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Euc, now do u know what i am talking about?? check your inbox
Awesome Post!
Excellent reasoning and straight to the point...sustainable profit!
I also agree with the Minors vs adult part as well. 100%
The only fuzzy issue I have is regarding reverse split....wouldn't they be better off just returning a significant amount of BONUS shares as this will increase the value of their shares...withour sacrificing shareholder value?
Yes Hamham I do think that, but the PPS isn't higher right now....therefore its a hedge they are forced to take.
And that is exactly why I think when the sustain Cash flow positive the will cancel a huge amount of their BONUS shares...increasing the PPS even further.
Ua merger will not happen, but all the links tell the story.
Ua will provide their quality product in exchange for marketing? Great move by Ua. Companies including mslp essentially compete with other marketers to sell same product(it's just branding). At the end of the day Ua gives discount to mslp, but they don't have to pay for advertising for these sales as they wre mslp products(mp brought them the business/sales).
Reason is simple:
Any contract would have to heavily favor Ua right now, and on the other end heavily favor mslp.
It wont happen; as Ua would be hedging their own product against mslp.
I think one of two things very optomistically:
1. They already new international sales were going to explode and are increasing efficiency.
1b. They just realized how great international sales are and the margins, etc (omg this wasn't the focus of plan, bit this is huge), and the luck we all need at some point and time.
A lot of misguided effort, then a whisper, it's quiet, ,,,make the better decision by takin the night off, clear your head,,,,,then revisit the situation.
Mslp retail long. They are learning too.
Mslp shareholder value increases the day mslp execs decide!
The brand is now in a execution of monetiZation stage. I am certain of this.
What I find interesting is games are coming to an end! The pps has declared its fair value today based on the "books" essentially when a certain pps hits it is always more adventagous for execs and company to buy shares. This decision to buy is not based on future projections, but rather current dynamics for off-setting the books. All shares are cheap sub.10! As soon as books hit equalibrium., profit recorded, execs cancel shares,pps kaboom!
Deep space, are u here for justlovetgegane ....especially since the post master general isn't?
Where's the comical pointed and contrite reply??
I am waiting on int'l sales info from Brasil as I type. I assure sooner than later....but even then if anybody thinks about it...if mp reached succes.... The numbers will make all us "current" mslp longs sick to our stomach.
And just to be on the wild side???
How would mp supplements being globally certified assist our potential friend? Would it put them above the rest? More trust worthy? Safer? More reputable?
http://beta.fool.com/callamarie/2012/06/07/will-counterfeits-squelch-these-sportswear-compani/5413/?ticker=LULU&source=eogyholnk0000001
Branding? Mslp could brand u know who (and vice versa) to gain a larger and more diverse market share! It could be dual marketing partnershio
Gonna take a chance here: I prefer to answer with questions because I know at the end of the day all is speculation and I would always rather maintain an opinion than proclaim something that may or may not ruin my credibility amongst our peers here:
Let's ask ourselves a few fundamental questions:
1. Who is the face of mp supplements? MP branding
2. Has mp supplements grown? MP branding
3. Who is responsible for growth in sales? MP branding( sorry not us shareholders)
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If anybody deny....I'd love to hear explanation
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4. Who has funded mp suPplements? (SHAREHOLDERS and branding)
5. Who has funded mp becoming a brick and mortar?SHAREHOLDERS and branding)
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6. Is anybody worried that mP worried could go bk?
7. If they bk is anybody think the MP name would continue (used for its marketing)?
8. If the mp supPs bk is anybody worried that mp shareholders wouldn't have a legal case against mslp for selling the branding of a company that produces 75 million revenue for 250k?
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IMO- this was a strategic omg to secure the brand and avoid bk last year. Luckily their previous advisor new that an llc was a great tool to manipulate (for better or worse)
The gist: used llc to guarantee their cash salaries, thyme also used it to advertise mp supplements, they also protected the only (previously) "mp value" the name/logo/brand.......
When (maybe q2; I'm still learning books of public company) they declare sustainable profit they will release all financials and benefits to related entity. ....which will be astonimical!
If I were to side with some here I would essentilly agree that mp is nothing more than a building that produces supplmets thtat is entitled to sell supplements with mp branding without any ownership....thus saying shareholders that bought mslp were nit investing in mp(musclepharm).....I think we can all agree that's not the case!!!
Hence my previous post...the "new/revised plan" based on current sales is already being executed!!
New face: IR firm answers what they can
Improved point of sale: new website
Efficiency: NSF certification, Iceland isssues( they are choosing where the most value in their decisions will come from.
Share structure: buy back shares, reduce o/s
Debt: reduced to cash flow(any future debts should be temporary)
Vested interest of execs: legal and financial!
DB, remember llc is a tool. Just like having another 1.5 billiion being added to as. They are only short a few bucks a quater. I guess I should have said this as well. My example can be vice versa....99% ownership with let's say "said contract of 10% profit"
First I now see you skepticism and think 2 things in agreemnent. First being they were in verge of bk and needed cash. 2nd they did not monetize this contract as thy COULD HAVE (may have had an account who wasn't as familiar with the depth, but he atleast understood the value of this tool.....
If they were to bk, who would then hold the company "essentially company is marketing, name, branding???? The apparel would have acces to trademark.
Hence the pps.
Now being profitable, mslp would adventagously, redistribute the limited liability back to mslp. It was a tool to ensure protection of the brand, but when it becomes profitable it becomes more adventagous for both mslp and shareholders. .....
DB, as with many of the numbers/biz focused topics here there are many ways interpet/manipulate.
I'm a little lost when you say LLC (and corporation for that matter)doesn't want to pay Tax Man...I don't know of any company that wants to Pay the Tax man untill they can SUSTAIN profit (otherwise you are giving up money to the tax man that would otherwise be used for growth to achieve a SUSTAINING profitable cash flow).
An LLC must follow (techinically..some corporations, LLC individuals all move/manipulate #'s that will benefit them the most financially) the same accounting procedures. If the owners/members give themselves huge salaries to minimize PROFIT of said LLC they will still have to pay taxes on their personal income.
I have 2 questions:
Is this 10% Net Profit factual? (u sure it's NOT 10% gross)
When was contract entered?
Where/how can I find contract?
In regards to LLC, it can and does act the same as a corporation with a few more (let's call them leniencies/abilities), but let it be know that any member will have an %ownership of said LLC.
For example: LLC could add a new member (individual or entity (LLC/Corp/Finacer) whom may provide services, Cash, assets, and even labor.
Let's use the cab service again (don't want to use MSLP and have my example used as misleading...)
CAB LLC may add another driver as member of LLC. Driver/member can have his contract written any way both parties agree to; ie: Driver will become 1% owner of LLC and will be paid $20 per hour. (In this case ownership/membership was given to minimize the cost of having an employee...no workers comp, payroll taxes, accounting of the previos mentioned,etc....)
All the while another member is added at 1% ownership and this member provides an asset (another cab) to CAB LLC. This member likes 1% percent ownership as it minimizes his risk if CAB LLC is sued or has other negligent issues to deal with...yet he can still write his contactual membership so that he receives payment based on anything he wishes (such as per mile, per month, per hours, per year, per life of depreciation of ASSET, per any set time period)
Sooo at the end of the day an LLC is NO different than a Corporation other than the words in LLC - It's a tool to LIMIT LIABILITY!
Now in regards to the facility, etc... Yes it is true that another business (assuming MSLP no longer existed) would have to pay to remove hot tub, wieghts, markings...if they didn't want them, BUT we are talking about a marketing company! MP has been a company thats' survival has been based on Sales. MP value lies within its' revenue and nothing more (atleast at this point). With the revenue they are producing; any other competitor would be able to monetize the already existing sales, hence any improvement of brand awareness will add value.
This is why I think now that MP was able to avoid BK...that when they show a profit....well the possibilites are endless...it becomes a game of how to most efficeintly monetize existing rev.
I also think the plan has already been made (of course their will be some adjustments as with any business), but MP is in the execution stage!
Thats why I see all the things they are doing with NSF, website, etc...as positives, as efficeincy, as Profit!
Hamham, DB or anybody know if 10% is Net sales or Net Profits?
(people love to move/change the verbage of Net in the business world)
Where/how can I find this contract?
When did they enter this agreement?
DB, interesting example for avocet. I can see parts of what both of you ate saying.
Bd would you classify his cab as an assert or liability?
Imagine a cab driver.....biz is good. Lost of CASH. Wants to grow biz and buy another cab.
He buys can with cash to get better deal and write off loss....(this Not good/accurate accounting or fiscal responsibility)....
I wnondr if you or how manny others understand this?????
This is terrible move! Can owner just declared cash/hidden(now taxable) income and you can't write this off as an expenditure except for "interest".....YOu can only depreciate it.
In addition may I state I do think they were on brink of bk....that's part of why I am here.
Is a state of the art training faciility a asset or liability?
No...I said they were hidden.
So your saying you had an AON order that filled 100K shares AON....negative batman! I was watching L2 the entire time!
Stop with the farse!....or maybe you just didn't read and articualte my post that you are replying to....therfore the Falsity your post!
Deep space...I'm waiting for a reply to my prior post....C'mon make this a great MSLP message board friday!
DB, you said it yourself that you deal with small patatoes when entertaining this market...
just because you can find a guy down the street who can do MSLP t-shirts for so much less does doesn't make it true at this level (digits) in the game.
Heck instead of going to AmberCrombie & Fitch to buy a pair of jeans for $100 plus that have holes and bleach....you can buy my pair that I used for 5 years....they even come with a natural comfort fit!!
Hmmmm numbers? We're getting there....
And for those that prefer a story rather than numbers and fact....I watched a Special about Tito Ortiz not so long ago....and the lovely Dana White said "selling t-shirts is chump-change"!!
Here is your 55 million shares of "COMMON STOCK".....make sure you know the definition of "common stock" and its' limitations or lack ther of.
In January 2012, the company instituted a convertible debt retirement program under which it would retire all of its outstanding convertible notes. Under the program, the company has used cash flow from operations, as well as mezzanine financing, to retire the notes. MusclePharm has retired $5.5 million of derivative financing instruments with $3.0 million cash and 55 million shares of common stock.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/musclepharm-completes-retirement-convertible-notes-130000976.html
What would the value of these shares be? if the rest of these notes were paid in CASH as stated?
I don't know everything by any means, but I don't make stuff up....and I also apply my knowledge to what I can with MSLP...and I'm learning more as we go....
Question regarding our horrendous PPS.
Where does anybody think the All or NONE orders are "hiding" on the bid?
Why NOT more selling by the flippers...We all know there are plenty of plenty of people with millions of shares that could dump in an "attempt" to buy back way cheaper.
With our low volume somebody could personally just drop 2 millions shares and make the PPS dive, then buy back cheaper right?
Hmmmmm???
Is somebody there with AON orders?
Hmmmmmm??? Who could this be?
Good job Deaf. I've been pondering these things as well, and when it comes to Public Companies/Share Structures I too wish I had real life expertise as an auditor.
Don't forget they issued 55 million shares of common stock...is this the debt of 2.6 million debt interest payment?
Stay on this....focus on numbers and biz mentality.
Good Post info and insight.
I've made the call as well before...due to circumstances basically same info...but pleasant.
To share my thoughts:
Improvement in IR/PR is great news. You can't sell to institutional investors if you don't have anyone to talk with. This is the face of the company as it grow! (just like the imporvements to website)
Buhler we all know was brought in to address these finance issues.
BOD - will just be who we already know, and will it be only a change in titles/duties (paper), BUT! it will include new compensation!
NSF (certifications) - I don't want to hear anything until after the fact! We can't expect or even hope for information until this situation is completely resolved....and with all the talk, there is NO doubt this is being addressed.
Why are they a penny? You act like you have some in depth knowledge base, yet anytime I post for information/numbers that I assume you would be familiar with based on your posts....I never get a reply that focuses on the post, but rather a twisted version of manipulated vocabulary.
If they already had the financing needed to grow the business, it would have never been sub-penny let alone where it is now...so share something new and focused.
When people mention share structure complaints (which I am NOT an expert on)...even I can see the a solid reasoning for this...including bonuses...yet nobody with so called experience will mention the following scenario:
Make a deal to ensure your salaries are paid (sell apparel for 250K CASH).
Bonus yourselves a major stake% (not money) its' NOT money till the sell shares.
When things get in order (all our conversations here from NSF, to Olympics, debt); you simply Cancel your shares....and bam PPS in order shoots up....but they can't do this until other issues in order.
This scenario shouldn't be to hard to follow....even for the hurahs, and OMG's.
Me too! As long as he has experience with 8 digits, and knowledge with this as additional income rather than a foundation.
Larger volume better rates....well thats genious! C'mon DB.
Running an Apparel business is like running an event management company....can be a major pain in the butt. Have reps running all over the place promoting, promoting, promoting.
Have you ever seen a bunch of "sales reps/groupies" running around promoting, promoting,...? supplements or apparel?
At this point MSLP may have decided to use this 250K to pay their CASH salaries thus keeping this from further affecting Cash flow of MSLP. It could be a way of setting the 2 businesses apart so that MSLP supplements is a business that should be recorded as self-sustaining?
Further more I had previosly posted an example from my experience as to when something is worth the time and money.
Labor = time & Money
My Example: My company : Lets say the following: Per $100.00 in revenue(1 hour labor needed when using my asset) & (.25 hours of labor when outsourcing)
Asset sits unused = cost $500.00 per month (no labor)
vs.
Don't have asset(sold it, therefore outsource) = 20% profit of all revenue (at 500 revenue I make $100.00 in 1.25 hours of work)
Asset in use (revenue to breakeven) = $4k Revenue (meaning 40 hours of labor just to break even.)...however after I break this point I my margins improve to 35%.
-------------------------------------
Don't have asset (outsource)20K revenue: 4K Profit in 50 hours of labor....Not to bad huh?
vs.
Asset in use (in-house) 20K revenue: First 4K ($0.00 / nothing with 40 hours of labor) + 16K revenue at 35% =$5600.00 Profit with 160 hours of labor)
Now which looks better: 4K Profit on 50 hours of labor or $5600.00 on 200 hours of labor?
Now I will admit my business is very labor intensive, but not all is what you think untill you deal with that many digits....don't assume you can value their time which = money...
Now I'm NOT saying they have made the best deal,,, but they may have based on their current situation....because thes numbers I showed will be greatly skewed once the Revenue starts hitting 6 digits... but why in the meantime until these numbers demand your time and money would you not limit your responsibilites ans risks?
Oh and by the way..I take all their recent actions from NSF to the website recontruction as being more effiecient! And I'm all for this!!
MSLP retail long
They already looked into endorsing an olympian....just haven't annouced it yet.
Why/who said they would sponsor the Olympics as an entirity?
Do you have any idea how long MSLP waits to PR something of this nature (an athlete specific endorsement)?
Well lets see the first initiated contact with Mr. Bryce Harper (huge asset to MSLP awareness)????? How about June 2011.
When was it announced???? May 2012.
DB, what were the execs salaries in CASH?
You also admittedly said that you onlt delt with small patotoes companred to the digits MSLP deals with....so how is it your are so sure this favors your point of view.
I have admittedly stated that I could not know for sure the value of Apparel because I do NOT operate with that many digits....
But to stay focused on MSLP....what were the execs CASH salaries?
DB, I would appreciate you address the following:
Appeal....
Share structure....
Prs (lack there of).....
You have used some numbers in the past in regards to apparel. But consider this.....does your friend contact local retailer, anybody that you personally deal with in the apparel market deal with 7 digits? I will be first to admit my faults regarding mslp. I do not understand how the weight of debt/shares reflects on their balance sheet. Secondly I don't operates a business that has revenue of 8 digits, let alone 9.
If they are growing up as we all want, then would essentially doing what everybody wants. Action, them words. No more say this....then do that and change this......there essential will be an extenuated gap before further explanations. Because they are doin that and waiting to tell is we already did this!
DB, I've been practically screaming at you to help me an others understand these issues!
How many posts have I posted saying : stay focused on numbers and business mentality?
I've been asking over and iver an explanation o the debt interest payment!
I am experienced (learning every moment) with business, but not books involving public companies....I will say I do know enough to know the risks a lot better than I did 1 month ago.....
If u don't like the word cost cutting, how about efficiency?
I will say what bothers me the most about the posters who prefer to ensure we see their negativity is that is so vocabulary emphasized.
Example: I state that "institutional investors" hold major stake in mslp and people go and search for what their brokerage says....so I had to restate with "groups".... People come up with .04%? Are you kidding me.....
Now it's we say it's a cost cutting measure to modify cerifications and if somebody doesn't see the actual cut within a couple months they will claim another lie! It may cut cost immediately, but it most dwfinitely will down the road......so let's go with the word "efficiency" starting now! Why do you think they are making changes to website???efficiency! Point of sale! The face of a global company!
Retail longs stay focused on business mentality and numbers!
Deep space, you from the west coast? We gotta have a beer, watch pulp fiction, then dazed and confused, then mslp talk about fair value!
Definitely holding long, but would like to take some profit next time when it's overbought.
You're awesome!
Dude are you cool man? ...... Like how man?.... Like sure man.
Now lets see what the next negative thing one of the "groups" can come up with regarding MSLP.
It must have been a major bummer that this whole NSF only resulted in a dip of 10%....they are probably pissed because the sold thinking buy back much cheaper after we all react....
I personally didnt' sell, but I got more for cheaper!! Thanks!
Well, we reacted by holding.....excellent.
Retail Longs....stay focused on business and numbers.....you can guarantee they will have someting else up their sleeve!!
Great Post. Great thoughts and perspective. This is definitely in realm of reality...for all we know its a piece of everything regarding financial descretion.
From cost, to holding back orders (i relate this to the Iceland BS as well....why have a product sit and risk some other countries' legal formalities when you already have needs that aren't being fulfilled right down the street.
The only thing that is still kinda ringing with me in regards to this is (maybe I'm reading too much into it,but....):
When NSF first stated that the only way to get Musclepharm products that were NSF certified was if you call musclepharm and ordered directly from musclepharm. It stated that no retail outlets or distributors MP products were NSF certified.
This statement makes me say "hmmmmmm" at which point and time has anyone ever gotten a product directly from musclepharm? And how could this be technically possible if MP doesn't have a facility?
Was a small batch of MP done within a NSF guidelines to ensure that their products were going to pass....and they then they said thanks....now we know were ready to move forward,,,,,but we will wait on paying you as we have product to move NOW!
As I have stated from day 1..this was/is a financial decision and everyone should acknowledge this....We all want Profit right??
well done. you're on it....
Euc...thats definitely useful....wish that poster had gone into further depth...what is considered a lot/batch.....
does this change when shipping internationally, is distribution tested, etc....
Not trying to hampen your post...it just is still a little vague.
But as I said before I'm NOT too concerned either way....I simply like the idea that they are doing what is best for the MSLP bottom line today! The sooner they make a Profit the easier to restructure debt and then future goals can be revisted when MSLP has the CASH to move forward.
When I started my biz....you could only imagine the ideas/goals I had....and 90% of them I tried to obtain to quickly resulting in the reverse effect....debt grew so out of control.
Whats even more interesting is that of all those 1st year ideas/goals I still only apply 15% to the way I operate my biz today! You could almost say I run a business "today" that has almost nothing in common (other than what the customer sees as my product/service) with the business I ran 12 years ago when I first started.
My product/service is NOW local, national, and international. I outsource 75% of all rev and I have 10% of the assets(liabilities, depending on how recorded in my books) that I did when I started.
I basically leave all the certifications, memberships up to my affiliates/partners to deal with.
At the end of the day...my partners/affiliates are essentially a member of my company and have been certified by me to deliver my product/service to my client.
The success of any business relies within managements ability to learn from others. It is never beneficial to be stubborn and say this is my vision and I will achieve it.
It's much easier, time saving, and cost effective to learn from others.
Remeber you can't get TIME or MONEY back once it is gone!!
The day you stop listening and learning is the DAY IT ENDS!!
Being a numbers/bottom line person myself...I wish I really knew as well.
I will say that I am sure as I have been since the day the negativiity regarind NSF decertification was mentioned that it was to some degree a financial decision. NOT sure how long this will remain,,,but it was and is.
At the end of the day...NSF can charge whatever they want....as it's essentially a monopoly with lmiited to no true competition. This is why my first reaction was this was a business decision...if anybody sticks it my biz just because they can; then I'm gone. Nobody should tolerate being taken advantage of, but some pull the plug sooner than others.
Nobody clearly knows each aspect of the requirements of NSF...therefore no idea of cost. For all we know MSLP only made the minimum payment to initiate NSF certification (meaning that the cost of NSF had NOT been as sginificant as we might think...to date atleast).
If anybody had any insight into the process it would help us make estimates....but to be honest i am NOT concerned either way (it can only be a plus for me if this did cut costs exponentially...which it may) I am more happy to hear that they made the dicision in itself. There may have been other ways to make this decision, but at the end of the day NOT all things are as easy said as they are done.
Deep Space your awesome presence is more than welcome here at MSLP.
You might be the reason I keep coming back to this MSLP board once we are long and gone from this PPS range.
Your one-liners are a great: they are funny, they are to the point, and they are proactive...and sometimes even provide a solution...
Heck you even remind those like myself that sometimes we get a little too wrapped up in the daily MSLP PPS to talk to our loved ones and remember priorities.
Thanks for all that!
MSLP Retail Long.
Keith G could you elaborate? Do you know if it was do to:
more retail locations carrying product?
Retailers selling more of their pruduct (existing retailers)?
Does this distributor only sell locally (chicago land area), or nationally, or internationally, or all of the above?
Are they already selling the new prodcuts that MSLP has yet to annouce?
At what level was this distributor?
Any furthe insight appreciated??
Also one further question? As a consumer (which it sounds like your are from previous posts) do you think it helps them to have all the flavors? I wonder how much this helps sales vs. cost with all the variations??
Looking forward to your input
Retail Long
Is the last time we see .015's? Nobody and is selling at all! Awesome!
C'mon! Speak up! I don't are if your janitor......why not ask an associate or yourself to dig and see if maybe mslp has some pharma priducts in line...or what it would take depending on type of product.....at the end of the day are they both over-the-counter drugs?
You can and should contribute.
Ps this may help explain Iceland (not worried about Iceland,,,it's been a topic here though
Great mslp actions taking place... This should settle some nerves if there are any.
I use the word action because that's what it is.
We've been trying to stay positive, on the numbers, mslp issued pr's....but their have been distractors/distractions.
Action is:
Increase profit margin of obtaining certification ( whether by having ic vs. NSF- cost efficiency)
Website updates (monetizing an already existing liability to increase profits and margins (cost efficiency)
Efficiency is key to me...... I remember when I started moly biz and said I want to do this, this, and that!!! Only to discover this and that wasn't profitable without major debt and risk."I took it and Paid for it......thing is mslP only has debt now......risk only relies within the debt/group/shareholders....... The risk of of day to day operations has more than Passed the test.....and with exponential sales growth.....it is solely the above debt holders game to be made.......
Patience mslp retail long