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Yup I fully agree. Was hoping this was people buying because they know something is about to come out. Since agreement came out Monday someone could know details and therefore buying. Will have to wait and see
Guess we will see just how good you are at this.
well, guess it's tough to get to that when it's back all the way down to .21
Thanks for the message Ernie.
Very good, I'm hopeful this is a good sign then that they may keep the stock, or they will issue shares to existing holders.
Thoughts on this movement, Ernie?
Another pump and dump? Or someone knows something we don't and jumping in before it does take off?
I'm assuming that Friday we may or may not know what the whole deal is about the agreement with the union. I don't think it will be presented to the court until their next hearing, which I think is August 20th.
ah, ok, then that makes sense.
Yeah, it looks like its trading, but not much at all.
I saw it shot up to .20 when news first came out, but went down a little bit. So far it's been very light. Would have figured this would have shot it up a little more. Definitely odd with news like this. Not sure what's going on
Patriot Coal reaches agreement with DIP lenders
Aug 8 (Reuters) - Facing a potential default on its bankruptcy loans, Patriot Coal convinced its debtor-in-possession (DIP) lenders to relax financial covenants as the company attempts to exit bankruptcy.
Patriot Coal notified lenders in late July that the company's operating earnings would likely fall short of third quarter targets required in the DIP credit agreement. A default on the DIP financing could have enabled DIP lenders to stop funding the company for the remainder of Patriot's Chapter 11 case.
Lenders wound up executing an agreement Wednesday night to lower the operating earnings thresholds in return for additional fees. DIP revolver lenders backing the $125 million bankruptcy credit line would receive a payment of 0.50 percent of their commitment. Meanwhile, the DIP term loan lenders would receive a 1.5 percent fee on their outstanding $375 million first-out and $302 million second-out loan tranches.
Patriot previously offered the DIP term loan lenders a 0.5 percent fee.
The amended loan agreement also requires Patriot Coal to obtain committed bankruptcy exit financing by October 31.
One lender involved in the negotiations explained that the broader lender group does not want to see a liquidation of the company, but did want to some extract some fees for this concession.
Patriot Coal held $206 million of cash on its balance sheet at the end of May, according to court filings.
The company blamed low metallurgical coal prices for its financial underperformance. Last month, Walter Energy, another major domestic miner of metallurgical coal, which is used in steel production, requested similar financial relief from its lenders.
Walter Energy paid loan amendment fees to its lenders and temporarily cut its dividend until the company's leverage metrics fell below specified levels.
A bankruptcy hearing to approve the Patriot amendment is scheduled for August 20.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/08/patriot-dip-idUSL1N0G90W820130808?type=companyNews&feedType=RSS
Well it won't matter if its pre or post bk. Shares are shares. If someone picked up a million shares in post bk and they do 1 to 1 then they get 1 million.
Yup I fully agree. I think they should keep it. We won't know until they file the POR. If anything they should issue new warrants to existing holders.
Coal Consumption expected to Grow
Very good video. This is related to PCXCQ since it's obviously "coal". This just came out today
http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/video/coal-consumption-expected-to-grow/2jhh1butc
Peabody Energy Corp. said Tuesday its second-quarter earnings fell by more than half, but cost cutting helped the coal giant beat analyst estimates.
Net income dropped 56 percent to $90.4 million, or 33 cents a share, compared with $204.7 million, or 75 cents, in the same period last year.
St. Louis-based Peabody, the world's biggest private-sector coal producer, was expected to lose 5 cents a share — the average estimate of 23 analysts surveyed by Bloomberg.
Revenue fell 13 percent to $1.73 billion as weaker coal prices more than offset an increase in sales volumes.
Peabody said global demand for coal is growing. And in the United States, coal is regaining some of the market share that was ceded to natural gas in 2012.
The company expects U.S. coal demand for electricity production will rise by 50 million to 70 million tons compared to 2012.
"Despite a slow start to summer, U.S. coal generation is up significantly year to date and natural gas generation has declined sharply," Gregory H. Boyce, the company's chief executive, said in a statement.
Peabody forecast total sales of 230 million to 250 million tons this year, including 180 million to 190 million in the U.S. and 33 million to 36 million tons in Australia, compared with 248.5 million tons in 2012.
Peabody said its second-quarter showing reflected its ongoing "tight capital discipline," including streamlining involving contractors, temporary labor and overtime while working across the supply chain to pare material and supply costs.
Peabody said it would continue reining in spending and cut its capital targets for 2013 by $100 million, to a range of $350 million to $450 million.
"Overall, we believe investors will react positively to the company's effective cost containment and capital management as (Peabody) improves its financial and operating position in the face of a tepid global pricing environment," Daniel Scott, a Cowen & Co. analyst, said in a research note to clients.
Peabody shares rose 82 cents, or 5 percent, to close at $17.14.
The company's earnings are closely watched because it is among the first of the coal sector's big players to report earnings each quarter. It gives analysts and investors a snapshot of the industry's health, including an outlook for thermal coal demand used to produce electricity.
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
Article can be found here:
http://www.stltoday.com/business/local/peabody-energy-delivers-unexpected-profit/article_c8cd1fda-f325-5998-95b7-655cb7560176.html
I know this isn't "Patriot Coal", but this is good news for Coal in general. I'm not saying Patriot coal is going to get profits because they are in BK. However, it should be a good sign for coal for the rest of the year and next year.
Indeed. I believe that PCX did this to force the union to re-do their benefits so they don't have to keep paying for them all the time. I'm ok with this because it was all the responsibility of Peabody to do it. We all know 90% of the retirees that PCX is paying for are people that never worked for PCX.
PCX is screwed with the large amount of liabilities to have to pay. only way to reorganize it all is to go into BK and have the court give them the "ok" to do so. Of course, PCX is also going after Peabody. I'm sure that will help out as well
You are definitely correct, no doubt. If they did this correctly, they would be fine in many aspects. But everything points to the fact that they almost wanted BK so they can do things that they want to do, where they couldn't if they weren't in BK.
I'm not saying I don't agree with you, but with AMR, they just turned a huge profit for last quarter. PCX is losing millions, not making millions like AMR. With negative equity, no profits, it's tough to keep the current shares.
now that being said, they can still choose to keep shares intact.
PCX is losing it on purpose. They cut production and other selling. It's so obvious they have done it on purpose for the sole reason of looking like they are "sad and pathetic" in the eyes of the court to prove that they need to be in BK. This will also help them show the court that they have no choice but reorg the unions and their benefits. If they are making profit, then the Judge would throw this out and say "you're making money, you need to keep paying retirees their benefits". But showing you are losing millions and blaming it on the unions, retirees, etc, forces the court to side with the company. It's working as you can see cause the courts have agreed with the company.
I have no doubt once they get everything agreed upon, get out of BK, or almost out of BK, they will turn up full production and get profits right away and stock will be way up. Then the question will be, did they keep it or issue new shares to existing holders, or throw everyone out on their butts. I'm leaning in the middle ground area of warrants issued to new holders.
I think the problem we will run into the fact that we are negative equity and AMR isn't. I could be wrong on that statement though. If we see AMR was negative equity and they got back financing, then it "can" be possible for pcx
Sam, awesome job on continuing to post this information for others to send to the court. I put in another call to McKool Smiths law firm and waiting for them to call me back. I'm trying to see if they are still going to push for EC or if they have given up.
My last conversation with them was they have not given up and are looking at other options to get it submitted via appeal and approved. I'm hoping our letters will add to the firepower proving a request for EC is valid.
If and when I hear back I'll let everyone know
Don't know. We won't know that until POR comes out and that won't be for another month. They have to get agreement by union first. I doubt they will keep it intact due to negative equity. However I do believe they will at least issue new shares in new company for existing holders. Question will also be at what ratio. Once again won't know for sure until POR is submitted.
If the initial POR doesn't say, I wouldn't worry just yet as the first POR is typically crappy and will have to go through several revisions before its approved by all parties.
All IMO
Next hearing is scheduled July 23rd. I'm hoping by then, or shortly after, Management will announce an agreement with the Union.
volume is very low and creeping back down again. Think they like to wait until end of the month, or beginning of a month to finally announce something. We should know something is coming when volume starts to spike again.
Ah, maybe that's why I was also thinking it was a "Chinese" company. Good info, thanks!
Yup i fully agree. Just saying that was just an example. Some could be half or 1 to 1. Won't know till the POR comes out
Ahhh, that's why I was thinking it was owned by Chinese. Thanks for the correction. My dumb butt should just take 5 seconds and look it up before I say it. My bad.
As always, thanks for all input Ernie.
Yup, I fully agree. However, they also used an example of AONEQ as one that did this big time. They didn't issue any new shares and wiped out all stock when they finished their BK. They just finished it this week I believe, so it's all gone.
I think PCXCQ is much smarter, plus I think AONEQ was a Chinese company, but I could be wrong. Since this is an american company, they may have stricter guidelines to follow and can be scrutinized even more. All speculation on my part. Hopefully they will do something "right". It appears they are doing everything they can to work with the unions and get this ball rolling. They are, so far, doing a lot of things that are "right". I hope they keep doing it and keep it intact, or issue shares to existing holders.
I've just seen a few others that are in BK that have given shares to existing holders. Although, as one of example (won't name the company) they are only issuing 10% to existing holders. So, lets say you own 10,000 shares of PCX stock. well, in the new company, you will only get 1,000 shares. That's rough, but it's better than nothing IMO. It does allow you to stay with them and if they improve and make profit, price will keep going up and its worth it in the long run.
The companies that I've seen where they wipe everything out, are companies that have been completely shady in the first place.
Thursday, July 11, 3:42 AM ET
A WSJ analysis of 11,000 insider trades at 550 publicly traded companies has found that those trades veer heavily towards the sale of stock in the year before a firm files for bankruptcy protection. At A123 Systems (AONEQ.PK), for example, six employees sold a combined 9.1M shares in the 12 months before the battery maker filed for Chapter 11. Other companies mentioned include Patriot Coal (PCXCQ.OB)
I'm thinking that if PCXCQ execs show they sold a lot of their shares within a year of them filing BK, will be another piece of that lawsuit that is already in place for pre-BK shareholders. And yet they still tried to tell everyone not to worry that they won't go into BK and they will protect shareholder value. Meanwhile they sold out of a huge chunk of their money before it went into BK. Just strengthens the law suit even more. I would think only way for them to get out of it without losing more money in the law suit is to keep stock intact, or issues shares to all holders into new company. Then they can easily argue that they are protecting shareholder value by not wiping them out or at least offering them shares in the new company. Obviously just my 2 cents though
It happens, some times. But I agree, sounds kind of shady. You would hope they wouldn't sell as it keeps moving up, and selling just keeps it down. Seems like it doesn't want to go past .23. I know it has a hard time getting past .26 as well. I think after it goes past .26 it will be moving a little better and hopefully with less resistance. Plus it's right before 4th of July break, so some people sell on a holiday weekend type of deal and look to get back in on a Monday.
once again, thanks for posting this. I believe this is more good news and glad to see this is official news from PCX directly.
Management bending the way they keep giving to retirees, even though they don't have to, is a great gesture towards getting things done. Also shows that they want to get a deal done that is respectful to the Union. The union will see this as a good faith and they save "face" by seeing it as a "win" with their threat of a strike if they remove all of the benefits. It's a win/win for both. Another good step on getting things agreed on and getting this out of BK
This is actually pretty good news that they are trying to keep each other happy.
OUCH! I never thought I'd ever see this get to .06 or less. What the heck is going on here? I always thought this was going to blow up awhile ago. good lord!
Good stuff, thanks for sharing on this board.
Excellent and I fully agree on what you are saying. I read that it's supposed to increase in the coming years as China and India keep increasing in number of people. They are behind us in the "hippie" area of trying to get clean energy. They just need coal to heat and survive, they don't have time for any tree hugging when you are in the billions of people. Being in a poor environment as well, they don't care, they just want to keep warm and electricity flowing.
I have pretty much also said the same thing you have. I'm in this until the end. IF they come out and state they won't keep it intact or won't give new shares to existing holders, then I may look to exit at some point. Won't have much, but it would be better than zero.
Hey Fido, if you are going to hold to the end, see my other posts about writing letters to the Justice Dept and Judge. This will hopefully help fight to get an EC formed to represent us shareholders. The more who write in, the better.
If you need help writing it, I can send you some examples, or I can put you in contact with the lady that helped me.
Samebeaux also included a good example of what he sent in and how you need to format it. I would recommend using some good examples, such as the AMR case, Tronox, and a few others that show an EC is needed, as well as them either keeping shares intact, or at least issuing new shares to existing holders.
As Samebeaux mentioned, the former CEO last year claimed he is going to protect shareholder value. So far no one has done this, not even the Board of Directors. Unless they keep the shares intact, or give shares into the new company, then they didn't do what they said they were going to do. Plus, Judge as said Board of Directors is supposed to look out for us holders and they haven't done anything. This is why their is a need for the Equity Committee
I figure it would be good to have a lot more letters. If you don't want to, no worries, fully understand
If you haven't already, I suggest you write a letter like me and "samebeaux" did. We have just sent in our letters to the Judge and Justice department. The more people who write in, will show more support for the need of an Equity Committee. The EC will then do it's best to either fight to keep shares/stock intact, or at least get new shares/warrants in the new stock.
I've been getting some help from the lady of the Delaware place I posted a little bit ago. It has her phone number and email address. She is more than happy to help you get a letter written to the courts.
My other posts also shows the 2 addresses you should send it to.
The more that write in, the better
think you are right, but they are probably holding from a couple of weeks ago when they bought a lot when it went up to almost .26. But they should hopefully be out soon. But who knows. It will be a good day when the shorts are out and only legit holders are still here, holding and not selling at these prices. Only way this is going to finally move up is when the shorters stop preventing it from reaching higher. Anytime it tries to blow up and go big, they do what they can to keep it down. Seen it several times.
This is obviously someone with Peabody paying to have this written up. It doesn't get any more obvious with all of the comments
Excellent letter! Make sure you send 2 copies. The one to the Judge and the other to the Justice Department.
If I don't get a response, or hearing in 2 weeks, I will talk to that lady again (we are in constant contact anyways) and see if she recommends I send another to both places again.
I would also suggest keeping in contact with her via email or phone at least once a week.
I'm sure they have been meetings frequently. I have no doubt that they do it at least once or twice a week and then let things "cool down" or take a break.
if they are working things out, then I'm sure both sides are trying to get things together correctly and present them correctly.
The Hostess thing should be a wake up call to the Union for PCX. It's plain and simple. You should be taking the offer, and if you don't, then you get NOTHING. The people can and will be replaced by non union workers.
I work for a company that has tons of union workers. They striked and were replaced by non union and others that did OT to cover. The numbers have dwindled down through the years. What they don't realize is they are being laid off and removed and replaced by non union. Companies can't survive with too many liabilities.
I understand the union wants to save "face" where they aren't just going to give in. They are playing hardball and going to wait until they can get as much as they can. When they get to the point where that's it, it won't be going any further and that's about as good as it's going to get, they will complain about it and eventually will accept. It will be under "protest", once again trying to save "face" and say they gave in as they had no choice. But the reality is, they got one hell of a deal. Better than nothing at all.
If they strike, it won't last long. It will only be a display of force that they can and will do it just to prove a point. Then they'll get back to it and get the final deal done.
Very good sam. Definitely include that statement in your letter. That will help greatly. I'm glad you got to talk to her. She's been a good person to talk to and share info. Very helpful in a aspects.
Hey Sam, if you have a chance, call that lady back from the Delaware place I mentioned. I've been talking to her several times and she has been a breath of fresh air and a GREAT help. Please call her to discuss this with her. She will point you in the right direction. So if you have some time, I highly suggest calling her back. She is definitely interested in talking with you.
I'm sending off my 2 letters to the Judge and Justice system tomorrow. I have referenced 3 court cases in my appeal for EC. I may send in another letter next week or week after.
Well, I wouldn't say that people are going to be lining up to buy coal once PCX is out of BK. The key word of "nostalgia" isn't going to be thrown around with PCX. You can get coal from so many other companies. With Hostess, they have a specific brand and they are the only ones that deliver it. Coal is pretty much coal.
But I do believe that PCX will be running a lot leaner and better once they are out of BK and will kick it off with good numbers to make a profit. where right now it's obvious they are purposely making sure they do NOT make a profit. In fact, they have pretty much went from +500 million in equity to -400 million. Almost 1 billion in a year. That's just horrible. And the Judge just rewarded them by allowing the managers and other "key people" to get all of these bonuses. I'm not sure how you can justify that these people are important when they just lost almost 1 billion in a year
Excellent point, and I also agree on it. I just figured we are still weeks or a month away before Union agrees with Management. Then submitting the POR then ALL parties have to agree and I figured the first POR will be rejected. Then typically the 2nd POR is also rejected. My guess time frame is 4 to 6 months.
But once again, excellent points on all fronts. I have definitely considered this and hence why I'm going to write in as quickly as possible, and urge all other holders to do the same
thanks!