Programing (PRGM)

[gotmilk]

The download contains a detailed Help file one can bring up at the Dos Prompt
(7-zip.chm 77,414 bytes)




doug

[Dimension]

thx for this...

[gotmilk]

Geeks Gone Wild (aka) Over The Top Geekness

When programmers get together to make an open-source zip utility
for their own usage, not for the general public like them Churakians.

7-Zip 4.42 (Windows 98/Me/NT/2000/XP/2003 Server)
License: Free
Limitations: None
File size: 817K
http://sourceforge.net/projects/sevenzip/
http://www.7-zip.org/

After the following image taken at the DOS command line > 7z
are two other zip utilities listed:
WinZip 10 $29 File size 6MB
WinRAR 3.61 $29 File size 1MB



WinZip 10
License: Free to try; $29.95 to buy
Limitations: No limitations
File size: 5.58MB
Windows 98/Me/2000/XP
Note: WinZip is now bundled with Google Toolbar and Google Desktop Search.

WinRAR 3.61
License: Free to try; $29.00 to buy
Limitations: 40-day trial, some features disabled
Windows 95/98/Me/NT/2000/XP
File size: 1,010K

doug

[sarals]

LOL

[gotmilk]

Oops, I forgot your "see a nice IDE for that"

Now that my homeworld Pluto is no longer a planet I must travel to a parallel universe
as an IDE (Inter Dimensional Entity) to do an IDE (Interplanetary Dust Experiment)

:)

[Dimension]

ditto!

[sarals]

could be handy, thanks for the info :)

[gotmilk]

sarals & Dimension,

Yes there is something like it out there for Windows/Dos.

Gulp.exe (Freeware)


"it may not be that difficult to write one"

All the code does is:

Read a line from a file, search for a character or string match,
and if found write that line plus any lines prior or after if a number
one through nine is on the command line, rather than a zero.

(i.e.)

> Gulp apple PieRecipes 0
> Gulp apple PieRecipes 3

A string is enclosed in quotes:

> Gulp "mac apple" PieRecipes 0

Rather than have multiple search items on the command line,
the program will prompt you for them, as follows:

Note:
1. the -1 tells Gulp to prompt for the search items
2. strings are not enclosed in quotes
3. signal no more search items by typing in -end-

> Gulp -1 PieRecipes 0
> apple
> pears
> white grapes
>-end-

Note:

This -1 method lets you create a text file of items to search for,
just create a file, for example at the DOS prompt:
> copy con > Inn
> apple
> pears
> white grapes
>-end-
> Ctrl-Z

Now these items can be searched for without typing them in again.
(i.e.) at the DOS prompt using the Unix pipe

> TYPE Inn | Gulp -1 PieRecipes 0 > Results01
> TYPE Inn | Gulp -1 CakeRecipes 0 > Results02

Now once the results are viewed one can edit the Inn file if needed,
or make a copy of it to be modified as another searching try.

WARNING... follows are the Help and Example files generated by Gulp.exe.

These happen whenever Gulp is executed without any parameters to give
hopefully helpful hints on what it needs to execute.

As we all know, instructions are not usually user-friendly.

One needs to actually try it and see whats happens.

> Gulp


> Gulp help


> Gulp example


doug

[sarals]

interesting idea, could be useful

most of my programming these days is in PHP or javascript. I wouldn't mind see a nice IDE for that.

[Dimension]

That would be useful. There must be something like it out there for Windows/Dos i'd think. Otherwise, it may not be that difficult to write one i think...

[gotmilk]

sarals & Dimension,

Many years ago I did a little C programming, and whenever I searched into the .C file using FINDSTR
or while inside the utility that came with the development kit, I remember that as expected only
the line(s) with the search term(s) were displayed.

Since I did a lot of Newlines and Tabs to make the sources easy to read I never got enough information
on what that line of code actually did, as in what the just prior lines of code did to initialize etc variables.

I figured that if a few lines that just preceded the line with the search strings were also displayed,
that that would help locate what I was looking for when lots of search hits were found.

Do either of you two see how this could help do your coding?

Even if you could have the option in the search to also be able to decide how many lines, 0 - 9,
and be able to decide if they are the prior line, or after lines, or both?

Its been too long since I used an Unix grep to remember what it could do, but it was very powerful,
and it did hurt my brain a little to figure it out :)

Just wondering about this since I remember a few years ago Matt had to look at IH's code
to check a zillion places for Bob's Oops :o) and if Matt has this type of search utility,
and a text file of the code, it could have been done quicker.

doug

[Dimension]

i think their source is saved in a regular ascii file (with an .asp extenstion). From my experience, you can open and edit most asp files in notepad.

as for search files for text...i have linux emulator installed and use grep for searching text. that's overkill for just that one function.

You can use windows search to search the content file.
As far as DOS, i've tested both FIND and FINDSTR. FINDSTR is better as it just lists the files that have matches by default. it also has a lot more command line options you can use when searching.

[sarals]

although programs like Word add formating codes, you can still use a simple text search for actual text within the documents because it's still there in tact, just surrounded by a bunch of other stuff that might look weird in raw form.

As for the programming that Bob and Dave write, it depends on their tools. But most programming tools have build in search features. Dreamweaver, which is my main tool for websites, has a pretty good find and/or find and replace feature.

And you can always use the windows explorer search on any file.

Is there something more specific you are trying to do that I might be able to help with?

[gotmilk]

Yes the dos help command does a good job. I'm wondering that with all the windows environment,
and powerful document utilities, that very few articles written are in simple text format. I'm one that never uses fancy & powerful document creation programs, only Notepad, and don't know how one can search for strings inside them. For example, all that code Bob and Dave writes for SI and IH,
how do they locate stuff? Infact I have no idea if their sources written are in text
or in a special editor that inserts "funny" characters for the complier (if used) to read. For sure they can send to the printer the sources to read,
and here I wonder if they can have a simple text only version FOO.TXT generated to search,
or does their source generating utility have a good search built in?

doug

[sarals]

wow, it's been so long I don't remember much. I think I finally through out my DOS reference books last year because I hadn't used them in so long.

I do remember you can get syntax help for dos commands by doing:

help find

or

help findstr

does that help?

[gotmilk]

Question on working with text files in Microsoft's DOS

First, does anyone do this, and if so do you use FIND and FINDSTR?

doug

[sarals]

private headers....

what are private headers? why would a firewall want to block them?

[sarals]

thanks for the response :)

[Dimension]

xhtml is basically XML. it's the way to go if you ever want to render the out put of your page a different way or display it in a different manner. with XHTML, you can also programatically search easier without having to parse html

[sarals]

XHTML vs HTML

anyone have an preferences? opinions?

[sarals]

it seems to me that programmers writing software for apple would be more interested in doing so if they felt they could get their stuff to sell for other platforms as well....

[Dimension]

interesting read...i've worked on a few "black-ops" projects myself...projects where one group or manager was trying to prototype something they hope will allow them to wrest controll from another group....so you're not allowed to let anyone know you are working it....yeah, corporate america is full of politics another nasties!
that Marklar project sounds like a black-ops gig...

it noticed the statement you bolded...that's interesting. Not sure how he's going to prevent that, but if he can, then he can market macs for their software and OS, but also allow it to run regular Windows based software...and market the Macs as the best of both worlds.

[sarals]

Apple's Next Test: Get Developers to Write Programs for Intel Chips
By JOHN MARKOFF and LAURIE J. FLYNN
Published: June 7, 2005

SAN FRANCISCO, June 6 - Steven P. Jobs took the stage at Apple Computer's Worldwide Developers Conference on Monday to tell more than 3,000 of his most enthusiastic fans - and occasionally also his harshest critics - that he was giving them a new homework assignment: to rework their Macintosh programs to run on chips from Intel.

Apple's decision to shift the Macintosh microprocessor business to Intel, a longtime rival, after more than a decade with I.B.M. was the latest bold maneuver in his eight years back at the Apple helm, a period in which he has reinvigorated the Macintosh line and overseen Apple's ascendancy in the digital music business.

Mr. Jobs said the company would begin incorporating Intel chips in some Macs reaching the market next year and largely complete the changeover by 2008. For the transition, Apple will offer a new version of its operating system, Macintosh OS X Tiger, that will run on both I.B.M. and Intel chips.

One immediate challenge will be to persuade Apple customers to continue to buy Mac computers based on I.B.M.'s PowerPC chip while they wait for the Intel versions to arrive. But in an interview after his presentation on Monday, Mr. Jobs said he believed that Apple would be able to navigate around that obstacle.

To hear Mr. Jobs describe it, the switch was a logical and straightforward business decision.

"It didn't feel to me like a long march," he said, describing a moment several months ago when he realized he would end his relationship with I.B.M. He said the decision seemed obvious to his small team of top managers. "There was a day when we looked at each other and said, 'this is the right thing to do.' "

Indeed, it was a contingency he had been preparing for since he returned to Apple, he said on Monday. He showed a satellite map of Apple's corporate headquarters and pinpointed the building where a secret engineering project, code-named Marklar, had been tuning Apple's software on Intel-powered computers bought off the shelf.

"Macintosh OS X has been leading a secret double life for the past five years," he said.

Apple had been counting on a version of the PowerPC processor that required less power and produced less heat, but had not gotten one from I.B.M. and its partner, Freescale Semiconductor. In addition, several analysts said they believed that I.B.M. had refused Apple's demands for deep discounts.

No financial details of the Apple-Intel deal were disclosed.

On Wall Street on Monday, both Apple and Intel shares moved down slightly. Apple's stock closed at $37.92, down 32 cents, while Intel's stock ended at $27.17, off 16 cents.

Yet a number of Wall Street analysts said the deal made sense. "My belief is that Apple had to do it," said Eugene Munster, an analyst with Piper Jaffray. "Clearly, they needed better availability, better pricing and a better development community." Mr. Munster has an outperform rating for Apple stock.

For his part, Mr. Jobs did not ascribe his decision to any pique with I.B.M., of which Apple remains a customer for other chips. Rather, he said he had become convinced that over the next three years Intel would win the race to deliver the most computer processing power per watt. He showed a chart projecting a significant advantage for Intel, which has struggled with heat problems in its own chips in recent years.

Several analysts said Monday that they were skeptical of such claims.

"We're not sure about whether Intel is that much better than A.M.D. or I.B.M.," said Richard Doherty, president of the Envisioneering Group, a consulting firm in Seaford, N.Y. The crucial factor in the deal was probably price, he said.

If outsiders are not true believers, however, Intel is. At the event Monday at the Moscone Center here, Paul S. Otellini, Intel's chief executive, gave Mr. Jobs a bear hug and said his company held no grudges for earlier Apple advertisements that poked fun at Intel's Pentium chips.

Moreover, Mr. Otellini was blunt in pointing out that although Apple's chip purchases might not make a significant contribution to his company's income statement, Intel was eager to move its technical innovations to market more quickly.

"It's a chance to reignite innovation," he said.

Indeed, despite Apple's small share of the personal computer market, the Intel-Apple partnership could affect the balance in the industry, providing Intel's labs with a channel beyond the Windows world of Microsoft - a longtime partner but one that Intel has periodically clashed with regarding competing technologies.

In his presentation today, Mr. Jobs painted a picture of a smooth technical transition from I.B.M. to Intel chips. He mustered support from two crucial Mac program developers, Microsoft and Adobe, whose executives said they were eager to move their programs to Apple's new computers.

Moreover, Apple unveiled a technology called Rosetta, a "dynamic software translation" tool that will make it possible for a user's existing programs to run unmodified on Apple's new Intel-based computers.

Mr. Jobs acknowledged that Rosetta was based in part on technology developed by Transitive Ltd. of Manchester, England, which has a novel approach to making it possible to run programs on disparate kinds of computers.

Al Gillen, research director at IDC, a market research company, said he was skeptical that the transition would be as smooth as Apple portrayed.

"They have a history of pushing platforms that is fairly disruptive," Mr. Gillen said. He pointed to Apple's move from its original Motorola 68000-based systems to systems using the PowerPC. Though Apple had promised the transition would be smooth for Mac users, "it was basically a 'repurchase' operation," he said, requiring new software for those purchasing the new computers. "Their concept of 'fairly easy' sometimes requires buying new things."

Mr. Jobs made it clear that he had no plans to sell Apple software to run on Windows computers. But several analysts said that because the Apple and Microsoft operating systems will be running on similar hardware, he would not be able to stop users from retrofitting Apple software to run on Windows computers.

As for the third-party developers of Mac software, the audience chosen by Mr. Jobs for Monday's announcement, most seemed to feel that he had forged a workable strategy, even though it will force them to revise their programs to run on the Intel chip.

Ray Slakinski, an independent Apple developer whose company, iPodderX, makes software for podcasting on the Macintosh, said Apple's strategy would not cause him any development delays. Apple has been reliable in providing developers with tools for smoothing major transitions, he said.

"It's a good sacrifice for them in the long term," he said of Apple's shift away from the PowerPC. Still, as a Mac user, he thinks the short term may be a bit bumpy. "I think Mac sales are going to take a hit for the next few months," he said. "I was in the market for a new laptop, but I'm holding off."

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/07/technology/07apple.html?th&emc=th

[sarals]

...but mostly because they wanted to make sure their the folks who developed the software were good and qualified.

how novel! Reminds me of an arugment I had with a boss some years back about when to release our software... I wanted to make sure the bugs were worked out and the owner of the company said that he wanted to do it the way Microsoft did it... release the darn thing half baked... sell it to everyone... get them hooked on it and then worry about maybe cleaning up the bugs LOL

[Dimension]

recently it's been all iPod. But they were known for their graphics and video and a more user friendly and integrated OS not too long ago. But their chipset was their achilles heel...intel x86 just had a dominance on the PC market and Apple's OS and software were just not compatible.

the other thing that also prevented wide scale adoption of Macs at that time were their licensing policy..they just didn't give out license to anyone...partly cause of what Microsoft did to them many years ago i thin, but mostly because they wanted to make sure their the folks who developed the software were good and qualified.

[sarals]

is it their software their driving force or their hardware? sounds like IBM is in real trouble... of course they've been going down hill for years.

[Dimension]

Applet switches to Intel chipset...
http://money.cnn.com/2005/06/05/technology/wsj.apple.intel.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes

Everyone seems to be questioning this move...
Does anyone besides me see this as a huge opportunity for Apple? in essence, if their software can be made to run on an Intel based platform, they have a whooooole new audience to market to...and that included both their stand alone software, which are some of the best out there since their requirements and certification is so much more rigorous, but also their OS.
In the next 10 years, We could concievably see Apple take some of Microsoft's market share....whoa...

yeah, they are sure to take a hit in the next 6 months or so...but this could be Microsoft's first real threat. i know, i know, there's also Linux, but that was never really could land a serious punch...if anyone can, Steve Jobs and the Mac OS can.

that's just my thought anyway...

[sarals]

I wouldn't mind that... or you could be :)

[Dimension]

it looks like the owner has been absent for some time...you could ask Matt to make tyou the owner.

[sarals]

that's very scary... I guess I have too much confidence in the firewall

[sarals]

oops... I don't know what I was thinking...I'm not a moderator of this board lol

[Ruellit]

One thing that came to mind when I was reading the article was just how much info is on the web about both me and my wife. Emails for example have a lot of personal info, let alone the brokerage I used when trading, as well as all the online bill paying services.

Thanks for the website, I've kept the post and will check out both our systems when we get back from vacation.

[Ruellit]

We have both a hardware and software firewall. Our home network requires a Router (hardware) and we are using Sygate Firewall behind the router. If what I think happened then the answer to your question is yes, they blew right through both firewalls. There remains one other possibility, and that would be that one our family members signed my wife up for this contract. Information to do so is very personal and much of it is kept very private and limited to few individuals. My first thought would be that none of those people would even think of doing that!

[Dimension]

no problem at all.

[sarals]

if it's okay with you, I'd like to put that link in the iBox for reference... good stuff

[sarals]

do you use a firewall? did it get around that?

[Dimension]

right. the concept they are talking about there is a simple communication protocol based on http (mini webservers as they describe). it is technique used in many client server apps and actually "web services" is based around that whole thinking. A more real example of technology based on similar thinking is BlueTooth. But the big difference there is typically there is an agreement between the client and server as far as what information is exchanged. That said, there are some applications that can be written to utilize this technology for malicious purposes, especially if it's an installed protocol on your device that anyone can make requests to (i.e. the recent BlueTooth viruses were something similar, though not based on http).

Sot there are basically a few ways folks can get information from you computer.
-you install a software that has code in it that sends information to some server. ( a trojan would fall into this category..basically with a trojan, you somehow were tricked into installing some software that can do harm).
-you're systems allow web pages to send information back to servers (i.e. cookies is an example).
-your system exposes certain holes that other computers on the internet can probe to find..and if they find, they can possibly hack into your system.

you can check this page to determine if you have any holes in your system. This is a useful site to see how exposed your computer is: https://www.grc.com/x/ne.dll?bh0bkyd2

interms of software to better protect your system..these guys here discuss this often: http://www.investorshub.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=6255048

[Ruellit]

Have a look, URLs coupled with HTTP stacks can garner any info from any device capable of supporting java on the internet.

http://www.javaworld.com/javaworld/jw-09-1999/jw-09-javadev.html

[Ruellit]

That is the answer I was looking for as it explains how a company could mine personal data from your computer without your permission. The reason I'm asking is that my wife and I were surfing the net for a new cell phone to replace her old one. We didn't knowingly sign any contracts with any cell phone company, but would up having a two year contract with Cingular wireless sent to us by a company named Inphonics. Luckily for us we printed the phone pictures that include the URLs.

[sarals]

that's all true... but in a way the html "code" in your page causes the data to be appended to the url...

"The method attribute of a form dictates how the data is sent to the handling page. The two options -get and post- refer to the HTTP method to be used. In short, the get method sends the submitted data tot he receiving page as a serious of name-value pairs appended to the URL."

... with the "post" the data is not visible.

[sarals]

Dreamweaver does alot of cool stuff for you and is a decent good development environment. But I'm going to keep learning the PHP anyway and eventually I'll figure out what's going on with Dreamweaver.

[Dimension]

right...how it got there...this might get a bit detailed...but here goes..

the www.investorshum.com part of the URL refers to a domain. When that domain name is registered (via NSOL or some other company), all requests to it are forwarded to the underlying IP, which is simply a server somewhere. Now if at that server there is a Web Server running, it can accept what are called HTTP requests. A webserver simply is a process that sits and waits for information to come it's way via a hole poked in the server (techy term: a port is opened to let info thru to the server) and it basically forwards it on to something that may or may not use that information. Typically, these request are sent from Web Browser clients as URLS. these Clients (Web Browsers) can send additional information if they choose to the server by attaching the additional inforamtion to the URL. These additional information can be used by APPLICATIONS, SCRIPTS, or PROCESSES running on the server machine to do something.

for example: the URL as i type right now is http://www.investorshub.com/boards/post_reply.asp?message_id=6476095
how did that get there?

basically, if you move your mouse over the message you just posted to me, you will that URL shown at the status bar at the lower part of your browser. So when you click on that link, that URL is sent to the browser. In that URL is all the information needed for the WebServer at Investorshub.com to be able to send me the details of your message. The URL says to go to Address www.InvestorsHub.com, and when you get there, seek out "boards/post_reply" page, and give post_reply page the following information "message_id = 6476095", it will know what to do with that info.
How will it know? because THAT'S WHERE THE CODE is. in post_reply page, is some code that runs on the server that takes the information in the URL, does something with it, when it's done, sends back data to the browser you are viewing...in this case, it sends back a new page with the details of your message.

phew! in short, URL is not code, instead, it's something that CODE CAN USE. that code resides on the webserver specified in the URL or that webserver will know where to find that code that can do something with that URL.

[Ruellit]

I would agree with your analysis but think the function of the URL has been expanded to possibly include data mining. I'm no authority on the subject but have experience that leads me to believe it's possible. URL's that signify an IP address as you mentioned would only need to be as long as your example and end with a .com or similar extension. The URL that has me asking for help contains the truncated phrase Referringdomain=AARP&ZipCode=66067&Ref...
Now since we didn't enter the zip code, could you explain how it got there if it weren't mined? We have printouts of the pages with there URLs on them.

[Dimension]

well, i have not used either much, so i cannot be of much assistance. If i get some time, i wouldn't mind looking it to it though..sound interesting that you can make db calls from Dreamweaver, i did not know that.

[Dimension]

Ruleit: If by URL, you mean something like "http://www.investorshub.com", then URLs are not coded. You can think of them as analygous to a home address. They are simply a way for an application to find a particular website and it's pages on th internet.

basically URLs are nothing more than a descriptive name assiged to an IP (Internet Protocol) address.

[Ruellit]

Questions for the board: What language are URL's written in? Can anyone supply links for learning this code?

[sarals]

Dreamweaver's default is using PHP MySQL... which I thought would work great since that's what works for me when I do it in notepad. I'm still trying to figure out what's wrong. Dreamweaver had a call to @mysql_pconnect() while I was using @mysql_connect()... I tried manually changing the dreamweaver connect file to remove the p from connect and I still get an error... HTTP Error Code 400 Bad Request

[Dimension]

both...so a bit fortunate to that end.
I have worked on various types of applications, including both web and desktop. In most cases these days, bulk of the work is on the server side and the client (desktop or web) is kept light.
i'm actually helping out OCS with the streamer stuff...java based.

A while back i did some Flash, but nothing much. Does dreamweaver have it's own proprietary language? How do you make (or attempt to make) a connection to a database...via ODBC, ADO?

[sarals]

do you do this for work or fun or both? are you doing web applications? desktop?

I'm currently working with Dreamweaver and learning PHP/MySQL. For the life of me, I can't get Dreamweaver to recognize my database, yet I can do it with plain ole PHP... frustrating.

Have you used Flash? I created a small Flash animination... it works great inside of Dreamweaver, but when I uploaded the page to the server, it just hangs...

[Dimension]

almost anything acutally...java, c#, vb, asp, javascript, SQL, etc....
i particularly enjoy architecting/design...the bigger picture.