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My guess is this first shipment will take a while, as they need to send the T-AGG to the shipping location, plus make whatever arrangements are needed to handle it, get the product in place, etc.
I still would like to know if they have put together more than one of the new shipping containers? If still only one, what will they do if an order for 10 or 20 containers suddenly comes in??
Does anyone have any info on the number of containers available? I have asked twice now by email, with no reply. My assumption is that finances have held them to perfecting just one Transprop AGG unit until more orders are recieced!
Sorry, I mispelled hemp (as kemp) in my last post! [:^(
I have not heard Bluefire talk about using kemp as a raw material, nor the intention of them to produce anything but sugar and/or ethanol, although they have mentioned the possibilities of producing a few other chemicals that sugar could be converted into.
Also, while kemp may be produced at a much higher tonnage per acre, it still wouldn't compete with a process that could utilize materials that would otherwise be discarded.
So far as I can find out, the Bluefire process utilizing concentrated strong acid and trash for raw materials is probably the lowest cost way to produce sugar and all the compounds it can be converted into.
Terry, while I am the one who asked to have some of Deanna's earlier messages removed, she has a solid point here. Hemp is one of numerous organic materials that can be used to produce alcohols. However, a waste product that BFRE is proposing to use, such as wood/paper processing leftovers, and/or landfill refuse(properly sorted), would have both the lowest possible raw material costs, and would not require using fertile land used for foodstuffs, etc.
So, BFRE's approach seems to me the best idea yet to produce ethanol( and/or other products) with the least intrusion on both land use and the environment. Their only remaining hurdle seems to be finances to build its plants. This seems to be the remaining goal of the Bluefire management that must be overcome for success..
Should be increasing buying interest at these prices as this great news gets around.
What would the price do if they very soon announce a massive new gold discovery at their Bateman Property?
If all the agreements and leases are signed, does anyone know why only a single Transprop AGG unit exists so far( as far as we have heard), and why they haven't begun trial customer shipments?
In other words, what's the delay now???
I read somewhere today that China has no ethanol production to mix with (reduce retailer's cost of) gasoline, and auto sales remain strong there. Ethanol sells for around a dollar a gallon less than refined gasoline, plus is cleaner burning. It was speculated that China may consider importing ethanol.
This could rejuvenate the MOU BFRE signed with Huadian a couple years ago for financing plants in both China and the US?
The only news that I see can revive BFRE significantly is either announcement of full financing, or some partial purchase-type partnership agreement that keeps the Bluefire name, and allows funding for at least the Fulton plant(s) to be built. If not something like that, perhaps the full purchase of patent rights and plant site by a refining company could happen, like Valero's purchase of several corn-based producing ethanol plants to blend into, and reduce cost of their retail gasoline sales.
They signed an MOU with Huadian(Chinese company) to finance several plants in China and the USA over two years ago. Anyone know how that turned out?
I think you are right! Maybe not as soon as we would like, though!
Good news, indeed! However, it implies there is still only a single Transprop AGG available, which they are still making improvements on. That may suggest DDCC won't start producing more until a shipping contract is actually signed?
Don't mean to sound negative, as this may well be the proper way to approach this business. I do think DDCC has a terrific future in utilizing its unique containers, plus of course, there is always the possibility of a major gold discovery on their land in Canada! [:^)
There is no place for this kind of talk on a message board like this! I expect it will soon be deleted!
Regarding cellulosic ethanol feedstocks, there is nothing lower cost nor less restrictive on land used to grow food than timber wastes, and Bluefire's original goal to use selected waste from landfills, which would have the effect of extending the usable life of the landfill.
Thanks, Scout, that IS a very encouraging video! I still would sure like to know how many TAGGs they have now, and at what rate they are being produced? I would think they would want to begin using them ASAP in order to maximize their utility and if needed make final design adjustments?
As I understand it, DDCC will provide both marketing and the shipping of both Barite and fracking sand to the users/drillers. Presumably both functions would bring significant income when ramped up to meet full user requirements.
Could it be that everything is about in place to begin, except for enough T-AGGs to begin big enough shipments to fulfill the customers' needs? DDCC has never addressed the two requests I have sent, asking about the progress of the T-AGG production? I would like to see them begin with limited shipments via the T-AGGs, and then expand as they build more shipping units.
I also have not been happy with the total lack of replies from DDCC. I have twice asked for some idea on how many T-AGGs were being built, and have received no replies. [:?(
All I know is they are still dealing with the DOE( to reverse latest DOE decision) as well as with various US and foreign banks for complete financing of the Fulton plant(s). The Chinese seem to be extremely cautious and slow to make big committments.
Regarding the choice between ethanol, biobutanol, or any other chemical that can be derived from sucrose, that is more of a marketing decision than a technological one, although there would be some changes in the final conversion process.
Terry/Trapper,
As a Chemical Engineer from the petrochemical industry, I can add that sugar(sucrose, actually, as in, "Sucresource", BFRE's subsidiary) is simply another hydrocarbon chemical that can be extracted/reacted from a large number of organic sources,including sugarcane and sugarbeets, and that it can either be refined into sugar as we know it( which is not very valuable), or can be further processed and turned into a number of other, more valuable chemicals, such as ethanol, butanol, etc.
Its extraction from sugarcane, corn, and sugarbeets is fairly easy, making it profitable to produce low-priced table sugar from these raw materials. Most other organic raw materials require a more involved preparation and process to extract the sugar. These sources, which include plant life such as wood in this case, are composed of organic plant cells, from which the term, "cellulosic" is used to generalize the more difficult process needed to extract the sucrose cells from the total plant's organic structure.
Different methods are used for this "cellulosic" process, including strong enzymes, weak acids, and in the case of Bluefire, strong acid which extracts the sucrose from the organic raw material(wood in the case of the Fulton plant).
Does this help? By the way, Bluefire's process has been proven at a Japanese pilotplant, and verified by an independent company, so I have no doubts about their process being successful technically and economically! [:^)
Bottom line with Bluefire: They either get full funding for at least one plant(Fulton), and fairly soon( 2014-15), or they will likely go bankrupt, forcing them to abandon their ground work in Fulton, MS. If they DO get financing, since they have the only truly viable(proven in Japan) process for economically extracting sucrose from cellulosic raw materials( for ethanol or other sucrose-based chemicals), then BFRE stock should soar, and future profitable plants built, turning BFRE into a decent investment for longer-term gains, in addition to our short-term speculative gains.
So, as I get it, Thomas Cochran, Head of Meginim Forestry LLC, has unique connections with the DOE, and has as an understanding of technical issues of forestry applications, as well as the clean energy/cellulosic sugar/ethanol industries.
It seems likely that he and Arnie Klann/Bluefire may have been working together on both the wood pellet addition to Bluefire's Fulton project, as well as financing, possibly with some combination of the DOE and banks, or the Chinese Huadian company?
Can anyone shed any additional specific light on these possibilities? If the above speculations are accurate, and complete financing is achieved for at least the full Fulton plant, we could see a MAJOR explosion in the BFRE stock price! [:^)
Agree Trapper. Arnie is a man of extraordinary strength of character IMHO, who has held on tenaciously through horrendous trials while dealing with banks as well as the DOE. If he does not toss in the towel, or be forced to go into bankruptcy, he will one day (soon, IMO) finalize a deal that should lead to multiple new cellulosic sugar/ethanol plants with excellent profitability.
I think the Korean sugar plant(s?) is a success, but they have a secrecy agreement preventing much info about it!.
Twice now I have emailed asking for status on how many AGGs are being produced, but I guess that is not an important enough question for them to answer! [:?(
So, WHY don't the DOE and banks who Klann is negotiating with recognize this? In addition, their proven(in Japan) process is very efficient and cost-effective, according to an independent report on their website.
Also, they have added the future production of wood chips in the planned Fulton plant to sell in Europe, which should enhance profitability and financial stability.
Hey, dreams is where all good things start! :?)
Agree! I expect a huge surge in price when an actual contract to begin using the T-AGGs is announced.
I still have not been answered as to how the construction of the AGG units is coming? [:^(
Google finance shows 46.3m shares. I suspect that, until banks approve full funding, the only way for Klann to stay afloat is now to issue shares?
It would be a real shame for this, what I as a Chemical Engineer perceive to be the best cellulosic process available, to close down.
I disagree! The potential is too great for a bank somewhere not to take a chance on what certainly seems to be the best cellulosic process available for all the materials that can be produced from sugar( mainly ethanol).
After the DOE's disaster with Solyndra, I think they would be looking for a successful venture to vindicate their entry into the energy/fuels markets?
I think their new AGG system is impressive! I did ask DDCC recently how the production of units was coming, but have as yet not been answered. I trust they have the financing for building large numbers of them??
Agreed. Tricia was very informative. From my review of earlier documents, AGG advantages include faster loading/unloading times which could be important in high volume shipments.
I had earlier asked for the number of containers that had been manufactured at that time, but never got a reply! [:^(
Looks like sellers are slacking off: Four upticks in a row today. :?)
" Moving forward" by testing its Oct.lows! :^(
Does this mean that the TRANSPROP AGG is the "Fort Knox" of the new gold? :^)
Bluefire has mentioned other products that can be produced from cellulosic materials also, since the process begins with sugar, and then whatever range of products can be made from that.It is by no means limited to ethanol.
The only thing holding back BFRE util now is the bankers and DOE who seem to fear another Solyndra if they make big investments into a new technology like cellulosic sugar/ethanol. etc. I am expecting this will soon change in favor OF funding for BFRE, after they factor in the export sales value of wood pellets and plants using wood waste such as Fulton.
From reviewing their description, the TRANSPROP AGG has two new features that seem to add significant value in effectiveness/time in handling:
1. The units can be directly loaded "as is" onto rail cars after filling.
2. They can be connected to load/unload several units together without the need to move units around.
Additionally, they can be easily refitted to handle different products as needed.
These advantages should have enough value in making faster handling during both loading and unloading to gain acceptance by the fracking industry.
As an Engineer, I agree with Profitscout. It is obvious from their reporting that they have followed the essential sequences: Starting with a dream( concept) to fulfill a certain need, they then conceived a preliminary working model, revising as needed over time, and, before starting a production prototype, had to consider all details such as materials of construction, necessary strength requirements, size and configuration requirements, costs,safety aspects, etc., etc., until they finally come up with a safe, effective working model that achieves the original dream within cost limitations( or modify, if not).
What the end product looks like may or may not appear unique, as the end RESULT is what really counts, and its value vs. other means of achieving the goals originally needed.
The only downside now remaining for using ethanol at 15% is the lower MPG. However, that is compensated for by the lower cost of ethanol, plus at 15%, the MPG difference should be non-detectable by most drivers.
I wouldn't be surprised to see the DOE taking a fresh look at BFRE after the disaster of Solyndra, and the probable addition of wood pellet sales at Fulton, plus their essentially proven process based on the Japanese pilot plant work.
Yes. Now that DDCC has filled the recent upgap, and seems to be moving up again, I predict at least a test of the recent highs, if not an actual new short-term high by year's end!
With the gap above 0.026 now (more than)filled, the price should soon continue its climb to test earlier highs, assuming no negative news!
GD, I agree with you!
That is a very impressive summary of Bluefire's progress to date, and is far ahead of rivals in terms of both credibility and feasibility, IMHO as a Chemical Engineer from the petrochemical industry.
If the banks are afraid to invest here, as it seems they are, it is a natural for our Government to pick it up 100% and make it a success, again IMHO. I don't think Klann can hold on too much longer with his primary means of survival being massive dilution of stock.
It actually hit that price during the day. My guess is it may drop to close the gap above 0.026 in the next few days before moving back up to new short-term highs.