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erthang: amateur hour at the apollo is over. issuing shares to directors/officers is just as dilutive as issuing shares to outside investors...they equally lessen the potential returns of current shareholders.
reading the financials of BOCX is like watching a drunk tightrope act. i am hoping that the second milestone comes soon, and that it involves a more significant payment. there are a lot of things we are NOT able to do as a company for the sole reason that we are in the poor house. that is a horrible predicament, considering the amazing potential of the technology and potential.
hey we got picked up by at least one news source, dinky as it may be:
http://www.genengnews.com/news/bnitem.aspx?name=392604
GREAT FIND HALFULL!! I've been all over the ABT sites and never stumbled upon that page. That is a very interesting look into what BOCX went through to get a deal with Abbott. A very formal and seemingly rigorous process!
If you look through ABT's archive you will notice that they don't just spawn partnerships every other day. That page gives a good idea why...nothing loosey goosey about it!
smartinvestor: not $9...it would be $11.40. The $9 number was the present value based on the discount. The discount, however, should be applied for every year UNTIL the future value is realized...I made an error with that. Thus if you think it would be one year off you'd apply 20%. 2 years would be 40%, etc.
Looking back on those old projections of mine, I would probably tweak them to some extent but not too much (ie...would decrease shares OS slightly, add to overhead slightly, and apply a tax rate after the first year or so when we've burned through our carryforwards). I think as a general rule of thumb it's safe to use $10/share for every $20 mil in revenue.
Remember, though, that $20 mil in royalty revenue means $150 - $250 mil in total RECAF revenue (the % royalty has yet to be disclosed and probably won't be until we see product revenue).
Frankly, though, my position has always been that running projections for a stock like this at the stage we're at is a pure circle jerk. When we run it will be because of hype and momentum NOT earnings, and we may very well be bought before we see a dime of EPS (although the insiders would have to be on board since they own a sizable chunk)
and thus you see why independant, large scale sampling is CRITICAL....not just important -- CRITICAL.
7,801,837 shares issued in 2005. 160,000 of those were at $1 and the rest were sub-$1. The vast majority of the shares were issued at a tenth of a penny to directors/officers since the company had nothing else to compensate with.
That is called EXTREME dilution and anybody who doesn't see that is in EXTREME denial.
erthang, stop embarassing yourself. the stock issuances i posted were all 2005. as i said, 2006 is not in yet but when they file the 10q it will undoubtedly show more. despite that moro said he "didn't want to dilute" at these low levels in his interview, the SEC FILINGS do not lie.
don't get me wrong...i don't fault the company for selling at these low levels -- they have no choice right now.
the only thing that bothers me is when people say don't worry about the share price just worry about the fundamentals. at this stage in the game the share price has a huge effect on the fundamentals.
PS: granting options/warrants to directors at these low levels counts as dilution. if the stock price was higher, we'd be able to compensate them exactly the same with much less dilution.
erthang: please tell me you're kidding. where do you think our operating cash comes from if we're not selling shares...the ABT upfront payment? LOL. Below is some flavor from the recently filed 10-k of dilutive measures -- look how we're just giving away ownership in the company. The 10Q for Q1 06 is not in yet but you will see when it is that nothing has changed...we have no choice but to sell shares at low prices at this point. That's why it bothers me when anybody, including you, makes light of the share price:
For the year ended December 31, 2005:
a) In December 2005, the Company received subscriptions of $19,712 for 394,244 shares of common stock at $0.05 per share pursuant to the exercise of warrants.
b) In December 2005, the Company received subscriptions of $50,000 for 500,000 shares of common stock at $0.10 per share pursuant to the exercise of warrants.
c) In December 2005, the Company received subscriptions of $16,250 for 325,000 shares of common stock at $0.05 per share pursuant to the exercise of warrants.
d) In December 2005, the Company issued 25,000 shares of common stock for consulting services at a fair value of $22,250.
e) In December 2005, two directors cancelled 1,750,000 options to purchase the Company’s common stock for $1,750.
f) In December 2005, a director cancelled 450,000 warrants to purchase the Company’s common stock for $450.
g) In August 2005, the Company issued 77,266 shares of common stock at $0.75 per share for proceeds of $57,950.
h) In July 2005, the Company issued 20,000 shares of common stock for legal services received at a fair value of $23,000 .
i) In July 2005, the Company entered into a consulting and marketing service agreement for a period of ninety days. The Company issued 50,000 shares of common stock at a fair value of $50,000.
j) In June 2005, the Company issued 600,000 shares of common stock at $0.10 per share pursuant to the exercise of warrants for proceeds of $60,000.
k) In June 2005, the Company issued 4,545 shares of common stock for consulting services at a fair value of $5,000.
l) In June 2005, the Company issued 135,000 shares of common stock at $1.00 per share for proceeds of $135,000.
m) In May 2005, the Company issued 682,714 shares of common stock at $0.21 per share pursuant to the exercise of warrants for proceeds of $143,370.
n) In May 2005, the Company issued 25,000 shares of common stock at $1.00 per share for proceeds of $25,000.
o) In May 2005, the Company issued 15,000 shares of common stock at a fair value at $18,900 to an employee for a performance bonus.
p) In April 2005, an employee exercised 5,000 options to purchase the Company’s common stock for $3,000. The Company received a note receivable for $3,000.
q) In March 2005, the Company issued 213,576 shares of common stock pursuant to the exercise of 272,903 warrants by a note holder. This exercise was based on the cashless exercise provision of the stock purchase warrant.
r) In March 2005, two directors exercised 1,750,000 options to purchase the Company’s common stock for $1,750.
s) In March 2005, a director exercised 450,000 warrants to purchase the Company’s common stock for $450.
t) In March 2005, the Company issued 25,000 shares of common stock at $0.07 per share pursuant to the exercise of stock options for proceeds of $1,750.
u) In March 2005, the Company issued 50,000 shares of common stock at $0.21 per share pursuant to the exercise of warrants for proceeds of $10,500.
v) In March 2005, the Company issued 30,000 shares of common stock at a fair value of $27,000 for consulting services provided.
w) In February 2005, the Company issued 209,000 shares of common stock to seven employees for the exercise of their options at their option price of $0.60. The Company received note receivables totaling $125,400.
x) In February 2005, the Company issued 7,042 shares of common stock at a fair value of $5,000 for consulting services rendered by Pacific.
y) In February 2005, the Company issued 8,450 shares of common stock at a fair value of $6,000 for consulting services received.
erthang: it's nice that you were able to load up on the cheap, but meanwhile we've been diluting the company at sub $1 prices.
i don't call that a blessing.
Kag, despite the data released this week for breast cancer I still believe that the first indication Abbott will pursue will be prostate cancer. This is because there is already a working serum-based assay for prostate cancer, and that assay just sucks.
steelcity: it goes back to reg FD once again. a milestone payment by abbott would be considered a material event and thus be reported directly.
steelcity: this stock will never, ever hold a breakout until we are on a real exchange. the liquidity pool is simply too small to sustain a breakout. being on the pink sheets makes us untouchable to about 99% of the available investment capital.
we will have little fly by night breakouts here and there, but the real deal will come when we are on a real exchange.
the good news is that there are no hoops to jump through for a listing on amex/nasdaqSC. you either have the shareholder equity on your balance sheet or you don't...it's that simple.
we are one milestone payment or equity financing away from instantaneous listing on a real exchange.
Misleading and factually false. He will be banned, gentleman. Matt, who is the Admin here, does not stand for foul play.
erthang he's not long and never was
bashers are one thing, but posting factually false information is a different story. I am also preparing a letter to the SEC -- they have been cracking down on rings of message board bashers and might be interested. you can check the "Bans" section of the board to see that the Admins here actually do something unlike RB.
KJG: I have reported you to the Admins here for posting false and misleading information about the company, and I advise others on this board to do the same. Moro and Gold have not sold a single share into this press release. The last filing was the 10k on 3/30:
http://yahoo.brand.edgar-online.com/default.aspx?cik=1092562
Dr. Wittenberg has NOT filed a Form 4 you almost gave me a frigging heart attack. He is the main squeeze in the company, I believe even moreso than Moro (from an ownership perspective).
Don't get me wrong...I expect the D/O's to take out some $$ here and there, and there is nothing wrong with that. But a form 4 right now would have signaled to me that there is no more significant news coming in the near-term.
I highly doubt Dr. Wittenberg and co exercised their options a few weeks ago for this announcement on breast cancer...they have made similar announcements in the past with minimal market reaction and I am pretty confident that they didn't expect this kind of market reaction to yet another internal study. Heck I still think we give back most of our gains before moving higher.
$2+ by fall.
kjg: I guess when you're trading tiny little blocks it's no biggy to scalp in and out of this thing without moving the market. But some of us here actually have real positions which took months if not years to accumulate. Some of us also understand the value of long term capital gains tax.
well guys i guess the pps party is over. $2 by fall...ta-ta.
kag: Moro has had his run in with the SEC...I just don't see him violating reg FD to time the market. These guys maintain sox compliance while on the pink sheets for crying out loud! Who does that LOL?!
erthang: despite our sparring i must reiterate my gratitude to you for that interview...unquestionably the greatest contribution to this board since I've been here.
Kag that is all fine and dandy but there is a little thing called regulation full disclosure (reg FD) which makes it illegal for CEO's to time the market in the fashion you're describing. Material events must be disclosed immediately.
I am not wrong on this: BOCX will be at $2 or more before the first day of fall. If that prediction doesn't come true I will change my name to ERTHANGSHUMBLESERVANT. Mark this post.
bob...the volume has absolutely left the building...we're in trickle mode. that tells me that the momentum traders are done here until the next episode. to think that they will suddenly show up again tomorrow doesn't make sense to me, so i definitely expect B.
bob i think you'll get filled on those. if this thing ever held a breakout it'd be a miracle.
kag stop screwing with my heartrate :)
Amazing how the directors started excercising their options right before this breakout. they also did that last year right before the abbott announcement. i have a feeling that there is much more in store for us in the near-term.
guys reread erthang's post he didn't say he sold...he said he's NOT selling until double digits.
Love the action, let's hope we hold above $1.
i'd love to be wrong.
Erthang: Every time the share price is mentioned, you interject with a rant about how the share price doesn't matter and those who are concerned with it "don't deserve to make money" and are otherwise negative. My point is that the share price does matter, BIGTIME, so enough with that lecture please.
Now, let's hope for a good day tomorrow. I don't think we will have some big run and would be satisfied to just see us hold these levels. A run to $1 would be nice but as always with this stock, we will float back down until we hit the next pivotal event.
PS: you don't have to pay for third party verification...yes, you can hire a reference lab, but you can also start lining up prestigious institutions (unlike Goshen) for collaborative efforts. Moro has chosen to pursue neither. There is no excuse for that after all these years and I guarantee you it is a massive red flag for all institutional and serious/high net worth investors that look at this stock.
erthang: you're missing the point. when you make comments like "i hope the stock goes lower so i can buy more" and "moro shouldn't care about the stock price" you are revealing yourself as a complete ignoramous and a poor excuse for a shareholder.
i am a longterm shareholder and, while i'd love a big spike to make me feel good, i wouldn't be selling regardless so it doesn't matter in that regard. now...any longterm shareholder that has a clue does not want to see the share price at low levels because of two pretty important issues: DILUTION and LEVERAGE.
we are in the development stage and need to raise money literally every quarter to stay afloat. every quarter that we dilute OUR company by selling shares at these low levels is extremely detrimental to our LONG TERM future. so, if you think dr moro is somehow excused from concering himself with this "small" issue you are smoking some good s**t.
so, you see, there is great importance to a healthy share price other than us peons seeing our account values go up.
get a clue buddy and please stop your gestapo party line about the share price not mattering and you hope it goes down and moro shouldn't care and blah blah blah. it's not about our account values, it's about the LONG TERM health of the company. if you care about the company and the technology, you by default should place great importance on the share price at this early stage in the company's development. Moro, as the CEO, should consider it one of his highest priority unless he is magically going to stop selling shares at these insanely low levels (dilution) and not approach anybody else for licensing (leverage).
feel free to attack me personally but please don't argue with the above as it is indisputable fact and everyone here knows it.
i feel like the homely girl at the prom who just got asked to dance.
dakota: yup...and if BOCX wanted to play the game that the others do of pulling the specificity cutoff down to 80 - 90%, sensitivity would probably go up to around 100%.
HalfFull, it's possible but I have a hard time believing that blind sample verification with a large pharma would not be performed under an NDA. Makes no sense to me.
Maybe ERTHANG can call Dr. Moro and find out for us if he can muster up the money to pay for the long-distance call...
I'm glad to see the news and it is truly phenomenal data...not to be crabby but Moro still hasn't learned his lesson about third party verification. He says that the study was blinded, but makes no mention of WHO provided the samples and WHO revealed the diagnosis after the fact. I'm absolutely sick of that. Before I get pummeled by the board (ahem ERTHANG), realize that this is an incredibly important issue. If Moro were to run his trials through a university, a third party reference lab, or some other independant entity -- and disclose who the entity was -- this data he puts out would actually be taken seriously.
yeeehaw price and volume let's hope it continues
LOL...what an entertaining fellow. Erthang, if you promise to rant and rave like that on a regular basis I promise to stop complaining. Funny stuff...
Maybe I should complain more...+10% on heavy volume.