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You could literally just write an email to JPM’s IR team and ask them about the purchase price payment for WMB. But of course you won’t, right?
👉👉👉COOP BOD wants to "...COMPOUND tangible BOOK VALUE at a DOUBLE-DIGIT PACE..."
The COOP BOD said at the 4Q'24 earnings call on Feb. 9, 2024:
But we will work diligently to compound tangible book value at a double-digit pace which for us is an exciting prospect.
BBANBOB.... it would be wise for you to read the official documents concerning the matters of WAMU, and WMI bankruptcies...... YOU NOW ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, EXCEPT TO BLOVIATE ALL OVER THE MESSAGE BOARD FOR YEARS......you cant even explain how the shareholders, and by what means they were included in the chapter 11, and where the financing came from to include them....stop with the spurious bull sh*t, and read the documents before posting.....here is a question for you.... why was the 20.7 billion dollars in retained earnings removed from the FEB MOR, and , if removed, where did it go?????????????..... answer this question because it is seminal to your expected returns..... Lodas
Just for clarity, The Underwriters had claims in Class 18 and Class 20. When POR7 was approved their Class 20 claim was moved to Class 19.
Completely Wrong BB0b.
Alice had no right to offer a charge in Class to anyone!
The Underwriter were the underwriter for a Class 19 security.
Therefore the UW never had the reason to go to Class 22.
All fictitious stories made by Alice.
]
IMHO
""Or could it have really been because of the JUDGES view that since they got caught for IT, that she would penalize CLASS 19 by allowing "" ALL CLASSES TO PARTICIPATE in CASE THERE WAS NOT ENOUGH TO GO AROUND"" with the APR in place ????????????????????????????????
ORRRRRRRRRRRRR could it have been
THAT THE JUDGE WAS OF THE OPINION THAT THE DIPS MAY HAVE SEEN SOMETHING SHE DIDN'T SEE and WOULD MAKE SURE THEY DIDN'T GET AWAY WITH IT
"""WHO KNOWS imho neither of us do for sure"""
I sure wouldn't risk my pinky finger on it would you????????????????????????????
@ newflow.....your answer to my question is non sequitur to the question as to why the 20.7 billion dollars was removed from the Feb MOR without a notation as to why, and where it went....if you have a link to the whereabouts, then post it......by the way, Ken Posner was asked that question years ago by a poster....Ken said he had no knowledge as Coop, and the old WMI was not connected in any manner after the chapter 11 closing....Lodas
This references Libor only. Bank payment is a different bucket.
LG
As we have talked about 100 times over
I think they ‘may have’ just used WAMU money to generate even that ‘book value’. Ideally that’s how every smart business owner protects their interests
LG
a LARGE GREEN BINGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO on that one
RON
""Removal of APR was do to the Retained Earnings of the February MOR""
Or could it have really been because of the JUDGES view that since they got caught for IT, that she would penalize CLASS 19 by allowing "" ALL CLASSES TO PARTICIPATE in CASE THERE WAS NOT ENOUGH TO GO AROUND"" with the APR in place ????????????????????????????????
One needs to look at both sides of the coin and she SPANKED CLASS 19 and caused them to give up 25% to a Class that never should have been allowed to participate ""UNTIL CLASS 19 WAS PAID IN FULL""'
This is why I suggest ya can't have it both ways, cap in anyway form or fashion CLASS 19 and then allow only U's to inherit the bulk of the estate, this would send the MARKET FOR PREFERRED INTO A TAIL SPIN, just like the BONDS WILL BE paid somewhere down the line or the BOND MARKET would freak out as well.
Hey bud the clock aint at zero, so lets sit back and see how the game ends, you may be right and then again ya may not be, WHO KNOWS imho neither of us do for sure
RARELY are a COURTS signed orders over turned, AND ESPECIALLY WHEN IT WOULD BE BACK IN THE SAME COURT THAT ISSUED and SIGNED OFF ON THE PLAN
AND GOOD LUCK WITH THIS TOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO,
I belive regardless whether you signed or not, you will still get pay,
as that WOULD INSURE A LEGAL MORASS to take place here and the JUDGE will not allow that...........
And imho it would be headed up by TEPPER SAVITZ and BONDERMAN oh and throw the UW's in there as well........
Contracts and their conditions when negotiated settled and signed off on by the court IMHO WILL NOT BE OVERTURNED, but instead UPHELDDDDDDDD.
Simple legal outcome
This is not complicated. You could literally just write an email to JPM’s IR team and ask them about the purchase price payment for WMB.
But of course you won’t, right?
Mufa
ALL I can or will say is DIG REAL DEEP INTO ""YOUR POCKET"" or ANY that decide to bring suit, since there will NOT be a LAWYER ONE imho that will take this on a CONtengency, but they darn sure will take your money on retainer..............................PANDORA's BOX imho will never be opened on this thing
Plain and simple ALL HAD the same payout MATRIX INFO and CONDITIONS basically PUTTING ALL on a level playing field.
LG and I discussed many times WHY THEY OFFERED UP the payout matrix and said YOU EITHER SIGN OFF to participate or you get nothing............
THEY HAVE COVERED THEIR REARS IN OUR OPINION...................
GOOD LUCK if you so decide and your case will be short and sweet, about 10 mins before the JUDGE DISMISSES IT, OH and you DO realize you would be in front of THJMW right
Along with Libor cactus claims “... (XXXX) is comin' “. Double whammy…..
>>>>>>>Mr. Cooper Group Inc. to Discuss First Quarter 2024 Financial Results on April 24, 2024
https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20240404446961/en/Mr.-Cooper-Group-Inc.-to-Discuss-First-Quarter-2024-Financial-Results-on-April-24-2024
BB, I believe the payouts revolve around two major actions.
1) The resolve of Libor
2) The resolve of (R) the Receivership being brought to a final conclusion
3) The FDIC has not been released and as a result of that action JPM has not been released via the FDIC[/b]
…
Dimon and FDIC likely have the settlement ready
JPM must pay for assets as explained in Amended POR 7 signed by the court on 2/23/2012
Once it is clear that no money is coming to Escrows in 2024 the happy gullible audience will readily move on to new dates in 2025, 2026 and beyond, all based on exactly the same theories like in the past 16 years.
Your honest question sync in with your honest character, why don't you call coop IR.
Sorry, how big ($ figure) is the pending settlement for COOP?
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/933136/000119312514100035/d630387d10k.htm
page 9......7.54 Billion in NOLS in 2012, and 5.98 Billion in NOLS as recorded for use with the 2013 WMIH 10-K..
an honest question to L.G, Ron, Boris, BBAN, newflow, and others expecting a return... take me off ignore, and bury your hatchet for once, and answer this SIMPLE QUESTION::::::::
under what circumstances would the IRS grant a 7.54 Billion in Tax NOLS to a corporation exiting chapter 11?...was the NOLS in connection to a shareholders loss in retained earnings, or more specifically a loss in equity?.... I call your attention to the fact that shareholders who lose value on a stock (equity) in the stock market are allowed a deduction on the income tax... is it not the same for corporations who writeoff equity earnings on a stock that was cancelled? the FEB MOR shows a Shareholders Retained Earnings loss of (20.7) Billions, but does not indicate a money trail to where it went...The MOR does not state that it went to a Treasury Bill, as ron suggests...my question is how can one simply remove 20.7 billion from a balance sheet, say nothing to why or where it went, and THEN CLAIM 7.54 BILLION IN NOLS WRITEOFF???.....ISN'T THIS FRAUD BY WMI?...or is the simple answer that WMI took the 20.7 billion dollar loss in the GSA agreement, and got the 7.54 billion dollar NOL writeoff against future earnings...this question is pivotal to your expectation of more returns... a reply is expected by any one, or all of you.... Lodas
From hold2wm:
"Dimon and FDIC likely have the settlement ready and once FDIC gets the deal from UK banks, then US banks will come to terms w/o additional legal fight imo. That said I won't be shocked if we see the Libor settlement in the next few weeks."
Of course I know that's not what SOME of you want to hear. Nothing is certain. But hold2 has been following Libor closely and is not an easter bunny type. Let's see what happens. I think this yr could be big but who knows???
Boris, I believe there are a few buckets of returns due to those investors who signed timely releases by 3/2012.
1) JPM must pay for assets as explained in Amended POR 7 signed by the court on 2/23/2012
2) COOP has used assets since 2012 without paying for them and making tons of money from servicing those assets. Remember, to have an asset that you can make money from is worth a fortune in itself, so when WMIH exited Chapter Eleven of the Delaware bankruptcy case/court, it only had 75M in cash and about 6B in NOLs...nothing more...then during the ensuing years they were able to have a servicing platform of around one trillion
3) The investors who signed timely releases are due monies from COOP for using those assets for years of which they did not own. One could also speak of Xome which I believe the same investors own because there is no way COOP could not monetize Xome as CEO Bray spoke of several times over several years, so this tells me COOP does not own Xome in its entirety
4) Then we know there are the Safe Harbor assets that should provide another bucket of returns but only time will tell
5) Also the FDIC should still own us for assets they took and not repay us not to mention the potential we should have once Libor is settled which should happen this year
...
LG, some on smart board think our Ps will be converted to new Ps. Interesting idea because that could be done easily without it costing anyone anything. They would just be traded on the open market. But who would issue the new Ps? Coop or Jpm?
And what value would be placed on the new Ps? Surely much more than $1000 face. Then what value would they have going forward if assets, minerals, etc. start to come into the equation. It gets really complicated.
soon". Is this days, months or years
Boris, you commented on JWW's post that follows.
_______________________________
Jww...imagine the pps when the 2.5% hits.
Could be meteoric.
_______________________________
I do not believe they will let the price skyrocket into the hundreds of dollars per share and as many have witnessed they are having a hard time keeping the price as low as they have. So, to me, it would seem before it becomes glaringly obvious, that there will be a positive financial event that will keep the price from going into the hundreds of dollars per share. The following MAY play a major role in the upcoming COOP financial event.
1) Remember, there are ten million Preferred shares that are shelf-ready and authorized to be used on a minute's notice plus these shares were never reduced in the October of the year 2018 Reverse Split and were never reduced since they were authorized on the (ED) Effective Date of March 19, 2012.
2) There are 300 million common authorized COOP shares to be used on a minute's notice
3) COOP has purchased 36 million common shares of its stock which has lowered the outstanding stock to around 64 million
4) There could be a forward stock split to lower the COOP price when the future value (2.5% and/or Xome monetized) comes to pass
5) COOP could be taken private in a very cheap takeover with ultimate value continuing to be legally obfuscated
6) I predict relatively soon that we will see an exciting event for both investors who signed timely releases by 3/2012 and those investors who hold COOP and did not sign timely releases. I believe the financial event will have to do with COOP paying those investors for some assets those investors who signed timely releases for their ownership in the former WaMU Estate
...
Completely Wrong BB0b.
Alice had no right to offer a charge in Class to anyone!
The Underwriter were the underwriter for a Class 19 security.
Therefore the UW never had the reason to go to Class 22.
All fictitious stories made by Alice.
APR;
Removal of APR was do to the Retained Earnings of the February MOR which created a payment mechanism for payment to Class 19 and Class 22 before Class 19 was satisfied. The ~2.1X greatly satisfy the Class 19 past interest payments
And YES I HAVE READ THE DOCUMENTS!!!
5885,
Ron
AZ,
Now ?, ol' cactus is just waiting around for the completion with everything "now freebies" ... COOP' / released P's, K's, and WMI Common Share uq's ... and the WMB Bonds' ... it should be soon' ... (XXXX) is comin'
How many times for so many has this been posted on this board concerning when....i.e. "soon". Is this days, months or years?
@justnormal: It depends. You know that I have still doubts, if we will get further payments (doesn't matter if by shares or by cash). And therefore I thought it would be good to find out who lodas really is. Because it seems to me that he knows too much for being an "ordinary" person. So there must be some relation to his job or to whatever. At least we should not exclude this possibility.
And AZCowboy is unfortunately not serious enough for me to trust him. I don't understand why he won't change his writing-style to a more serious one.
So we can still just hope ..
And coming back once again if it matters ...
I would feel better when I know that lodas is just an ordinary person and no insider. Because when he is actually an insider and is right with his referings to the documents, then it is all said (just we would not know for which reason lodas informs us here again an again .. ). Something is not consistent. I am wondering what will be written and discussed when there are no information about payments in 2024 .. we just can hope that we will have information about soon ..
Hallo Key Key does IT realy matter? Gruß Just
...When it never should have mattered.
What sort of luney goes "all in" on just one class, anyway?
My bad but yes completely agree. Same as the 75/25 never ending discussion. Can you believe it’s been 12 years and that discussion still continues ?
This is the whole problem with what is being discussed, PEOPLE DO NOT READ WHAT IS WRITTEN, THEY interpret it THE WAY THAT THEY WANT TO SEE IT or read it
Jww...imagine the pps when the 2.5% hits.
Could be meteoric.
SHHHHH. ...We are about to get paid $100B+ from the "LIBOR 'Settlement' that FDIC is overseeing for us...
COOP's fair PPS is $200 to $250, if not even higher
Check COOP's current P/E ratio:
https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/COOP/key-statistics?p=COOP
COOP's trailing P/E is only: 10.68
COOP's forward P/E is only: 6.23
The P/E ratios in this list (data is as of January 2024)
Financial Svcs. (Non-bank & Insurance) covering 172 companies is the correct row:
http://pages.stern.nyu.edu/~adamodar/New_Home_Page/datafile/pedata.html
Financial Svcs. (Non-bank & Insurance)
The average P/Es are:
Current: 34.63
Trailing: 25.59
Forward: 25.54
BTS, just a guess on my part. I’m going with inability to interpret plus lack of comprehension. The mentality of it can’t be my fault, therefore my problems are caused by someone else.
Many of them did not release, thinking they can sue for fraud.
I know few of them.
When we get pay, they can still do it cause they hide a lot from us in order to make a right decision.
I belive regardless whether you signed or not, you will still get pay, most of the payments comes from outside the backrupcy, this way everything is clean and closed.
Will you spend 24 h /day posting on something you know you lost?
Everything was done behind the scenes, you can't say you got the same information as TPS (they signed after meeting with Susman).
That s why the stay around here.
@ KeyKey..............subject: "ownership change", page 9.....
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/933136/000119312514100035/d630387d10k.htm
Lodas
~ LOL', Yepperini, It Is Up To Me ! ! ... Isn't It ? ... I don't have any questions ... None' ... ~
"Well, it is up to you"
@AZCowboy: You would be taken much more serious without writing words like "Cactus" "LOL'" etc etc .. Is it really important for you to communicate on that level ?? It is really difficult to understand and follow you .. Well, it is up to you, but with just reading the sentences, I would trust lodas much more ..
Mid summer soon? Fall soon?
JHD
~ Well' ... WMIH / "COOP" Has Already Made This ol' Cactus Cowboy ! ! Quite Happy ~
... don't quite get any thoughts related to a ... "Pig In Poop" though' ... ? ... But the source consideration' explains that ! ! LOL' ...
the 2018 Acquired Sub, now symbol "COOP"s pps ride up from the single digits, allowing for the recovery of ALL WaMu expenditures for anyone and everyone to take advantage of ?, ... worked out quite well ... Thanks ! ! ... including what was (cowboy) spent on the WMB Bond DIRECT PURCHASES', after the Holding Company's Reorganization and before "Globic" settled, showing the included cusips' ... rock on' ... those Directly Owned WMB Bonds are saweeeeeeet ! !
Now ?, ol' cactus is just waiting around for the completion with everything "now freebies" ... COOP' / released P's, K's, and WMI Common Share uq's ... and the WMB Bonds' ... it should be soon' ... (XXXX) is comin'
"Abba Da Ayy" ... and those that have "Pigs In Poop" ? on their mind ? ... well, good luck with all that, SMH' ... wow ! ! LOL' ... LOL' LOL
just sayin'
AZ
@mufa: Ok, let us assume that lodas didn't release .. ok ..
But would this really be a reason to post here ongoing .. day by day ?
And again: Where does lodas have all this knowledge from ??
Still wondering.
Well, I am not a native english speaker .. ok ..
But also when I would be a native speaker, it would not understand all the things which are written in the court documents ..
You need to be familiar with this business also when lodas will not agree.
So who is lodas ? Is it an US-finance lawyer ?? And how old is he really ?
We probably can still just guess .. But something seems to be strange ..
Anyhow .. We should find out the next months .. or LG is right and it needs further time till Jamie retires .. So one extension after another after another after another .. And lodas just insists on his documents and nothing else beyond .. strange strange strange .. so he might know more but he will not tell .. so again the question to @lodas .. do you have another source than just reading information from documents ?? Did you speak to somebody from FDIC or whoever ? And again: Are you a lawyer ? Which profession do you have ? Thanks
I'll be as happy as a pig rolling in poop
Didn't say I WOULD ROLL IN POOP
This is the whole problem with what is being discussed, PEOPLE DO NOT READ WHAT IS WRITTEN, THEY interpret it THE WAY THAT THEY WANT TO SEE IT or read it
Please ask somebody to make a video when you do this, and post it on Instagram and YouTube
I can guarantee that you will make millions with just the number of views for that video
so if 4.6 X's face comes back to P's and face to K's I'll be as happy as a pig rolling in poop
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Mr. Cooper Group Inc. (NASDAQ: COOP) provides quality servicing, origination and transaction-based services related principally to single-family residences throughout the United States with operations under its primary brands: Mr. Cooper® and Xome®. Mr. Cooper is one of the largest home loan servicers in the country focused on delivering a variety of servicing and lending products, services and technologies. Xome provides technology and data enhanced solutions to homebuyers, home sellers, real estate agents and mortgage companies.
Upon completion of the merger between WMIH Corp. and Nationstar Mortgage Holdings Inc. on July 31, 2018, WMIH became the parent company of the Nationstar Mortgage Holdings Inc. family including Mr. Cooper (Nationstar Mortgage LLC, d/b/a Mr. Cooper), Xome and Champion Mortgage (Nationstar Mortgage LLC d/b/a Champion).
As of October 10, 2018, Mr. Cooper Group Inc. is the new name of WMIH Corp. On July 31, 2018, WMIH, now Mr. Cooper Group, became the parent company of the Nationstar Mortgage Holdings Inc. family including Mr. Cooper (Nationstar Mortgage LLC, d/b/a Mr. Cooper) and Xome.
As early as late 2006, WaMu would begin to become a victim of what would eventually become the worst recession in US history since the Great Depression of 1929. WaMu's aggressive business strategy would begin to unfold throughout the end of 2006 and become increasingly disastrous through 2007. As housing rates were at all time highs before the recession began, WaMu would use its considerable leverage and assets to make large amounts of loans in both subprime mortgages and subprime credit cards. The banking division of WaMu at one point before the end of 2007 had nearly 336 stand-alone branch buildings where various types of home loans were processed and approved. WaMu would eventually over leverage themselves due to the high number of Adjustable Rate Mortgages (ARMs). As the US economy slowed down, the number of home loan defaults began to rise in quick succession. This coupled with the falling home prices throughout most of the US meant that even with foreclosures and the properties back in the hands of the company, they were unable to sell them back into the market, or were not able to derive enough revenue from the sale to cover the loan that was made on them. In the mean time, the credit card division was also seeing a surge in the number of late and non payments being made.
By September of 2008, WaMu's stock price had fallen to $2 from its previous highs of around $50 just two years earlier. Amid strong voices from the shareholders, then company CEO Kerry Killinger was dismissed by the company board. In the meantime, the company went looking for a buyer for part of its banking division. WaMu had been unsuccessful in finding an appropriate buy until its seizure by the FDIC. Overnight the companies banking division was bought by JP Morgan Chase in a secret deal brokered by the FDIC for 1.9 billion dollars. Washington Mutual Inc. has reorganized to Washington Mutual Holding Inc. WITH SHAREHOLDERS INTACT
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