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Anyone successful in finding out why Bob and team will not update investors on the uplisting or audit? Yes, I realize this year's audit cannot be completed yet...simply was hoping that from a good faith investor standpoint Bob would step up with an update or guidance on it.
Impressed with the recent hires and sales...
ha, okay. Well at least in this case when I'm wrong, I make $ (as do you). Will be an interesting next few months one way or the other.
I was referring to the well being of VTSI (the stock itself). The company as an investment is in a spiral and has been for a while....I feel because Bob is not familiar enough with how to run a public company. He is great at R&D and turning out great products that people want...but that hasn't meant anything from an investor standpoint. If there was someone else handling Virta from a public company perspective (ie transparency, guidance, quarterly calls) the value of Virta in the market place would be greater. Certainly we need Bob around...don't get me wrong.
I'm not upset if others feel otherwise, or feel he is the right person for the stock. The chart of VTSI will speaks for itself and will continue to speak for itself...we'll see. I certainly hope I'm wrong and Bob is the perfect one to make Virta into the investment we all hoped when we bought in.
Note I said "VTSI has the wrong guy at the help of the ship"...the stock. Do you agree he is handling investors and the stock appropriately or do you feel we need someone who can better handle the public aspect of the company?
How's that timing working out for you? :) Not as easy as one would hope with a company that is selling large $ products to the government and helped create the largest US retail virtual shooting range and simulator.
One day, Bob will be moved into a lessor position than CEO and the market value of the company will grow. I always am amused to think back to Bob telling all of us in the conference call that sales were definitely impacted by the low share price, yet that doesn't even seem to motivate him to improve Virtra from an investor standpoint.
VTSI definitely has the wrong guy at the helm of the ship, I think everyone seems to agree to that.
I'm glad you are trying, and hope that others will try as well. Unfortunately I have never received a response other than ie "we are trying hard...what do you suggest?".
Management firmly believes the stock will move by itself. I picture Bob hearing from someone that "just keep your head down and ignore the noise and the stock will eventually follow" and he took that literally for EVERY aspect of investor relations.
Thanks Avocado. We'll see....
An additional way to show strength from an investment perspective, would be for insiders to buy. Yes Ferris owns shares, but there are many others in the company, and where are those buyers? If things are going to be so great in the future, you would think that insiders would be buying. Sure there are restrictions on when they can purchase shares, but the entire year is not blocked out. If I'm simply overlooking this info online, please send me a link.
For starters, simply give investors an update on the audit and preparation for move to the Nasdaq. Host quarterly conference calls for investors to keep them informed on things other than sales. ie he could answer questions on the increase in overhead expenses (ie headcount increase), reasons why he is against a share buy back, reconfirm future intentions with the company (ie private etc), update on progress at Gander and future expectations. Transparency is the key to be able to attract and retain investors.
Also, do not try to do a massive reverse split without having his ducks in a row....as we would be in a much different place if VTSI mgmt handled that properly. They shot themselves and all investors in the foot with that one. I realize that is in the past, but by not being clear about their intentions intially, he created a trust issue with some investors. Transparency is even more important after that fiasco, but instead their communications department went into hiding cancelling the shareholder meeting and held no quarterly calls afterwards etc.
I have not sold (yet) and have no agenda other than to state what I've seen to date. Those of you who are not frustrated or are not voicing concern, you are living in an imaginary land where things might come true in the future. It's more realistic to talk about years of track record here, not what might happen. I've never questioned Bob's skills at improving the balance sheet, only with handling the investor aspect of the business....which leads to PPS appreciation (balance sheet does not solely increase PPS, case in point exhibit VTSI).
The reason I say Nasdaq is going to be a failure.....is that as each month/year goes by with lack of concern of Bob for VTSI in the market, the more investors will put a red flag on a Ferris business. At some point, even if he says he'll hand deliver investors a PPS increase, investors will either not trust him, or simply not want to give VTSI the time of day. When there are many different companies to do business with (ie invest) do you ever say, you know, with all things equal I'm going to give my business to this other person/company.
Trying to quiet the voices on the message board is obviously not the change that is necessary. If message board buy/sell transactions are the important ones, then the company is not doing enough. Investorshub.com members should be the small potatoes in the scheme of VTSI...but unfortunately that's not the case because Ferris and management have not done anything to encourage new investors. Ferris is creating his own issues and his non-actions will continue to create issues until enough people contact management and let them know change is necessary.
Many will never invest in another Ferris run company again...and the word is spreading the longer his non-actions continue. The move to Nasdaq will be a complete failure.
How long does this continue until it's a big deal? 50-60% decline from the reverse split fiasco. That's not exactly keeping pace with even a terrible market. Frustrating part to most is that with a product as amazing as theirs, a deal with Gander Mountain, etc, any other decent management team would have the company in a much better place. It almost seems like they would have to work hard to forcefully keep the company valuation this low...but our management can do it with ease.
Sorry, have to laugh at this decline. If Ferris would simply communicate with investors as much as he did when he was trying a get the reverse split passed, things would be different. The stock is going to continue to go down....many of us have told him that. If you are concerned, you should write Bob Ferris, Jed, or Stephen and ask for better IR. An update on audit, move to other exchange, etc would be great for investor relations starters.
Until Ferris updates investors on several key items the downward movement will continue, no matter if they get more $1M orders from Gander (as we've already seen when those orders come in). This stock is purely weighted by Virtra management's inability to properly run a public company. Management doesn't realize the extent of long term damage they are doing. They are shooting themselves on the foot. Investors have a sour taste in their mouth with how Ferris runs the company and it will not be forgotten even with an audit or move to Nasdaq. The longer they wait on establishing an investor relations program, the worse the sentiment with investors will become and most will not return in the future.
I can definitely see why my statement about sales would be confusing, considering my earlier posts. The sales increase is in coordination with properly run investor relations and company support/acknowledgment of the stock.
I definitely feel Bob Ferris's approach of ignoring IR, ignoring quarterly calls, trying for a terribly misguided/mistimed reverse split, etc etc plays a huge role in the lack of Virtra's appreciation in the market.
Good find Teeroy...
Sort by date and the contract signed 9/27/11 for the $399,790K pops up to the top.
Of the 4 floors/sections of booths at ITSEC, Sony and Virtra's setups are 4 booths down from each other, close, but I was dreaming for a minute of opening the map and finding them directly next to each other.
http://exhibits.iitsec.org/iitsec11/public/floorplan.aspx?Mapid=593
ITSEC and Virtra - Gaming? Sony?
http://n4g.com/news/837585/freddie-wong-shows-sonys-vision-on-the-future-of-gaming-in-new-video/com#c-5791761
Notice in the post above someone mentions the following:
"Couple current gaming vests for feedback with the tech that is alreay available and holographic projection is the main hurdle. Several companies, including Lasershot, SRI, and Virtra that provide immersive simulators are already working that angle. It may be here sooner than we think. There are several unveilings set for ITSEC this fall."
http://exhibits.iitsec.org/iitsec11/public/booth.aspx?BoothID=132312 (Virtra's booth at ITSEC)
If Virtra could bring their technology into the home by working their technology into a gaming system, that would be amazing to see. I would certainly buy it and have to imagine millions of others in the world would as well. And of course for shareholders, if they announce a partnership with Sony or similar, VTSI would have a little different reaction than of late. We know they have great technology....maybe Bob's letter is referring to a bigger deal in the works than just a sale of a bunch of simulators.
Bob's recent email mentioned that Virtra is currently blessed with more opportunities than ever before...so maybe some of those are large government/military orders. As only a 10M company, it wouldn't take many large orders of $200K products to move the stock price.
I hope they continue to work on a more significant recurring revenue angle with their products. ie software, new scenarios, etc.
Since when? Let's take Virtra for example...sales have been increasing more than 100% quarter over quarter, debt paid off, etc, yet no benefits to company value. Do you believe that if Apple for instance handled a reverse split as VTSI did that investors would still stay on board and say all is okay? No audit in place, no plans for uplisting (Bob changed his tune later saying the reverse split was for an uplisting a year out), significant communication all of a sudden during that time, etc etc. And then afterwards the conference calls with investors immediately stop. Do you recall the types of proxy calls people were receiving during the reverse split time? The reverse split situation is just one example. The inner-workings that many of us have seen at Virtra in regards to investor relations has never happened to me with any successful stock I've owned.
Let's say an investor is comparing two companies. Both show revenue/profit growth. One has a questionable reverse split ordeal and an IR department that says "....send us your ideas..." as a response to emails and does not even update investors on progress of an audit/uplisting that it was feverishly touting many months earlier. The other company provides much more significant feedback to investors, hosts quarterly conference calls for investors, etc. Which one would you invest in? There are many companies increasing revenues/profits, it takes more to build investor confidence enough to actually get their investment.
Ferris believes revenues/profits will increase the stock price. We've seen years of his PR's showing the books improving greatly. How long it will take him to realize that he philosophy does not work? We've told him this for a long time and we are obviously correct(look at chart)....his approach does not work. Most of us recall Ferris saying on the conference call that share price significantly influences sales, a reason why he wanted to do a reverse split. Thus the irony is that he's shooting himself (and company) in the foot by handling VTSI they way he does. He tried so hard to encourge shareholders to bend over for the reverse split, but yet won't do anything to improve share price naturally. I suspect many will be laughing very hard (I will be) when the Nasdaq or OTC debut is a failure...and it will simply be because of Ferris's history with investors. Yet, he'll still scratch his head not remembering what he's done to cause such a stock failure.
Why does Ferris even have Virtra as a public company if he's not at a minimum going to provide execellent IR, provide updates to investors regarding move to new exchange, audits, promotion of the company to the investor community, etc. Will he wake up one day and smell the roses or will it take having someone on board in management that has dealt with a public company and investors previously.
Everyone content with management's handling of IR and VTSI? If you are not, I would encourage you to share your thoughts with either Bob or Steven Shaffer. The email sent to shareholders recently was certainly the easy way out and involved no actual actions to improve the share price (ie insider purchases, move toward Nasdaq, Audit, small buy back from company, etc etc).
VTSI is getting some decent investor attention.
Okay not really, as evidenced by only $100's of dollars worth of trades recently. It will be nice for investors when B Ferris is concerned about increasing the market value of Virtra. Just bettering the balance sheet obviously isn't going to cut it....sorry Bob that's not the way the stock market works.
I'm disappointed we have not heard about the audit or move to Nasdaq. Was he simply not truthful and only trying to get the reverse split passed? Seems like Virtra was quite the communicator during those reverse split days. Good times.
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Young grasshopper, don't get too carried away with an 8% gain on paper so long as you are still holding VTSI and not selling. Obviously the stock has been up and down for all of us, .03-.11...so we could all easily had/have 8% or more at some point. I COMPLETELY hope it continues to go up this time, but for now I'm not so naive (been around market too long) as to get excited. Earlier this year when it started going up management announced a 100:1 reverse split. Yes, that causes a stock to change directions quickly (as it did for VTSI) when there is not proper groundwork for an announcement like that.
When you sell, then let us know and you'll get that pat on the back you want. Until then you might appear simply naive based on past history of VTSI management decisions. But again, hopefully the future will be different...I truly want that to happen.
The chart of VTSI that you posted is amazing considering the fall started not long after the Gander deal was announced. For 99 out of 100 public companies, having the largest deal in the company history, and getting the biggest retail contract in the industry, would result in a much much higher stock price. Only a company run by Bob Ferris evidently could see a 40% loss after that kind of deal. Brilliant. Bob has even had chances to prove he knows how to run a public company in the past few weeks and stop the bleeding (ie updates on future milestones), but cannot pull even the basics together.
New article written about Gander Academy --
http://www.gunblast.com/Gander.htm
If the proxy was handled properly: ie If Bob conveyed the Nasdaq intentions from the get-go, Virtra did due diligence to realize that a 1:100 split is overkill and not generally acceptable by investors, and they made a prior effort to communicate with investors frequently to establish a relationship, then people would have voted yes. Not voting is the equivalent of "No"...and the above reasons are why most voted no by not voting.
Look how many companies get measures passed through proxy's. It's very possible to do with investors, it just requires an effective process from the company to make it happen. It is fully the responsibility of the company to lead investors down the path properly...and Virtra/Bob is hopefully learning.
You are crazy if you think investors won't vote if Virtra says we are going to Nasdaq on Jan xx, 2011, we are doing a reverse split to meet minimum nasdaq guidelines (not overkill), we have the BOD requirements met, all Nasdaq requirements are met and we have the audits complete or scheduled for completion on XX date? Now that is one way for the company to handle the proxy...but the opposite of how Bob handled it....so yes it's squarely on the shoulders of Virtra that people did not care enough to vote.
See the difference and why people might vote "no" or not vote at all to show their no vote?
I know people who have tried to contact Ferris etc, but it is met with a "....what do you suggest?....".
Ferris believes it is the fault of investors that the reverse split did not pass...when in reality it is fully his fault that investors did not care to vote or trust enough to vote yes. Given the vast majority of shareholders didn't vote and/or voted "No", this would speak volumes to most CEO's as to what they need to do to step up...however Ferris sees it as investors fault. Good times. Definitely not the right guy for the job.
As a business and investment, Virtra could be in a vastly better place at this point with the right person (great products, gander deal, debt free, etc)...however with Ferris we are at a PE of 2. Still amusing to me that he can't reflect and make change. It's sort of like watching a train wreck tv show, just have to stick around to watch it continue to unfold.
The above is all in my opinion.
You share the same positive sentiments we all shared a long time ago. PR's such as this one come out VERY often, just check news history over the past couple years...this type of PR is status quo my friend.
However, welcome aboard and I hope that things change with the company...otherwise I suspect you will want management change as well in a couple years when you are holding at the same price or less.
Ferris - How's that focus on revenue strategy working out? The plan has resulted in a 50% loss in Virtra market value in a number of months...brilliant. Maybe Virtra needs a comprehensive IR plan afterall, just like every other public company.
We just touched .06...headed into the .05's as volume increases.
Unfortunately Ferris believes that if he increases revenue/sales, the stock price will just automatically rise.
He doesn't see the writing on the wall from the past 5 record quarters of sales (or full history of Virtra)...which has resulted in zero stock appreciation. Not too hard to put two and two together that this approach does not work.
I can almost assure you that if anyone emails Virtra, the response from IR and Bob will be "what are your suggestions". Seems accomodating, but many people have provided suggestions on multiple occasions but nothing changes.
A side of me will unfortunately find it amusing to see the stock price continue downward while Bob sticks to his plan of trying to grow sales/revenue and ignoring the stock and its investors. At what point will he finally realize this does not work (or will he?)....maybe a PE 1 company trading at .04 cents is the breaking point...or is he willing to watch it go down .01. Regardless he will deserve a pat on the back for accomplishing what many thought was impossible with amazing products and a balance sheet as great as Virtra's.
Ferris should be fired or take the company private if he does not want to deal properly with investors. How can a CEO have a debt free company, growing at 100% rate, at a PE of around 2. Congratulations Bob, you've done what many would have thought impossible. Ever think that you might actually need a good IR plan as a public company? Or is your current plan working well?
Bob and team are so nervous/concerned about appearing to "promote" VTSI, that they fail at executing the most basic (and free) methods of reaching out to new investors....such as relating the two companies on PR's etc.
I'm hopeful Bob and team will realize the "official" IR information from that website is a cookie cutter approach that is not applicable for VTSI given a number of factors.
1. Investors are very frustrated that there is no plan communicated regarding the uplisting and audit. (cookie cutter plan does not account for special circumstances such as this which can cause investors to sell their investment)
2. There is a lack of trust between management and investors after management's handling of the proxy and various other items in the history of VTSI.
3. If management expects to pass any major future proxy, such as a huge reverse split (not the norm for must companies), the relationship with investors has to be much better than a cookie cutter approach. Do they actually want people to care about voting, and vote yes?
4. This approach has not been working, the share price has been in decline or status quo for a good while.
etc etc - other items that are special circumstances which cause frustration with investors and thus selling in the market and value of Virtra Systems to decline.
Wait for the company to mature? Considering the company's years of history, when does management think that will happen? When do you propose will be a good time for VTSI to start investor relations and build a positive relationship with them...if it's not when they already have investors holding stock? If they are waiting for the Nasdaq listing, then management should at least simply convey a firm time table for the audit, uplisting, etc.
The VTSI investors I know (6.5M shares that I know of), who have contributed to the success of Virtra through dilution and investment, believe this would be a good time to dedicate a few days to an IR plan. Management/Bob is simply shooting themselves in the foot for the future value of the company.
Yes, they watch the stock price and seem surprised that what they are doing (growing sales) is not working to increase the value of the company. As critical thinker said, investor relations don't really matter, and CT seemed to really believe that. I'm not sure when it's going to click with Bob and team that IR is very important and they need a solid IR plan if they want to increase the company's value.
If they think investors will give them credibility going forward, and trust intentions of future proxy's etc, they've got some work to do. Again, it will be amusing when they all of a sudden jump out and say "pass this huge reverse split for Nasdaq" after ignoring investors in the past. They need to build the relationship and trust before things will be passed or move forward. I love how people like Critical Thinker and Bob say that the only reason the proxy didn't pass was only because people didn't vote. If VTSI actually had an ongoing, positive relationship with their investors, people might actually care about voting. It falls back squarely on managements shoulders that people did not vote...and same thing will happen next time as well...and it's going to be very amusing to see a frustrated Bob again...knowing that he is solely responsible for it.
Yes, the way Virtra is handling sales vs investors is evidently working very well...we've got .066 on the bid. Will be amusing to see the market value of Virtra continue down while Bob and the stellar IR team scratch their head and wonder why investors are not behind them on Proxy vote or investing in their stock for that matter. And they will do the same thing when the Nasdaq is attempted....
Yes, Virtra said on the conference call that the value of the company had a direct correlation to the sales they could bring in...which is the amusing part as they continue to have terrible investor relations. Was Bob not truthful about that statement? If he was truthful, and the share price does negatively affect sales, than he is certainly not the guy we want at the helm of the ship since the IR is terrible and thus hurting our sales.
The other amusing part is that I can picture them now scratching their heads at the Nasdaq debut going "why" when the stock price quickly falls below a dollar and they get delisted. No one will respect their stock given their track record of poor IR, unless they switch it up quickly here in the very near future.
I'm not so sure Bob wants to see the price go down, although you couldn't tell from the lack of investor relations these days. Do you think Gander and other companies are going to be concerned if the value of Virtra starts heading way south? They have long term support agreements and such in place with VTSI...
I know that management would focus more on shareholders if we sold and the Ganders of the world thus expressed concern. Management would have no one to blame but themselves. They will also not have anyone to blame for a poor Nasdaq showing, except themselves. They are leaving such a bad taste in investors minds that people will not give them the time of day no matter the exchange. Management can correct the situation, but doesn't appear they care to do so and thus will throw their money out the door on the Nasdaq listing IMO.
I'm not selling right now, and believe strongly in what Virtra has established, but it is not being run as a company that new investors will want to touch. What is the new IR/Marketing guy doing? Will he leave, or be fired by Virtra, soon to move onto his 12th company in 3yrs? That will be a shocker. Okay, not quite 12, but he sure has not been able to hang around a company very long. Anyone email him and get anything worthwhile back? I suspect he would respond with "please send me your ideas" if you ask him what Virtra is doing in regards to investor relations. ha