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Those of us who see no ethical problems with stem cell research have no need of an "ethical stem cell alternative" and unless said alternative is more efficient or more promising than ESC technology it is a waste of research funding and time.
It is a widespread problem - not just an ISP problem.
Most likely a DNS failure.
I can't get to any of my bookmarked boards either. Also did a google search to get a link to some specific messages - all totally off line.
A very encouaging anectdote, esammee, for several reasons. Thanks for posting it.
9/11 commission cites failures of both Bush and Clinton adminstrations:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/23/politics/23findings.html?ex=1158033600&en=7d7d7212251d9834&...
Excerpts from the above:
WASHINGTON, July 22 - The Clinton and Bush administrations failed to grasp the gravity of the threat from Al Qaeda before the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks and left counterterrorism efforts to a disparate collection of uncoordinated, underfinanced and dysfunctional government agencies, the commission on the attacks said in its final report published on Thursday.
"Across the government, there were failures of imagination, policy, capabilities and management," the panel said in its report, which was harshly critical of how the intelligence, law enforcement and military branches performed before the attacks.
In a series of findings that were searing in tone, sweeping in judgment and backed by voluminous reporting, the report said senior officials were repeatedly warned about Osama bin Laden's intentions, but failed to respond with an aggressive sense of national purpose.
"Terrorism was not the overriding national security concern for the U.S. government under either the Clinton or the pre 9/11 Bush administration," the report said.
In contrast to most government reports, the findings were presented in a dramatic, often gripping narrative style with chapter headings like "We Have Some Planes" and the "The System Was Blinking Red."
In a tone that sometimes resembled a paperback thriller, the report chronicled Mr. bin Laden's rise as a global terrorist leader and the agonizingly slow recognition by the Clinton and Bush administrations of the danger that his network represented.
The account described in authoritative detail how the plot, despite setbacks, gathered shape and direction and how it finally struck with four nearly simultaneous hijackings even as the national security experts here continued to ponder a counterterrorism strategy and the agencies responsible for protecting the country were completely blindsided.
Many findings were foreshadowed in the 17 staff reports previously made public, but the new report had new information about the Sept. 11 attacks, including a detailed account of how passengers on Flight 93 tried to gain control of their hijacked plane.
The report did not address directly whether the attacks might have been prevented.
"Since the plotters were flexible and resourceful, we cannot know whether any single step or series of steps would have defeated them," the commissioners wrote in the executive summary. "What we can say with confidence is that none of the measures adopted by the U.S. government, from 1998 to 2001, disturbed or even delayed the progress of the Al Qaeda plot."
.....
Different sections give contrasting accounts of responses by national security advisers under Mr. Clinton and Mr. Bush. It describes how Mr. Berger, under Mr. Clinton, took the lead in December 1999 in mobilizing the F.B.I. and other domestic agencies to address the so-called millennium plot, in which attacks planned in Jordan and Los Angeles were disrupted. By contrast, the report describes Condoleezza Rice and her deputy, Stephen Hadley, as not having regarded the coordination of domestic agencies as part of their responsibility after they took office in 2001, even as warnings of a possible attack continued to grow.
The report said of the Bush White House before Sept. 11: "The domestic agencies never mobilized in response to the threat. They did not have direction, and did not have a plan to institute."
The report found no evidence that Iraq, Iran or Saudi Arabia provided operational or financial support to Al Qaeda as part of the Sept. 11 attacks. In contrast to the Bush administration, the panel singled out as most worthy of further investigation not Al Qaeda's pre-Sept. 11 ties to Iraq, but its links to Iran.
......
"Our failures took place over many years and many administrations," the panel chairman, Thomas H. Kean, said at a news conference. "There's no single individual who is responsible for our failures. Yet individuals and institutions cannot be absolved of responsibility. Any person in a senior position within our government during this time bears some element of responsibility for our government's actions."
........
The report singled out the Central Intelligence Agency for serving at the forefront of counterterrorism, saying no agency did more to attack Al Qaeda before Sept. 11. But the report also described its response and those of other intelligence agencies as insufficient and hamstrung by a lack of resources, competing priorities and internal rivalries.
At no point after 1995, the report noted, did the intelligence agencies produce a new formal National Intelligence Estimate to sum up in a fully developed assessment the Qaeda threat. Even in summer 2001, it said, counterterrorism analysts were slow to perceive a broader threat. Before Sept. 11, the report said, the Clinton and Bush administrations limited the C.I.A. primarily to disrupt terrorism abroad and efforts via proxies. The operations tried to capture Mr. bin Laden and his aides in Afghanistan rather than kill him. Officials of the Counterterrorist Center at the intelligence agency and the National Security Council staff, the report notes, grew more frustrated.
At a briefing for reporters on Wednesday, senior C.I.A. officials acknowledged that its performance before Sept. 11 had flaws. But they also said the panel had underestimated the degree to which the agency had warned senior policy makers and shared information with other agencies about the terrorist threat.
****************************************
Personal comment - nothing is to be gained by making national security a partisan issue.
Relationship? You'd have to be crosseyed-ed not to seeit.
What's that old saying?
"It's the MARKET - stupid!"
Follow the money -
Always good advice when investigating a pump and dump. Who benefitted from the ACTC pump and dump? Was it the company or those who sold the shares over $2?
http://chart.bigcharts.com/custom/ameritrade-com/big.chart?symb=actc&startdate=8%2F11%2F2006&...
Hasbro - point of fact.
esammee did not say that you were from the RR - she said your information was. She also cited the specific quote showing that the nature article conveyed the procedure accurately to her.
I have not read the article but I think I understand what happened pretty well from the comments of esammee and others on this board and Yahoo.
Esammee's point is valid. Just because you and others did not get an accurate idea of what was going on does not mean that the deception was on the part of the researchers or Nature.
A reminder - the trip to 8 could be a quick one...
http://spiritsites.com/stocks/GERN/GERN%20-%20comments%20082306.htm
For that to work we would have to have a system that let us bid out contracts in a fair and competitive manner and demand a reasonable quality product for our dollar. Ain't gonna happen unless we get some grass roots reform.
I think that the first thing every citizen needs to attend to are honest elections, term limits, and prosecuting those who game the system.
Unless that gets fixed and we have a firm democratic foundation the rest is a house of cards no matter what the system is.
Totally worthless -
It isn't even a reasonable basis for the capital market in its current state. Too much game playing.
In order for the US economy to become stable again the stock market needs to be re-invented. Safeguards against manipulation must be created and enforced.
Our currency is a sham -
Our capital market is a sham -
Our executive branch is a sham -
Our courts are a sham -
Our legislature is a sham -
Our elections are a sham -
Our "religious faith" as a country is a sham -
Our diplomatic relations consist mainly of terrorist policies against other nations.
In short - this country is in big trouble.
Honest citizens need to create a democratic revolution and take back our own country.
Gold and silver are not a suitable basis for currency any more. I am expecting a pump & dump in precious metals and within 10 years a serious devaluation due to the use of nanotech and biological refining methods. Gold is not a rare metal, it is only rare in a form that we can refine economically at this time. If that changes, the value of gold changes.
This article only came up in cached form after a google search so I am archiving it here.
With the release of the interrogation manual, it is now the CIA's turn to answer a few questions.
The Terror Trade
The CIA was loath to release its manuals to the American public, but the agency has readily shared its expert opinions on interrogation with military and intelligence forces around the world. In numerous cases both the CIA and the Defense Department have been implicated in the international dissemination of torture and other political terror tactics. The tricks of the trade were often exported to governments who turned the brutal methods against their own civilians. There are too many cases on record to recount them all here, but a review of some frequently cited examples suggests that U.S. involvement in this terror trade has been so widespread that its effects can accurately be described as global in scope.
Most recently the CIA has come under scrutiny for its training of abusive officers in Guatemala and Honduras. These cases are but a sampling of the agency's experience in promoting the use of political terror in Central America. During the 1980s one of the agency's major covert operations, the contra war against Nicaragua, was repeatedly plunged into scandal due to its reliance on tactics that blatantly contradicted President Reagan's public praise of the contra guerrillas, whom he described as a force of "freedom fighters." A CIA-produced manual, Psychological Operations in Guerrilla Warfare, schooled the contras on the use of "implicit terror," kidnapping and assassinations. (21)
U.S. Army instruction programs that spread similar methods in the region are also attracting criticism. According to declassified documents and recently issued Defense Department reports, the Army's "Project X," a set of intelligence courses taught since the 1960s in countries throughout Central and South America, included instruction on how to surveil, infiltrate, and undermine dissident groups. The training covered the use of kidnapping, blackmail, and executions. The materials were later consulted in the preparation of manuals used at the Army's School of the Americas (SOA), a Ft. Benning, Georgia, facility that trains Latin American military officers. Among the objectionable tactics later found in the SOA manuals were instructions on the use of hypnotism and "truth serum" drugs in interrogation. (22)
Representative Joseph Kennedy, a longtime congressional critic of the SOA, remarked that the manuals "taught tactics that come right out of a Soviet gulag and have no place in civilized society -- they certainly have no place in any course taught with taxpayer dollars on U.S. soil by the members of our own military." (23) Amnesty International issued a statement calling for full disclosure of the history of Project X and commenting that "it seems highly unlikely that it is merely a coincidence that some of the most widespread and systematic human rights violations have taken place in precisely those countries, Colombia, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras, Mexico, and Peru, where these materials were most widely used." (24)
By virtue of their proximity to the United States, these countries bore the brunt of the abuses that accompanied U.S. counterinsurgency aid -- but the manuals and lesson plans that shared such tactics were extensively distributed outside this hemisphere as well. In March 1997 the Washington Post reported that according to Army documents and former Pentagon officials, the Project X materials "were used much more widely, by U.S. personnel working in a variety of countries," including Vietnam, Japan and Iran. (25)
CIA ties to torturers have likewise reached to every corner of the globe. The agency created and guided oppressive security programs in several Southeast Asian countries, most notably Vietnam, where the United States ran its most intensive counterinsurgency campaign. During the late 1960s, in South Vietnam the CIA set up the infamous Phoenix Program, an effort to eradicate the Viet Cong infrastructure. Phoenix is largely remembered as an assassination program (at least 20,000 suspects were murdered), but the operation also established a network of "Provincial Interrogation Centers" that often served as torture chambers. (26)
In the years that followed, the advanced counterinsurgency tactics of Phoenix were shared with thousands of foreign police officers trained by CIA instructors in various programs run by the State Department's Agency for International Development, including the Office of Public Safety and the International Police Academy. (27)
The CIA has also been directly linked to torture training in the Middle East, where the agency for two and a half decades reinforced the repressive state of Shah Mohammed Pahlevi, the dictator of Iran. Shortly before the Shah's overthrow in 1979, New York Times journalist Seymour Hersh reported that "a senior CIA official was involved in instructing officials in the Savak [the Iranian secret police] on torture techniques." Jesse J. Leaf, a former head Iran analyst for the CIA, told Hersh, "I do remember seeing and being told of [CIA personnel] who were there seeing the rooms and being told of torture. And I know that the torture rooms were toured and it was all paid for by the U.S.A." (28)
The human rights abuses promoted by the Pentagon and CIA are compounded by the abuses of government secrecy that continue to conceal many important records on these operations from public scrutiny. In the case of the Project X program, the Defense Department says it has destroyed almost all of the original documentation, purportedly to prevent further dissemination of such unacceptable tactics.
When such crucial records are wiped out of existence, our ability to document the history of U.S. military assistance and training programs is seriously impaired. Fragmentary media reports based on the recollections of former Pentagon officials are no substitute for a complete accounting of Project X. Likewise, neither the CIA's declassification of a couple incriminating manuals nor its "scrub" of its motley band of foreign assets is a substitute for a comprehensive congressional investigation of CIA cooperation with regimes that regularly employed terror tactics.
Currently there is little determination on Capitol Hill to unearth this disturbing history. For the time being, if the facts on the U.S. role in developing and exporting these tactics are to be established, they will be extracted from documents such as this interrogation manual. The document joins the steadily growing stack of declassified records that offer clues on the nature and extent of the CIA's complicity with state terror in other countries. Though much of the documentary evidence on the terror trade remains shielded by official secrecy, a close reading of this manual reveals the value of the pieces of the paper trail that we can currently examine.
Sources
(1) Intelligence Oversight Board, "Report on the Guatemala Review," June 28, 1996, p. 3.
(2) Associated Press, "Report Says CIA Guatemala Contacts Violated Human Rights," March 18, 1997.
(3) Tim Weiner, "For the U.S., a Bad Bedfellow in Guatemala," New York Times, May 12, 1996, p. E4.
(4) Frank Smyth, "The Nun Who Knew Too Much," Washington Post, May 12, 1996, p. C1.
(5) Allan Nairn, "CIA Death Squad," The Nation, April 17, 1995, p. 511. In another article two months later, Nairn identified the names and years of service for the CIA's station chiefs in Guatemala from 1977 to 1995. See "The Country Team," The Nation, June 5, 1995, p. 780.
(6) George Gedda, "Official Says CIA Hounds Him," Associated Press, November 16, 1996.
(7) George Gedda, "Ex-Clinton Aide Quits, Reams CIA," Associated Press, February 25, 1997.
(8) R. Jeffrey Smith, "CIA Drops Over 100 Informants," Washington Post, March 2, 1997, p. A1.
(9) The Baltimore Sun's four-part series on Honduras, which ran in the newspaper from June 11 to 18, 1995, is available on the Internet at http://www.sunspot.net/sunspot/crabhouse/channel/cia/honduras1.html. A reprint of the series can be purchased for $6.95 from the Baltimore Sun, 501 N. Calvert St., Baltimore, MD, 21278.
(10) Telephone interview with Gary Cohn, February 28, 1997.
(11) Daniel Schorr, National Public Radio, February 16, 1997, transcript #97021609-215.
(12) For a detailed account of Nosenko's detention, including his remarks on the interrogations and druggings, see Tom Mangold, Cold Warrior: James Jesus Angleton, the CIA's Master Spy Hunter (Simon & Schuster, 1991), pp. 160-207.
(13) Ellen Herman, "The Career of Cold War Psychology," Radical History Review, Fall 1995, pp. 53-85. This article is drawn from Herman's book The Romance of American Psychology: Political Culture in the Age of Experts (University of California Press, 1995).
(14) For numerous examples, see Christopher Simpson, Science of Coercion: Communication Research & Psychological Warfare 1945-1960 (Oxford University Press, 1994). Further insights and arguments about government attempts to harness social science expertise for national security purposes can be found in Irving Louis Horowitz, ed., The Rise and Fall of Project Camelot (M.I.T. Press, 1967).
(15) In one of his last acts as Director of Central Intelligence, in early 1973 Richard Helms ordered the destruction of the MKULTRA files (though some records survived, some of which were later declassified). See Thomas Powers, The Man Who Kept the Secrets: Richard Helms and the CIA (Alfred A. Knopf, 1979), p. 272. Concerning still-classified records, Steven Aftergood of the Federation of American Scientists' Project on Government Secrecy recently noted: "In 1995, the Presidential Advisory Committee on Human Radiation Experiments called for the expeditious declassification of all surviving classified records from MKULTRA and more than half a dozen related CIA human experimentation programs from the late 1940s to the early 1970s. To date, the CIA has not complied with this recommendation." See Steven Aftergood, "Secrecy and Accountability in U.S. Intelligence," paper presented at Center for International Policy seminar on intelligence reform, October 9, 1996, note 2. (Available on the Internet at http://www.fas.org/sgp/cipsecr.html).
(16) John Marks, The Search for the "Manchurian Candidate": The CIA and Mind Control (Times Books, 1979), p. 128.
(17) Ibid., p. 161.
(18) Simpson, p. 186 n117.
(19) Marks, p. 143.
(20) Ibid., pp. 164-181; pp. Orrin DeForest and David Chanoff, Slow Burn: The Rise and Bitter Fall of American Intelligence in Vietnam (Simon & Schuster, 1990), 63-66.
(21) Peter Kornbluh, Nicaragua: The Price of Intervention (Institute for Policy Studies, 1987), pp. 43-45.
(22) Dana Priest, "Army's Project X Had Wider Audience," Washington Post, March 6, 1997, p. A1.
(23) Office of Representative Joseph P. Kennedy, Press Release, "Kennedy Responds to Pentagon Report on 'Torture' Manuals," February 21, 1997.
(24) Amnesty International USA, Statement on United States Army Training Manuals Containing Materials Inconsistent With U.S. Policy, October 4, 1996.
(25) Priest, "Army's Project X Had Wider Audience."
(26) See Douglas Valentine, The Phoenix Program (William Morrow and Company, 1990), pp. 73-88.
(27) See Michael McClintock, Instruments of Statecraft: U.S. Guerrilla Warfare, Counterinsurgency, and Counterterrorism, 1940-1990 (Pantheon Books, 1992), pp. 188-196.
(28) Seymour M. Hersh, "Ex-Analyst Says CIA Rejected Warning on Shah," New York Times, January 7, 1979, p. A3.
Email from OTC journal - not sure of how I got on the list, but I thought you guys might want to read about what they had to say about ACTC:
Advanced Cellular (OTC BB: ACTC) Capital Raise Resets the Bar
There isn't much else to write about this weekend. ACTC was clearly the story of the week in an otherwise dull, listless, last week of summer. However, ACTC is providing all the fireworks we need for a little excitement.
Earlier this past week I chronicled the meteoric one day rise of 357% post release of the article in Nature Magazine. ACTC scientists are doing something no one else in the Stem Cell industry has done. It's not new to OTC Journal readers, but it is new to many investors that didn't have the advantage of knowing about the company months ago.
When I pointed to the stock as the biggest one day gain in OTC Journal history, one loyal reader pointed out that, as measured from the level at which I first introduced the company it was only a 40% gain. True, but nevertheless it still traded up 357% in one day. I never said it was from the level of the first edition back in March. In fact, my SSL for traders over the long, listless summer months was $.75. Therefore, if you had a trading mentality, you should have been out of the stock if you followed my advice- who knew this would happen? On the plus side, I have written many times that this company could be the recipient of high profile publicity which would put a charge in the stock.
Yesterday, the company held a conference call to discuss recent developments. I had the opportunity to listen to the replay late in the day, but didn't realize I would have to budget an hour for the call.
If you are interested in this stock, you should listen to the call. It is extremely enlightening. I found it interesting as much for what was said as what wasn't said. CEO Bill Caldwell and Stem Cell pioneer Michael West discussed at great length the importance of their breakthrough. In short, the company can take a one to eight cell Blastomere (an early stage human egg) and extract and cultivate fetal stem cells. From there, the Blastomere can become a viable egg from which a human life can be born. Why is this important?- Because it meets President Bush's rather Draconian demand that new fetal stem cells lines be created without harm to potential human life. It allows the NIH to fund more research.
Here's what wasn't said. During the conference call, management did not address the company's ability to infuse a Blastomere with some else's DNA. This gives ACTC to create a custom fetal stem cell just for you. This discussion gets into the moral issues associated with potential cloning. At this stage I believe the company wants to focus on the less controversial aspects of what they have achieved.
I strongly recommend listening to the call. The management does a much better job than I do describing their breakthrough. Click Here to be directed to the call.
The high print on Thursday was $2.30 (up from $.40 early in the week), at which point the rally turned the other way, and the stock tanked. The sell off was sparked by ACTC disclosure of a financing.
The original group that had invested about $17 million in a debt deal with the company was holding approximately 14.2 million warrants with conversion prices of $2.53 and $1.27. The shares underlying these warrants were already registered. In a move designed to use their new found fame to load up their treasury with cash, the company reset the price of all the warrants to $.95, and forced their conversion.
Net result: The company issued another 14.2 million shares, and will receive in return $13.5 million in cash, which buys them another year of operations. I think this was a great move. They needed to raise more money. They achieved it in one day, and it all happened as a result of the market's recognition of their achievements. They took advantage of a hot market to reload their treasury. Imagine the arrangement they would have cut had the stock been trading at the depressed $.40 level with little or no volume? This was much better for existing shareholders.
Here's the chart of this crazy week. The stock runs from $.40 to a high print of $2.30 in 1 1/2 trading days. Then it tanks. Why does it sell off so abruptly? - because the company announces they just sold 14.2 million free trading shares at $.95.
Here's the typical sequence on an event like this. The first money to pounce on the stock comes from investors who read the new information, understood the significance, and wanted to own a piece of the company. The next money in, perhaps later that day or early the next, is the hot money- traders who are buying the stock because it is trading huge volume and going up.
Then, behind the scenes you have the warrant holders who make their deal with the company. Believe me, this is a risk averse bunch. They don't put their capital at risk long term. They structure "no lose" arrangements. I absolute guarantee this bunch has sold every single share they could, and sold them as quickly as they could. It would not surprise me to learn that all 14.2 million shares have already been dumped. Also, as the hot money learns about the massive issuance of shares below the current market, yesterday's buyer becomes today's seller. Hence, the rapid blow off in the stock.
I believe the stock could now well be a great opportunity for both investors and traders. Here's why: I am quite certain the excess supply created by the warrant conversion has already been absorbed by the market. The supply will now dry up.
Like a faithful labrador retriever fetching a tennis ball, the stock honed in on guess what price? - you got it - $.95- the exact same price as the warrant conversion.
Moreover, $.95 is extremely close to the $1.05 perfect 61.8% retracement of the entire move.
If I had to make an educated guess, I would say the market has already absorbed the excess supply from the newly issued 14.2 million shares at $.95, and will now head back up.
In the meantime, there is probably more high profile publicity in store for this company. Look for a number of major news organizations have an interest in a small Stem Cell company that has met Bush's challenge on the moral issues. A Wall Street Journal reporter was on the conference call asking questions.
If you are a trader and want to jump in, your SSL is $.75 once again. If you just want to own a piece of this technology for the long term, own some now and don't worry about where it goes in the short term- either up or down.
More on the technology sometime next week.
*****************************************
Personally, there is no way I would own a stock that pumps on a secondary like this one did. It seems obvious where Geron's bad reputation originated - with the "father" of the industry.
Chris, that's an estimate by a researcher and it was qualified with an "if all goes well". Have you ever given an overly optimistic estimate on a project? I certainally have.
Charts are complicated. You have to use multiple indicators and multiple time frames in order to get the whole picture. That's why I've made up the HTML template that puts it all on one page.
Right now we are holding 6.55 which is a good sign because there was a lot of buying at that level yesterday.
Bear in mind, though, that on Friday a lot of the fund managers go home early and the hedgies come out to play. It's a good time for head fakes & manipulation.
TA chart posted on the 23rd - scroll down the page until you see the brick colored volume bars on the left, then move right to the daily chart. See comments below the chart.
They will try to hold us at this range as long as possible because next significant resistance is around 8.
http://spiritsites.com/stocks/GERN/GERN%20-%20comments%20082306.htm
What roadblock are you talking about? I thought Kierstead said they would be in the clinic late this year or early next and I've heard nothing to indicate this would not be true.
Shorts are in trouble -
http://realtime.bigcharts.com/custom/ameritrade2/big.chart?symb=GERN&time=4hr&freq=3mi&m...
Volume spike just now was bigger than yesterday's.
Hourly showing breakout and great volume spikes. If we hold 6.55 today I'm saying that tomorrow will be an up day too.
It implies that someone out there is doing a pump & dump on ACT - nothing more.
TA - if GERN holds above the 6.30 - 6.40 support shown on intraday it should continue to move up without regart to the ACT stuff. I would not short it here, spike was not sufficient.
http://realtime.bigcharts.com/custom/ameritrade2/big.chart?symb=GERN&time=4hr&freq=2mi&m...
http://chart.bigcharts.com/custom/ameritrade-com/big.chart?symb=GERN&startdate=7%2F30%2F2006&...
Theory: whoever got the ACT secondary is doing a pump & dump - they are doing a little action on the other stemmies to make it look like a sector thing.
The frustration is that Geron reports real medical progress and it gets ignored, while this b.s. moves the stem cell stocks.
Proof positive that the stock moves according to the whim of the MM's and hedgies, not with news.
Yeah, watch for MLM distribution of the stock through Amway.
Close over the 50 day and a nice candlestick pattern.
http://stockcharts.com/gallery/?GERN
I tend to be cautious about analyzing for others, but I believe that we are at or close to the bottom. Yes, we could revisit the 5.50 area but it would take negative news (can't think what that might be) or a negative market.
http://spiritsites.com/stocks/GERN/GERN%20-%20comments%20082306.htm
Warning - chart is graphics intensive and takes a while to load. If you don't have broadband you might not want to try it.
Dude - I am deleting a post that had no content other than slamming another poster. Please refrain from the nasty cracks. If you disagree make a counter claim.
I really don't blame the company. It's the perversion of the capital markets in this country that's the problem.
Geron will get jerked around until the science becomes so obvious that the instys start fighting to get a piece of it.
They are re-inventing medical science. That takes time.
Done..
and my reply to Mr Quint is on the new board.
http://www.investorshub.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=12828019
In the future when I discuss a side issue I will post it over there and post once and only once here summarizing the issue.
Mr Quint's post from Geron board:
http://www.investorshub.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=12827310
<<<There are some nasty things in the O.T. too.>>>
Absolutely. The Book of Deuteronomy is almost a "How to Rape and Get Away with It" manual
<<<If your religion is the starting place for a personal search for Truth, it is a good thing.>>>
Not really... there is no truth in the tales written by bronze aged gypsies.
*************
My comment - yes really. As Yeshua (Jesus) taught, the Truth is within. Those tales you refer to are the cultural history of the Hebrew people. Many of those people loved God and advanced civilization. There are things that can be learned from the Bible and any religious book but we learn by asking the questions that mankind has already asked again and again.
*************
<<<If it becomes your excuse for thinking you are better or holier than your neighbor and your justification for hating and abusing your neighbor it is a bad thing.>>>
That's all religion does... it causes people to think that they understand the mind of an All Powerful Cosmos Creating Deity (a deity that also happens to care about our sex lives).
So when a person thinks they understand the mind of this creature, they get delusions of grandeur.
*************
I can assure you that that is not all religion does. The Bible can be read in an attitude of prayer and with the interpretation of the Holy Spirit. When you do this you begin to discern Truth. The Bible is a tool, and I have found it to be a very useful tool.
Yeshua said that we need to be willing to give up everything to follow Christ (Christ is the annointed of God according to Hebrew tradition, not an aspect of a mythical trinity). I beieve that the first thing you have to be willing to give up is the dogma of religion and seek the Truth within.
Peace,
Paula
Minotaur & everyone - I've created an auxiliary board for side discussons.
http://www.investorshub.com/boards/board.asp?board_id=6690
I would like to point out that the discussion is NOT one sided as you stated Minotaur. Jim does not seem to be "politically left of center" to me.
There are some nasty things in the O.T. too.
Personally, I believe that religion is simply a cultural artifact. It is the story that your culture tells you about God. It is what the individual does with religion that is important.
If your religion is the starting place for a personal search for Truth, it is a good thing. If it becomes your excuse for thinking you are better or holier than your neighbor and your justification for hating and abusing your neighbor it is a bad thing.
Jim, you've made a bunch of assumptions...
First is that I glossed over the Fox report. I watched it completely the first time I ran into it and have run into other aspects of the same information on several different sites. I am starting to put to gether a more complete picture of this whole mess.
Second, you seem to think I give more credence to the blogger. I don't. It's just part of the whole. I am trying to understand the whole.
Third you state "The Blogger reports the same thing , but makes it seem as though he's the only one thats "digging" , AND being hounded and beaten for it , repeatedly saying he can't mention his "sources" . Sources for what ? For a story that was already covered on national news long before his ? "
Fox covered one aspect. I think there is a lot more to the story and that is what Cameron is going for.
"There very well may be a conspiracy to squash any news that Israel has spies in the US ... but it takes a Blogger to get your attention , long after Fox had covered the same thing . Why ?"
Why do you presume that I haven't paid attention to this before? Why do you need to accuse me?
"Conspiracy" doesn't float my boat. It scares the hell out of me. I was peripherally involved ith the "intelligence community" in my early 20's. I know that conspiracies are real. I know that people within our government will blackmail or even murder citizens of this country and those people don't give a damn for the constitution and your rights or mine.
If these are the folks who hold most of the power in Washington right now (and I think there is abundant evidence to support this) we are ALL in trouble.
Perhaps this will help you with your misconceptions about Islam:
http://www.mpfweb.org/islam14questions.htm
jcssms needs to be aware that if he persists his posts will be deleted.
Half & jcssms - I have a problem with your attitude.
My posts had nothing to do with Kerry ,but you said they did. This is a falsehood.
I am not a "lib" who can not win an election...
I am a patriot who believes that elections should be fair and not rigged.
Do you have a problem with a fair election? Do you think it's OK that an election can be altered with a garage door control in someone's pocket?
I tried to cover that in the initial post. I don't think political posts should be outlawed, but like all communication, it's a two way street. If the political discussion were to become overwhelming we can always start an auxiliary board like Zeev did ( do a board search, you will find a zeev thread with and without politics).
The key to a fulfilling life is balance. The same should be true here.
Love & Light
Paula
"The political avalanche on Yahoo in recent times eventually destroyed the board. The board was for the most part was anti republican and anti Bush."
I don't believe this is true. I beliebve an illusion was created by a few vocal and multi-id'd individiduals who wanted to poliarize the discussion and disrupt the board. When the political discussions began there were many more rec's for the "liberal" posts than the conservative.
I still maintain that it was the constant abuse (aphapsyche and moms) and the stupidity (geron janitor & jok-o-whatever) and stupidity that drove folks away, not respectful discussion of important political issues.
"Finally I find no fault with your political opinions (opposite of mine for the most part) or your efforts to make this board a success I hope you do.But I doubt it will ever reach heights we once enjoyed."
First of all, I have to emphasize that most of what I post on Yahoo is research on political issues, not opinion. Things like the FACT that some voting machines can have the tally switched with a garage door opener are important no matter what "side" you are on unless you are opposed to democracy itself.
I have yet to see anyone on the "other side" post any comparable research, with the exception of a couple of articles NS linked to recently that seemed to support the concept of a morally bankrupt administration. There is something very wrong in this country if we can no longer discuss political issues.
If the information is posted, traffic will build here. The format is vastly superior to Yahoo.
Love & Light,
Paula
A true teacher teaches one to look within, not to look at the guru.