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To:mikesloan who wrote (528)
From: mikesloan Tuesday, Jul 15, 1997 1:37 AM
Respond to of 80092
Additional signs of the new world order?
Don't mention the euro as Germany
prepares for E-Day to dawn in City
The Times July 15/97
For bankers, an affirmative answer to the question Sprechen
Sie Deutsch could become vital to their careers. Speaking
German may soon be essential for working in the City.
For years, the growing number of Germans in the City have
been subjected to the time-honoured taunt of "don't mention
ze war". Their employers had either bought old British houses
such as Kleinwort Benson or established new head offices in
London. During induction weeks, the German bankers were
told to humour the Brits and their hang-ups. The jibes were
met with well-practised smiles and the peace was kept in City
wine bars.
But the balance of power seems to be dipping the other way.
The war that currently dominates wine bar talk is the war
between Frankfurt and London as financial centres. And this
time, the Germans could be on the winning side.
Frankfurt has ambitions to match London's position as the
best place in Europe to take large amounts of money. Of
course, this is not the first time they have said this. So far, the
usual response from the British has been a belly laugh. No
more. Now, it is British bankers who smile politely with a hint
of embarrassment and try to recall a few German O-level
phrases. What has happened?
Frankfurt has assembled an impressive set of levers to propel
itself towards pole position. And it has recruited the Paris
exchanges as partners. For the first time in its history, the City
is facing a serious threat.
Germany began its assault on London's market position with
a total reform of the way the equity and futures markets
operate. In 1994, insider dealing was made illegal to counter
accusations that the German markets could not be trusted
because of the lack of effective supervisory control.
Reserve requirements imposed on all banks by the
Bundesbank were also gradually lifted to improve Frankfurt's
attractiveness. And German companies were encouraged to
break with tradition and seek listings rather than be owned
privately by large institutions.
The Frankfurt stock index, the Dax, has doubled in little more
than two years, closing at an all-time high yesterday. Last
year's flotation of Deutsche Telekom was Europe's biggest.
But getting the local trading environment right was never
going to be enough to challenge London's position.
Frankfurt's trump card is the single European currency, which
is only about 350 working days away.
It is on the euro that Germany is pinning its hopes. What
impact the single currency - and Britain's absence from it -
could have on the flows of money is particularly obvious to
businessmen operating and banking on both sides of the
Channel. Bernd Pischetsrieder, the chief executive of BMW,
which owns Rover, recently said: "If Britain should stay out
for a long time at the beginning [of Emu] the financial capital
of Europe will be Frankfurt, not London."
European companies such as BMW or Unilever would be
likely to see Frankfurt as the best place to see their shares
listed after a re-denomination of the shares into euros. Not
only would the need for currency conversions be greatly
reduced but Frankfurt would also be the home of the
European Central Bank, which will set euro interest rates.
Furthermore, if Britain stayed out of Emu, British-based
banks run the risk of not being admitted fully to Target, the
new pan-European payments system. The Bundesbank and
the Bank of England have for months been locked in talks
over the system.
Under the thin disguise of academic debate between central
bankers, the two institutions have been battling for their
respective interests. Frankfurt is trying to keep non-Emu
members out of Target by arguing that it needs to retain the
fullest possible control. London has taken up the familiar
theme of a multiple-speed Europe in which an independent
British financial centre would have priority links with the
Continent.
The ferosity with which the Target debate is being pursued in
Frankfurt has surprised the Bank. The Bundesbank is a
recent convert to Frankfurt's cause. Only now that it is about
to lose power to the European Central Bank, has it shed its
studied indifference.
London's strong point over the last decades had always been
the unrivalled liquidity of its markets. Pension fund money,
Arab money, small savers' money - a vast amount of it was
available in London while continental exchanges suffered at
times from a lack of buyers and sellers.
Frankfurt has had to acknowledge that it is unlikely to match
London's liquidity overnight. At least on its own. The heads
of the bourse and the futures market came up with a plan to
combine their operations with the next biggest financial centre
in Europe - Paris.
The French connection has now reached an advanced stage.
The two stock exchanges say they will start trading on single
joint computer screen from the middle of next year.
The futures exchanges are aiming to do the same but at the
momemt Paris still operates an open-outcry system.
However, J”rg Franke, a board member of the Terminb”rse
in Frankfurt, said that a link-up was likely after an expected
move to screen-trading in Paris.
Only last week, Liffe, the London futures exchange,
reaffirmed its commitment to open-outcry trading as the most
efficient system, guaranteeing the highest degree of liquidity.
Herr Franke retorted that screen-trading reduced market
participants' cost by half.
The argument over trading systems is really a metaphor for
the different cultures of banking on respective sides of the
Channel. London is staking its future on the traditional
techniques that generated fortunes over decades, while
Frankfurt is copying the more technically advanced methods
of the highly successful American banks, which are now just
as dominant in Frankfurt as they are in London.
In Frankfurt, the British low-tech option is considered as
redundant as the House of Lords. German bankers see
themselves winning in the race with London because they pay
more attention to new methods that can boost profits.
Ulrich Schr”der, a policy analyst at Deutsche Bank, said:
"Due to a new consciousness, Continental centres such as
Paris and Frankfurt will improve their performance and close
the gap to London."
The official City's reaction to Frankfurt's ambition has been
marked by complacency. When The Times first contacted
the London Stock Exchange regarding the alliance between
Frankfurt and London, the exchange knew nothing about it.
Gavin Casey, the LSE chief executive, remarked that the
Continental exchanges have tried to co-operate before and
failed. He delighted in recalling that 35 per cent of top
European companies are listed in London. But even Mr
Casey had to admit that Emu is a threat.
The City's favourite statistic with regards to Frankfurt is a
survey of the number of banks situated by the River Main.
Some 7 per cent of Frankfurt's banks left the city last year.
But the Frankfurt Chamber of Commerce said the closures
were mainly by less prominent banks that had not been doing
business in the city.
The large investment banks are all increasing staff levels in
Germany at the moment. For British bankers, this is no time
to discard old German textbooks and O-level notes. The
arrival in massed ranks is expected in Frankfurt on E-Day,
the day the euro becomes legal tender, most likely to be
January 1, 1999.
Until such times, their German colleagues will tell each other
in the wine bars of the City: "Don't mention the euro."
To:Abner Hosmer who wrote (522)
From: Bear Tuesday, Jul 15, 1997 12:30 AM
Respond to of 80092
I may be missing something--how can South Africa solve the problem of low gold prices by increasing the supply of gold on the market?
Bear
To:Bear who wrote (527)
From: mikesloan Tuesday, Jul 15, 1997 1:13 AM
Respond to of 80092
Eight straight for Nasdaq
Stock Markets
July 15/97
Expectations of strong second-quarter earnings boosted the Nasdaq
composite index to its eighth consecutive record close. The TSE 300
outperformed the Dow in uneventful summer trading
By THE FINANCIAL POST
Computer-related shares rallied as investors bet that falling personal computer prices will cause
sales to surge later this year.
The rally sent the Nasdaq composite index surging 21.26 points, or 1.4%, to a record 1523.88.
The index has risen 24% this year.
The advance came one day before Intel Corp. - the world's largest semiconductor maker -
reports earnings for the three months ended June 30.
Santa Clara, Calif.-based Intel is expected to earn US$1.79 a share, according to the average
estimate of 30 analysts surveyed by IBES International Inc. It reported earnings of US$1.04
billion, (US$1.17 a share) on revenue of US$4.62 billion in the year-earlier quarter.
Intel shares (INTC/NASDAQ) rallied US$1 7/8 to US$78 3/4.
Analysts said recently announced plans by Compaq Computer Corp. and Hewlett-Packard Co.
to cut prices on some commercial personal computers by as much as 25% should drive consumers
and businesses to add new computers or replace existing machines that have less power, analysts
said.
"There's big expectation that sales will take off in the second half," said Brian Kramp, a computer
industry analyst at Meridian Investment Co.
Among the biggest gainers, Compaq (CPQ/NYSE) surged US$4 1/4 to US$128 1/4, Dell
Computer Corp. (DELL/NASDAQ) jumped US$4 7/8 to US$142 7/8 and Microsoft Corp.
(MSFT/NASDAQ) surged US$63 1/816 to US$13515 1/816.
Oracle Corp. (ORCL/Nasdaq) surged US$17 1/816 to US$53 3/4 and Netscape
Communications Corp. (NSCP/NASDAQ) jumped US$5 7/8 to US$44 3/4.
The Dow Jones industrial average lagged the Nasdaq's impressive advance. It rose just 1.16
points to 7922.98. Only two of the Dow's 30 stocks - International Business Machines Corp. and
Hewlett-Packard - are in the computer industry. IBM shares (IBM/NYSE) fell 7 1/816 to US$95
1/4 and Hewlett-Packard (HWP/NYSE) climbed US$3 7/8 to US$651 1/816.
Volume on the New York Stock Exchange was 489.7 million shares, down from 503.9 million
shares traded Friday.
The Standard & Poor's 500 composite index climbed 1.7 points, or 0.2%, to 918.38.
Toronto stocks rose to a third successive record close as industrial-product issues advanced on
anticipation of strong earnings growth in a climate of low interest rates.
The Toronto Stock Exchange 300 composite index rose 13.2 points, or 0.2%, to 6639.6. Volume
fell to 85.1 million shares, from 95 million shares traded Friday.
Interest rates are at their lowest in three decades and are expected to help lift corporate profits.
Northern Telecom Ltd. (NTL/TSE) rose $2 to $139 and Geac Computer Corp. (GAC/TSE)
climbed $7.50 to a new high of $55.
Last week, Geac reported its fiscal fourth-quarter profit more than doubled to 70› a share, up
from 31› in the year-earlier period.
Low interest rates also help banks, which perform best against a background of low rates and
stable prices. Royal Bank of Canada (RY/TSE), rose 40› to $66.40 and Canadian Imperial Bank
of Commerce (CM/TSE) gained 45› to $36.70.
Gold issues surrendered early gains as the price of bullion on the New York Mercantile Exchange
fell US$1.50 to US$320.10 an ounce.
Barrick Gold Corp. (ABX/TSE) tumbled 90› to $29.65 and Placer Dome Inc. (PDG/TSE)
slipped 90› to $20.30.
The TSE gold and precious minerals subindex, which accounts for 6.59% of the benchmark TSE
300, has fallen 31.8% so far this year.
The other major Canadian markets closed mixed. The Montreal Exchange market portfolio gained
7.76 points, or 0.2%, to 3359.2. The Vancouver Stock Exchange composite index lost 3.84
points, or 0.5%, to 808.34.
All but one of the major overseas markets closed higher.
London: British stocks jumped to a record as investors overlooked the strength of the pound,
which can hurt profits of British companies. The FT-SE 100 rose 57.9 points, or 1.2%, to 4857.4.
Frankfurt: German stocks rose, with the Dax index adding 83.22 points, or 2.1%, to 4124.19.
Tokyo: Japanese stocks surged as investors actively sought high-technology issues backed by firm
earnings. The 225-share Nikkei average closed at 20,228.72, up 353.23 points or 1.8%.
Hong Kong: Bank stocks led a broad rally, propelling the Hang Seng index to a record
15,370.94, up 145.65 points or 1%.
Sydney: Australian stocks fell. The all ordinaries index lost 26.1 points, or 1%, to 2673.
To:mikesloan who wrote (524)
From: mikesloan Tuesday, Jul 15, 1997 12:06 AM
Respond to of 80092
POG at New York closed $319.90 down $1.30 presently $319.25 down $0.65
To:mikesloan who wrote (525)
From: John Barendrecht Tuesday, Jul 15, 1997 12:24 AM
Respond to of 80092
Soft Australian stocks head down again at open
SYDNEY, July 15 (Reuter) - The Australian share market headed for the downside again on Tuesday as Monday's weaker sentiment spilled over with little in offshore finishes to counteract the downbeat tone.
By 10.10 a.m. (0010 GMT) the All Ordinaries index was down 21.2 points at 2,651.8, while September share price index futures contracts were down 12 points at 2,661, a 9.2 point premium to the underlying index.
``There is no (buying) interest. Those that are there are looking to lock in profits,'' said a Sydney broker, pointing to continued thinness on the market's buy side.
POSSIBLE LOST DATA Solid trade in the September SPI contract, with 4,506 contracts through by 10.40 a.m. (0040 GMT), again appeared to give the initial impetus, with traders resigned to another soft showing with few reasons to take a bullish stance.
``Gold was a touch softer and the rest were noting to write home about,'' the broker said.
Indeed, gold majors were again on the slide with sector heavyweight Normandy Mining (NDY.AX) two percent lower at A$1.49 while Acacia Resources (AAA.AX) lost five percent to A$1.29 and Newcrest (NCM.AX) shed 2.4 percent to A$2.45.
While golds had slightly the worst of it, the weakness was widespread, with nearly all sectors losing ground as investors lightened positions.
Falls outnumbered rises by a ratio of about seven to three, while about 42 percent of stocks traded remained steady.
In other local markets, Australian bond yields rose following an easier tone in U.S. Treasuries, but with few other events to inspire interest, turnover is again expected to be light. By 10.55 a.m. (0055 GMT), 10 year T-bonds were yielding 6.72 percent, compared to Monday's 6.67 percent.
The Australian dollar's downtrend proceeded by the book as all attempts to bounce faltered well short of US$0.7410 resistance leaving U.S. investment bank sellers to break support and reach fresh cycle lows. By 11.00 a.m. (0100 GMT), the local currency was hovering at US$0.7354/59 having slipped from US$0.7375/80 here Monday and US$0.7445/50 late last week. -------------------------(TECHNICALS)---------------------------
Short-term range Support Restnce RSI-14 MA-10 MA-20
AORD 2620/2670 2630 2660 42.67 2702 2703
SPI 2620/2670 2640 2690 40.43 2724 2727
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1762130
To:Abner Hosmer who wrote (522)
From: Abner Hosmer Monday, Jul 14, 1997 9:51 PM
Respond to of 80092
What's behind the "perfect" economy:
http://talk.techstocks.com/~wsapi/investor/s-14043/reply-2524
To:Abner Hosmer who wrote (523)
From: mikesloan Tuesday, Jul 15, 1997 12:01 AM
Respond to of 80092
Excellent post thomas tks.
Japan: Corporate bankruptcies reach an 11-year record
Financial Times
TUESDAY JULY 15 1997
By Gwen Robinson in Tokyo
Japanese corporate insolvencies rose in the first half of this year to their
highest level in 11 years. The bankruptcies increased 10.4 per cent to
7,857, with liabilities surging more than 106 per cent to a record 6,330bn
($55.6bn), according to Teikoku Databank, a private research agency.
The previous record for any six-month period was 3,950bn, in the first
half of 1995.
The increase in liabilities reflects the extent of financial problems still
haunting companies with outstanding debts from the "bubble economy" era
of the late 1980s.
The surge in liabilities was due primarily to the simultaneous failures of
three private financial institutions affiliated with Nippon Credit Bank, which
is now undergoing restructuring. The three NCB affiliates, Crown Leasing,
Nippon Assurance Finance Service and Nippon Total Finance, filed for
bankruptcy in April with debts exceeding 2,180bn.
Without these three failures, the continuing high number of corporate
bankruptcies illustrates how Japan's economic downturn in the past four
years has compounded the bad-debt problems among companies across
many sectors.
Nearly 65 per cent of all bankruptcies in the six-month period were
blamed on poor economic conditions, according to Teikoku Databank.
Failures in the building sector surged; those among wholesalers showed
marked increases.
Among specific reasons, "poor sales" were cited in 4,119 cases, up from
3,708 last year; "lax management" was blamed for 1,337 failures, up from
1,318.
Bad debts caused 300 corporate failures, up from 173 the year before, the
agency said.
In June alone, corporate bankruptcies rose nearly 20 per cent
year-on-year to 1,349, though total liabilities for the month fell nearly 40
per cent to 403.88bn.
The drop in liabilities led some analysts to predict the scale of bankruptcies
might be declining, as more large companies resolve their bad-debt
problems and complete restructuring programmes.
The unexpected collapse on July 4 of Tokai Kogyo, a medium-sized
general contractor, with 510bn in debt has reawakened fears that further
big bankruptcies are yet to surface.
On the Tokyo stock market, construction-related issues and those of
debt-laden companies have fallen sharply in response to the news. Tokai
Kogyo ranked as the eighth biggest collapse since the end of the second
world war. Its failure will boost total liabilities from bankruptcies in the
second half of this year.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1762020
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (521)
From: Abner Hosmer Monday, Jul 14, 1997 9:12 PM
Respond to of 80092
By Melanie Cheary JOHANNESBURG, July 14 (Reuter) - South Africa's gold mining industry and the National Union of Mineworkers on Monday unveiled a productivity-linked wage deal which could save thousands of jobs threatened by a meltdown in the gold price.
The framework deal is the first of its kind, offering miners substantial wage increases in exchange for a quantum leap in productivity designed to lift national gold output by nearly 20 percent.
The deal offers a two-year package of annual wage increases of between nine and 25 percent, providing agreement is reached at individual mine and company level to increase 1997 gold production by 90 tonnes from the 495 tonnes produced last year.
"An accord of this nature is likely to protect employment rather than jeopardise it. But we can't give employment guarantees," said Adrian Du Plessis, industrial relations adviser to the Chamber of Mines employer body.
The South African gold industry has long called for improvements in productivity to offset rising costs at its deep, labour-intensive mines which have hampered its ability to compete with cheaper open-cast operations elsewhere in the world.
"(The weak gold price) has added a great urgency and imperative to reaching a robust wage and productivity agreement.
This is an accord which links wages, production and productivity," said Chamber president Nick Segal.
Segal said employers believed there was great scope to increase productivity in the industry.
Thousands of miners, in an already pressed industry with declining production, are threatened with job cuts after the recent slide in the bullion price to 12-year lows.
Gold mine jobs have already been cut back from around 530,000 in 1987 to around 350,000 in 1996.
"This accord allows us to save jobs and lay a foundation for substantial growth in the industry. (This accord) lays down the first lesson for us in how to deal with major setbacks in the industry without panicking, without alarm at possible job losses," said the NUM's general secretary Kgalema Motlanthe.
The deal is subject to negotiation and approval at mine and company level between management and union representatives. The aim is to commence these mine level talks immediately and the Chamber said agreement could be reached within weeks.
A two-year agreement will hopefully eliminate the annual wage struggle that has long been a feature of the industry and has often led to disputes and strikes, the Chamber added.
"The settlement seeks to take the wage conflict out of the mining industry and lays a platform for a better partnership (between workers and management)," Du Plessis said.
The proposed 90-tonne output increase was calculated by accumulating individual producers' target output increases.
"Agreement on this production will trigger the implementation of the wage increases. These are significant wage increases tied to substantial productivity improvement and reflects the joint commitment of both parties," Du Plessis said.
The Chamber said it was negotiating the same deal with other smaller unions and these talks were at an advanced stage.
The wage increases will be backdated to July 1.
10:18 07-14-97
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1760938
To:mikesloan who wrote (514)
From: John Barendrecht Monday, Jul 14, 1997 8:44 PM
Respond to of 80092
London daily gold turnover just down in June-LBMA
LONDON, July 14 (Reuter) - The average daily turnover of gold cleared through London fell slightly in June to 32.2 million ounces per day from 32.4 million in May, according to figures issued by the London Bullion Market Association on Monday.
In value terms the daily average was also lower at $11.0 billion, from $11.1 billion in May. It was the lowest average daily value since December last year.
The average daily silver volume cleared in June rose sharply to 270.5 million ounces from 236.6 million in May, while the average daily value cleared rose to $1.3 billion from $1.1 billion in May.
The average number of transfers in June for gold was 1,105 compared with 1,154 in May. There were 513 silver transfers on average up from 455 in May.
The average afternoon gold fixing price in June was $340.76 per ounce, down from May's $343.84, and silver's average fixing was $4.755 versus $4.759 in May.
To:Alex who wrote (516)
From: John Barendrecht Monday, Jul 14, 1997 8:42 PM
Respond to of 80092
Demand for gold picks up in India, dull in Pakistan
BOMBAY, July 14 (Reuter) - Demand for gold is expected to pick up in India but may remain subdued in Pakistan in the next few days despite dropping to 12-year low prices, dealers said on Monday.
``Urban demand has started picking up in India because of low prices,'' said V.M Kapoor, president of Gold Jewellery Exporters' Association, based in Bombay, India's main bullion market.
Kapoor said gold imports had risen in the last few days following the fall in world prices.
The premium on special import licences (SILs) needed for importing gold rose to 12.0 percent from 9.0 percent in the last few days, he said.
``The amount of gold imported is not much and the gap between supply and demand has narrowed down,'' Kapoor said.
Standard gold (24 carats) rose 105 rupees to 4,455 rupees per 10 grammes on the local bullion market. Last week gold lost 200 rupees to 4,350 rupees per 10 grammes.
A plunge in world gold prices to below $325 per ounce on Friday, their lowest in 12 years, had earlier triggered selling among traders both in India and Pakistan, dealers said.
In Dubai, the re-export market that pumps gold into the Indian sub-continent, retail trade in bullion was upbeat following the drop in world prices, dealers said.
But they said re-export sales to the key market of India did not show any signs of revival because of the monsoon season and agriculture operations in the country.
Dealers in Bombay said a recovery in world prices also helped domestic rates firm after they touched their lowest in four years.
``Fresh physical buying at lower levels and rising premia on import licences helped local prices bounce back,'' said Bhayabhai Sanghavi, a leading bullion dealer.
``Renewed investment buying further helped the rally,'' Sanghavi added.
Sanghavi said some stock market players booked profits in booming shares and diverted their excess funds into gold.
Dealers in Pakistan's main commercial city of Karachi said they would expect prices to dip further on low demand for gold from jewellers.
``Demand for gold jewellery has gone down in the domestic market,'' one dealer said.
Dealers in Dubai said they would expect demand for gold in India to remain subdued in July and revive in August with the start of a Hindu festival season.
``Demand from India is limited because of the monsoon season,'' said one Indian trader based in Dubai. Gold demand in India usually rises at the end of the monsoon as farmers sell their harvest.
``I do not see much room for the market to go lower...It has bottomed out and a modest reversal is on the cards,'' said one trader.
GOLD PRICES 24 CARATS PER 10 GRAMMES in U.S. DOLLARS
July 14/13/12* July 7/6/5*
BOMBAY 124.68 121.57
KARACHI 107.10 108.43
DUBAI 103.86 104.98
(Conversion $1=35.73 Indian rupees, 40.62 Pakistani rupees
and 3.67 UAE Dirhams) *Bombay prices July 14/7, Karachi July
12/5 and Dubai July 13/6.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1760703
To:mikesloan who wrote (514)
From: Alex Monday, Jul 14, 1997 8:08 PM
Respond to of 80092
http://www.korealink.co.kr/koreabiz/kb_1/kbe43.htm
To:Alex who wrote (515)
From: Alex Monday, Jul 14, 1997 8:16 PM
Respond to of 80092
http://www.portalinc.com/manilatimes/news2.html
To:Alex who wrote (516)
From: John Barendrecht Monday, Jul 14, 1997 8:31 PM
Respond to of 80092
Chirac warns on EMU failure, France must be ready
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/97/07/14/z0009_47.html
To:Alex who wrote (515)
From: John Barendrecht Monday, Jul 14, 1997 8:33 PM
Respond to of 80092
Istanbul gold trade sinks as prices firm
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/97/07/14/z0009_32.html
To:Alex who wrote (516)
From: John Barendrecht Monday, Jul 14, 1997 8:38 PM
Respond to of 80092
ERM tension builds as pound drags punt to the roof
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/97/07/14/z0009_4.html
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1760679
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (513)
From: mikesloan Monday, Jul 14, 1997 5:19 PM
Respond to of 80092
HK a safe haven amid Asia currency woes
Australian Financial Review July 15/97
By Rowan Callick, Hong Kong
The ill wind of speculation blowing through South-East
Asian currencies is doing some good to Hong Kong.
The Hang Seng sharemarket index, which had been
floundering since the July 1 handover to China, burst
back into life last Friday, substantially as a safe haven for
money committed to the Asian region but anxious about
its security in South-East Asian States triggered by the
Thai baht taking a hit last week.
Yesterday, the Hang Seng soared again, reaching a new
record, as the Philippines' peso also came under extreme
pressure.
Hong Kong's dollar is pegged to the $US, at about
$HK7.8 to $US1. The spurt on Wall Street on Friday,
and the release of June figures showing US wholesale
prices coming down to reinforce America's low-inflation,
low-interest regime, further reinforced positive sentiments
in Hong Kong.
Mr Joseph Yam, chief executive of the Hong Kong
Monetary Authority -- the world's best-paid central
banker, at about $1.2 million a year -- said yesterday he
was not concerned about the prospect of speculation
against the $HK.
He said: "Basic economic fundamentals support a stable
currency, and that's what you're seeing in Hong Kong."
This special administrative region of China holds about
$100 billion official reserves, and its interest rates remain
at the same level as those in the United States.
Mr Yam told the Asian Debt Conference in Hong Kong:
"Stability of the Thai economy and its currency has been
adversely affected by an over-reliance on short-term
foreign borrowing for investment activities, and the
over-extension of property-related lending. Had there
been a mature debt market, the reliance on short-term
foreign capital, which is inherently volatile, would have
been reduced."
In Hong Kong, savings will be further institutionalised by
the implementation of the Mandatory Provident Fund, on
similar government-legislated, privately-managed lines to
the Australian pension scheme introduced by Mr Paul
Keating.
Liquidity was a problem in the Asian region, Mr Yam
said, because its markets were fragmented. He proposed
"more effective financial intermediation on an international
basis", facilitated by a platform to help cross-border
trades in debt securities within Asia.
The region's central banks were already discussing such a
scheme, starting with bilateral links as "the pragmatic way
forward", he said.
The monetary authority had agreed in principle to
establish a bilateral repurchase pact between its Central
Money-market Units and the Reserve Bank of Australia's
Information and Transfer System.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1759436
To:Bobby Yellin who wrote (512)
From: John Barendrecht Monday, Jul 14, 1997 4:57 PM
Respond to of 80092
NY precious metals end lower, volumes light
NEW YORK, July 14 (Reuter) - COMEX and NYMEX precious metals futures ended lower Monday, but volumes were light, with activity tradionally slow during the seasonally weak demand period of the northern hemisphere summer.
``There are tentative signs that the gold price is forming a new base, but on the other hand many investors are still waiting for gold to revisit the lows closer to $300 seen last week,'' CPM Group research director, Joseph Rosta said.
COMEX August gold ended down $1.40 at $320.80 an ounce, with the August/September spread widening back out to $3.90 an ounce from $3.60 Friday.
August gold has consolidated between $325.00 and the contract lows at $314.60 in the past week, with daily momentum indicators recovering from their oversold condition, while 20-day historical volatility has steadied around 14 percent, up from six percent back in mid-June.
In the bullion market midday Monday, spot gold was quoted $319.70/20, compared to the London Monday afternoon fix at $321.70 and the New York close Friday around $321.60/10.
Gold fixed at a 12-year low last week at $315.75 in London, after news of a sale of 167 tonnes of gold by the Reserve Bank of Australia, which encouraged more short selling by hedge funds.
COMEX gold open interest fell 1,969 lots Friday to 214,421 contracts, but open interest is at its highest levels in 18 months.
According to the CFTC Commitments of Traders data, net short open interest held by funds and small traders rose from 36,168 lots on June 10 to a record 70,665 lots on July 1, an increase of 34,497 lots, representing 3,449,700 ounces (107 tonnes) of gold.
But since the latest CFTC data dated July 1, COMEX gold open interest has risen a further 18,313 lots.
``The net speculative short position on COMEX is probably now 90,000-100,000 lots, more than 50 percent above the prior record,'' one hedge fund analyst said.
But OTC market positions are often two to three times greater than exchange-traded positions, and as a result speculative short positions by hedge funds may have increased by about 500 tonnes in recent weeks, an amount equivalent to one year's production by South African gold mines, he said.
``That is what has broken the gold price, not 167 tonnes of Australian reserve gold sold over six months,'' he said.
But ``the current overall flow of central bank metal delivered via official sales, and central bank lending to fund producer hedging and fund short sales, exceeds anything ever experienced before by this market,'' he said.
By comparison net official sales of gold by central banks for the whole of 1996 was 239 tonnes, according to industry consultants, Goldfields Mineral Services (GFMS), while net producer hedging averages about 200-300 tonnes annually.
But ``once the flow of borrowed gold from fund short sales and producer hedges abates, the slingshot will start to move in the direction of release,'' he said.
``Once the gold price rises above its chart breakdown point of $326.00, the odds are high that technical short selling will reverse.''
COMEX September silver ended down 8.5 cents at $4.275 an ounce, as the contract also consolidated just above contract lows seen last week at $417.50. The September/December spread narrowed further to 6.0 cents an ounce.
The spot gold/silver ratio edged higher to 74.8:1, continuing its recovery from two year lows around 66.00 seen in May this year.
NYMEX October platinum ended down $7.20 at $388.50 an ounce, but spot platinum in the physical market remained above $400 an ounce, quoted $402.50/406.50.
NYMEX September palladium ended down 55 cents at $152.45, with spot palladium around $164.50/168.50.
One month lease rates in platinum eased a little Monday to around 40-50 pct, but palladium lease rates remained firm around 80-90 pct, dealers said.
Japanese trade houses reported last week that some Russian palladium had arrived in Japan, but platinum was not due to arrive until this week.
Russian PGM exports had been suspended for six months. Russia supplies about 60 percent of the world's palladium and 20 percent of its platinum.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1759279
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (509)
From: Bobby Yellin Monday, Jul 14, 1997 3:31 PM
Respond to of 80092
Sir John Templeton is going to be on CNBC tomorrow around this time ...just announced...hopefully somebody will catch the interview.. this is what I have been waiting for..wonder if he will say just more of the same..
To:Bobby Yellin who wrote (510)
From: Ted Gregg Monday, Jul 14, 1997 4:12 PM
Respond to of 80092
Does Sir John ever talk about gold?
POG $319.90 down $1.30
Ted
To:Ted Gregg who wrote (511)
From: Bobby Yellin Monday, Jul 14, 1997 4:36 PM
Respond to of 80092
I only know he tends to be a contrarian and likes to use the phrase
buy when there is blood in the streets...he might also not want to
go against the threatening central bankers...or might eye other markets...ie Japan...
I am just curious when somebody is really going to mention that inflation is in paper assets...I might have to wait forever :)
To:PSkars who wrote (508)
From: John Barendrecht Monday, Jul 14, 1997 2:55 PM
Respond to of 80092
<<``That is what has broken the gold price, not 167 tonnes of Australian reserve gold sold over six months.''>>
Phil, the link to your article has expired. I guess that is why I paste most articles rather than link them.
NY precious metals mostly weaker midday
NEW YORK, July 14 (Reuter) - COMEX and NYMEX precious metals futures were mostly weaker midday Monday, but volumes were very light.
``There was some trade and bullion bank selling silver, but volumes were light and there's no real feature to the activity today,'' one COMEX floor trader said.
COMEX August gold was down 90 cents at $321.30 an ounce, though intraday and daily momentum indicators have been recovering in the past few sessions, while 20-day historical volatility has steadied around 14 percent, up from six percent back in mid-June.
For now, August gold is seen in a $320.00-323.00 range, traders said, as funds continue to take profits on record net short positions.
COMEX gold open interest fell 1,969 lots Friday to 214,421 contracts, but open interest is at its highest levels in 18 months.
When gold was trading at $343 an ounce on June 10, the net speculative short position on COMEX was 33,272 lots, but four weeks later, when gold prices were down to $335, the net speculative short position, including funds and small traders, was 70,665 lots, according to the CFTC Commitments of Traders data, and since then COMEX open interest has risen further.
``The net speculative short position on COMEX is probably now 90,000-100,000 lots, more than 50 percent above the prior record,'' one analyst said.
Including OTC short sales, ``over the last five weeks, fund short sales have probably been on the order of 500 tonnes ore more,'' he said.
``That is what has broken the gold price, not 167 tonnes of Australian reserve gold sold over six months.''
Gold fixed at a 12 year low last week at $315.75 in London, after news of a sale of 167 tonnes of gold by the Reserve Bank of Australia, which encouraged more short selling by hedge funds.
In the bullion market midday Monday, spot gold was quoted $320.50/00, compared to the London Monday afternoon fix at $321.70 and the New York close Friday around $321.60/10.
COMEX September silver was down 8.0 cents at $4.315 an ounce. Last week September silver saw a contract low at $417.50.
COMEX silver open interest fell 1,705 lots Friday to 96,667 contracts.
NYMEX October platinum was down $4.20 at $391.50 an ounce, but spot platinum in the physical market remained above $400 an ounce, quoted $405.50/409.50 midday.
NYMEX September palladium was up 50 cents at $153.50, with spot palladium around $165.50/169.50.
One month lease rates in platinum eased a little Monday to around 40-50 pct, but palladium lease rates remained firm around 80-90 pct, dealers said.
Japanese trade houses reported last week that some Russian palladium had arrived in Japan, but platinum was not due to arrive until this week.
Russian PGM exports had been suspended for six months. Russia supplies about 60 percent of the world's palladium and 20 percent of its platinum.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1758469
To:long-gone who wrote (504)
From: Bill Jackson Monday, Jul 14, 1997 9:03 AM
Respond to of 80092
In Canada we have no reps, no votes, we are far from the land of the rave and the home of the fee. However I would prefer far less government than we have.
Bill
To:Alex who wrote (492)
From: Bobby Yellin Monday, Jul 14, 1997 9:05 AM
Respond to of 80092
glad there is no cold war...this article is terrifying...a friend had mentioned something like this to me a few weeks ago...I just emailed him the article..
To:Alex who wrote (500)
From: gmweber Monday, Jul 14, 1997 11:01 AM
Respond to of 80092
Alex
Excellent charts!!
thanks
regards
gmweber
To:mikesloan who wrote (427)
From: PSkars Monday, Jul 14, 1997 12:37 PM
Respond to of 80092
To All: Sounds like Germany is selling Oil instead of Gold now!
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/97/07/10/0024_z00_10.html is the URL which has the article. My wife, who is an excellent research analyst, found the article for me. It states that "Germany will sell off 400 million marks worth of strategic crude reserves this year to plug a growing budget deficit". Sounds like they decided to stop selling gold and start selling something that hasn't fallen so far in value. This could be a switch in central bank strategy...sell off something that is worth selling.
Best of Luck
Phil
To:Bill Jackson who wrote (499)
From: long-gone Monday, Jul 14, 1997 7:19 AM
Respond to of 80092
Bill,
I find your arguments sound, if somewhat shortsighted. BE PROACTIVE.
Call Your representatives. They work for us.
What I am proposing, is little more than a noise level support for the yellow metal. If the governments of North America were to accept mine grade bullion (90%+ pure) as payment of taxes by mining concerns, it would do little to change the amount of gold in the market. The mining companies can make only a very limited profit at these POG levels. It would show, however, a support of gold as a standard of trade.
this would provide the "bottom" we are all looking for!
Call them, Make things change!
richard
To:long-gone who wrote (502)
From: Bill Jackson Monday, Jul 14, 1997 8:10 AM
Respond to of 80092
Higly unlikely they would do that. Gold is 100% fungible and the cash from it is easy to raise. The losses from D'ore bars to 9999 fine is under 1% at major mines. Governments have an aversion to gold standards. It stops the presses. To ever go bakc on a gold standard we would have to stop annual salary increases forced on us by unions etc. I think that is why thelstandard failed. You would have to have a creeping price, every month it would climb by s small increment determined by gold production and GNP measures. What a bureaucracy would arise!! The Gold group, the God group. If we can slowly liquidate national hoards over 100 years it would work out fine, the hoards overhang would slowly vanish and if it was known that 350 tons/year was going to be sold it would be low enough to not inhibit the market. Dont forget that we are going to see a much bigger slump in recycling over the next 5 years as the last of the high gold computers gets scrapped.(made in the 70's and 80's)
What if everyone went to the mall and bought a gold plated chain?, or a 1 ounce bar? It does not take much collective purchasing power to do this.
Witness the DeBeers Diamond campaign, global in extent,
diamonds are forever.....
The majors need to get together and advertise this way with 0.1% of their production as an advertising budget. No mention of a company name, just a golden glow concept for love, respect, getting laid on Sat night etc, like diamonds, but different to form it's own identity.
I think that would be a good course of action.
Bill Jackson
To:Bill Jackson who wrote (503)
From: long-gone Monday, Jul 14, 1997 8:14 AM
Respond to of 80092
Bill,
Gold Has Worth!
Call your representative & get support for this vital industry!
Make the Call!
thanks
richard
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1755931
To:long-gone who wrote (494)
From: Bill Jackson Monday, Jul 14, 1997 1:17 AM
Respond to of 80092
A free market is also a mass market, capable of mass manipulation and mass hysteria. If enough people feel it will drop it will. At some time in the far future gold will become fully detached from the financial arena and be just for jewellery and industry. Right now the attachments is strong, and gold will go back, someday??
Bill
To:Alex who wrote (492)
From: Alex Monday, Jul 14, 1997 3:02 AM
Respond to of 80092
Two very interesting charts...
http://www.kitco.com/comments/gold/thread/970714.023038.bb_fisher.htm (dead link)
To:Alex who wrote (500)
From: mikesloan Monday, Jul 14, 1997 3:19 AM
Respond to of 80092
Gold funds rocked by price drop
Bullion hit a 12-year low last week,
and some managers fear the worst may not be over
Monday, July 14, 1997
By Paul Waldie
The Globe and Mail
The recent drop in the price of gold has been a blow to managers of resource and precious metals
funds, many of whom are still grappling with the collapse of Bre-X Minerals Ltd. earlier this year.
Some fund managers are putting on a brave face by saying the price drop has created opportunities
to buy undervalued mining stocks. But others say the worst may not be over.
"It's a difficult time," says John Weatherall, manager of Green Line Precious Metals Fund. "We are
very concerned about the outlook for gold."
Gold hit a 12-year low of $314 (U.S.) last week. It averaged $387 last year, and traded as high as
$420 in February, 1996.
The falling price has slammed the Toronto Stock Exchange's index of gold companies, which has
fallen 41 per cent since May, 1996.
The average return for precious metals and resource funds fell nearly 7 per cent in June, according
to data from Globe HySales. In contrast, the 16 other fund sectors increased in value last month.
For the past six months the return for the precious metals and resource funds was off 11.4 per
cent.
The softness in the gold price is being attributed in part to Australia's central bank, which
announced on July 3 that it was selling 167 tonnes of gold -- or about 68 per cent of its total
reserves. Banks in Belgium and the Netherlands also have recently sold some of their reserves.
The move by the banks is a signal that gold is losing its special status as the foundation of the
world's monetary system and is now just another commodity. Analysts fear central banks in other
countries also may start selling, which could drive the price below $300.
Mr. Weatherall says this is understandable.
Historically, gold was bought by governments and investors as a hedge against instability, he said.
"If you have a period of low inflation and peace in the world, after a while central banks prefer
financial instruments. Smaller countries, who had been so pleased they had gold during the [Second
World] War now wonder why they have got it at all."
Mr. Weatherall added jokingly that the only remedy may be a disaster.
"I tell my people here to go to church on Sunday and pray for war. You've got to have something
dreadful happen. History is depressing because someone in the end does do some dreadful thing.
But it seems unlikely it will be next week."
FundB6
Fund managers rocked by drop in gold price
For now, Mr. Weatherall says he is shuffling some of the stocks in his fund's portfolio to take
advantage of the drop in gold company stocks. He said his fund has managed to avoid a massive
drop in value and big redemptions by investors.
Jackee Pratt, manager of Toronto-based Maxxum Resource Fund, says the recent drop in the
price of gold has more to do with psychology than reality. She said gold is still in demand in many
parts of the world for jewelry and other commercial uses.
"What you do is you go through the fundamentals and look at the supply and demand numbers, and
the demand still looks pretty healthy. Demand seems to be growing faster than new mine
production."
But she adds that fears about central bank selling seem to have taken over the market.
"I can't tell you when the psychology is going to change and when the price is going to turn around.
But at $320, I think there is less reason for central bankers or companies to sell. I would think that
[the price] will come back."
Nearly a quarter of her fund is invested in gold company stocks and, for now, Ms. Pratt isn't
planning on decreasing that amount.
"I could, but I guess I feel that we are closer to a bottom. Over the next 12 to 18 months, the
[stock] prices we are seeing today will appear like bargains."
Ms. Pratt's view is shared by Wayne Deans, a partner at Deans Knight Capital Management Ltd.
in Vancouver, which manages the Marathon Resource Fund.
It "isn't necessarily a bad thing if you've got some cash to invest," he said. "It's going to present us
with some very interesting opportunities. I really believe that if you are a pure investor you look at
situations like this -- when everybody is tending to lose their cool over the price of gold -- as a
possible area of profitable investment."
For example, he cited Vancouver-based Manhattan Minerals Corp., which produces about
30,000 ounces of gold annually, as a good investment that has become an even better buy. "Today,
Manhattan is trading at 50 to 60 per cent of the value placed on the company just four months
ago."
Marathon's mix of investments is 10 per cent in forest products companies, 35 per cent in oil and
gas stocks and 20 per cent in mining companies. The remaining 35 per cent is held in cash, which
Mr. Deans said he plans to devote to buying more gold mining stocks.
He also is bullish about a rebound in the gold price.
"If the price stays where it is, it is going to render 50 per cent or more of gold production
uneconomic. And banks won't sell at these low prices so shortages might develop and you might
get a recovery."
But other fund managers and analysts say a recovery may be months away.
"The price of gold might not fall that much further this year, but it's hard to envision a significant
upside," said Richard Webb, publisher of The Fund Counsel, a Toronto-based mutual fund
newsletter.
"When you are faced with performance in other assets, like Canadian and U.S. equities which have
been so spectacular, it's very difficult to say, 'I am going to commit myself to gold.' "
"I think Canadian gold stocks are ridiculously overvalued," said Scott Penman, senior
vice-president of equities at mutual fund giant Investors Group Inc. in Winnipeg.
For example, Mr. Penman compared Denver-based Newmont Gold Co. with Barrick Gold Corp.
of Toronto. The companies are similar in terms of size and production, he said, but Barrick's
$11-billion market capitalization is about 40 per cent higher than Newmont's.
Mr. Penman said Canadian gold stocks have a long way to go before becoming reasonably priced.
Even if the gold price recovers to $350 an ounce, the market would still be overvalued, he said.
"At best it's a bear market that will last 12 months at least."
Victor Flores, who recently managed a large U.S. gold fund and is now an analyst with
Montreal-based Marleau Lemire Securities Inc., also believes gold stocks could fall farther.
"Fund managers are faced with redemptions and they have to sell. Many of them bought last year
and feel it's just best to get out."
He doubts that the current low stock prices will be enough to lure many fund mangers back.
"Some fund managers are down 80 per cent. Even if you can say to them, 'Hey, this is really cheap
now,' are they really going to make four times their money on that holding? Probably not, at least
not for a long, long time."
Mr. Flores said fund managers are going to have to re-examine their portfolios and look at the
fundamentals of each company. "What they really need to focus on is whether the companies they
own are going to be here in five years." He added that last year's hot market was an exception.
"You don't see these really hot markets every other year. It takes a few years between them and
we are still going to have to, unfortunately, chew through a lot of stock."
Precious metal funds
Percentage return
Total to June 30
assets 3 1
($million) months year
Altamira precious & strat 90.4 -18.2 -32.8
Dynamic precious 320.3 -14.7 -26.8
Friedburg double gold + 1.1 +2.9 +7.1
Global strategy gold + 116.6 -23.2 -36.5
Goldtrust 11.0 -15.0 -25.8
Green Line precious 137.6 -23.5 -23.7
Maxxum precious 18.2 -23.2 -33.2
Royal precious 352.4 -14.3 -26.6
Scotia excelsior Prec 61.9 -17.8 -19.7
Universal precious 116.8 -17.1 -24.1
Source: Globe Information Services
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1755675
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (497)
From: mikesloan Monday, Jul 14, 1997 12:03 AM
Respond to of 80092
No bottom in sight for gold
Australian Financial Review July 14/97
By Stephen Wyatt
The gold market is taking a breather from its bungy
jumping act. After dropping to 12-year lows of
$US314.50/oz early last week, gold finished trading on
Friday in New York at $US320.50/oz.
But most analysts think that this is just a consolidation
period before gold again takes another dive. "There are
no heroes left. All the contrarians [gold buyers] have
been taken out. There is such a momentum on the short
[selling] side, it looks like its going to go still lower," said
Andy Smith, London-based precious metals analyst with
Union Bank of Switzerland.
"Gold's not out of the woods yet. We still think the
market can go lower, especially given the vested interests
of some funds and banks," said Edward Kempf, of New
York-based metals consulting firm CPM Group.
Not even the gold producers are prepared to put their
money where their mouth is. And what an hysterical
mouth it's been after the recently announced Australian
Reserve Bank sale of 167 tonnes.
Australian gold miners point the finger at the RBA for
"unnecessary" and "insensitive" activity. Joseph Gutnick,
chairman of Great Central Mines, even suggests the RBA
should buy back the gold it sold.
But some gold analysts suggest that if gold is so sound,
then why don't the producers, including Gutnick, buy
back some of their own forward sales. After all, they
have sold about six times the amount of gold that the
Reserve Bank sold. Australian miners have forward sold
almost 1,000 tonnes of gold.
Fingering the RBA as the culprit for gold's collapse is
akin to shooting the messenger. The RBA sale simply
highlights the changing role of gold as a reserve currency.
It is seen as an expensive, non-income earning part of a
central bank's portfolio. And anyway, the gold price had
been falling for 18 months prior to the RBA sale.
"You mean those bastards are still holding 80 tonnes?"
was a common statement in the Australian bullion market
shortly after the RBA announced it had sold 167 out of
its 247-tonne gold reserve, one bullion dealer said.
This gives some idea of how some dealers view gold as
an investment. And it has been the lack of investment
demand for gold that has been a major factor in its
demise. Not only was there a 4 per cent decline in bar
hoarding last year, but weakness in the official coin
market "points to a certain disillusionment with the gold
price last year", said Gold Fields Minerals Limited in its
Gold 1997 report.
Add to this the fact that central banks have been net
sellers of gold since 1989 then it is no surprise that
fabricator demand, although strong, has just not been
enough to absorb the selling.
And the Reserve Bank of Australia is hardly alone as a
gold seller. It's sale is just one among many. Central bank
selling of gold accelerated in 1989 when Belgium
announced a 127-tonne sale. Since then it has sold an additional 580 tonnes. The Netherlands kicked its sales
off in 1993 with the sale of 400 tonnes and then another
300 tonnes in late 1996.
No matter what the gold bugs say, in such a bearish
environment, gold has little glitter. And the news just gets
worse. Inflation in the US is nowhere to be seen. On
Friday the US producer price index, which measures
inflation in goods at the wholesale level, showed a 0.1
per cent fall for June. The index has fallen every month
this year, which has never happened before.
These factors make Deputy Prime Minister Tim Fisher's
comments that gold is falling because of the activities of
screen jockeys in braces seem more than a little shallow.
To really polish it off, all the gold market now needs is for
the Sojouner Mars Rover to discover that Mars is littered
with more gold than the vaults of the world's central
banks. And it's possible -- Mars is a big planet.
But if gold has further to fall, just how low will it go?
"If you think of the gold market collapse as a currency
collapse," says Andy Smith, "then it's impossible to detect
a bottom. Central banks have moved from being mother
hens to werewolves."
Is the gold slide like the slide in the rand, sterling, the
Mexican peso or the rouble ?
"The US threw $US50 billion to stabilise the peso. But
who is going to do this for gold? It's scary," said Smith.
Last week the Wall Street Journal said that if two
traders on a desert island had every statistic on the world
economy and if they were asked to estimate the price of
gold, "they wouldn't have the slightest clue". Just like a
currency, "there is no intrinsic yardstick to fall back on"
when valuing gold.
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (495)
From: John Barendrecht Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 10:52 PM
Respond to of 80092
"I tell my people here to go to church on Sunday and pray for war. Gold slump hurts metals funds:
http://www.southam.com/calgaryherald/cgi/newsnow.pl?nkey=ch&...
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (497)
From: mikesloan Monday, Jul 14, 1997 12:03 AM
Respond to of 80092
No bottom in sight for gold
Australian Financial Review July 14/97
By Stephen Wyatt
The gold market is taking a breather from its bungy
jumping act. After dropping to 12-year lows of
$US314.50/oz early last week, gold finished trading on
Friday in New York at $US320.50/oz.
But most analysts think that this is just a consolidation
period before gold again takes another dive. "There are
no heroes left. All the contrarians [gold buyers] have
been taken out. There is such a momentum on the short
[selling] side, it looks like its going to go still lower," said
Andy Smith, London-based precious metals analyst with
Union Bank of Switzerland.
"Gold's not out of the woods yet. We still think the
market can go lower, especially given the vested interests
of some funds and banks," said Edward Kempf, of New
York-based metals consulting firm CPM Group.
Not even the gold producers are prepared to put their
money where their mouth is. And what an hysterical
mouth it's been after the recently announced Australian
Reserve Bank sale of 167 tonnes.
Australian gold miners point the finger at the RBA for
"unnecessary" and "insensitive" activity. Joseph Gutnick,
chairman of Great Central Mines, even suggests the RBA
should buy back the gold it sold.
But some gold analysts suggest that if gold is so sound,
then why don't the producers, including Gutnick, buy
back some of their own forward sales. After all, they
have sold about six times the amount of gold that the
Reserve Bank sold. Australian miners have forward sold
almost 1,000 tonnes of gold.
Fingering the RBA as the culprit for gold's collapse is
akin to shooting the messenger. The RBA sale simply
highlights the changing role of gold as a reserve currency.
It is seen as an expensive, non-income earning part of a
central bank's portfolio. And anyway, the gold price had
been falling for 18 months prior to the RBA sale.
"You mean those bastards are still holding 80 tonnes?"
was a common statement in the Australian bullion market
shortly after the RBA announced it had sold 167 out of
its 247-tonne gold reserve, one bullion dealer said.
This gives some idea of how some dealers view gold as
an investment. And it has been the lack of investment
demand for gold that has been a major factor in its
demise. Not only was there a 4 per cent decline in bar
hoarding last year, but weakness in the official coin
market "points to a certain disillusionment with the gold
price last year", said Gold Fields Minerals Limited in its
Gold 1997 report.
Add to this the fact that central banks have been net
sellers of gold since 1989 then it is no surprise that
fabricator demand, although strong, has just not been
enough to absorb the selling.
And the Reserve Bank of Australia is hardly alone as a
gold seller. It's sale is just one among many. Central bank
selling of gold accelerated in 1989 when Belgium
announced a 127-tonne sale. Since then it has sold an additional 580 tonnes. The Netherlands kicked its sales
off in 1993 with the sale of 400 tonnes and then another
300 tonnes in late 1996.
No matter what the gold bugs say, in such a bearish
environment, gold has little glitter. And the news just gets
worse. Inflation in the US is nowhere to be seen. On
Friday the US producer price index, which measures
inflation in goods at the wholesale level, showed a 0.1
per cent fall for June. The index has fallen every month
this year, which has never happened before.
These factors make Deputy Prime Minister Tim Fisher's
comments that gold is falling because of the activities of
screen jockeys in braces seem more than a little shallow.
To really polish it off, all the gold market now needs is for
the Sojouner Mars Rover to discover that Mars is littered
with more gold than the vaults of the world's central
banks. And it's possible -- Mars is a big planet.
But if gold has further to fall, just how low will it go?
"If you think of the gold market collapse as a currency
collapse," says Andy Smith, "then it's impossible to detect
a bottom. Central banks have moved from being mother
hens to werewolves."
Is the gold slide like the slide in the rand, sterling, the
Mexican peso or the rouble ?
"The US threw $US50 billion to stabilise the peso. But
who is going to do this for gold? It's scary," said Smith.
Last week the Wall Street Journal said that if two
traders on a desert island had every statistic on the world
economy and if they were asked to estimate the price of
gold, "they wouldn't have the slightest clue". Just like a
currency, "there is no intrinsic yardstick to fall back on"
when valuing gold.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1755165
To:long-gone who wrote (493)
From: John Barendrecht Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 10:04 PM
Respond to of 80072
Dubai gold souk stays upbeat, India trade slow
DUBAI, July 13 (Reuter) - Gold jewellery retail demand in the Gulf Arab emirate of Dubai has remained upbeat after bullion's steep price decline though traders saw few signs of an upturn in re-export sales to the key Indian market.
Indian gold import demand remained seasonally subdued because of monsoon rains and was unlikely to pick up before buying for the country's festival and wedding season took hold at the end of next month, Gulf-based traders said.
Indian demand was also blunted as Indian funds were being geared towards the local bullish stock market and other equity exchanges rather than the traditional safe haven of gold.
``Demand from India is limited because of the monsoon season,'' said one Indian trader based in Dubai.
Gold demand is India usually rises at the end of the monsoon as crop-farmers sell their harvest.
Dubai is the main feeder market into India which is the world's single largest consumer of the yellow metal.
Retail sales in Dubai's main historic souk in contrast were higher as the country's large Indian sub-continent expatriate community and Gulf nationals took advantage of lower prices.
Dubai's benchmark TT bar -- 3.746 ounces of 24 carat gold -- was quoted at 4,446 UAE dirhams ($1,210) on Sunday based on a premium to spot rates of $1.36. This was down from 4,491 dirhams on July 6 but above the mid-week low of 4,390 dirhams.
International spot gold was last traded on Saturday at $321.20-70 an ounce, down from $324.50-$325.00 week a earlier but above 12-year price lows caused by Australian central bank reserve selling.
``I do not see much room for the market to go lower...It has bottomed out and a modest reversal is on the cards,'' said one trader based in the Gulf. ($1 equals 3.67 dirhams)
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (495)
From: John Barendrecht Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 10:46 PM
Respond to of 80072
'Equity Cult' exists in Canada
http://www.southam.com/calgaryherald/business/970713/971753.html
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1754837
To:mikesloan who wrote (491)
From: Alex Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 6:59 PM
Respond to of 80072
Is this the world that C.B.'s claim to have under control?
http://www.washtimes.com/internatl/internatl3.html
To:stanley new who wrote (484)
From: long-gone Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 9:50 PM
Respond to of 80072
Stanley,
Understand from this thread,of this possibility in Canada. Projected spending reductions (per CNBC rumor) might cause same in US by year 2008 lower quality paper of europe's govt's (not backed by as much gold & freedom)are not as well thought of.
richard
Also, all on all threads, write your elected representatives! NOW!!!
Get them to support gold. This is one of the few times helping investors,will help the government.
When Harley Davidson was under fire from Honda/Yamaha..., The US government saved them to fight another day. They are now showing a BIG
profit.
The job of the government is to protect their citizens! We are getting killed by Europe's Central Banks!! Speak to them & IR at each gold mining company in North America!!! Get them to "twist arms" of "elected officials". These Guys work for US! tell them to support GOLD
& the dollar!
We are under attack by agents of Europe. We can & should not have to win this fight alone! Call NOW!!!
rh
To:Bill Jackson who wrote (483)
From: long-gone Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 10:03 PM
Respond to of 80072
Bill,
One of the parts that makes this whole thing work - we call it a free market economy - is that when something is down,something else is up!
if gold does not get some support now, all could be lost. think about it.
richard
To:mikesloan who wrote (487)
From: Alex Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 3:15 PM
Respond to of 80072
http://www.afr.com.au/content/970714/market/markets4.html
To:Alex who wrote (488)
From: Alex Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 3:43 PM
Respond to of 80072
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/97/07/13/z0009_3.html
To:Alex who wrote (489)
From: Alex Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 3:46 PM
Respond to of 80072
http://search.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/WAPO/19970711/V00068...
To:Alex who wrote (490)
From: mikesloan Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 4:00 PM
Respond to of 80072
Low inflation pumps up US economists
Australian Financial Review July 14/97
By Colleen Ryan, Washington
Economists across the United States hailed the death of
inflation, at least for the time being, as the producer price
index for June fell for the sixth consecutive month.
This is the longest string of declines since 1947 when the
Government began tracking these prices. And it is
particularly significant given that it has occurred during a
period when the economy is growing strongly and
unemployment is at an unusually low 5 per cent.
"For the foreseeable future inflation is dead," a senior
vice-president for the National Association of
Manufacturers, Mr Paul Huard, said. Mr Joel Narloff of
First Union Corp bank said: "It's time to call in Sherlock
Holmes, for we now have the case of the missing
inflation."
Mr Bruce Steinberg, chief economist with Merrill Lynch,
said: "Basically, there is simply no pressure in the inflation
pipeline. We look for a stable inflation rate during the
next year and would not rule out further disinflation."
The search for reasons for such benign price behaviour
has centred on increasing productivity due to major
investments in information technology, the flow through of
benefits from the corporate downsizing of the 1980s, a
stronger US dollar compared with other currencies, and
relatively weaker economic growth in Japan and Europe
which has contributed to falling prices for imported
materials and finished goods.
Agricultural performance is also important. Supply is
strong in most areas compared with last year when strong
demand, poor crops and drought pushed grain prices to
high levels. The Agriculture Department on Friday
predicted bumper US crops of winter wheat and
soybeans. Subdued labour costs, which typically account
for more than two thirds of average corporate outlays,
and the falling price of oil are also important factors
contributing to the flat price performance.
In June the Producer Price Index for finished goods fell
by one tenth of 1 per cent, bringing the drop for the first
six months of the year to an annual rate of 3.4 per cent.
Changes in the producer price index usually show up
later in the cost of these goods at the retail level.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1753404
To:mikesloan who wrote (486)
From: mikesloan Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 7:29 AM
Respond to of 80072
An emerging bubble
Financial Times
THURSDAY JULY 10 1997
Some very strange decisions are being made in the world's financial
markets. Serious financial institutions are buying billions of dollars of
long-term bonds from countries that five years ago were regarded as
economic disaster areas. Moreover, they have been buying them at
razor-thin margins over US Treasury bond yields.
Some institutions will come to rue their euphoria. Many know it, but each
believes it will be the one to escape the consequences that will be visited
on its less nimble rivals. Their behaviour is one important sign that central
banks in Japan and continental Europe are still pursuing an expansionary
monetary policy, pushing money into their economies in an attempt to
revive the spirits of consumers. But consumers have been slow to react.
This excess liquidity has spilled over into financial assets on a global basis,
driving up prices. Much of the money ends in the hands of institutions in the
US which scour the world in search of higher returns.
The behaviour of investment institutions also contributes to the euphoria.
With yields so low, institutions' returns come mainly from capital gains.
With their performance against their competitors measured quarterly,
short-term trading gains or losses far outweigh relatively small differentials
in annual bond yields.
This means that institutions can justify buying, to cite some recent
examples, US dollar bonds from China yielding less than a percentage
point over the equivalent US Treasury paper and bonds from Slovenia with
a yield difference of less than half a point.
These are margins that in no way compensate investors for the higher risks
they are taking. Fund managers know this but cannot bail out, lest the rally
continues and their performance against their peers looks anaemic.
These "emerging" bond markets are not alone. Russia's very risky stock
market has raced away this year, as has Mexico's in recent weeks. The
Thai stock market last week shrugged off a devaluation that could further
undermine the banking system, and rose sharply. There is even a growing
interest among investors - or at least among the brokers that vie to serve
them - in Africa. In the US itself, the junk bond market has been roaring
ahead and bank lending margins to corporate borrowers have slumped.
There are good reasons why some emerging markets should be more
highly rated than they were. In a world of increasingly institutionalised
savings, fund managers are seeking to spread risk by investing in new
financial markets. In regions such as Latin America, pools of domestic
savings are also being created through private pension funds. Moreover,
many developing economies are simply more open and market-oriented
than they were in the 1980s. Inflation has fallen and the prospects for
growth in certain emerging markets are genuinely better than in the more
developed world.
Yet it is abundantly clear that many investors are not distinguishing adequately between these good risks and the bad. The history of financial market bubbles suggests they should now act with greater caution. Let the buyer beware.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1752080
Financial Times of London July 12/97 (Gold bulls do not read this.)
Gold: Not quite so 'precious' any more
SATURDAY JULY 12 1997
Deborah Hargreaves examines the latest price plunge and finds prospects gloomy
A bout of depression has enveloped the precious metals market as analysts question whether
gold, beset by tumbling prices, is losing its status as a "safe haven".
Governments and private investors have traditionally turned to gold during periods of
inflation and economic instability. But, with many central banks selling off reserves, a
significant change in the way the metal is valued could be under way.
The price drop of $14 a troy ounce over the past 10 days was sparked by the
announcement that Australia's Reserve Bank had sold two-thirds of its gold holdings over
the previous six months. Prices slipped to a 12-year low of around $318 an ounce and, in
spite of some consolidation since, most analysts believe the market will go lower over the
longer term.
"There is a genuine shock factor here," says Andy Smith, precious metals analyst at UBS in
London. "If Australia, as a leading producer, is not interested in holding gold, who is?"
Australia is not alone. In recent years, central banks in Canada, the Netherlands and
Belgium have got rid of gold, while more recently there was a serious row in Germany over
a proposed revaluation of its reserves. Moreover, Switzerland and Portugal have both said
they will sell.
But what makes Australia's move such a blow to the market is that the country's mining
companies are important producers of gold and had counted on the government to support
prices.
Reaction to the Reserve Bank's action has been bitter. Australia's Association of Mining and
Exploration Companies said the cyclical downturn in the market had been made worse than
it would have been. The World Gold Council added: "For a leading producer to take
unnecessary actions that prejudice the well-being of a key sector of its economy suggests a
lack of sensitivity to the factors impacting the market."
Explaining its reason for selling - a decision supported by the country's prime minister - the
Reserve Bank said: "While there was a case to hold some gold as a contingency against
unforeseen events, the previous holdings - about 20 per cent of international reserves - were
no longer justified."
The Australian central bank hit out at its critics yesterday, blaming gold miners and
speculators for the fall in the gold price this year. It said the money from the gold sale had
been put to better use buying foreign securities such as bonds.
If all central banks were to take the same approach, however, the market would be awash
with gold and the price would plunge.
The holdings of central banks differ widely. Around 73 per cent of US foreign reserves - or
261.75m oz - are in gold but Australia and Canada now have only about 5 per cent.
M. Murenbeeld & Associates, a Canadian precious metals consultant, estimates that if most
countries were to cut their holdings to 10 per cent of foreign reserves, an additional 618m oz
would come to market - almost the same as eight years' new supply from mines.
Smith compares the present-day gold market with silver a century ago. In 1871, about 80
per cent of the world's population had currencies redeemable in silver. Ten years later,
silver's monetary value had been nearly obliterated.
Demand for gold depends so much on its value as a "precious" metal and a safe haven - it
has few industrial uses - that its price could collapse if bankers start to lose interest.
Technical analyst Brian Marber, who charts the price of gold, says an important pattern is
building up which shows the price hitting $150 an ounce over the long term. Smith himself
believes it will drop below $300 fairly quickly.
Over the short term, the price could bounce back, but most observers believe the longer
term trend is far from promising.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1751856
To:Bill Jackson who wrote (461)
From: long-gone Saturday, Jul 12, 1997 10:25 PM
Respond to of 80072
Bill,
Many will note a bond shortage coming soon. While many areas of the world have a real estate shortage,others are having a glut thus a hard way to get good returns if one were to buy into shortage areas at high valuations. Most of the stock markets of the world hold room for growth in but one sector(and as we know all to well) little more bad news can be thrown at the precious metals,most has to be out now.
Demand for the metal as safety, jewerly,& electronics will return! Many know this & have been (somewhat)supporting the price of the mining stocks.
many have not taken the % hit the metal has of late! stocks always turn prior to the metal.
I think you are right!
rh
To:long-gone who wrote (482)
From: Bill Jackson Saturday, Jul 12, 1997 11:01 PM
Respond to of 80072
Many bargains in mining stock now. I think that we will see a fall in NYSE and NASDAQ, and this will make gold jump, and gold stocks will be seen as bargains by the funds and they will flow money at them again. By this fall we should have a good recovery, in the gold and mining areas.
Bill
To:long-gone who wrote (482)
From: stanley new Saturday, Jul 12, 1997 11:27 PM
Respond to of 80072
Richard: Very interested in hearing more regarding your statement about "bond shortage coming soon." Certainly have been good to trade in last few days. ....sn
To:stanley new who wrote (484)
From: John Barendrecht Sunday, Jul 13, 1997 1:10 AM
Respond to of 80072
China gold output at 60 tonnes in Jan-June
BEIJING, July 13 (Reuter) - China's gold output in the first half of this year reached 60.0 tonnes, up 18 percent from the same period last year, the China Business Weekly said on Sunday.
The northern province of Shandong ranked first in output, followed by Henan, Hebei and Shaanxi provinces, the newspaper said.
Gold output in the southeastern province of Fujian rose by 500 percent year-on-year in the period due to expanded production at the Zijinshan and Shuangqishan mines, it said.
However, production of gold in Henan, Heilongjiang and Jilin provinces dropped in the first half, it said.
The decline in output in Jilin and Helongjiang was due to exhausted resources after long-term exploration and a lack of new reserves, it said, but gave no reason for the fall in output in Henan, China's second-largest gold producer.
China has said it expects to produce 130 tonnes of gold this year, up from about 120 tonnes in 1996. That would probably allow it to overtake Russia, ranking it in fifth in the world, the newspaper said.
China has said it plans to raise annual gold output to 150 tonnes by the end of the century.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1751708
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (475)
From: Stephen D. French Saturday, Jul 12, 1997 12:43 PM
Respond to of 80072
Precious Little Upside - (via this week's Barrons)
Why gold's price has plunged -- and could tumble lower still
Michael Santoli
Table: Central Banks Take Dim View Of Gold
he gold market, desperate to account for the metal's tumbling price this year,
found a villain this month in the unlikely form of Australia's central bank. The bank's
announcement July 3 that it had sold two-thirds of its gold reserves in recent months
knocked the wind from the market, sending prices down violently to 12-year lows of
$314 a troy ounce, 14% below where the metal started the year. For gold holders, it
was bad enough that the consuming fear of central-bank sales was affirmed. Even
worse for market sentiment was that the culprit was Australia, one of the world's
biggest gold producers. What's next, Saudi Arabia switching its government limos
from gasoline to electric power?
But Australia's actions are more a symptom than a cause of gold's problems, and
outright sales by central banks in general have been overdramatized as a looming
supply overhang.
In the first four months of 1997, the period when Australia was apparently unloading
much of its cache, the change in central-bank reserves of the metal was small.
According to the International Monetary Fund, central-bank reserves had ebbed to
897.5 million ounces by April 30 from 906.1 at the start of the year. (In addition, the
IMF, European Monetary Institute and Bank for International Settlements hold a bit
more than 200 million ounces among them, bringing total official reserves to 1.1 billion
ounces - about 30% of all the gold believed to ever have been taken from the
ground.)
And, of course, the market absorbed Australia's dumping of 5.3 million ounces
without even knowing it - not surprising, given that 30 million ounces of gold pass
through the London Bullion Market each day.
The damage from Australia's decision isn't so much in the actual weight of metal
hitting the market, but in reinforcing what the declining gold price was already
suggesting: Gold's role as the ultimate store of value, as a key monetary instrument, is
withering in the current economic climate, making the yellow metal more and more
like any other commodity.
The sales ``call into question the fundamentality of gold,'' says Peter Munk, chairman
of Barrick Gold. ``The allure of gold as the automatic safe haven in a crisis is gone.
It is gone not because of Australia's sales, but Australia sold because it is gone.''
Current prices are below the average global cost of producing gold, making more
than half of the world's mines unable to book a profit on the next ounce they gather.
This surely will lead to production halts among high-cost producers, such as South
African companies. In fact, to gold boosters, this suggests that the recent price action
was a ``selling climax,'' a piling-on by short sellers that will quickly be rectified by the
forces of supply and demand.
But unlike in many other commodities markets, where prices below the cost of
production tend to right themselves once stockpiles are depleted, gold can wallow
below production costs because of the massive inventory stored around the globe.
Virtually no gold, after all, has ever been consumed or destroyed, creating a huge
latent supply that is sent to the market largely through the back door as central banks
lend out their gold to gold producers, which sell it forward. Munk, whose company is
an exception in having locked in an average price of $420 an ounce for its production
through 2000, thus sees no reason gold can't decline below $300 and then stay there
for some time.
Some other producers are at least partially hedged, such as Royal Oak Mines,
which has locked in at $395 an ounce, while Coeur d'Alene stopped hedging as gold
fell. Most North American producers, though, have costs well below $300 an ounce,
giving them some remaining cushion. Newmont Mining, for one, says 1997 cash
costs will be less than $200 an ounce.
Wayne Angell, the former Fed governor and now chief economist at Bear Stearns,
forecast this year's drop in gold prices in a December 1996 Wall Street Journal
article. He now sees the price slipping toward a once unimaginable level near the
$230-$250 it costs the more efficient North American producers to mine an ounce of
the metal.
``The main message of the price of gold,'' Angell contends, ``is that the world's
central bankers are increasingly prone to increase their holdings of U.S. Treasury
notes, relative to their holdings of gold.'' And that is because under the
Volcker-Greenspan regime at the Federal Reserve, ``people have come to see the
dollar as a very stable currency relative to world wholesale prices.'' So, gold is
moving toward an equilibrium point with the low end of world production costs, ``a
process that I presume is already three-quarters done.'' That suggests the price
would fall below $300, as average production costs rise somewhat to meet it, owing
to the need to spend more to tap into increasingly scarce deposits, Angell predicts.
This argument makes gold the flip side of the vaunted ``New Era'' in the financial
markets, in which gradual economic growth and modest inflation foster low interest
rates and rising liquidity.
It's just such an environment that has made investors chase capital appreciation at
increasingly higher prices in the stock market, at the expense of dividend income or
general safety. If current income is disparaged by today's investor, certainly the
concept of preserving principal can only fare worse.
Michael Kosares, president of Centennial Precious Metals in Denver and author of a
book on investing in gold, says he has seen an uptick in demand at his firm from those
relatively few individuals who view gold as ``an asset-preservation instrument.'' Not
surprisingly, ``we have yet to see demand from people who want to buy gold because
they think it will go way up.''
Today's financial markets also have found a way to supersede another of gold's
historical roles, that of inflation hedge.
Smith Barney investment strategist John L. Manley notes that, in the Greenspan era,
the bond market is acting as a high-precision thermostat, attuned to inflation and
expectations thereof. Bond prices drop violently at the mere hint of incipient inflation,
raising interest rates and acting as a governor on the pace of
economic activity. This kind of bond market has helped bring the inflation-adjusted
gold price to the levels of the early 1970s, before investors were trained to expect
ever-accelerating price increases. And it has intercepted the ripples of inflation fears
before they get to the gold market.
One harbinger of the prospects for the yellow metal's price comes from central
banks that aren't selling, but instead are active in making gold loans. To glean an
interest rate of 1%-2% on an otherwise inert asset, central banks lend their gold to
middlemen, who then provide it to gold producers, which generally sell the metal
forward to lock in a price. Angell says: ``Central banks wouldn't be willing to lend
gold out if they thought the price were going to rise.''
Investment demand, or the lack of it, has been gold's key vulnerability in recent
years. Demand from jewelry fabricators and industrial users has been steady, if not
fast-growing, of late. But investment demand in 1995 and 1996 came to only a
combined 3.7 million ounces. This was far below historic levels and wasn't even
equal to the four million ounces of a weak year like 1994, according to CPM Group.
Encouraged by the long bull market in equities, investors today need no new reason
to buy stocks. But with inflation in check, many see no compelling reason at all to
purchase gold.
If gold has lost much of its potency and appears to have no impetus to rise in the near
term, it need not be permanently on the outs - as even the bears will admit. A major
factor in its slippage has been the impressive strength of the U.S. dollar. Any
sustained weakness in the dollar would help gold. One precious-metals trader says he
took to heart the recent comment by the Japanese finance minister - since disclaimed
- that continued strengthening of the dollar might tempt Japan to sell U.S. Treasuries
and perhaps buy gold.
The remark was important, the trader says, ``simply because it put bonds and gold
into the same sentence.''
Make a Clear Statement
Barrick Gold's Munk believes in the eventual success of European monetary union,
which would create a single central bank on the Continent before the turn of the
century and would free the gold market from its current state of confusion. Upon
unifying, the one bank will have to, in Munk's view, make a clear statement on its
gold-reserves policy or forfeit any legitimacy. A hopeful sign, but one that means
perhaps another two years of gold investors looking over their shoulders for the next
central-bank sale.
Certainly, if Greenspan or a successor at the Fed were to lose the zeal for pursuing
price stability, it could give gold a good excuse to rally.
And if much of gold's monetary mystique is gone, making it a truer commodity -
subject most of all to real supply and demand - that may not be all bad over the
longer term. Commodities of all types today are in large part a way to follow the
broad, powerful theme of Asian wealth generation. And gold holds a valued cultural
place through much of East Asia and India as a vehicle of individual savings and
prestige.
Then there is always, when speaking of gold, the force majeure clause, under which unforeseen disaster can provide a great lift to the market. But the historic value of gold as a haven amid global emergencies - as a sort of call option on calamity - seems to have been diluted.
Gold prices, for instance, got only a fleeting boost from the stock market crash of 1987, the Persian Gulf War and other disruptive events of the past decade.
This puts the gold bull in the odd fix of perhaps wishing that things will be different - and worse - next time. And if they aren't, he'll be in an even odder - and more painful - fix.
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (471)
From: Bill Jackson Saturday, Jul 12, 1997 9:56 PM
Respond to of 80072
upwards momentum is seen, at last. Barrick shares went up.
Bill
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1751152
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (464)
From: Mark Kubisz Saturday, Jul 12, 1997 12:06 AM
Respond to of 80072
John, after I read Pat's post I wanted to respond immediately. Fortunately I read ahead and saw that you had already responded with all the points that I wanted to raise, plus more. Excellent response, and thanks.
Sorry to hear that you are so busy now. We'll miss your diligent posting.
Cheers,
Mark
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (469)
From: Pat O'Brien Saturday, Jul 12, 1997 1:36 AM
Respond to of 80072
John, yes sort of like the old infomercials, until someone woke up and said we better make them start to print "infomercail is a conspicuous place so the public is aware that this is not editorial content here.
Respectfully, Pat O'Brien, NVE
To:paul ross who wrote (468)
From: Abner Hosmer Saturday, Jul 12, 1997 4:09 AM
Respond to of 80072
Paul -
>>Milling-stanley has another theory. He says the biggest selling power in gold is coming not from central banks but from speculators. He cites the Commodities Futures Trading Commission's weekly commitment of traders report. It showed a fat surge in "spec" shorts as of Joly 1. He adds that the cash and forward markets are from 3 to 10 times larger than Comex gold trading. "So it seems to me spec shorts now stand at an all-time record.".....<<
From 3 to 10 ? If the head gold- market analyst for the World Gold Council doesn't know doesn't know, I wonder how the heck we are suppossed to figure it out ?
Tom
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (470)
From: John Barendrecht Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:52 PM
Respond to of 80072
Bre-X hasn't scared Canadian firms
STEPHEN EWART
Calgary Herald
All the negative publicity about Indonesian meddling in the business world during the Bre-X debacle has hardly scared off Canadian energy companies.
The sprawling resource-rich archipelago in southeast Asia is second only to the United States as a destination for Canadian companies heading abroad in the search of oil, natural gas or other riches associated with the energy business.
Twenty-nine energy Canadian companies have operations in Indonesia, says industry analyst Ian Doig in a new report called Canadian Energy Ventures Abroad.
Doig's study found that 128 Canadian exploration, transportation and service companies had international operations around the globe. Not surprisingly, the United States was the most favored nation with about 70 Canadian companies operating there.
The trials and tribulations of Bre-X Minerals Ltd. may have put Indonesia on the map for most Canadians in the last year but the former Dutch colony has long been popular with Canadian energy companies.
In 1961 Asamera Inc. signed the first production-sharing agreement in Indonesia.
"Indonesia has been a good hunting ground for Canadian companies," says Doig. "Canadians know the ground rules. They know the procedures and they've generally made good discoveries, not great ones, they've been able to deal with."
Companies operating in Indonesia include senior producers such as Talisman Energy Inc., Gulf Canada Resources Ltd. and Canadian Occidental Petroleum Ltd.; juniors like Tracer Petroleum Corp.; and a variety of service companies.
TransCanada PipeLines Ltd. has secured a foothold in southeast Asia's booming energy market through the purchase of a stake in a project to build and operate two huge power plants in Indonesia.
The lure is obvious.
Indonesia has been one of the most prolific oil producers in the world since Royal Dutch made a discovery in Sumatra in 1885 which became the base of the Shell empire. Indonesia produces about 1.3 billion barrels of oil a day.
While Bre-X had scandalous problems with political interference and official corruption before its fabled Busang gold deposit was exposed as a fraud, oil companies have generally suffered few such woes.
"The success of the oil industry probably means they've (Indonesian government) taken a more business-like approach on the oil side than may have been evident in the mining side," says Dick Gusella, president of Carmanah Resources Ltd., who has operated in Indonesia since the early 1980s. "From my experience once you sign a contract in Indonesia it's as good as gold."
Gusella says Carmanah has suffered from guilt by geographic association with Bre-X, along with some problems meeting its production forecasts of 4,000 barrels of oil a day. Its share price has fallen from $7.25 to less than $5.
Tracer, a Vancouver-based company, has also felt the Bre-X factor. It says its having difficulty finding partners to farm-in on its oil and natural gas exploration block on Kalimantan near the Busang site.
Gulf Canada, which acquired Asamera in 1988, has had few such problems.
Gulf produces about 25,000 barrels of oil a day in Indonesia expects to be producing 250 million cubic feet of gas a day by fall. It will also start selling shares directly in its Indonesian subsidiary by fall.
"We're continuing to expand aggressively in Indonesia," said Gulf Canada spokesman Dennis Martin. "It's been a really good news story for us."
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (475)
From: paul ross Friday, Jul 11, 1997 11:48 PM
Respond to of 80072
There was an interesting interview on CNBC this afternoon with Jimmie Rodgers about gold. Rodgers, though bearish on gold still feels that world wide inflation is imminent. Following is some of the statistics that were presented in the interview.
TOP 5 CENTRAL BANK HOLDERS of GOLD
(millions of troy ounces)
1. US 261.8
2. Germany 95.2
3. Switzer. 83.3
4. France 81.9
5. Italy 66.7
INTERNAL INSTITUTIONS
(mills. of troy oun.)
total central bank holdings 903.6
Intern. Monetary Fund 103.4
European Monetary Institute 89.7
___________
1096.7 total
TOP 6 GOLD PRODUCING COUNTRIES
(mil. of troy ounces)
1996 1999 (est.)
1. So. Africa 15.9 14.6
2. USA 10.6 12.7
3. Australia 9.3 7.5
4. CIS 7.2 7.5
5. Canada 5.3 5.8
6. China 4.7 6.0
total world product. 74.6 83.1
TOTAL WORLDWIDE GOLD INVENTORY
4.02 billion troy ounces
<eom>
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1747972
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (470)
From: John Barendrecht Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:49 PM
Respond to of 80072
Banks, brokerages need safeguards: Study.
NEW YORK - Big banks, brokers and insurers - not governments - should take the lead in adopting safeguards against rogue employees or poor managers who threaten the global financial system, a new study says.
The study, released Friday, was prepared by the Group of Thirty, a leading group of international public and private officials.
They warned that sweeping changes in commercial and investment banking pose a risk to financial stability.
The study cited Mexico's financial crisis in 1995, which spilled into other countries, and Barings Bank of Britain, which was brought down by bad bets a rogue trader made on Asian markets.
"The threat of serious disruption to the international financial system may be small, but is nonetheless a serious concern," the study said.
"Shocks sufficient to disrupt the international financial system may arise in individual countries or from the institutions, markets or the clearing and settlements mechanisms that link them."
In the past, central banks have often rushed in to help a faltering institution or ease a financial crisis.
But the report said it will be more difficult in the future for central banks to help on an ad hoc basis. It would be better, it said, "to establish policies and procedures to prevent and contain crises."
The report urged leading financial institutions to shoulder much of the burden of guarding against these threats.
"The buck really stops with particular firms to make certain that the controls are in place," said Lord Alexander, chairman of Britain's NatWest Group and co-chairman of the panel that conducted the study.
The group surveyed 66 major financial businesses, ranging from Generale Banque of Belgium and Banque Indosuez of France to Chase Manhattan, Goldman Sachs and Metropolitan Life in the United States.
The report also called for independent global audits of major companies and urged banking and other government regulators to co-ordinate their work across national borders. Accounting standards, for example, vary so widely around the globe that businesses and consumers have a difficult time judging some companies' financial conditions.
The report was spurred by the tremendous changes under way in the world financial system.
Banks, brokerages and insurance companies are expanding rapidly to far-flung corners of the world. Securities trading and currency swapping, once limited to certain hours in key capitals, can now occur around the clock worldwide.
"This is a new world in which we are operating," said John Heimann, a former U.S. banking regulator and now chairman of global financial institutions at Merrill Lynch.
To:mikesloan who wrote (458)
From: John Barendrecht Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:43 PM
Respond to of 80072
Italy's quest for EMU comes at price of low growth
By Andrew Hurst
MILAN, July 11 (Reuter) - Italy's economy shows muted signs of recovery after a long spell in the doldrums but Italians are starting to count the cost of the government's quest to join European currency union.
Despite data showing a surge in industrial orders in April, few believe the economy will come within spitting distance of the government's official 1997 growth target of 1.2 percent.
Weighing on industry and employment has been an unprecedented increase over the past year in the tax burden -- the price Prime Minister Romano Prodi says Italy has to pay for mismanaging its public finances in the past.
The fiscal squeeze has prompted warnings from the Bank of Italy's austere governor Antonio Fazio that high taxes are stifling an economic recovery.
``What is putting a brake on investments is the excessive tax burden and excessive regulation above all of labour,'' Fazio said earlier this week.
Business leaders have said they are sceptical of government claims that the first green shoots of recovery are starting to sprout.
``There has not been a strong upturn in the economy,'' said Giorgio Fossa, head of industry association Confindustria.
Prodi has said the clamour for lower taxes is not falling on deaf ears but he believes that it is too soon to act.
``I am not deaf to pleas for fiscal cuts,'' he said on Friday, adding, ``the reduction of the tax burden must come entirely from (cutting) the size of the cost of public debt.''
A Reuter survey of 18 economists published on July 10 showed a consensus forecast of 0.9 percent growth in gross domestic product (GDP) in 1997, rising to two percent next year, with some predicting the economy will expand by just 0.5 percent.
A government scheme to boost car sales has breathed life into the economy but analysts fear the upswing could lose momentum if incentives are phased out later this year.
Most analysts believe that despite sluggish growth Italy will succeed in bringing the ratio of the public sector deficit to GDP down to three percent -- a target it must meet to be sure of qualifying for membership of European monetary union.
``We think the three percent target will be reached. The political will is so strong that it's no longer a question of how fast the economy is growing,'' said Maria Rosa Trolese, economist at Deutsche Bank in Milan.
Joining EMU at all costs has been the rationale behind the centre-left government's efforts to slash some 100 trillion lire ($58.5 billion) off the public deficit since it took office after elections in April last year.
Membership of EMU is seen as delivering the best escape route, in the form of lower interest rates, for the government's biggest headache -- a huge national debt mountain.
The fiscal straightjacket imposed on the economy has come at a higher cost than need have been necessary, economists say, because the government has resorted to a number of one-off measures, notably a notorious 5.5 trillion lire ``Euro-tax.''
The Bank of Italy's Fazio has brought down interest rates very slowly -- the latest move was a half percentage point cut to 6.25 percent at the end of June -- partly over concern that the government has done too little to cut spending.
``The cautiousness with which Fazio is cutting interest rates is a reflection of the fact he does not find the government's tax policy entirely credible,'' said a London-based economist with an international investment bank.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1747675
To:Bill Jackson who wrote (467)
From: John Barendrecht Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:37 PM
Respond to of 80072
Istanbul gold volume leaps, prices mixed
ISTANBUL, July 11 (Reuter) - Traded volume on the Istanbul gold exchange jumped to 1,562 kilos on Friday, after just 464 kilos on Thursday as demand responded to what were seen as low prices, dealers said.
Gold closed sligthly easier in dollar terms at $320.30 an ounce, from Thursday's $321.50, but edged higher in lira terms to 1,563,800 lira per gram, versus the previous 1,561,000 as the Turkish currency fell against the dollar.
``The market expects an upturn in prices in the short term, so these prices seemed attractive, encouraging buying from free market traders,'' one dealer said.
The Turkish currency closed easier at around 151,300 lira to the dollar on the free market, from around 151,000 on Thursday.
Of the day's trade, 762 kilos took place in the morning session and 800 kilos in the afternoon, 60.3 percent of total trade being conducted in lira terms.
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (469)
From: John Barendrecht Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:39 PM
Respond to of 80072
Consumers may seek palladium substitutes
FRANKFURT, July 11 (Reuter) - Industrial consumers of platinum group metals, especially palladium, may consider alternative materials following extended interruptions to Russian exports, Dresdner Kleinwort Benson said in a market report.
Consumers might wish to lessen their dependence on an exporter that accounts for 60 percent of world palladium production.
Palladium prices crumbled to two-month lows on Thursday and platinum also eased on news Russian exports to Japan had resumed, but both bounced back on Friday.
Three tonnes of palladium had been delivered to Japan, the bank noted.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1747659
To:paul ross who wrote (468)
From: John Barendrecht Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:26 PM
Respond to of 80072
NY precious metals end mostly higher
NEW YORK, July 11 (Reuter) - COMEX and NYMEX precious ended mostly higher Friday, on fund shortcovering in both gold and platinum group metals (PGMs), but volumes were only moderate.
``Silver saw fund selling in Europe overnight, but gold ended near the top of the week's range, helped by some physical buying around $315.00 earlier in the week and some fund shortcovering,'' Refco New York analyst Jim Steel said.
``Platinum and palladium may also have already anticipated the Russian return to the market and shortcovering may push prices higher next week also,'' he said.
COMEX August gold ended up $1.40 at $322.20 an ounce, after climbing above Thursday's high at $322.20 late in the day, and edging up to a session high at $323.10.
Earlier news the U.S. June Producer Price Index (PPI) had fallen 0.1 percent, the sixth consecutive monthly drop, had little impact, traders said.
But the expiry of COMEX August gold options at the close also had little impact, as gold's slide this week had taken prices well below the active strike prices, analysts said.
The COMEX August/December spread narrowed further to around $3.20 an ounce, from $3.50 Thursday and $4.40 last Thursday before the Independence Day holiday weekend.
In the bullion market, spot gold ended quoted $321.00/60, compared to the London Friday afternoon fix at $319.50 and the New York close Thursday around $319.60/10.
Gold fixed at a 12 year low early Wednesday this week at $315.75 in London, after news of a further central bank gold sale last week. The Reserve Bank of Australia sold 167 tonnes of gold, two-thirds of its reserves, with deliveries occurring in June, August and September this year.
While further shortcovering may ensue next week, as the gold market works off its technically oversold condition, sentiment remains bearish, analysts said.
Long-term cycle analysts seen gold staying weak into October this year, when the end of a 60 year cycle may present a major buying opportunity for gold equities in particular.
``There is no question in our minds that gold stocks will be a better buy than either gold or silver once the final lows are in place,'' Gann-cycle analyst and ``Past, Present, Futures'' newsletter editor, James Flanagan, said.
Gold and silver equities did relatively better than gold this week, with the Philadelphia Stock Exchange's index of gold and silver mining stocks (.XAU) up 2.46 pct at 93.99 at the close Friday, up from a three year low at 85.79 Monday.
Meanwhile the gold/gold-stocks-index ratio (XAU=/.XAU) slipped to 3.41-to-1, after the ratio saw a 12 month high of 3.66:1 in April.
COMEX September silver ended down 2.3 cents at $4.360 an ounce, after running into some resistance near $4.40 an ounce. The September/December spread narrowed further to 5.00 cents an ounce.
But NYMEX October platinum jumped $14.00 to end at $395.70, and spot platinum in the physical market closed higher quoted around $406.00, recovering from the week's low around $394.00 an ounce.
NYMEX September palladium ended up $4.60 at $153.00.
The physical platinum and palladium market remained tight, with one month platinum lease rates offered around 50 percent and one month palladium lease rates around 80 percent Friday.
Japanese trade houses reported this week that some Russian palladium had arrived in Japan, but platinum was not due to arrive until next week.
Newswire reports also suggested the Russians had decided not offer platinum in the spot market due to limited supplies of the metal in Russia.
Meanwhile, Tokyo Commodity Exchange (TOCOM) palladium short positions, amounting to 61 tonnes, remain to be covered, while traders wait for the market to stabilize after the resumption of Russian PGM exports this week.
Russian PGM exports had been suspended for six months. Russia supplies about 60 percent of the world's palladium and 20 percent of its platinum.
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (464)
From: paul ross Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:14 PM
Respond to of 80072
Excerpts from 7/11 Investor's Business Daily:
But lost in the uproar over the Australian sale is that central banks haven't dumped that much gold.
"Truth be told, there have only been 3 big (central bank) gold sales," said George Milling-Stanley, manager of gold market analysis
at the World Gold Council in New York, an international assoc. of producers.
Besides Australia, the Netherlands early this year announced it sold 300 tons last year, and Belgium sold 200 tons last year....
"And some central banks see themselves in a finacial-world leadership role - the FED, Bank of Japan, Bank of England, Bank of France and Bundesbank," he added. "They don't want to destabilize the market." Some of those central banks, including the FED, are barred by their own rules from selling or leasing gold. That takes some of the biggest players out of the game.
The central banks, though, have added to the confusion and created an exaggerated sense of gold sales, Milling-Stanley said. "Earlier, the Swiss National Bank suggested it might sell some gold, but has since backed off," he said. "It turns out they prefer to get income by leasing it out. Yet many were left with the impression that they did (sell)."
Milling-stanley has another theory. He says the biggest selling power in gold is coming not from central banks but from speculators. He cites the Commodities Futures Trading Commission's weekly commitment of traders report. It showed a fat surge in "spec" shorts as of Joly 1. He adds that the cash and forward markets are from 3 to 10 times larger than Comex gold trading. "So it seems to me spec shorts now stand at an all-time record."..... With all the focus on supply, much of the market seems to have forgotten about demand, argues Milling-Stanley."Demand (for bullion) in the first quarter was an all-time record for any quarter," he said. "What's unusual is that you'd expect the fourth quarter to be the strongest. That's the Christmas quarter." The demand surge is coming from emerging markets. There, gold is far more popular as a store of wealth.
To:Pat O'Brien who wrote (466)
From: John Barendrecht Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:18 PM
Respond to of 80072
Pat, just watched an interesting story on the CBC "When is the news not news"? Answer, when it is advertising disguised as news. One of their examples was the cleaning of the roof of the Seattle Sky Dome. This "news story" was carried on hundreds of stations but the maker of the soap paid $10,000 to Canada Newswire to orchestate the commercial. The newstape is then distributed free to stations as news.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1747581
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (464)
From: mikesloan Friday, Jul 11, 1997 5:25 PM
Respond to of 80072
Dollar and British pound soar against ailing mark
July 11/97
NEW YORK (Reuter) - The dollar surged to its highest level against the mark in almost six years
Friday, buoyed indirectly by a sharp rise in the British pound against the German currency.
Sterling, which failed to get much mileage out of the Bank of England's decision to raise official
British interest rates by a quarter of a percentage point Thursday, soared above 3.0 marks to its
highest threshold since October 1990.
The pound was supported by an article in the London Times which suggested sterling could push
up to highs of 3.30 marks, last seen in January 1989, and by expectations of future interest rate
rises to curb soaring consumer demand in Britain.
"The idea of further rate hikes in the U.K. is making sterling an extremely bullish currency," said
Hillel Waxman, chief foreign exchange dealer at Bank Leumi Trust Co. of New York. "And the
dollar is getting a lot of help against the mark from the rise in sterling."
The dollar pushed to a peak of 1.7775 marks, its highest level since August of 1991, before
ending at 1.7770. On Thursday, the dollar had closed at 1.7515 marks.
German Finance Minister Theo Waigel said Friday that the country's total public sector deficit
would fall to 3.0 percent of gross domestic product in 1997, allowing Germany to meet criteria for
monetary union and join in the launching of the euro, Europe's planned single currency, in 1999.
But currency market participants remain skeptical of Germany's ability to ensure a strong euro by
boosting economic growth and getting its fiscal house in order.
Comparatively robust growth in Britain and the United States, along with expectations the mark
will be replaced by a weak euro, have fueled active buying of pounds and dollars for marks.
"The U.S. economy just looks too good to be true, especially when you hold it up against what's
going on in Germany with its high unemployment," said Ben Strauss, assistant vice president at
Bank Julius Baer. "From everything we're seeing, it looks like the euro will be a very weak
currency."
Reinforcing the positive U.S. economic backdrop on Friday was a Labor Department report
which showed that producer prices declined by 0.1 percent in June.
The benign inflation data pushed bond yields near 6.5 percent for the first time since December
1996, and lent support to the stock market and dollar, dealers said.
The dollar also strengthened against the Japanese yen, helped by its strength against the mark and
by remarks from former Ministry of Finance vice minister of international affairs Makoto Utsumi.
Utsumi said in an interview with a Japanese daily that financial authorities could intervene to stop
the yen's appreciation if the dollar fell below 110 yen.
The dollar ended at 113.98 yen, up from 113.15 late Thursday. Elsewhere, the dollar rose to
1.4650 Swiss francs from against 1.4490, but fell to Canadian $1.3703 from C$1.3733/38. The
British pound advanced to $1.6920 from $1.6885.
To:Bill Jackson who wrote (461)
From: Pat O'Brien Friday, Jul 11, 1997 6:45 PM
Respond to of 80072
Bill Jackson: How right you are!!
Respectfully, Pat O'Brien
To:Pat O'Brien who wrote (466)
From: Bill Jackson Friday, Jul 11, 1997 8:17 PM
Respond to of 80072
Yes we see it now as the far futures have started to stir as the implications of SA , Canadian, and other mine closires get factored in.
Bill
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1747001
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (435)
From: Pat O'Brien Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:43 AM
Respond to of 80072
John, Case in Point re Articles.
Mike Sloan posted the Northern Miner's July 14th article, which in it's self is fine.
BUT to understand that news one must also be made aware of a few things. One is that Ms. Witt built Royal Oak by acquiring marginally economic mines from others. These have not been money makers since day one. So closing them down at this point is no suprise to anyone with a knowledge of the industry. The Macassa mine at Kirkland lake had been in operation by Lac Minerals for ten of years and is now over 8000 feet deep and the walls have been exploding from the pressure for years. Barrick bought it and sold it to Kinross. The Macassa is the last of the big six that make up the "Mile of Gold" and everyone knew it was going to be shut down very, very soon anyway.
The same goes for a good number of the others mentioned as well.
My point John is that many who would have read that very article would have been led to believe that these events are precisely triggered by the drop in the gold price alone. Not True!! and very misleading in my view.
Respectfully, Pat O'Brien, NVE
To:long-gone who wrote (452)
From: Bill Jackson Friday, Jul 11, 1997 12:32 PM
Respond to of 80072
Pent up demand soon to be unleashed!!
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (459)
From: mikesloan Friday, Jul 11, 1997 3:42 PM
Respond to of 80072
POG closes at $321.20 up $1.50
To:mikesloan who wrote (462)
From: Randall E. Brubaker Friday, Jul 11, 1997 4:17 PM
Respond to of 80072
This picture of the XAU today is worth a look.
http://fast.quote.com/fq/briefing/chart?symbols=INDEX:$XAU.X...
To:Pat O'Brien who wrote (460)
From: John Barendrecht Friday, Jul 11, 1997 4:39 PM
Respond to of 80072
Very good point, Pat. However, that is why we have a broad base of people posting articles and commenting on them. If you know the story behind the story, then you should comment on it, as you have done here. Without your comments, I may have read the article anyway, whether Mike posted it or not, and interpreted a different way. One thing I like about this thread is the articles from a broad base of newspapers, giving different perspectives. I realize that newspapers must sensationalize the news to sell papers and that many of these "experts" couldn't find gold in a jewelry store. I think one way we can tell when gold has hit bottom is to watch when the newspaper articles turn positive. A few positive articles have already started to appear. Whether this is a dead cat bounce right now or whether this is the bottom, is hard to tell.
The alternative, not posting or reading any articles on gold at all, is worse in my opinion. Then the only source of news that we would have is the company news releases. Then if you read that XYZ company hit a vein of gold at 70 grams per ton and the stock dropped, you would wonder why. Or take the other event, BreX, certainly explained why the price dropped on many stocks. But as you pointed out, taking 70 million ounces out of the market should have made gold stocks go up. But people panicked and dumped everything. That is good, there are a lot of good bargains out there. I have done better since the BreX news, than before. Lately my SPECULATION strategy is to buy a good stock that goes down to 10% of it's value on March 24 and to sell it when it bounces 25 to 50%.
I don't base my investment decisions only on articles posted by Mike or myself. I weigh a lot of other factors and so should anyone who wants to invest and make money. I get and READ the company prospectus and financial statements.
Many times here and on other SI threads, you can read the story behind the story. I know when they were talking about gold recycling from computer boards, I wanted to jump in and answer but someone else posted before me. The first person seemed to have the impression that computer boards have a lot of gold. Collectively, computer boards do. But individual boards have very little gold plating. I have build some and we measure the pads for gold plating in thousands of an inch. Also, when our company scraps the boards, they are crushed first, making it virtually impractical to recover any gold from that tangled mess of plastic, garbage steel and gold. We buy the boards new for $60.00, so I can imagine that the gold must be worth 0.005 cents.
I appreciate your comments and that people should be very careful as to the news and price of gold and mines that are shut down. Try to get news from reliable sources. I think I only read 3 articles that said Busang was a bust, one year before it happened and explained why. Now when I read articles by these writers, I give them more credibility then others who were saying 70, no that is not right, it is 200 million ounces.
So, I hope that Mike and others will keep posting articles and that you will comment and provide balance and the story behind the news. I am working 7 days a week now so have less time to search for articles.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1745676
To:mikesloan who wrote (458)
From: John Barendrecht Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:42 AM
Respond to of 80072
Portugal received U.S. gold for Nazi loot-document
By Arthur Spiegelman
NEW YORK, July 10 (Reuter) - At the height of the Second World War, Portugal used the Swiss National Bank to swap 20 tons of looted Nazi gold for gold held in the U.S. Federal Reserve Bank and the Bank of Canada, according to a U.S. intelligence document released on Thursday.
The swap was made to eliminate evidence that Portugal was receiving gold stolen by the Nazis, the document said. The Allies had warned Portugal and other neutral nations they would face reprisals if they bought looted German gold.
The Sept. 10, 1944, document details ``a classic money-laundering operation,'' said World Jewish Congress Vice President Kalman Sultanik, whose organization released the previously classified report.
The document, described as coming from ``a very confidential source,'' said that in 1942 the Bank of Portugal deposited about four tons of gold it had bought from Nazi Germany in its account with the Swiss National Bank.
The Swiss transferred the same amount of gold it had in a Bank of Canada account to the Portuguese, who, in turn, transferred title to the gold in its Swiss account.
In 1944, the Swiss and Portuguese swapped another 15 tons of looted Nazi for gold held in the U.S. Federal Reserve Bank in New York.
The document said the Bank of Portugal's objective ``is to get rid of gold purchased from the Reichsbank through the Banque Nationale Suisse''.
``The bad guys win all around. The Nazis have sold their gold. The Portuguese have swapped their looted gold for clean gold and the Swiss National Bank earns commissions on each transaction,'' Sultanik said. ``All it took was a few strokes of the pen.''
The 20 tons of gold was worth $24 million in the 1940s and would be valued at about $220 million today.
Sultanik said the transactions might have been legal because the Swiss had the right to transfer gold to other accounts and there was no evidence that the U.S. and Canadian banks were aware of what was happening.
``Wittingly or not, the U.S. and Canadian banks were disguising the movement of looted Nazi gold and this helps explain one of the mysteries of World War II -- why the war started with Portugal having no gold reserves in New York and ends with it having 258 tons of gold in the Federal Reserve,'' Sultanik said. He said it was now apparent that a significant percentage, if not most, of the 258 tons came from Portugal's purchase of looted Nazi gold. The WJC said present-day Portugal had cooperated with its efforts to trace Nazi gold movements and an investigating commission headed by former prime minister Mario Soares was making rapid progress.
After the war, the Allies demanded that Portugal return an estimated 139 tons of looted Nazi gold that it bought but the country only gave back four tons of Dutch gold that it had in its banks, in its original wrappers. A 1949 letter of protest delivered to Portugal by the British Embassy in Lisbon on behalf of the Allies said: ``Gold once looted remains loot and the Allies maintain that the thief has no title (and) cannot transmit a title.''
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1743153
To:mikesloan who wrote (457)
From: mikesloan Friday, Jul 11, 1997 10:13 AM
Respond to of 80072
GERMANY might not qualify for the euro
Calgary Herald July 10/97
BONN - The German government plans new borrowing worth $14.2
billion Cdn under an emergency budget plan outlined Thursday, raising
fresh doubts about whether it will qualify for the planned single currency for
Europe.
Some economists said the revised budget for 1997 will put Germany
above the budget deficit limit set by the European Union for would-be
members of the common European currency, scheduled to debut in
January 1999.
The budget is due to be approved Friday by Chancellor Helmut Kohl's
cabinet. Kohl has insisted the country will meet the EU's currency criteria.
One of the hottest debates in Germany is whether the EU will permit
leeway in the deficit limit of three per cent of gross domestic product. Most
of the 15 EU countries are struggling to meet the target.
Many Germans said the euro currency should be delayed if Germany
overshoots the fiscal criteria. They worry about opening the door to other
European countries viewed as fiscally less prudent, especially Italy.
Kohl has pledged to meet the three-per-cent goal but he also insists the
euro, seen as a rival to the U.S. dollar and the Japanese yen, will start on
time.
Higher than expected spending on jobless benefits and lower revenues
forced the government to draft the supplementary budget, which includes
new sales of government assets to help keep the deficit from growing even
bigger.
Germany now expects a deficit worth $56 billion this year, compared with
$42 billion in the original 1997 budget, the figures indicated.
Next year's budget calls for a deficit of about $46 billion.
To:Casey who wrote (454)
From: mikesloan Friday, Jul 11, 1997 9:38 AM
Respond to of 80072
From another thread
To: Jim Somerville
From: jerry janko
Jul 10 1997 9:54AM EST
Reply #122 of 126
From: newsout@canada-stockwatch.com
Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 06:33:29 -0700
Subject: Stockwatch: Redell Mining Corp - In the News
To: ajanko@erinet.com
Van Sun says two ex-directors charged with fraud
Redell Mining Corp RDC
Shares issued 13,257,323 May 10/96 close $2.75
Thu 10 Jul 97 In the News
The Vancouver Sun reports in its Thursday edition that two former directors
of a mining company listed on the Vancouver Stock Exchange have been
charged with fraud concerning the amount of gold in a Yukon mining claim.
Reporter Neal Hall says that Glen Elmo White of Vernon and David Walford Thomas of Surrey are each charged under the Securities Act with one count of fraud and 20 counts of misrepresentation concerning the amount of gold in Redell Mining's mineral claim in the vicinity of Mount Freegold. Mr White is the former v-p of Redell and Mr Thomas was the president. The alleged misrepresentations inflated gold reserves by up to 900 per-cent in various news releases and promotional materials issued between September 1994 and April 1996. During this time, the company raised about $3 million in financing through private placements. The stock price shot up from less than $1 and peaked at $6.62 in February 1996. Trading was halted in May 1996 after an investigation began.
To:mikesloan who wrote (455)
From: mikesloan Friday, Jul 11, 1997 9:44 AM
Respond to of 80072
U.S. producer prices drop for record sixth month in row
July 11/97
WASHINGTON (Reuter) - Wholesale prices fell for a record sixth consecutive month in June as
food costs plunged, the Labor Department said Friday in a report that was likely to be greeted
warmly on Wall Street.
The 0.1 percent drop in producer prices last month followed a 0.3 percent decline in May.
Excluding volatile food and energy costs, wholesale prices rose 0.1 percent last month after a 0.3
percent decline in May.
Wall Street analysts had expected prices paid to producers of goods ranging from grain to
computers to hold steady in June.
"Six consecutive monthly declines in producer prices is really an extremely favorable inflationary
report suggesting that there's not the slightest hint of inflation in the producing sector of the
economy. It has been wrung out completely," said David Jones, vice chairman and chief economist
at Aubrey G. Lanston & Co. Inc.
"The bottom line here is that the goods producing sector, because of improved productivity,
cost-cutting and global competition, isn't showing the slightest hint of accelerating inflation despite
full employment conditions in the economy," he added.
Last month's unexpected price drop should reinforce growing sentiment among investors that the
economy can continue to grow strongly without generating inflation and that there is no need for the
Federal Reserve to raise interest rates further.
The June decline in wholesale prices was paced by a steep 0.9 percent drop in food costs. The
drop in food prices was broad-based, with prices for beef, veal, pork, poultry, fish and vegetables
all lower. Prices for fresh fruits and melons tumbled by more than 15 percent, their biggest decline
in more than six months.
Energy costs turned up last month, rising by 0.7 percent, after declining steadily for much of this
year. Gasoline prices rose unexpectedly, although heating oil costs dropped, by nearly 6 percent.
Prices of a variety of other products also rose modestly last month. Car prices increased by 0.3
percent, tobacco gained 0.1 percent and alcoholic beverage prices were up 0.5 percent. Computer
prices, which have been falling steadily, also rose in June, by 0.6 percent, after a steep drop in
May.
The producer price report showed there is little in the way of inflation in the pipeline. Prices of
intermediate goods, which are used to make finished wholesale products, were unchanged in June.
Prices of crude goods, materials at the start of the production process, fell by 3.3 percent.
To:long-gone who wrote (452)
From: mikesloan Friday, Jul 11, 1997 9:00 AM
Respond to of 80072
Ottawa stops new borrowing
Nesbitt economist predicts bond shortages,
estimates sharp drop in federal deficit
Friday, July 11, 1997
By Rob Carrick
Investment Reporter
The Canadian government has stopped new borrowing for the first time in 25 years, issuing no new
bonds a year earlier than expected. In May, Ottawa reached the point of no longer needing to issue
new debt to finance its operations, Nesbitt Burns Inc. says in a report released today.
Weekly data from the Bank of Canada indicates Ottawa has been running what's known as a
financial requirement surplus for the past two months, the investment dealer says.
"Everybody has been talking about the looming shortage of new bonds in Canada," said David
Rosenberg, Nesbitt's senior economist. "What has changed is that the word 'looming' can now be
striked out. The Great Canadian Bond Shortage has arrived."
The result is that the federal deficit should be about $5-billion for the fiscal year that began April 1,
with surpluses to follow, compared with Finance Minister Paul Martin's prediction of a $17-billion
shortfall, Mr. Rosenberg said.
The implications of this development are sweeping in that they affect corporate bond issuers, the
pension and mutual funds that are the prime buyers of government bonds and the bond trading
desks at major investment firms. All Canadians will feel the broad impact because a shrinking
supply of bonds will put downward pressure on interest rates.
This year's sudden pickup in consumer spending is the most likely reason for the improved federal
financial picture, Mr. Rosenberg said.
"What I think is happening is that the bounceback in the domestic economy is obviously doing
wonders on the revenue side," he said. "That's probably where the big story is because the big
spending cuts have already been made and interest rates, of course, have already been coming in
below expected."
While the need to issue new bonds has dwindled, the federal government will still have to roll over
a stock of existing bonds now valued at $304-billion. Yet the impact on the bond market will still
be massive because the government has in the past issued $20-billion to $35-billion in new bonds
annually.
The strain on the country's bond supply will actually be even greater because the $40-billion paid
by Ottawa each year in bond interest has generally been ploughed right back into fixed-income
investments.
An obvious alternative to Government of Canada bonds is provincial debt, but most provinces
aside from Ontario and Quebec are in a similar position to Ottawa in terms of their declining
borrowing needs.
That leaves corporate bonds as an increasingly plentiful but riskier substitute.
"There is risk in that when you buy Government of Canada bonds you're quite safe and secure on
the issues of liquidity and credit quality," said Patti Croft, vice-president and portfolio manager at
Sceptre Investment Counsel Ltd., which manages about $14-billion in investments. "But when you
get into corporate bonds, you have to do your homework to ensure the stability of the
corporation."
Standards vary among pension funds, but many are prohibited from buying bonds with a rating of
less than triple-B or single-A. Yet about about one-quarter of publicly and privately issued bonds
in Canada are rated below triple-B, according to an estimate by Canadian Bond Rating Service
Inc. of Montreal.
Some investment funds may have to deliberate over the question of whether to buy corporate
bonds, but it's still expected that demand for them will be tight. So tight, in fact, that retail investors
may have trouble buying them.
Mr. Rosenberg said corporations have already jumped into the bond market in a big way, issuing
$36-billion worth of bonds in the past 12 months as opposed to $27-billion in the year-earlier
period.
"Corporations are borrowing to fund a dramatic upswing in business investment and they're being
able to do it at interest rates we've not seen in 25 years," Mr. Rosenberg said.
Aside from pension and mutual funds, the biggest adjustments to the changing bond market are
being made at investment dealers. Where as before they may have depended on government debt,
now they're embracing the corporate side of the fixed-income market.
Steve McGirr, vice-chairman of CIBC Wood Gundy Securities Inc., said the firm has redeployed
staff to increase the number of people underwriting corporate debt, which entails working with
issuers.
"It's a brave new world in terms of the bond market," Mr. McGirr said. "We are currently
experiencing phenomenal growth in corporate debt."
A more skeptical view of the evolving bond market was offered by Will Sutherland, manager of the
$575-million Altamira Income Fund. He believes there will still be a good supply of government
bonds going forward as a result of rollovers and the repatriation of debt that occurs when foreign
investors dump Canadian bonds.
"I don't think the bond crop will fail in my lifetime," Mr. Sutherland said. "My grandkids may have
to worry about it."
To:Pat O'Brien who wrote (438)
From: Casey Friday, Jul 11, 1997 9:17 AM
Respond to of 80072
Pat:
<<NOTE that gold is a "Political" metal. He who controls the gold sets the rules. Don't be fooled with who appears to be the owner of the gold with the CB sell-offs etc. Ask who "controls that gold or the right to that gold. Ask who will play that gold as the trump card when the timing is right. All of those other common things that are bantied around that supposedly will effect gold prices are somewhat of a facade. When "they" want the price of gold to move up, It Will !! When the timing is correct, those little gentlemen in London will start to wind it up and up.>>
Ok. I'll ask. Who does control that gold or the right to that gold? Who are these little gentlemen in London?
Sounds intriguing. I sure need an education on this subject.
TIA
Casey
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1742596
To:mikesloan who wrote (450)
From: mikesloan Friday, Jul 11, 1997 1:08 AM
Respond to of 80072
Lawmakers open formal U.S. budget negotiations
WASHINGTON (Reuter) - Nearing the end of a years-long quest, lawmakers opened formal
negotiations Thursday to craft compromise legislation balancing the federal budget by 2002.
From opening remarks at a purely ceremonial meeting to debate on the House floor, lawmakers
made it clear that Medicare changes would be among the most contentious issues as the House and
Senate work out a final budget plan.
The House voted 414-14 to fight a Senate plan that gradually raises the Medicare eligibility age to
67 from 65. The overwhelming margin, plus opposition from the White House, made it highly
unlikely the proposal would survive.
"We should discard age changes in the Medicare system. I hope that would be one of the first
things dropped," Massachusetts Democratic Sen. Edward Kennedy said.
Congressional leaders hope to meld separate House and Senate-passed tax and spending bills
into final compromise packages and get them signed by President Clinton before leaving in August
for a planned recess.
"(Negotiators) will come out with a package we will be comfortable with, the American people
will benefit from and the president will sign," Senate Republican Leader Trent Lott predicted.
Lawmakers faced an unexpected dilemma as they got down to work -- better-than-expected
economic figures indicating the deficit was shrinking faster than anticipated.
Republican leaders were already looking beyond the current talks, saying they may call for a new
round of tax cuts or a move toward tax simplification if lower deficits materialize.
The current measure would implement a five-year balanced budget deal between the White
House and Congress. There was broad consensus on the outlines of the legislation, cutting about
$140 billion from Medicare, Medicaid and other federal programs and offering a net $85 billion tax
cut.
The details were the sticky part.
The White House opposed the House Republican version of the tax plan, saying most of its
benefits would flow to the rich. It warned the tax cuts could explode in later years, increasing the
deficit.
"The goal that the Democrats have of delivering a tax cut to middle income Americans ... is really
facing only one remaining obstacle: Republicans' insistence that the lion's share of this tax cut go to
the wealthiest Americans," said House Democratic Leader Dick Gephardt.
Gephardt, Vice President Al Gore, Senate Minority Leader Tom Daschle and other Democrats
appeared together at the White House later Thursday to denounce the Republican plan jointly.
Republicans were split internally on how to design a final tax plan, but united in challenging White
House charges that they are looking out mainly for the wealthy.
They cited their own economic data to argue that the bulk of the tax cuts in the bill -- including a
$500-per-child tax credit, new education tax breaks and a cut in the capital gains rate -- would
benefit the middle class.
Another brewing issue was a Senate-passed plan to raise the federal cigarette tax by 20 cents per
pack, raising about $15 billion over five years. The majority of that money would be used for
children's health care.
House Republicans were set to make minor changes to the welfare sections of their bill. The full
House went on record calling for fair labor laws to apply to welfare recipients.
Most of the $115 billion in Medicare spending cuts in the budget measure came from reducing
federal payments to managed care, hospitals and other health providers in the popular insurance
program for 38 million senior citizens.
The Senate voted to make affluent beneficiaries pay higher Medicare premiums and raise the
eligibility age from 65 to 67.
In a shift, Clinton has said he might be willing to go along with some form of income test. House
Republicans want political cover from Clinton before embracing the plan.
To:Bill Jackson who wrote (437)
From: long-gone Friday, Jul 11, 1997 5:14 AM
Respond to of 80072
Thanks Bill,
What I suspect is everyone is looking at only the lack of inflation(BS) & supply side (CB)of the coin. There is a new level of wealth in SE Asia. This population wants the Gold jewelry wealth can bring. I understand in China people save for a 2/3 oz ring w/ large jewel before buying a $200 used TV. Visit any mall jewelery is selling! Demand will soon outstrip any supply we can now conceive.
Everyone will be looking around and saying "why did I not buy" or Hold.
Later
Richard
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1742111
To:mikesloan who wrote (449)
From: mikesloan Friday, Jul 11, 1997 1:06 AM
Respond to of 80072
S&P, Moody's criticize report on China
NEW YORK (Reuter) - Two major U.S. credit rating agencies Thursday criticized a report that
described China's banking system as a serious threat to global market stability.
Sovereign credit analysts at Moody's Investors Service Inc. and Standard and Poor's said China's
banks may constrain the country's rating, but noted the sector did not pose any danger of systemic
crisis across Asia, or even within China.
"We don't see China as a great threat to global market stability," said Moody's analyst Thomas
Byrne. "The story is a bit alarmist because the Chinese banking and financial banking system is not
really integrated into the global system."
Moody's maintains an A3 rating, while S&P rates China's long-term foreign currency debt at
BBB-plus, both of which were investment grade.
The Massachusetts-based economic forecast firm DRI/McGraw Hill said in a report that within
the next three to five years, China could see its banks default on between 20 percent and 40
percent of the country's $600 billion in outstanding loans.
Chinese banks have been crippled by government policies that forced them to make questionable
loans to state-owned or state-sponsored companies, many of which were in weak financial
positions, the report said.
"Although reforms of the Chinese banking industry may contain the problem over the short-term,
the risk of a serious debt problem will continue to mount and could have major economic
ramifications for many of China's smaller and weaker economic neighbors," it added.
But credit analysts said fears of a China syndrome were exaggerated.
"We do not believe it is a situation that poses dire macroeconomic threats to China," said Guido
Cipriani, director of sovereign ratings at Standard and Poor's. "It is an important constraining factor
in getting a higher rating."
S&P's Cipriani said the banking sector could undermine a country with low levels of economic
growth, but that China's strong medium-term prospects, growing 7.0 percent to 10 percent per
year, should enable the country to grow out of its problems.
"When you have an economy that is generating that type of increase in real economic resources,
you are buying yourself tremendous flexibility to finance yourself out of that problem," Cipriani said.
The banks should also benefit from the assets of state enterprises that were heavily indebted to
them.
Moody's Byrnes said no one knew the precise size of the bad loan problem, but that 40 percent
sounded far too high.
"If the banking system were to collapse, it would cause problems. Yet, it's not a $600 billion
problem," Byrne said. "The cross-border exposure of Chinese banks is about $25 billion, and they
have assets to offset that, too."
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1741600
To:Abner Hosmer who wrote (448)
From: mikesloan Friday, Jul 11, 1997 1:02 AM
Respond to of 80072
President names Gramlich, Ferguson to Federal Reserve Board
July 10/97
WARSAW, Poland (AP) - President Bill Clinton named Edward
Gramlich, an economics professor at the University of Michigan, and
Roger Ferguson Jr., a securities and banking lawyer, to the Federal
Reserve Board on Thursday.
The U.S. central bank, headed by Alan Greenspan, formulates
monetary policy and sets interest rates.
Gramlich is a former acting director of the Congressional Budget
Office and worked at the Federal Reserve.
Ferguson, a partner and director of research and information systems
at McKinsey & Co. in New York, holds three degrees from Harvard
University.
In April, administration officials had said the two were Clinton's
choices, pending a final screening process.
Their confirmations would bring the seven-member Fed board back
up to full strength. Along with Greenspan, they would join holdovers
Edward Kelley and Susan Phillips and two other Clinton appointees,
vice-chairwoman Alice Rivlin and Laurence Meyer.
Ferguson, 45, would become the third black member to serve on the
board and the first since the 1986 resignation of a Jimmy Carter
appointee, Emmett Rice.
Most recently, Gramlich, 58, served as chairman of a 13-member
advisory commission on Social Security. Although the commission's
members couldn't agree, Gramlich advocated raising payroll taxes and
establishing individual investment accounts owned by workers but
managed by the government.
Neither nominee has a particular background in monetary policy, but
colleagues have said in interviews they expected they would fit in with
the moderate, mainstream views of the other board members.
To:Mark Kubisz who wrote (443)
From: Abner Hosmer Friday, Jul 11, 1997 12:45 AM
Respond to of 80072
LONDON, July 10 (Reuter) - Gold prices hovered at firmer levels on Thursday but palladium sank to the lowest in two months after dealers confirmed that long-awaited Russian material had been delivered to Japan.
Gold stuck to a narrow range during European trading and was fixed at $319.80 an ounce in the afternoon -- virtually unchanged from the morning fixing of $319.65.
It was meeting resistance around $320 since bouncing off a 12-year low of $313.60 early this week, dealers said. But more short covering was probable after its sharp fall last week.
``People are short-term bullish and long-term bearish for gold,'' a dealer said.
Gold tumbled sharply last Thursday after the Australian central bank announced it had sold off 167 tonnes of its gold reserves.
A number of dealers said they expected prices to reach $300 eventually.
``It seemed to have bottomed out around $315 for the time being. But it's not over yet,'' the dealer said.
In the other precious metals, palladium dipped sharply at one point to $158.00, from Wednesday's close of $166.00/$171.00.
Resumption on Thursday of long-delayed exports to Japan from producer Russia was a psychological factor depressing the market after prices rocketed to 17-year highs last month amid extreme supply tightness, dealers said.
But even though it came off its lows, prices nevertheless fixed at a two month low of $162.00 in the afternoon versus $168.00 in the morning.
Dealers said that although the June high of $240 was now far away palladium still had the potential to bounce from current levels as supplies remained tight.
``It's being overdone, people are getting excited about a few thousand ounces arriving into Tokyo,'' a dealer said. ``Then again, it was overdone on the way up.''
Platinum was also weaker although it was moving down with less vehemence than palladium.
Prices were last indicated at $396.00/$400.00, down $2.50.
Silver, which is generally moving in tandem with gold, was just softer at $4.31/$4.33.
11:25 07-10-97
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1741498
To:mikesloan who wrote (444)
From: Abner Hosmer Friday, Jul 11, 1997 12:39 AM
Respond to of 80072
SYDNEY, July 11 (Reuter) - Australian shares opened slightly firmer on Friday as gold shares regained some gloss on their recently tarnished prices, while the broader market was helped by the rebound on Wall Street.
The All Ordinaries index was 7.2 points up at 2,701.6 with trade turnover A$105 million (US$78 million).
The Dow industrials rose 44 points to 7,887 on Thursday.
Australia's gold index was up four percent, which helped tip the broader resources index into the positive zone, while industrials were weaker as bank shares came off the boil after Thursday's strong run on hopes of a further monetary easing.
Traders said they expected the market to trade in a narrow range as expectations of a rate cut were dampended by Treasurer Peter Costello on Thursday after the release of June's weak jobs data. The figures had earlier sparked a rally in yield stocks.
``It looks like they are not going to do anything on that (interest rate cut),'' Hassett said. On Thursday, Costello said the market should wait for previous rate cuts to take effect.
June's job data was weaker than expected showing jobs growth was about a quarter of average expectations, heightening speculation of a another rate cut. The Reserve Bank cut official cash rates to 5.5 percent from 6.0 percent in May.
Despite the bank index fall, Commonwealth Bank was the only major bank to rise, up six cents at A$16.32.
Elsewhere in the industrials, Coca-Cola Amatil continued its fall, down nearly 2.5 percent. On Thursday, it fell seven percent on a earnings downgrade and the negative impact of the drop in the Philippine peso after its San Miguel deal.
(A$=US$0.7430)
21:48 07-10-97
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (424)
From: Dale Schwartzenhauer Friday, Jul 11, 1997 12:30 AM
Respond to of 80072
At one time, the Belgian Franc was a highly respected currency, with its strong implied gold backing. That's obviously not the direction the authorities are taking now. It's ironic that these governments are systematically selling off the people's assets, only to later make them illegal and call them back in.
To:Abner Hosmer who started this subject
From: Abner Hosmer Friday, Jul 11, 1997 12:35 AM
Respond to of 80072
.c The Associated Press
By The Associated Press
Selected world gold prices, Thursday.
Hong Kong late: $319.55 up $3.90.
London morning fixing: $319.65 up $2.35.
London afternoon fixing: $319.80 up $2.50.
London late: $319.55 off $0.40.
Paris afternoon fixing: $321.61 up $6.99.
Frankfurt fixing: $319.52 up $3.54.
Zurich late afternoon: $318.60 up $1.20.
NY Handy & Harman: $319.80 up $2.50.
NY Handy & Harman fabricated: $335.79 up $2.62.
NY Engelhard: $320.99 up $2.50.
NY Engelhard fabricated: $337.04 up $2.63.
NY Merc. gold spot month close Thu. $320.20 up $2.00.
NY Republic National Bank 4 p.m. Thu. $319.80 up $1.80.
AP-NY-07-10-97 1712EDT
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1741438
To:Mark Kubisz who wrote (443)
From: mikesloan Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 11:18 PM
Respond to of 80072
Will all the 24 year old gold screen jockeys with braces please take a bow.
Thursday July 10 8:44 PM EDT
Australia Deputy PM slams gold "screen jockeys"
SYDNEY, July 11 (Reuter) - Australian Deputy Prime Minister and Trade Minister Tim Fischer
slammed critics of the Reserve Bank of Australia's (RBA) huge gold sale, saying on Friday
speculators were responsible for the gold price slump, not the government or the RBA.
Fischer said ``24 year-old screen jockeys with braces'' in the world's financial markets had to
accept more of the responsibility.
``If they've got to close out or hedge with pain the speculative positions they've taken, I'm not going
to shed one tear for them,'' Fischer told Australian Broadcasting Corp radio in South Africa.
The gold price was set by traders around world, and it was unfair to blame Canberra, he said.
World gold prices slumped to 12-year lows after the RBA announced last week it had sold two
thirds of its reserves.
The RBA, which reduced its holdings from 247 tonnes to 80 tonnes over the last six months, said it
would invest the proceeds from the sale in foreign currency assets like bonds.
Earlier in a newspaper interview published on Friday, RBA governor Ian Macfarlane defended the
bank's gold sales and said miners had exaggerated the price impact of the RBA sale and helped to
undermine the price through big forward selling.
``I think they (miners) somewhat exaggerate our impact on the overall world market,'' the paper
quoted Macfarlane as saying.
He said the gold price had been heavily influenced over the past year by European central bank
sales and by proposals by the International Monetary Fund to sell gold to fund debt relief.
He also cited a research paper from the U.S. Federal Reserve which proposed the U.S. central
bank sell down its gold reserves.
``Heavy forward selling by producers has not helped either,'' the RBA governor added.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1741020
To:Mark Kubisz who wrote (443)
From: mikesloan Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 11:18 PM
Respond to of 80072
Will all the 24 year old gold screen jockeys with braces please take a bow.
Thursday July 10 8:44 PM EDT
Australia Deputy PM slams gold "screen jockeys"
SYDNEY, July 11 (Reuter) - Australian Deputy Prime Minister and Trade Minister Tim Fischer
slammed critics of the Reserve Bank of Australia's (RBA) huge gold sale, saying on Friday
speculators were responsible for the gold price slump, not the government or the RBA.
Fischer said ``24 year-old screen jockeys with braces'' in the world's financial markets had to
accept more of the responsibility.
``If they've got to close out or hedge with pain the speculative positions they've taken, I'm not going
to shed one tear for them,'' Fischer told Australian Broadcasting Corp radio in South Africa.
The gold price was set by traders around world, and it was unfair to blame Canberra, he said.
World gold prices slumped to 12-year lows after the RBA announced last week it had sold two
thirds of its reserves.
The RBA, which reduced its holdings from 247 tonnes to 80 tonnes over the last six months, said it
would invest the proceeds from the sale in foreign currency assets like bonds.
Earlier in a newspaper interview published on Friday, RBA governor Ian Macfarlane defended the
bank's gold sales and said miners had exaggerated the price impact of the RBA sale and helped to
undermine the price through big forward selling.
``I think they (miners) somewhat exaggerate our impact on the overall world market,'' the paper
quoted Macfarlane as saying.
He said the gold price had been heavily influenced over the past year by European central bank
sales and by proposals by the International Monetary Fund to sell gold to fund debt relief.
He also cited a research paper from the U.S. Federal Reserve which proposed the U.S. central
bank sell down its gold reserves.
``Heavy forward selling by producers has not helped either,'' the RBA governor added.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1741020
To:go4it who wrote (441)
From: mikesloan Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 11:05 PM
Respond to of 80072
Maybe the developing situation in Korea is contributing to the POG. It closed up $2.00 today at $319.70 and is up another $0.70 presently.
Thursday, July 10, 1997
Defector: North Korea prepared to invade
South Korea
SEOUL, South Korea (AP) - North Korea has networks of tunnels and
is stockpiling weapons, the country's highest-ranking defector said
Thursday. warning the North may start a war to head off starvation and
despair.
North Korea is confident it can win a war against South Korean and
U.S. forces, said Hwang Jang Yop, 74, a former confidant of North
Korean leader Kim Jong Il.
"They believe that war must be waged. This is a firm policy of North
Korea," Hwang said in his first public appearance following 80 days of
interrogation by South Korean and U.S. intelligence officials.
"The North has only two options: to surrender or to start a war,"
Hwang told a news conference. "It is their unshakable faith that they
must fight a war, once and for all."
Warnings of war are nothing new in South Korea, which fears a famine
has left North Korea increasingly desperate and envious of the well-fed
South as well as eager to find a diversion from its problems.
Hwang - touted as a potential gold mine of data on one of the world's
most secretive regimes - did not provide any startling new information.
Still, there was huge interest in his news conference, carried live by all
major TV stations.
Hwang did not disclose details of North Korea's alleged war plans.
But in a report issued Thursday, South Korean intelligence officials said
Hwang told them the North planned a surprise artillery bombardment of
Seoul, the capital, followed by seizure of the rest of the country within a
week - a scenario repeated by earlier defectors.
A former secretary of the North's highest decision-making body, the
Central Committee of the Workers Party, Hwang is the most prominent
North Korean defector since the division of Korea in 1945. He served
three times as chairman of the North's parliament and once tutored Kim
Jong Il.
Hwang said Kim Jong Il was in tight control of the North, especially its
1.1 million-strong military, the world's fourth largest.
"With the economy in paralysis, Kim Jong Il has only the military to
depend on," Hwang said.
He said he had no evidence proving Pyongyang has nuclear weapons,
but added it was "common sense" among North Koreans that their
government possessed them.
In a report to Parliament in May, South Korean intelligence officials
quoted Hwang as saying North Korea has nuclear weapons capable of
"scorching" all of South Korea and part of Japan.
But Washington has cast doubt on that claim, saying North Korea's
nuclear program was frozen and monitored under a 1994 agreement.
Before the freeze, however, the country was believed to have enough
plutonium to put together a nuclear device.
Hwang and an aide, Kim Duk Hong, 59, arrived in Seoul in April,
ending a 67-day ordeal that began with their escape to South Korea's
consulate in Beijing on Feb. 12.
About 10 North Koreans have defected in the past three years, 60 this
year alone. All complained of an acute food shortage the United Nations
says could lead to mass starvation.
The Korean peninsula was partitioned into the communist North and the
capitalist South in 1945. They are still technically at war since no peace
treaty was signed at the end of the 1950-53 Korean War.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1740936
To:Casey who wrote (440)
From: Mark Kubisz Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 11:11 PM
Respond to of 80072
Well done, Casey!
When I first read the page, it didn't click for me as to why an increasing lease rate should be bullish. So I downloaded the page, went offline and gave it some thought. The way I figure it is this: the lower the cost to borrow gold (i.e. the lease rate), the more people that are going to borrow it, sell it, and invest the proceeds, pocketing the difference between their rate of return and the lease rate when it comes time to return the gold (or the claim to it). Therefore, the immediate effect of a higher lease rate should be to ease the selling pressure. That's the way I figure it, anyway. If I am wrong (which I don't think so) or my explanation is incomplete (quite possible), I invite others to add to it.
Thanks for the link.
Mark
To:John Barendrecht who wrote (419)
From: Pat O'Brien Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 9:33 PM
Respond to of 80072
John, thanks for the press. Here's a question to ponder.
Bre-x was expected to bring 100 million ounces of Au on stream. Quite quickly, that product evaporated and of course the market realized that it would not be impacted with that amount of supply. One would think the price of gold would have kicked up substantially, would on enot?? But no.
CB of Aust. decides to unload 167 tones over several months and all hell breaks loose. The gold supply figures were not altered. Simply, another party has their name on the title cert for a while, until they decide to sell.
Are we sure that these little transactions of late, are not getting "the media and promotional spotlight' purposely as to explain why the gold prices are be "placed at lower levels" for reasons unknown?
Just a question, that's all.
Respectfully, Pat O'Brien
To:Mark Kubisz who wrote (420)
From: Casey Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 10:28 PM
Respond to of 80072
Mark:
I finally found an explanation of the gold lease rate mechanism. Check this out.
http://www.the-privateer.com/gold4.html
Now I have to figure out what a sudden increase in the lease rate means, i.e. what causes it.
Casey
To:Pat O'Brien who wrote (439)
From: go4it Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 10:33 PM
Respond to of 80072
Interesting concepts Pat. Thanks Chuck
To:Mark Kubisz who wrote (420)
From: Pat O'Brien Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 9:22 PM
Respond to of 80072
Mark, our thoughts are not that far apart. I find that many goldbugs tend to look to Economic Indicators to inform them of golds next move. They watch the levels of Comex warehouse levels, Professional commercial gold traders commitments vs commitments by speculators, Correlations between the commodity indices and the price of gold, Future inflationary guages, Worldwide interest rate policies, Insider stock transaction activity with the gold producers, XAU vs Spot Gold Price, Behaviour of other precious metals; eg Platinum, Paladium and silver, Price/Volume Statistics re gold trades, XAU "Magic Multiple Five", Page access to various gold sites or request for gold info, Special Political considerations, Golds trading range (tight or lose), supply coming on stream, to name a few.
Makes you dizzy doesn't it.
Then we have to take into account the economic implications of a money glut in the economy worldwide, consumption frenzie by consumers that has been going on for years and the personal and government debts outstanding worldwide. As well, all the forward selling that has taken place and the fact this gold will have to be mined just to fulfill the obligations for the dollars already received. And all the precious Metal Loans (particularily gold) where the true owners have lent there hard metal and now this metal has already been consumed and will somehow have to be repaid (could have a sort of run on the bank syndrome here). Actually I don't think there is enough metal above ground to cover this scenario.
Personally I know there is a world out there that trades in billions of dollars of gold bullion and other forms on a daily basis. Little about this world of people and transactions is known by John Q Public.
The London fix is still happening twice a day and this merry little band of gentlemen decide our fate. Or do they?? Or are they merely going thru the motions for the prestige of it all, on behalf of those that are really calling the shots from behind the scenes.
Are the economic statistics that the common folks are being fed, being manipulated? You bet! Is debt (personal and public)at absurb levels? Of course! Two years ago Japan held 7% of US public debt, today it is 33%. What if Japan cut of the inflow of cash?? Can the gold obligations be currently repaid on the spot without gold hitting the roof? Not a chance! Etc. Etc.
What does all this garble mean??
NOTE that gold is a "Political" metal. He who controls the gold sets the rules. Don't be fooled with who appears to be the owner of the gold with the CB sell-offs etc. Ask who "controls that gold or the right to that gold. Ask who will play that gold as the trump card when the timing is right.
All of those other common things that are bantied around that supposedly will effect gold prices are somewhat of a facade. When "they" want the price of gold to move up, It Will !! When the timing is correct, those little gentlemen in London will start to wind it up and up.
Now, just what do we do? Get into the juniors, as their potential for new gold in the ground combined with the market's multiples, will drive their stock prices through the roof.
Enough for now.
Respectfully, Pat O'Brien
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1740290
To:mikesloan who wrote (431)
From: John Barendrecht Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 4:12 PM
Respond to of 80072
Istanbul gold volume dives, awaits world trend
ISTANBUL, July 10 (Reuter) - Traded volume on the Istanbul gold exchange dived to 464 kilos on Thursday from 1,281 on Wednesday as the market quietly awaited world trends amid expectations of a decline in the short-term, dealers said.
Gold prices closed higher at 1,561,000 lira per gram and $321.50 an ounce, versus Wednesday's 1,535,000 lira and $318.00 in line with the European levels.
``Although we entered the summer season when demand usually firms, there were no buyers because the market is waiting for world prices to go down again in the short-term. Nobody wanted to buy gold at these levels,'' said one bank trader.
The Turkish currency closed easier at 150,980 per dollar after Wednesday's 150,900 which also pushed up lira prices.
The bulk of the day's trade -- 320 kilos -- took place in the morning session and 76.5 percent of the total trade was in lira terms.
To:mikesloan who wrote (413)
From: Ted Gregg Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 4:28 PM
Respond to of 80072
NY POG $319.70
gold/silver XAU up 3.28%
http://quote.yahoo.com/quotes?symbols=^XAU&detailed=t
Ted
To:long-gone who wrote (417)
From: Bill Jackson Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 8:35 PM
Respond to of 80072
Richard; The next time I am in Toronto, I will get a consolidate goldfields gold book, then I may be able to answer that.
Bill
To:Alex who wrote (430)
From: John Barendrecht Thursday, Jul 10, 1997 4:05 PM
Respond to of 80052
Gold Fields mulls closure of Leeudoorn mine
By Melanie Cheary
JOHANNESBURG, July 10 (Reuter) - Gold Fields of South Africa Ltd said on Thursday that the Leeudoorn division of its Kloof Gold Mining Co Ltd (KLOF.J)could not continue to make a loss and closure was one of the alternatives it was mulling.
But it said consultation with the mineworkers' unions at the mine was crucial and no decisions would be taken before this.
``Obviously we can't continue to incur losses. Something has to be done. One of the scenarios would be closing this operation or we could combine it with the Kloof (division),'' said Keith Spencer, general manager of Gold Fields gold operations.
``We've got to make a decision as fast as we can but this will be with consultation with employees,'' he said at the group's second quarter gold results presentation.
The Leeudoorn division reported a second quarter loss of 29.34 million rand from the 5.64 million rand loss in the three months to end March 1997.
Gold Fields said in a statement that a major increase in unit working costs to 65,909 rand/kg from 55,020 rand/kg and a drop in gold output to 1,769 kg from 1,892 kg were the prime factors behind the increased loss.
But current weak gold prices are likely to pressure most South African gold mines in the current third quarter, cutting average gold price received substantially.
Gold Fields has a traditional policy of not hedging its gold production and analysts have said that only mines that have locked in gold prices better than spot are likely to weather the gold price fall.
Leeudoorn received an average gold price for the quarter of 49,324 rand/kg, which was less than the 52,042 rand/kg received in the preceding quarter.
``Investigations into the alternative options for this division are well advanced which could lead to substantial changes. In the interim, efforts to increase the tonnage milled will continue and the current yield is expected to be maintained,'' Gold Fields said.
The group was also looking at downscaling or rationalising the Leeudoorn operation.
The Leeudoorn division employs about 5,000 mineworkers.
The Kloof company's Libanon division also made a working loss with cost per kg for the quarter at 51,550 rand and revenue received 49,652 rand/kg.
``There is no reason why Libanon cannot make a profit even at the current gold price,'' Spencer said.
This could occur if the mine managed to increase its milling rate to 500,000 tonnes per quarter with an average grade of 6.0 grams/tonne. Libanon milled 402,000 tonnes in the second quarter and average grade was 5.9 grams/tonne.
But Spencer added that if the current sickly bullion price continued, Gold Fields would be forced to re-examine shafts at Libanon and consider downscaling.
The bullion price fell to 12-year lows last Thursday on news the Australian central bank had sold 167 tonnes of its gold reserves over the last six months. Bullion was last trading in London at $319.70/320.20.
Gold Fields posted a pre-capex net profit for the three months to end June of 192.34 million rand compared to 236.42 million rand in the preceding March quarter.
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=1738093
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The PHLX Gold/Silver Sector Index (XAU) is a capitalization-weighted index composed of companies involved in the gold or silver mining industry. The Index began on January 19, 1979 at a base value of 100.00; options commenced trading on December 19, 1983.
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