be able to do with the printers as they wish.
Disagree that competitors have any say in the issue. Who cares what they think. If GE gets 50% it will operate arcam as it sees fit. Competitors will have no input. Even at 40% and being arcams greatest customer, GE will have its way I bet. they can wait for a while as not ready for mass production yet as evidenced by the fact they aren't even taking delivery on the OEMs they bought.
I'm a small guy myself and just trying to make a buck. But I've been in it a while and have some experience as well as common sense and an inquiring mind. Have my own share of speculative stocks like Sigma as well as solid blue chips.
Hope you didn't get you graphene interest from Gary whose suggestions are quite questionable and didn't play graphene by buying lemko (sp) mining like he originally advised. On wave, hope you were not in optt which has been on a wild ride but lately, after a reverse split seems to have regained some footing.
But you have to take interviews and articles with a gain of salt. They serve a purpose in getting an interest in a new stock but then you need do your DD. For example, every warning bell should go off on a 19 cent stock, especially as it has gone down after its big announcement to produce powder. why??? And after it attacks APC's technology, which we own, need to discern whether APC is using 2012 technology as the CEO said and hence can be beaten by pyroogensis or the plant expansion by APC is with the new technology which means it will be a big competitor for pyrogensis. Why would APC use old technology. Gota assume it is buying new machines with new tech. And note, the pps has not improved with this interview and announcement still well off its highs.
This is not to say that pyrogensis is a bad company. It is a warning to do more DD and you better be able to evaluate a company or you will eventually loose all. For example, with Sigma, it has bad financials and hasn't done much as its just getting its product to market. But if the product works it will be able to satisfy a niche which no one is doing now, providing the data that the regulators need to certify products. So i'm betting that it will work, especially with the continued interest of Honeywell, GE and others. But if it doesn't provide value, the company is dead. That is the speculation but only have put little of my total into it and if I win, I win big. If I loose, it has been covered by arcam profits. And if you are going to speculate in a cheap stock, you need to buy enough shares to make it worth while, so if you hit, you hit big to make up for all the losers. Just my 2 cents, hope it helps
I've won and probably lost as well. I won on the 3/5 of my shares that I sold at 34/35 as it will take a while for the pps to get back up there after the deal assuming it does. I've lost on my retained shares as my broker tells me the FX is now 31.94ish so much lower than 34/35 and if the deal doesn't go though will loose more. Look what happened to SLM today. I expect, assuming the stock trades OK, to be able to buy back all shares at a much lower price, again assuming the stock trades acceptably and does not become totally zombie like. That will depend on the total percentage GE takes, if they do. Or if GE doesn't accept, what the market values Arcam at post tender and given q3 ER, I'm pessimistic short term.
Interesting interview, couple of questions.
1. We all know that titanium powder demand is increasing and the supplies restricted. If this company's powder is so good, and it will start competing in the market next quarter, why is the pps so dismal??. Its down from where it was when the announcement was made. 19 cents down from 30ish. WOW.
2. Are this company's machines much better than the ones APC uses, if so how much, and will they be able to hurt APC because they will be more efficient in the powder business??.
3. Given that APC is expanding, are those new machines still being provided by pyrogensis and do they incorporate the latest technology?? Or will pyrogensis still have better machines as they claim and possibly put APC out of business. I would think that the new factory will have the latest in the new machines but then the implication Pyrogensis implied in the interview that APC is using 2012 technology is invalid. I would hope APC is buying the latest technology and the interview claim that APC uses old technology is invalid.
4. How much will pyrogensis be able to produce to satisfy market demand. More importantly, does that Chinese company, whose 9 non delivered machines are forming the basis for powder production, have recourse and may eventually get those machines, thus precluding them from being used for powder production.
These questions are impotent because if Pyrogenesis is as good as they claim, and have much better technology than APC, that could hurt APC and hence Arcam.
Is the FX rate now down to 31.90ish for the ADS, down from 33ish??. Wow, I sure made a mistake not selling all at 34/35 and considering buying back after the tender.
Sadly I agree on the glacial pace of EBM adoption, but disagree on Renee not promoting growth. If that was true they would not have committed resources to APC and OEM expansion. Remember when you said there would be NO ge order because of the delay from when Rene first mentioned one. Same with now, it is moving on a glacial pace and will take time. With GE money, people, clout and technology it will happen faster. The company has no control over timing. Heck, ge has not even taken the machines it already ordered a year ago.
I agree with everything you've said about Arcam and as you know been bullish on it for years. BUT, history is replete with those that think something is greater than its real worth and that worth is established by the market. The market valued arcam in the mid 20s and ge offered a 50% premium. That is a fact. I'm also sure that GE reached a consensus with the Board and probably some of the major stock holders re a fair price and that is also probably a fact. Consensus with the board certainly is. Why would GE pay a lot more than the market values the company at, especially when it already added 50%. The lack of competing bids and noise suggests that others view the price as fair as well. I also note that all of the companies you mentioned had enough cash on hand to offer the same price or somewhat more than GE. Do you really think the mere fact that GE has the most cash on hand, and could offer 50 or 90 (because you want it) means it will use that cash to overpay for Arcam??
I'm also disappointed that given all the potential EBM has, and the experimentation being done on EBM, so far the only part being utilized in the aviation field is the blades and most of the aviation parts that are nearing utilization are laser made. Is that not a fact?, Many more laser than EBM parts nearing utilization. That also goes into the valuation equation. If there are additional EBM parts nearing certification or flying please advise as would love to know about them.
So while arcam may have a very positive future, GE is fairly valuing it now, And with its clout, money, people (arcam has said getting qualified people has been difficult), technology, and the ability to utilize the best of both ebm and laser, GE will help them be the best that they can be.
GE got 40% of the shares at the end of the last period and could have taken them and 40% of the company with a pen stoke. We will now see in light of 2 bad quarters in a row, 3q being extremely bad, what percentage of the company GE gets at the end of this period and whether it accepts the shares again with a stoke of the pen. That is why the number of tendered shares is important, but we won't know what ownership percentage they reflect towards GE's goals till the end. I hope its 50%+ as that will allow ge operational control and be beneficial for both companies.
Very true, but they show the trends and at the end of the period, if accepted, ownership is conveyed. But the Revocability is why we don't know how far GE is progressing till the end, filings be damned..
You are partially right. GE must match any increased price on tendered shares. It does not apply to shares directly bought or sold on the market where ownership is conveyed immediately. Must make a distinction between bought and tendered shares, the former are done with no match and the latter must be matched for 6 months. Accuracy is important.
And on accuracy, I said GE had effective ownership of 40% which it could have accepted and changed ownership of arcam shares at the end of the 1st tender period rather than 19%. Obviously, when the shares were not accepted and the period was extended, the matter went back into a state of flux and as I've said all along we won't know where GE is towards its goal till expiration but it will be higher than 19%. Shares tendered show how far GE is progressing towards its ownership goal, not the filings, and as I've said we won't know that till the expiration of the extended period. Please note the difference, which keeps escaping, between immediate ownership (bought shares) and tendered shares which only covey a change if accepted. This is why we don't know about the latter from the filings yet they are important to show trends and how far GE is progressing (not there) towards its ownership goal.
Mr. Twenton, the flaw in your contention is that GE DID BUY 1.9% at least during the tender period and 14% at the start, all at 285 or below and they did keep track of the numbers as they reported them. Is that not correct. GE announced the tender amount and the bought amount so that establishes that they DID buy on the market and it doesn't matter if they were private deals or on the exchange, they were directly bought, again at 285. Now at the end of this expiration we will know how many more shares they bought at market directly and how many tendered. .
Oh and on the zombie trade issue, I have posted my fear of that result not necessarily my prediction Haven't I consistently said tender and see how the stock trades????? That shows its a fear, and we will see, rather than a prediction or certainly. Please be accurate
Very slowly and gradually and pick up what they can both on the exchanges and in private deals. Put the limit orders out there and see what they get. Granted, as the volume diminishes, the ability to pick up on the market diminishes. But some institutions may well want to get out from under Friday's losses though tendering or direct deals. Just my guess but ge is not a fool. THey picked up 1.9% so far. We will know at the end as GE announces their tendered shares and market shares just like they did after the 1st period.
Can afford?? Of course they can. But like most consumers and buyers, IMHO they will buy at the price they consider fair and advantageous, will not succumb to Elliot extortion. We shall see. GE will raise or it won/t. It will accept less than 90% or it won't.. But we won't know unless it gets enough to make it practicable, 40% being the minimum, 50% and operational control much more practicable. In this second period, I will tender given the current pps and lack of new bid.
Me thinks both. GE WANTS all of arcam, 100%, but it knows with Elliot it won't get 90%, hence 100%. It will probably accept 50%, maybe a little lower, to get effective and/or operational control (40 vs 50%) and then work towards some more on the market given that both share types are now under water. Friday was a great day to buy another 2% at market. No one ever said ge was dumb or not a hard ball player. Their job is to get arcam as cheaply as they can. Ours is to determine what is a fair price, and that price is not what we want it to be (600/90) it is what the market considers a fair price and right now its below the tender.
The currency exchange just helps GE and why the focus on dollars???? GE may be buying the company with euros or sek, with some of that money they can't bring home as its GE Sweden that's actually buying the company. THey may be using non dollars to buy the basic shares and us money to buy he ADS. who knows but ge will do what is in their best interests. That's part of the reason I think operational control, with nuisance Elliot, will be acceptable. Elliot can make noise about process, minority rights, but not standards, patents, technology or basic business decisions, etc
Why ledude???. I agree with you long term, but short term, disagree with you.
First, how long do we need to wait till those large orders come since GE hasn't even taken delivery of the ones it has made. Notice Rene punted on that question today.
Second = why does the backlog have to be used up. A lot of that backlog is the GE avio order which won't be delivered till 2017 per them.
Third no vision no guidance, no indication of other big buyers such as RR or PW or Alcoa and the only indication Rene offered is it will be hard to even equal last year, this from a high PE growth stock. No wonder it got killed today.
I'd rathe take the tender, especially with the pps now and then consider buying back in assuming the stock trades well.
I've even considered betting on the tender by buying some of this stock. Heck can get an almost 3 dollar gain assuming the tender is completed.
I love the posters here who say GE should bid 90. LOL
I like the way GE played hardball with Elliot on the SLM deal. Sadly, there is a danger they may do it here as well although here at least they did extend. Elliot must be hurting a lot with a 8% minimum loss there and probably a 4 o 5 point loss here as well given today's action.
I noticed that AEF, but what commentary??. Heck, Rene would not even answer the question regading Ge deliveries. No guidance, no vision, no info except saying it will be hard to even meet last year's results, this with a growth company at a 300+ PE. No wonder it went down. Now i'm optimistic long term, but my vision is make a nice profit now, see how the stock trades and what ge plans and then buy back if justified. Meanwhile, please GE get 50% and complete the tender.
Ridiculous. GE will not offer that price and at this point Arcam is not worth that price as the market has shown. Cooler, it is the market, not you, that determines arcam's price and worth. I sure hope that realty trumps your delusions, minimum of 50% will tender and GE will accept and operate arcam. Geeze, 90???? I will then consider buying back in and riding Arcam which will then have adequate resources, people, and clout to reach its potential
Put simply, the market has said 285 is a fair price as shown by no competing bid and pps weakness.
Trader, I already postulated that. 50% lower, back to pre tender levels.
Don't know about what you read but in the Reuters article I read the GE CfO interviewed said they had alternatives to arcam as well. But given the extension, and higher percentage (not 19%) maybe they want the exclusive EBM a little more but it shows as I've shouted that GE will not give in to Elliot extortion. Right again. With the weak q3, the catalyst to tender is even greater and I sure hope GE continues as I do not want to get stuck with a much lowered pps like the SLM holders who look like they will be stuck with short term as the stock is down 8% on the GE announcement today and one can expect the same here.
My hope at this point is that GE wants arcam enough to be satisfied with operational control and the tender will be completed and we will get our premium, Elliot be damned.
I love it that some posters, given the clear evidence, cannot see Eillot's strategy for what it is. Also amused that some think 100% control will provide a lot more control than operational control will with respect to patents, standards and the other things mentioned. Actually, the higher ownership percentage goes more to process that operation and GE doesn't really care about process, i.e. noise from minority. Will simply assign a middle mgr to deal with Elliot noise like Canon is doing.
But Trader and All, GE will not raise their bid, there will not be any competing deal and you will live or die, at least short term, by this tender.
The key however is getting the 50% and I sure will help with my shares. I'm even considering betting on the tender and buying more shares as the pps has fallen so much today. But still fear a greater fall and zombie trading or a long period for arcam to get back on its feet assuming it has the resouces to meet demand.
what do you guys think about buying shares speculating on the tender completion??
Wow those ER numbers were bad. 10% revenue growth, diminished sales and deliveries and poor Di Santo numbers. Worse than even the analyst numbers Charlie posted. Maybe mgmt Knew something. Just think without the tender, what these numbers would have done to the pps of a stock with over a 300 PE. Bet these numbers spur tendering as why risk a lower pps when you have the tender floor. Can always rebuy, if one wants to with these numbers, since with less than 90% the stock will still trade assuming it doesn't fall into total zombie mode. A conspiracy theorist might think the company wanted bad numbers to spur tendering. But of course that's only a conspiracy theory.
Ace, Same with the filing issue, think you are wrong. The filings did not show how far GE was towards its goal (40% vs 19%) and Elliot has no higher agenda than extorting a premium from GE to get the 100%. Of course GE, like Cannon would like 100%, but they will not succumb to extortion. Ge will accept operational control as that will give it the patents, technology design control, and leadership that you mention. It can achieve same with operational control and its too smart to pay extortion which is all Elliot wants and its their MO like I've said before. And your money losing comment is not valid. They can make a lot of money with their wins like the hedge fund, and that pays for the potential losers and it has not actually lost money yet with Cannon. We will see how it plays out. But that is all that Elliot wants, extort a premium and meanwhile whine about minority rights, and it has done the same with SLM with its 20% and other Swedish companies. Its not hope Ace, its their MO like some hedge funds speculate in junk bonds.
One post on the topic is enough. Like with the filings, you will be right or wrong. On the filings you were wrong. On Elliot, GE will either accept operational control or a percentage below 90% or they will not. They will either pay Elliot's extortion after 6 months, and it will be after 6 months, or they will not. You were proven wrong on the filings, we shall see on Elliot.
Another post on this topic?? If you mean Elliot, of course they have a strategy and have used it multiple times. Buy enough stock to prevent a buyer from getting full control, 100% of a company, and then extort a premium to sell. THat is what they do. That is their strategy, haven't you realized that. Just like many hedge funds buy bonds trying to extort a better payment. Or hedge funds buy into a company, become a nuisance and then get a nuisance buy out. That is what they do. That is their strategy. Ace that is not hope, that is pragmatism. Depending on weakness of buyer, it works sometimes (the hedge fund) and fails sometimes (Canon.)
Your point????????????????//
Another post on the same topic? Same might be true in future if GE gets 50% or more. Arcam is already a low float, low volume, stock, with ge, Elliot and Die hards holding, it will be even less. Danger is with its being part of GE, and not a pure play, the stock may trade poorly. We just don't know is my point. Hopefully we will not keep visiting this issue like we did the filings issue where I was proven right, 19% vs 40%. We will see after all is said and done. I hope your right.
Do you know what the tem zombie trading even means??. At least some do.
It means a stock that trades with a low float, vey little pps change and low volatility . It doesn't matter how many shares are in pvt hands if they don't trade or move the pps up or down. IMHO for the last few days the stock has been in zombie mode with volume much less than avg and pps not moving much. And when GE gets even more, and die hards like you don't sell, volume will be even less. Additionally if GE takes operational control, the results will be diluted into GE as a whole so it won't be as pure of a play as before and as such won't move as the company performs. Heck, if GE takes 50%, there might be no more CCs or ERs as the results will be included with GE as a whole.
I sure was proven right that the filings as you and others kept citing, did not reflect GE's tender position, still won't as a poster just belatedly realized. We won't know that till the end, filings be damned. We have seen that 19$ vs 40%, LOL Case made,
Naturally GE will give them money, people, technological skill and clout. Sooooooo. Doesn't matter to us if it does not move the pps.
Wondered when you might realize that the 40% was withdrawable and thus would not be reflected in the filings. But as I've said all along, the 40% gives us an idea of where GE is towards its ownership goal. Given the weak pps and lack of a new bid don't think much will be withdrawn and GE will get additional shares including mine and people of my ilk assuming no new bid or pps explosion.
Thats why reliance on filings is not accurate as GE has and will have a lot more under its control than the filings indicate. How much, as I've said before, we won't know till the end. Bet its above 50% as people like me tender.
Ace, bet they hope it will. They win some lose some. Remember we have two Elliot examples, the Cannon one where they lost and the hedge fund where they won after 6 months. They can also ride any appreciation which may/may not happen post tender. But like with buying junk bonds, this is what hedge funds do. Heck, given GE's money they might just pay the nuisance but I hope they don't. Note they have done the same with SLM and many other companies. Its what they do.
Rjestling, 2 comments:
1. Talk about zombie trading, it appears to be already happening, with both papa and baby arcam having very low volume and hardly any pps movement.
2. Am I reading the cc time right, 6am EDT. Wow, that will be a early alarm clock. But at least we can listen to it and the GE cc as well. Maybe GE will have something to say about arcam and SLM.
If those earnings estimates Charlie gave us are accurate, that is not great news as it suggest minimal printer sales and deliveries given that revenue increases from the subsidiaries may be making up a lot of that 23% gain.
If this is how the stock will trade, should tender and think carefully about buying back for a while. ADS, which is what I own, remains trading below the pps.
Good point Silver. We don't know the interest rate, the conversion details, the warrant price or any of the details to know if the potential dilution given the additional money is good or bad. We will know more with the impending cc. The key is not the new loan facility, its the outlook for more product sales and how the beta testers are receiving it. The two things that we know about, and are key to sigma's success are how is the printer contract business developing and where is it with the Materialize deal. If it becomes adopted by Materialize that will be a Major Major achievement. If sigma makes progress on selling its product or getting into the materialize software, this lending facility will be nil.