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Sometimes it takes a few days for subtler information to register as well. This is not “money”, it’s about advancing a critical process. Even when highly significant, the small community of investors following a company like NWBO may already be fully invested and the significance might not register in a larger community for a while or not until later news or commercialization of the new technology.
ExW appears to have gotten his “Flaskworks competitor” from the profile link for the NWBO collaborator firm that the woman in this LinkedIn profile works for…
“5. Northwest Biotherapeutics created a DCVax platform to treat a wide range of solid tumor cancers.
— Ida Bogac (@albtur_mnymkrs) February 6, 2024
These continuing efforts herald a potential breakthrough in alternative cancer prevention and treatment regimens. “$nwbo #dcvax pic.twitter.com/pwACyXzVHa
Definitely not a manufacturing tool. All anyone has to do is look at what it is… it’s equipment NWBO would maybe use in prep to spin out the dc’s before they begin to make the vaccine by hand… nothing more.
When shorts are caught by surprise, all they can do is pretend to know what they are talking about, supply a “link” if they can and then bluff…
It’s interim news, so your ridiculous glee is nothing to notice. It’s pure Dunning-Kruger nonsense…
You clearly have no idea what you’re talking about. A casual dive into that site tells anyone vaguely knowledgeable that this is not anything like the Flaskworks machinery or technology and that this machine does not manufacture anything like DCVax-L. You might be able to use it for prep before you then do the actual manufacturing of a vaccine like DCVax-L, but this is not at all what you think it is…
This machine is for separating DC’s not for a cGMP manufacturing process of a real clinical vaccine. This is for separating dendritic cell types and mixing them a bit, it has nothing to do with actually creating a state of the art vaccine for a manufacturing process. This is basically a clinical machine you might use in prep for a manual process like NWBO does now.
Did you even look at the brochure or the actual “machines”? Total nonsense.
No, they already have units, they just need a cGMP version. And this other company having their claimed units doesn’t mean they can make every product. Flaskworks had such units when they were bought, but to get the machines to the specific requirements of a particular product and the cGMP takes more than reading a website claim and equating the two…
More on general IP Protection, old post
https://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=172826539
I do not consider myself uninformed. I think this is the obvious circumstance. Flaskworks will come along shortly. I think I also previously predicted how they would get it approved, that it would not require human testing or any of the things some suggested and that you would be able to do multiple different batches at once in one system. All things that caused my assertions to be challenged.
It’s looking very good and very exciting, and the patent process as well, is extremely exciting. These will become core and very important patents for maintaining ownership of the Lysate + DCVaccine pipeline. Others will not only need to create, and trial and prove survival numbers comparable to DCVax-L, but they will also need the manufacturing technology. NWBO can become a go to for vaccine inventors and a partner for commercializing such vaccines also, if they want to go that route and if there are new innovations that make that a profitable and viable route. But most importantly, regardless, they will have a solid set of patent moats to protect the company and investors.
Very exciting PR in my opinion!
Why do you throw out these patented lies every day? It’s really strange at this point.
Not news. And it cannot attack the diversity and reality of unknown and broad antigens like DCVax-L. Further, it will take them years to accumulate the survival data NWBO has even if it has some efficacy, which may be very unlikely given past efforts to attack handfuls of known antigens only. If everyone gets a different mix of different antigens, how do you even measure which human concocted version worked and which didn’t? Seems like a questionable endeavor.
And I previously told you why that would be a stupid move for any BP interested in a deal. It would trigger basically a hostile takeover and a bidding war most likely. It’s no way to actually invest for a serious potential partner as the money is paid to other shareholders and not the company and a negotiated deal can create rights and opportunities that buying shares on the secondary markets cannot possibly trigger. Given the extensive holdings of various persons and friends of the company, as well as other complex relationships that drive some crazy, a hostile buyout for cheap would be a grave mistake.
Excellent post!
Inquirig continues to illuminate the nature of Dunning-Kruger.
Don’t be so churlish.
Wish posting is not reality, as much as some might like to believe it. DCVax-L published peer reviewed results, has the backing of top doctors from top institutions in top developed countries and apparently a very friendly disposition pre-approval in the UK. It’s unlikely your wishes will ever become reality.
Great post!
Only in a hostile takeover scenario, which involves a proxy and likely triggers a competitive situation. You don't buy 10% on the market if you're Merck except in that scenario and even then, it's way too splashy. Not going to happen.
If they want 10% only, they are going to discuss it with the company and negotiate and likely there will be some other factors that will lead to proper valuation despite what is going on in the market. Most likely those RIGHTS and joint commitments will be about things much broader than the current share price.
Just saying, your scenario is completely unrealistic.
I did not say it was a bust at all. Reread what exactly I said. You need a reading comprehension skills refresher my friend. Very basic stuff.
Thank you Roman. I think it's important to clarify on your post that when you say 30,000 vaccines, you don't mean individual doses but basically a full course of vaccines. They make them by batch, not shot by shot, which was Dendreon's problem. So potentially $250,000 doses for 2 to 3 years, assuming the tumor tissue allows it. I suspect, despite their pre-approval pricing, that they would make the full course all at once because going back after, unless there is new tumor tissue, is very inefficient and costly.
That may be but if DCVax-L had those kinds of sales I think it is a virtual certainty that YOU and every short here would label it a “bust”. Meanwhile the long you replied to said the opposite, that Gilead paid $21B for it.
Shorts play all sides of every argument to always argue, maximally, that longs are “delusional”, that other drugs are better, regardless of the details, and that DCVax-L is a bust, again, regardless of details.
So yeah, if DCVax-L generated those levels of sales, I am pretty certain shorts would be on here day and night saying, “it’s a bust”!!! What else would they or could they do?
You can be wrong and correct at the same time.
Since the numbers after the last 10Q are larger, clearly they are the most up-to-date at this point in time. The 10Q will be definitive as of that date. But the in between updates are the best information possible unless they file something in the interim that is up-to-date as of that day.
Captain’s posts are very helpful and a good deed for other investors.
You don’t need to 8K an application.
This Dunning-Krueger syndrome thing of yours is really a problem. You clearly don’t know what you don’t know and so you’re very confident about the false things you say.
I believe there was a discussion where we went through this with shorts when they left and they were compensated for each milestone. There were indications, but some things, you complete and you can’t wait around for the final outcome, they have staff for that. These conversations are typically is so tedious and really pointless to repeat every 6 months again and again. I expect they will ultimately announce in some form or another when Flaskworks is finalized for actual utilization in the manufacturing process.
I have never claimed that, I have always been consistent in my statements on this matter. I can’t explain why you apparently can’t recall what I have been saying directly to you consistently. Feel free to find some past statement of mine where I said what you suggest. It doesn’t exist.
Nonsense. Advent is a contractor. They may buy it as a courtesy. They do not need to buy advent. There is no IP, nothing critical in advent that is not transferred when they buy NWBo. You do not understand corporate affairs or buyouts if you think that is the case. Contractual rights travel to the buyer. All of advents obligations flow to the acquiring company. Period. Advent has no other significant clients and is under contract to manage Sawston. They get Sawston when they buy NWBO and they get all of Advent’s obligations.
I have dealt with this issue for fortune 100 and smaller companies thousands of times in my career. What I just told you is the basic circumstance. And a buyer would certainly be sure of that before they bought NWBO regardless.
This noise shorts make is about the largest pile if crap you’ll see and is meant to deceive retail. Generally I couch my statements in “I believe”… this is not one of those instances. What I said is basic. Basic, basic basic. Anyone saying otherwise is not experienced in buyouts. There are circumstances where parties agree to terminate outstanding contracts, or parties do not want to have a contract with a following party. Typically that will be where the buyer is of a lower credit value, and usually those parties are banks. Those contracts just like the NWBO contract with Advent are terminable at will, but as I said, a buyer would in fact work those details out with NWBO before a buyout if it was critical. However, a buyer would likely plan to sell Sawston and potentially build their own facility, so that manufacturing might only be required for a transition period anyway.
Advent is a modular provider of services and that is how the CDMO business works. They do a phenomenal job and I do not say this because I want snitching other than prosperity and security going forward, but short nonsense is constantly and wrongly describing situations to deceive retail.
There is no apparent looting going on. This was previously raised with the SEC by shorts and was not found to be the case. Nothing has changed except the provider. Even the contract is based on the same contract. And if shorts thought otherwise they have a remedy even if we all know they’d end up in the same place and be seen for the harassing parties that they in fact are.
I suspect so as well. Guessing.
You sure sound like you’re working this on the short end as a “long”. And you and ExW sound in sync except for your claim you “believe” periodically.
We went through this last summer, it seemed the obligations were met. Now you’re doing a rerun. This gets so f’ing tiresome with your constantly rerunning the same nonsense over and over and over again.
NWBO had absolutely nothing to do with this event being closed at all.
I look forward to it. Also, I make no claims that someone might not have a reason to just go ahead and buy or sweep
advent into a company, even NWBO. I do not think they have to do it, but sometimes it is just easier and the nice thing to do. These are folks who have worked hard on this project. They have received shares, so that is probably the fix there. But even if a third-party did that, it’s not theft from us. It’s just likely a way to sweep that talent into the firm or overall project. Talent is talent. Sometimes it is difficult to come by. They would not have to do it. But, depending on the circumstances, it might be the nice thing to do.
But I honestly don’t see it. I just don’t want to be absolute.
There are always these miracle cures for cancer in test tubes. I think there has been a cure for cancer out of Israel that will just be 5 years almost every year since I have been conscious as a human being. Lots of great headlines, but one must look at the core concept, that it has a means to be consistent with the way the body works and immune system works and we happen to be in the sweet spot.
In that context you describe, it’s an approved drug, prescribed by a doctor which is off-label. But they will easily extend the label after approval. It will take a while, easy compared to past hurdles, because of changed laws and regulations.
I have no worries about this because they have had shorts on their back since Cofnate, got scrutiny from the SEC because of complaints from shorts, put in additional protections in terms of contracts and the contract they have in place was the base contract from Cognate as this was a subsidiary. Typically extending such contracts is very simple and the terms described and the baseline contract when I reviewed the old contract were exactly the same. Obviously you modify the new details and you address things like new costs and inflation. This development occurred in NWBO’s facilities. It’s a positive that they have commercial manufacturing not just approved, but can manufacture and provide DCVax-L under the UK Compassionate Use “Specials” program.
You clearly do not understand how biotech works. If they set-up the factory without a CDMO, the costs would likely be even higher. In this instance it is in their factory, these are contractors, so benefits and other issues are on Advent. Further, because of the easy regional development authority financing of Sawston’s development, NWBO has responsibility to sell services to other companies. Advent is doing that and effectively the facility can be subsidized by whatever business comes in.
The fact is, it is modular. Those employees are on the payroll of Advent. There are set costs which NWBO would have no matter what but because of the lease and possibly other factors, for Advent, costs can be spread potentially to other potential customers and NWBO being the owner of the key infrastructure and facilities, benefits. It’s a win-win-win for the companies and the region.
The fact is, traditionally, in the past, companies needed their commercial manufacturing facility set-up up front, and this cost billions of dollars in the earliest period of development of such companies. CDMO’s allowed those requirements to be eased, for specialization and know how to be aggregated and for costs to be shared to some degree amongst developing firms. They did not need to create full fledged factories before their clinical trials even started. Costs like that were horrible. I recall a friend telling me about his experience with a blood substitute company early on, many years ago. Now the product may not have been ready, but just to get to clinical trials was an ordeal.
You complain a lot about Advent, but the reality is that it was Cognate’s subsidiary and she got it as her payout when CRL bought Cognate and it allowed for immense flexibility and symbiosis that benefits everyone. Further, the regulators understand that it is a modular relationship and not what shorts claim, and to them, their understanding is what matters, not the ravings of people on bulletin boards who trade the stock up and down and praise and then complain depending on which way they are trading this week.
Partial.
No, they do not need Advent. Advent is a contractor and a smaller version of Cognate, which is a contractor. The contracts of these companies and Advent and Cognate are drafted intentionally to be modular and replaceable. There is a term for the replacement of either internal employees hired to do the job or another firm, doesn’t matter. Completely modular deal.
As for a larger firm buying, they can just as easily buy out employment contracts for any employees that they want.
Your notions about where the value is and what is what are completely out of kilter with reality. You’re repeating short narratives that have no commercial reality.
I completely agree HB4C! Well said!
It’s percentage. You said a higher percentage. The percentage is the same. Of course if you go to trial and get a larger award it is a “higher amount”. The percentage is the same. It is set by law. They do not take less, regardless of when it is settled. Of course states have different rules. This is NY State.