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PLUG is responsible for building the factory JM will supply the equipment
expansion to 10 GW of CCM/MEA a year but 5GW initially (matches there current UK facility. I think PLUGs Rochester makes 1GW of MEA a year using the CCM they get from JM.
On this scale PLUG has to be building a new electrolyser factory.
I did not, I did sell on the way up to buy a car.
but held everything on the way down (across the board even my non EV/ESG stocks like SHOP TTD etc)
Learned a lot and still up significantly though. LIke WTM the Andy selling was a definite flag to lighten up.
I like Cummins to add to your list of traditional stocks. JM probably doesn't get the attention it deserves as it is a UK stock.
waiting for some inheritance money so just buying a few calls here and there.
They better move quick on a site and power sourcing if they want something that big producing by 2025. I suggest Ga. since we have power, water, rails, shipping, no unions and large tax incentives. We also have a Green H2 source here.
WTM - Thanks. It was just an attempt at humor.
JM has several assets and companies in the US and around the world.
JB, according to the press release the facility will be built in the US. https://ih.advfn.com/stock-market/NASDAQ/plug-power-PLUG/stock-news/90094471/plug-power-and-johnson-matthey-announce-long-term
"This strategic partnership between Plug and JM will support Plug in delivering its targeted revenue of US$5 billion and US$20 billion by 2026 and 2030 respectively. To help achieve these targets, Plug and JM will co-invest in what is expected to be the largest (5GW scaling to 10GW over time) CCM manufacturing facility in the world. The facility will be built in the United States and likely begin production in 2025."
Two years ago, this news would have sent PLUG stock price soaring even more.
Andy Marsh is still at the helm, unfortunately.
Uh oh ! "My friend Liam." Anyone remember, "My friend Twiggy" ?
Anyone remember, "We are leaving Australia because the US is Better..." ?
I predict : "We are leaving the UK because the US is Better.".
Banger - Did you sell at $70? $65?
I sold PLUG when Andy sold PLUG. Your analysis of JM over 5 years, is NOT Risk adjusted nor does it take into account the dividends paid out over the 5 year period.
If you do a proper, risk adjusted analysis, you will see that JM is the much better long term investment, especially when compared to PLUG, Ballard and FCEL.
WTM - Thanks. You forgot to mention that I also said BUY the day PLUG announced their first MEGA-Symposium. PLUG went from $3.00 to $70 on that run.
I am also on the record here as saying that MULAG, EnergyOR, FEDEX and Gaussin and many others were all Nothing Burgers.
My detractors seem to overlook these FACTS.
JB, great call on Fortescue, but an even better one was when you told us to sell when Andy Marsh sold a ton of shares a year or so ago. I should have listened to you, would have saved a ton of money. Live and learn I guess. Note to self for the future, when the CEO of a company sells a ton of shares, sell.
WTM / Banger - Do you recall who posted that FFI was a great deal for PLUG ?
Do you recall who didn't?
You're welcome.
Banger - True, but compared to PLUG, I like JM's dividend much more. JM, Linde, Air Liquide and Bosch are some of my better hydrogen investments.
looking at JMAT in the London stock exchange it looks better as far as 5 year peak, but. you sold PLUG at $70 you made more %age.
https://www.tradingview.com/x/4MaUex3q/
JMAT like CMI and other "traditional businesses" that moved into hydrogen are less risk, lower beta and but if you time your trades (I dont) PLUG was much better!
So PLUG is building the new facility for the partnership (not an JV note!)
Hopefully this is next to the new electrolyser factory they forgot to mention in the business update.
https://webcast.openbriefing.com/johnsonmatthey-jan23/player/?player_id=50366
Some good questions around ROI for JM. " our strategy is to win with winners!"
Wonder what the reduction in cost to PLUG is of PEM components?
Anyone have an idea on what performance will be delivered in the "next generation" of PEM and when we can see them come into mainstream products? I'm still worried about Sanjay avoiding that question last week.
Now you know the secret of my success.
Sure? .....)))))
Johnson Matthey has been making money, literally, for more than a century.
JM has proven that they know how to make money. One of the criteria for my investments.
PLUG on the other hand, has proven to date that they DON'T know how to turn increasing revenues into profits and shareholder value .
Now you know the secret of my success.
Well Jack mayb jm will provide the outsider needed for the new ceo of pp ...in the future hopefully sooner
I would rather be long JM.
I’m happy as it’s just more good news for a stock that’s up almost 30 % YTD. I love that it’s hurting shorts and that longs are just doing so well with more good news to come.
No matter how people try to spin PLUG, it’s in the early stages of the hydrogen BOOM. Why would anyone want to short PLUG
That said, I would much rather be LONG PLUG thank JM
And oh yeah
Goldman predicts clean hydrogen will be a $1 trillion market. Here’s how to play it.. GO PLUG
I choose to listen to top Wall Street analysts
I don't know if I am happy or sad.
I have been long JM for decades, one of my Good hydrogen stocks.
More great news that will be painful to those shorting this stock. Way to go PLUG. Marketed melted down last night and plug barely moved. Some small trades at the close made it go red
Why would anyone short PLUG.
Plug Power and Johnson Matthey announce long-term strategic partnership to accelerate the hydrogen economy
January 31 2023
https://ih.advfn.com/stock-market/NASDAQ/plug-power-PLUG/stock-news/90094471/plug-power-and-johnson-matthey-announce-long-term
Plug Power, (NASDAQ: PLUG) (Plug), a leading provider of turnkey hydrogen solutions for the global green hydrogen economy, and Johnson Matthey (JM), a global leader in sustainable technologies, today announced a long-term strategic partnership to accelerate the green hydrogen economy.
JM will become an important strategic supplier of MEA components, providing a substantial portion of Plug’s demand for catalysts, membranes, and catalyst coated membranes (CCM). Importantly, JM brings security of supply of precious metals, and unique recycling capabilities.
This strategic partnership between Plug and JM will support Plug in delivering its targeted revenue of US$5 billion and US$20 billion by 2026 and 2030 respectively. To help achieve these targets, Plug and JM will co-invest in what is expected to be the largest (5GW scaling to 10GW over time) CCM manufacturing facility in the world. The facility will be built in the United States and likely begin production in 2025. Plug and JM will also continue to leverage government incentives from the Inflation Reduction Act in the US and REPowerEU in Europe to push for exponential growth across the hydrogen industry.
“Plug is proud to expand our relationship with JM, a highly respected and skilled supply partner with a proven track record,” said Plug CEO, Andy Marsh. “This partnership will help us strengthen our supply chain and underpin our ability to deliver on the growing demand for our fuel cells and electrolyzers. With a partner like JM, Plug is in a strong position to be the global leader of the green hydrogen economy.”
Liam Condon, CEO of Johnson Matthey added: “For the rapidly developing hydrogen economy, this partnership is a game-changer. By bringing together one of the largest green hydrogen and fuel cell companies in the world with JM’s technology and manufacturing capabilities, we’re creating volume and scale for green hydrogen that hasn’t existed until now. This partnership confirms JM’s world class position in catalyst coated membranes, the key performance-defining components of electrolyzers and fuel cells.”
Plug Power is the leading user of liquid hydrogen with the world’s largest fuelling station footprint, as well as over 60,000 fuel cell systems, operating more than one billion hours across the globe. Plug is building an end-to-end green hydrogen ecosystem, from production, storage and delivery to energy generation, to help its customers – including Amazon, Carrefour, Walmart and BMW – meet their business goals and decarbonize the economy.
JM has been a leader in hydrogen for many years, founded on its core competencies in platinum group metal (PGM) chemistry and catalysis. It has an established Hydrogen Technologies business, with long-standing customer relationships and manufacturing capability of 2GW, with plans to expand to 5GW through a new 3GW gigafactory in Royston, UK. As the world’s leading secondary refiner of PGMs JM has pioneered a circular business model for the scarce metals that will also be employed for this contract, and it will look to develop further closed loop solutions.
About Plug
Plug is building an end-to-end green hydrogen ecosystem, from production, storage and delivery to energy generation, to help its customers meet their business goals and decarbonize the economy. In creating the first commercially viable market for hydrogen fuel cell technology, the company has deployed more than 60,000 fuel cell systems and over 185 fuelling stations, more than anyone else in the world, and is the largest buyer of liquid hydrogen. With plans to build and operate a green hydrogen highway across North America and Europe, Plug is building a state-of-the-art Gigafactory to produce electrolysers and fuel cells and multiple green hydrogen production plants that will yield 500 tons of liquid green hydrogen daily by 2025. Plug will deliver its green hydrogen solutions directly to its customers and through joint venture partners into multiple environments, including material handling, e-mobility, power generation, and industrial applications. For more information, visit www.plugpower.com.
About Johnson Matthey
Johnson Matthey is a global leader in sustainable technologies, catalysing the net zero transition. With over 200 years of sustained commitment to innovation and technological breakthroughs, we improve the performance, function and safety of our customers’ products. Our science has a global impact in areas such as low emission transport, energy, chemical processing and making the most efficient use of the planet’s natural resources. Today, about 13,000 Johnson Matthey professionals collaborate with our network of customers and partners to make a real difference to the world around us. For more information visit www.matthey.com
From your lips to god's ears.
Hopefully it is an outsider. I am not at all impressed with the 4 amigos running the show now.
If one of them get to be CEO, all bets are off.
If they bring in an outsider with an IQ, I might even invest in PLUG.
JB Time will tell...remember when plug gets a new ceo the price will double?
mikman - If you are asking me, I can only speak from experience in dealing with politicians.
So long as you have something they want or need ie. Investment $$$ or Jobs, they are your "friend". If you have nothing for them, you are yesterday's news / chopped liver.
What's the relationship between Andy. Manchin and Schumer good or bad?
Hard to think andy may have burnt those bridges
WTM - A 1 BCF/day hydrogen plant could not be permitted without carbon sequestration.
And Exxon will have no problem finding bulk customers for a BCF/day in the Baytown area.
More Hydrogen is consumed in the Baytown region than in the rest of the US combined.
One important note. FID has not happened. Until then this is only a pipe dream (pun intended).
JB, I find the numbers mentioned in the article and timeline of particular interest.
https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2023/01/30/exxon-blue-hydrogen-baytown/6701675093684/
"Exxon is targeting production of 1 billion cubic feet of blue hydrogen per day at Baytown and could capture nearly 98% of the associated emissions of carbon."
"Exxon stated it was already looking for consumers that would draw on the hydrogen reserves from Baytown. A final investment decision is expected next year and production could begin as early as 2027."
Excellent News for Technip.
Exxon uses grey / blue hydrogen for hydro-treating crude oil in refining and petrochemicals, and is one of the largest consumers of Bulk Hydrogen for hydro-treating in the World.
Exxon is not using PLUG equipment .
Exxon will not be going into the retail distribution of Hydrogen.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemical-engineering/hydrotreating
Exxon planning largest hydrogen production facility in the world
French company Technip Energies secured a preliminary contract to start planning the facility.
By Daniel J. Graeber
JAN. 30, 2023 / 11:12 AM
https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2023/01/30/exxon-blue-hydrogen-baytown/6701675093684/
Plug Power and Nikola featured in latest Hydrogen Podcast.
Posted 7 hrs ago
Steve - If you read the list of deals with NEGATIVE ROI's I posted earlier (below), I no longer put ANY VALUE on PLUG's PR. I need to see real numbers. And as we all know, PLUG's PR never includes real numbers.
_____________________________________________________
I have figured out exactly what is Wrong with PLUG !
Here is a list of some of our Largest Customers and Largest Deals ... Not ONE of these has a positive ROI:
Amazon
Walmart
Renault
Linde
Gaussin
MULAG
Energy OR
Nikola
Microsoft
Accione
And there are others as well. All Negative ROI?
If PLUG could do deals with real value and ROI's this would be a good investment.
Right, I caught that revenue 26-28 was mentioned but the announcements this starting this summer with PLUG being involved in some way with all of them. That should help the stock and add millions to the future bottom line.
Steve - If you watch or read the transcript you will hear Sanjay say NOT in 2023 or 2024.
The projects might be announced this year, but actual revenues won't happen for a long while.
So Andy might be right with his statement, but he won't be taking anything to the bank in 2023 or 2024.
This might be another case of Andy over-promising .
So, Andy said Hubs starting this summer being announced and yet Jack says none in 2023 or 2024. Why is that Jack?
These nuisance suits are brought on by shorts to drive the price down. Granted, Andy gives them fodder, but you cannot sue just because they missed their numbers or clients delayed taking delivery unless you can prove it was just a flat out lie.
No Banger - Not believing everything, just posting on topic information.
Jack are you believing what you see on other boards?
They are following crossing the chasm strategy pretty well.
GenKey is clearly profitable(gross margin wise) form the accounts. (not if you include genFuel (like Amazon and Walmart) and the market is growing as they can address smaller warehouses now with in house 1MW hydrogen generation and storage solutions.
All the partnerships you list are for mobile - typically last mile or short haul - solutions.
As I stated they were likely successful from technology and the Progen engine solution seems to have been well liked, but the economics of both upfront cost and hydrogen meant they were ahea dof their time thats all.
was it money waster? we will see. it led to Andy deciding he had to make the hydrogen himself and to look for partnerships in the actual manufacture of vans/buses etc with large volumes. but he had a proven solution to sell.
BTW no one would be expecting any relationship with Microsoft to have ROI yet, if we got anything from them that is a good thing. We did get a proven solution we are rolling out already into the EV and other stationary markets. At least we are at the table with Microsoft with a roadmap to commercialize a suitably sized solution, with at least 2 other companies competing for slices of the large opportunity.
I think Blackrock is buying more shares now. I would. Every firm on Wall Street loves PLUG. Now, if I was short, then I would be a bit nervous as I would be down 30% YTD. Instead , longs are up 30%. Good time to be in plug.
Goldman loves Hydrogen.
I’ll believe them and Morgan Stanley and numerous other firms and says their faith doesn’t look to blind.
Fuel-cell manufacturer Plug Power has been in the clean energy industry for decades, but its focus is increasingly on hydrogen production. The company is rated as overweight on FactSet with a target price of $26.80, which suggests shares could gain as much as 74% from Thursday’s close. The stock is up 22% this month.
No news on Heven Drones website. It's been several years now. https://www.hevendrones.com/technology/#hydrogen
"We are exploring additional opportunities to enhance this partnership to promote the hydrogen economy."
Banger - I love your blind faith:
From another Board:
"Given the company's negative gross margins, it is quite clear that PLUG is losing money on each GenKey solution sale but some of the companies listed above have never been meaningful customers or not even customers at all.
Linde:
MoU signed in 2020 for the demonstration of Plug Power’s ProGen fuel cell engine in Class 6 and Class 8 vehicles for use in Linde's own fleet with these FCEVs expected to be on the road in early 2021. Nothing has happened since then.
Gaussin:
This collaboration was signed in late 2020 but other than PLUG ordering 30 units for customers in North America, not much seems to have happened. Amazon actually opted for the BEV version recently:
www.marketscreener.com/...
MULAG:
One prototype produced, MULAG still does not offer a commercial FCEV solution.
ENERGYOR:
Small acquisition in 2019 to gain access to the field of drone technology. In 2021, PLUG signed an alliance with Israel-based HevenDrones but again, nothing appears to have transpired from the relationship so far.
NIKOLA:
Just recently announced hydrogen supply deal which is unlikely to ever come to fruition due to Nikola running out of cash soon.
Microsoft:
3MW demonstration project at Plug Power's parking lot in Latham !!!!!!
www.datacenterdynamics.com/...
Fedex:
Just two failed DoE-supported demonstration projects in the past decade."
FFI have their own electrolyzer developed with mining equipment refueling in mind. I believe it is alkaline so cheaper but takes more space. Something Australia, mines and all the countries he has talked to have lots of. USA and Europe put more value on space so PEM is more favored
Well give some of them time.
Pretty sure Nikola is +ve, Renault will be.
Some of others did technical proof and then waiting for economic viability so put on pause. Lots of experience gained from things like FedEx and MULAG.
The proGen “engine” seems to be pretty versatile now, being used in 2MW stationery systems as well as buses and vans.
With emerging markets and technology it takes time and a few false starts to get the strategy right. That’s what their cash raises allowed them to do.
Positioned nicely for 2024 so long as they now stay on their current strategy and partners.
Thank you, jammy. I know what asset reallocation is.
But what I was doing was correcting some False Information that you posted:
jammy32
Friday, January 27, 2023 6:27:59 AM
I think black rock is buying more shares. That’s a good thing.
HY24 PARTNERS SUCCEEDS IN RAISING WORLD’S LARGEST ROUND OF FINANCING IN HYDROGEN SECTOR
By Anela Dokso
January 13, 2023
https://energynews.biz/hy24-partners-succeeds-in-raising-worlds-largest-round-of-financing-in-hydrogen-sector/
Hy24 Partners is a recently established joint venture between FiveT Hydrogen and Ardian, the top private investment firm in the world. FiveT Hydrogen is the investment partner and investor member of the Hydrogen Council who enables clean hydrogen.
The goal of Hy24 is to support the global deployment of the hydrogen energy vector by making investments across the whole clean hydrogen value chain, beginning with infrastructure, one of the most difficult components of market scale up.
In light of this, Hy24 established “The Clean H2 Infra Fund,” a €2 billion infrastructure fund devoted to investing in vital infrastructures, and closed it within a year. The Fund will make investments in a variety of initiatives, ranging from upstream ones like the production of renewable and low-carbon hydrogen to downstream ones like captive fleet and refueling facilities.
The fund’s portfolio is geographically diversified (Europe, Americas and Asia). With the help of its major strategic investors, a seasoned team with a track record in those industries, and a unique combination of financial firepower (leveraging on debt, subsidies, and co-investment) and sector know-how, Hy24 hopes to mobilize up to €20 billion of investment capacity over the next six years.
COMBINATION OF FINANCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL INVESTORS
The founding anchor investors, Air Liquide, VINCI Concessions, TotalEnergies, Plug Power, Chart Industries, and Baker Hughes, contributed to the foundation of the Fund. Since then, it has drawn more than 50 notable investors from 13 nations in the Americas, Europe, and Asia, including significant industrial businesses, banks, pension funds, and insurance companies. LOTTE Chemical, Airbus, Snam, Enagás, GRTgaz (joined as an anchor partner), and CMA CGM Group are a few examples of industrial anchor investors. AXA, Crédit Agricole Assurances, CCR, Allianz, CDPQ, JBIC, and Border to Coast Pensions Partnership are a few examples of financial anchor investors. ERAFP, Nuveen, Ballard, Schaeffler, Société Générale Assurances, Groupe ADP, EDF, Norinchukin, Caisse des dépôts, DBJ, Itochu, Groupama, and BBVA are some more significant investors. The majority of these benevolent industrial firms are Hydrogen Council members.
Given that 50% of the Fund’s commitments are made by industrial investors, which is unusual for businesses that typically deploy their own hydrogen projects, this exceptional group of financial and industrially significant investors gives Hy24 a unique position within the ecosystem.
FROM DESIRE TO ACTION
The money obtained through the Fund has already begun to be used: The Fund took part in the €110 million fundraising effort of H2 MOBILITY Deutschland, the company in charge of running the largest hydrogen station network in Europe. The Fund additionally took part in Hy2Gen’s €200 million funding round as a producer of decarbonized hydrogen and its derivatives with assets in France, Germany, Norway, and Canada. A 30% investment in Enagás Renovable, a top developer of renewable hydrogen projects and a subsidiary of Enagás, the operator of the Spanish Transmission System, has also been bought by the Fund.
Unprecedented growth in the hydrogen sector is being backed in large part by government agencies that are establishing the market’s legal foundation. In order to compete with European incentives and packages, the Biden Administration in the US signed the Inflation Reduction Act (IRA) in August, giving the clean hydrogen economy a significant boost.
Here’s what’s right with PLUG. Up 30% YTD. Deals with huge corporations. Revenue is growing which will eventually improve margins. PLUG had to spend some money to make a ton more money.
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Page is currently being updated - watch for more information about their recent acquisitions and competitors
Welcome to Plug Power
http://www.plugpower.com/Home.aspx
Plug Power is the leading provider of clean hydrogen and zero-emission fuel cell solutions that are both cost-effective and reliable.
In 2020/21 Plug Power cemented two major partnerships
https://www.plugpower.com/plug-power-and-sk-group-partnership/
https://www.ir.plugpower.com/Press-Releases/Press-Release-Details/2021/Groupe-Renault--Plug-Power-Join-Forces-to-Become-Leader-in-Hydrogen-LCV/default.aspx
The architect of modern hydrogen and fuel cell technology, Plug Power is the innovator that has taken hydrogen and fuel cell technology from concept to commercialization. Plug Power has revolutionized the material handling industry with its full-service GenKey solution, which is designed to increase productivity, lower operating costs and reduce carbon footprints in a reliable, cost-effective way. The Company’s GenKey solution couples together all the necessary elements to power, fuel and serve a customer. With proven hydrogen and fuel cell products, Plug Power replaces lead-acid batteries to power electric industrial vehicles, such as the lift trucks customers use in their distribution centers.
Extending its reach into the on-road electric vehicle market, Plug Power’s ProGen platform of modular fuel cell engines empowers OEMs and system integrators to rapidly adopt hydrogen fuel cell technology. ProGen engines are proven today, with thousands in service, supporting some of the most rugged operations in the world. Plug Power is the partner that customers trust to take their businesses into the future.
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