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That's why I made reference to the "LT Assets" because they would refer to bankruptcy specific assets. To counter that point though,...why would the LT specifically state to whom the Equity and Assets of WMIIC belong???
Just as in the US bankruptcy of 2008 the main players were in both sides of the deal
We are sitting good
Very interesting points. There is assets beyond a shadow of a doubt shielded snd once again were cerrtified under abratration after Por 6. The amount of the shielded estate is something we will not know for sure as to the exact the time and or vehicle and mechanism.
Even a run of the mill bk attorney understands as to the how and WHY our lrfal team including A&M shield assets of the debtor from the court; legally.
So as we all see the peripheral and obvious, the true accounting of assets without a full accounting in black in white it is truly difficult to know for sure the true $ Amount.
One thing is for sure,that is all entities deemed Equity are not invested so heavy over so many years waiting on the chance they get a crumb at the feast.
If it were just lowly share holders involved and none of the massive billion dollar players (deemed) Equity then I would agree show is Over!!
I find the mere fact a full accounting of all assets and liabilities may never be known due to the fact a Schrivers error occurred as the trap door for the FDIC OTS Treasury Jpmc and the henchman to save our fincial system from collapse due to Jpmc's collapsing bank becuase their exposure to the Trilateral Repo market.. As all things would be fought out in court and as long as equity could keep its seat at the table some restitution had to be paid .
As last week I made my final call to the FDIC and spoke to my contact whom previously where polite and somewhat accommodating, the final conversation was much more direct and curt as reaction to my pointed list of questions. In the end the call was completed by saying I would need to file a F. O.I.A . to see what more could be provided. WHY so secret? FOIA's are the only mechanism outside of those who are privy to THE SHELTERED true accounting of what went where and whom gained or loss and its related mechanism.
Your post CBA09 is very good and well posed. Your background as a c.p.a.is even more qualifying for the legitimacy of your thoughts! Bravo
C.P.A .
Regards
B
CBA,
"On another issue,do you think that by WMI having abandoned it's stock in
WMB as worthless will remain worthless? I don't. This was an astute move. By doing so, having this on record within the bankruptcy, any value that returns will not be an assets of the bankruptcy estate and whollly retained to WMI.
How much value? And how would this play out, going forward?
Thank you.
Quote..."On another issue,do you think that by WMI having abandoned it's stock in WMB as worthless will remain worthless? I don't. This was an astute move. By doing so, having this on record within the bankruptcy, any value that returns will not be an asset of the bankruptcy estate and whollly retained to WMI."
I actually thought about this very point and had previously been of the opinion that abandonment meant WMI relinquished their full rights of control over WMB. It never occurred to me that this was a move that was legally permissible, if it was done under the umbrella of the bankruptcy.
From the first post, yep, you betcha.
Just in case you didn't know Lehman Brothers bankruptcy is not over either. They were the largest Washington Mutual 2nd. Tick tock tick tock
Yes on both accounts.
"No reversion (of LT Assets) to the Debtors" clause in the LT Agreement.
I have always wondered since WMI off BALANCE assets could NOT BE USED IN THE BK since they were not theirs LEGALLY by title!!!!!!!!!!!!
Are they actually ASSETS OF THE DEBTOR IMHO NO???????????? ANd especially once this is really over those assets if you will are only earmarked or can legally come to the ESCROW and KOSTUROS has a blank check as to what he has the right to do as a TRUSTEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have always wondered if these rules if you will are only governing what happens WITHIN THE BK, but NOT OUTSIDE OF IT
Ref Would this really also apply to WMI even though they never securitized or sold any MBS's?
I believe WMI would have transferred assets to WMIIC as it seemed to be their Investment Management Vehicle.
In such a case, how would WMIIC's assets be treated post bankruptcy with regard to the WMILT and WMIHC?
It was specified (in an LT MOR, not sure) that WMIHC owns the Equity and the WMILT owns the assets of WMIIC.
In addition there is the "No reversion (of LT Assets) to the Debtors" clause in the LT Agreement.
I honestly believe we're sill missing a lot of important pieces here.
Comment:
WMI is the parent and thereby have ownership rights to all the assets of it's children, namely subsidiaries. Holding companies are the "Gem" within it's conglomerates. Their survival is dependent upon it's revenue of it's subsidiaries. The courts know this and will support this ownership position.
On another issue,do you think that by WMI having abandoned it's stock in
WMB as worthless will remain worthless? I don't. This was an astute move. By doing so, having this on record within the bankruptcy, any value that returns will not be an assets of the bankruptcy estate and whollly retained to WMI.
I agree dips are buying opportunities. Go Cubbies!
Blackshadow just relax,everyone will win in the ends except for non escrow holder,,so just enjoy the ride..
We both know who we are and who they are and one thing is certain right now.
1.The BK isnt still over from the FDIC in its capacity as Corporate.
2.The Fight againt the hedgies on the IT Claims got settled after two months of Discusions and the TPS got involved and one side acepted in the first hand(majority of them)and the rest did get along because run out of options.
3.The "More than fair and Reasonable"after four years going for five irregardles of your opinion still didnt materialise and geting working out from the Parties involved in the case knowing as much as necesarily but for sure on the highth of their presence on this food chain.
4.The WMIH is right now in the proces of letting him self being tested from the SEC and preparing to issue the Billion of more shares in the return of the Assets from the FDIC R and more than that selling their bussines model to the new Investors to get in after the billion shares get distributed to the Escrow shareholders in the return of their releases given for free to the FDIC+JPM.So the prices of those releases are those to be issued new shares too the old Escrow holders and the dollars to the Serviced MBS from JPM+DB.
So enjoy the ride to come and dont forget that only after the october gone will start the New Era of the WMIH Escrow holders.
Ps My hats of to you too and all Mason group which so proudly tried to make the diference.Thanks for everything you and others did but to Willingham and othe Equity members too which fought and stood against all the Odds against the Crime Syndicate of the WALL STREET.Enjoy the New Week and Life ahead.
Sincerely Altini.
Olti100, I'm 100% sure that will not be...
...the sentiment when the receivership and liquidating trust end.
...100%.
Olti100 Sunday, 10/08/17 10:00:28 AM
Re: bkshadow post# 491039
Post #
491041
of 491042 Go
when NOTHING MATERIALIZES (and it won't, other than what's in the WMILT) the praises of Mike Willingham and Susman will turn quite bitter.
Now wonder how would Willingham and More than anything else Sussman known for his integrity and Personality would feel if they would read it from you knowing that you actually fought so much to bring your man in the table with them before the BK was finished.Wish they would read your MEssage and let us know what they thought about it.
Ps IMHO am 100% that Sussman presence and fight on our side gave the tone and the hope to our Fight and we were luck to have Willingham bring so heavy Weight wolfes on our side and am 100% they did the best to give the maximum for the Retail Shareholders and that 100% that the "More than Fair and Reasonable" still didnt materialise its self.My many thanks to them for everythink they done on our behalve for our pockets and Lifes..
If it does I’ll buy some more. Dips are buying opportunities.
Your pain and suffering shine through just let go let go start relax and you will find peace after all nothing will change the out come either way take care
when NOTHING MATERIALIZES (and it won't, other than what's in the WMILT) the praises of Mike Willingham and Susman will turn quite bitter.
Now wonder how would Willingham and More than anything else Sussman known for his integrity and Personality would feel if they would read it from you knowing that you actually fought so much to bring your man in the table with them before the BK was finished.Wish they would read your MEssage and let us know what they thought about it.
Ps IMHO am 100% that Sussman presence and fight on our side gave the tone and the hope to our Fight and we were luck to have Willingham bring so heavy Weight wolfes on our side and am 100% they did the best to give the maximum for the Retail Shareholders and that 100% that the "More than Fair and Reasonable" still didnt materialise its self.My many thanks to them for everythink they done on our behalve for our pockets and Lifes..
Has a WMIH QA Been Triggered – If So WMIH 8K Imminent – Also WaMu 1031 Exchange Information
For a Qualified Acquisition, then all the Series B preferred stock converts. Currently, WMIH currently has 206M shares, so now add in another 342M shares that converts from preferred B and maybe another 61M (Tranche A and B) and you get over 600M WMIH shares. The price is probably dropping due to dilution.
Possibly, we have gone from roughly 200 hundred million shares to 600 million shares outstanding which also took the price from roughly $3.00 to $1.00. So the math works and now we need to see an 8K showing the (QA) Qualified Acquisition.
On another note, remember when ole Rosie tried to cancel out all of equity when he was ready to announce his plan at the very end of 12/2009 but was caught with Joe McMahon “Exigent Circumstances” in middle of 12/2009 so Rosie postponed his infamous announcement of “no money for equity until 3/12/2010 when the stock plummeted with Rosie’s connection to Kevin Stark.
My thoughts now are now is the same plan in effect where WMIH wants to be as close to the end of year 2017 to formalize a QA if it has to do with maximizing various tax attributes? I am not sure but in principle makes sense.
600,000 shares of Series B Convertible Preferred Stock
10,065,629 Shares of Common Stock issuable upon conversion of the Series A Convertible Preferred Stock
342,857,143 Shares of Common Stock issuable upon conversion of the Series B Convertible Preferred Stock
30,700,000 Shares of Common Stock issued upon exercise of the Tranche A Warrant
30,700,000 Shares of Common Stock issued upon exercise of the Tranche B Warrants
The Series B Preferred Stock is not convertible at the option of holders.
All or a portion of the Series B Preferred Stock automatically converts into our Common Stock upon an Acquisition (as defined below) or a Qualified Acquisition, as the case may be. If an Acquisition does not occur, none of the Series B Preferred Stock will convert into our Common Stock. If an Acquisition occurs but a Qualified Acquisition does not occur, only a portion of the Series B Preferred Stock will not convert into our Common Stock. Holders of the Series B Preferred Stock will have no right to convert their shares of Series B Preferred Stock at their option into Common Stock. Furthermore, if an Acquisition or a Qualified Acquisition does occur, the Series B Preferred Stock will automatically convert into Common Stock at a conversion price no less than the Floor Price even if such conversion is unfavorable because our Common Stock is trading below the Floor Price.
In addition, the market price of our Common Stock could also be affected by possible sales of our Common Stock by investors who view the Series B Preferred Stock as a more attractive means of equity participation in us and by hedging or arbitrage trading activity that we expect to develop involving our Common Stock. The hedging or arbitrage could, in turn, affect the trading price of the Series B Preferred Stock or any Common Stock that holders receive upon conversion of the Series B Preferred Stock.
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/933136/000119312515400186/d29830d424b3.htm
The WaMu 1031 Exchange is Key to Time-frame of WMIH Moving Forward – Hidey Hole of Sorts – Yeah!
• 600 million funding expires-must be returned to investors 1/5/2018 if QA not accomplished
• WMILT – 2nd set of 3-year extension expires 3/19/2018
• If WMILT wants to extend – Court hearing/approval a must
• WMILT must file 6 months prior 3/19/2018 as before-Mid to late Sept-Allow court time
• Currently, only one remaining subsidiary – that is WaMu 1031 Exchange
• This is expected to be dissolved be 12/31/2017
• Please see below what a 1031 Exchange can accomplish
• If JPM receives 645 million 9/19/17 (60 days + 10 business days from Calif Judge Signature) time condenses more
• One can condense timeline due above facts
• Timeline based on previous facts when WMIH files 8K moving forward follows
• That timeline is between 9/20/2017 and 10/31/2017
*WaMu 1031 Exchange*Why Leave One Sub Open hm, hm
Note 9: Investment in Subsidiaries Since the Effective Date, the Trust had five (5) dormant subsidiaries without any active business operations. The subsidiaries adopted a plan of liquidation in October 2012. The assets held by these subsidiaries were comprised solely of cash and cash equivalents. On June 23, 2017, four of the subsidiaries were merged with and into the last remaining subsidiary, WaMu 1031 Exchange. Prior to such mergers, such subsidiaries distributed their remaining cash to the Trust. The Trust received $444,333 on June 27, 2017. The last subsidiary, which no longer has any assets, is expected to be dissolved by December 31, 2017.
From 78 to 93 million in till-No payoff for Piers-Left impaired?
http://www.wmitrust.com/wmitrust/document/8817600170728000000000001
https://www.bloomberg.com/research/stocks/private/snapshot.asp?privcapId=9262133
Consumer Finance
Company Overview of WaMu 1031 Exchange, Inc.
WaMu 1031 Exchange, Inc. operates as an exchange intermediary for 1031 tax-deferred exchanges in the United States. Its services include preparation of exchange agreements and other necessary documentation, management and disbursement of exchange funds, coordination of the exchange with settlement providers, and general exchange assistance to exchangers and their advisors. WaMu 1031 Exchange was formerly known as Lawyers Asset Management, Inc. The company was founded in 1977 and is headquartered in Manhattan Beach, California. WaMu 1031 Exchange, Inc. operates as a subsidiary of Washington Mutual, Inc.
3601 North Aviation Boulevard
Suite 1000
Manhattan Beach, CA 90266
United States
Founded in 1977
Key Executives For WaMu 1031 Exchange, Inc.
WaMu 1031 Exchange, Inc. does not have any Key Executives recorded.
dragoon76, read what? The "P&A?" What is...
...the P&A from your reference to the bankruptcy case or to the banking subsidiary?
...there is something known as the Purchase and Assumption Agreement, generally referred to by reasonably informed investors OSM as the "P&AA."
...that is available on the FDIC-C website and has been SINCE 2008.
...not only read it, but fully comprehend it, don't have issues with the 'wording, or other nuances that are confabulated into billions missing though.
dragoon76 Saturday, 10/07/17 07:00:07 PM
Re: bkshadow post# 491019
Post #
491020
of 491038 Go
I just asked you if you read it or not, that's all. simple question that deserves a yes or no answer. No other info is needed.
Stop being salty about not being on the equity committee, too. LMAO !!
Ref post #489606 for context....what's your take/comments???
Quotes from post............
"Commentary:
Trust Sales accounting solidified! Reason - Two Tier SPE Entities. First tier (i.e., Depositors - “WaMu Asset Acceptance Corporation” and “Washington Mutual Mortgage Securities Corporation), Second Tier issuing Trusts.
Conclusion:
$615 Billion were removed from the Balance Sheet of WMB in true sales. Neither WMB / JPM nor the FDIC receivership has any claim to these securitized Trust assets.
Further, revenue that has & continues to be generated remains captive within each respective Trusts.
Now the caveat - The holding company generally receives the cash flow from Trusts either directly from the Trusts or indirectly thru it's Depositors. From here the holding company will past "on an as needed basis" cash to it's banking entities. To safeguard and protect the assets received by the holding company it will not have an expressed contractual rights to pass on what it receives."
Would this really also apply to WMI even though they never securitized or sold any MBS's?
I believe WMI would have transferred assets to WMIIC as it seemed to be their Investment Management Vehicle.
In such a case, how would WMIIC's assets be treated post bankruptcy with regard to the WMILT and WMIHC?
It was specified (in an LT MOR, not sure) that WMIHC owns the Equity and the WMILT owns the assets of WMIIC.
In addition there is the "No reversion (of LT Assets) to the Debtors" clause in the LT Agreement.
I honestly believe we're sill missing a lot of important pieces here.
Note: getting caught up on missed posts
IN your Wildest DREAMS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You mean REAL Rich opens Monday .84 then sinks to low .70's
Got my jogging shoes on!
Did JPM purchase ALL of WAMU??? Actual expertise required.......
Pg 2 of P&AA: “Assets” means all assets of the Failed Bank purchased pursuant to Section 3.1. Assets owned by Subsidiaries of the Failed Bank are not “Assets” within the meaning of this definition.”
Pg 9 of P&AA: Section 3.1 Assets Purchased by Assuming Bank
Pg 11 of P&AA: Section 3.5 Assets Not Purchased by
Assuming Bank (Listed in Schedule 3.5)
Pg 11 of P&AA: Section 3.6 Assets Essential to Receiver
(a) The Receiver may refuse to sell to the Assuming Bank, any Asset or asset that the Receiver determines to be: (parts iv + v of v)
(iv) secured by collateral which also secures any asset owned by the Receiver; or
(v) related to any asset of the Failed Bank not purchased by the Assuming Bank under this Article III or any liability of the Failed Bank not assumed by the Assuming Bank under Article II.
ZC!!!
I'm here for the kmart RUN....its coming.....
People saying "You better cover your short position!" since 2.25....lol. Shorts have benn the winners for the last year or so. Check a chart.
Poor Real your plan didn't go to well.. you better cover your 's shorts position. ..
You should scroll down, IH has the end of day volume.
47K shares changed hands by the end of trading on Friday. Trading volume was down 89.05% under the stocks average daily volume time to let this company die
dragoon76, so what is the "P&A" you...
...refer to?
...LOL.
...doesn't appear related to the WMI/WMIIC debtors, WMILT.
...is it the basis for another 'theory of hundreds of billions of hidden secret off balance safe harbor fantasy?
dragoon76 Saturday, 10/07/17 02:20:03 PM
Re: bkshadow post# 490988
Post #
490995
of 491017 Go
Have you seen the P&A?
Geee....thanks for NOT answering my question. A simple yes, I have read it or a no, I have not would have sufficed, LOL.
Thanks, we will be fine about 100 miles from the cost but I have some trees that may come down not near the house thank God. Good luck all all we can do is wait!
We will see what happens after 4 BUSINESS days which is next Friday IMO!
draggon76, what is the "P&A" in such...
...esteemed and erudite understanding of the WMI/WMIIC (i.e., the 'debtors) bankruptcy?
...the court documents are absent such acronym.
...thanks.
dragoon76 Saturday, 10/07/17 02:20:03 PM
Re: bkshadow post# 490988
Post #
490995
of 491003 Go
Have you seen the P&A?
ron, your theory is deeply flawed, sorry to say that.
When the escrows/WMILT (the debtor's estate) receive a final payment (IF there is any), then WMIH can NOT book this same amount A SECOND TIME as capital gain, because WMIH did not receive this final payment and thus did not have this capital gain, but the WMILT. And neither is the WMILT owned by WMIH, nor has WMIH a stake in the WMILT
Your theory "magically" duplicates the amount of the final payment (again, if there is any)! Not possible...
NOLs are GONE with
"the Final Payment".
JPM paid FDIC-C on or before June 1st, closing the PAA with JPM's Indemnification payment on July 14th. The FDIC-C will push the funds to FDIC-R for distribution to "the Debtor's Estate" WMI-Escrow Holders to complete the "Change in Control" for "WMB and it's assets".
When "the Debtor's Estate" WMI-Escrow Holders realize "the Final Payment", when WMIH will 'Book' the Capital Gain against the Capital Loss and the NOLs are GONE.
The old Capital Loss will be re-Booked as the new offsetting Capital Gain. Hence; No Capital Loss, no 'gives rise to' NOLs.
The current 8-K [Value from the Hawaii Insurance Bond "Assets" which Old-WMI owns] can be 'Booked' against current NOLs, until "the Final Payment" is realized by Old-WMI, and 'Booked' by WMIH.
HLCE,
Ron
Bond, good luck to you!
Mon, Any Sierra news on WMIH. LMAO!!
Quote:
MONICALAW Saturday, 01/19/13 11:37:13 PM
Re: xoom post# 382133
Post #
382134
of 491000 Go
Xoom, Sierra is saying the settlement JPM/WMIH will be completed in 14 days???? From when? from today??? Thanks Awesome man...Mon
Got relatives who live about 80/miles South of Nashville, (Huntsville) looks like right in path.
Thanks we will... Just making sure my loader is ready to remove trees off fences if need be. Lets keep wamuing lol
UP
IRS has already Been TAXING our LT....Look at 3/31/2017 LT 10Q ...We paid $30 Millions for the first Quarterly Income made from LT assets held in our LT Existing Cash and Stock investments....Already....We are Not aware of Taxes paid in second and third quarters this year....And WMIH NOLs has Nothing to do with LT income or M&A with WMIH....Separate entities right now....Separate Taxes paid.....Thank you for your knowledge and contributions....Best
Stay safe down there!
Still waiting on your answer about those P's, Claw
Have you seen the P&A?
Sorry guys on the tractor getting ready for the cat 1 hurricane. If that be the case then maybe the nols survive. I can tell you this we will soon know...
Yep and 32 bil went to Dell for WMB IMO :0
Bond:if my memory serves me correctly ( and some time it doesn't) there were two tax credits. One for the nol's for the bank and the other was a one they took as an ordinary loss on the bank stock that was held by the holding company.
There is ONLY one reason the BIG MONEY PLAYERS have been here since 9/2008
***********AND THAT IS***************
They are after VERY LARGE SUMS OF MONIES LIKE THE AMOUNTS MOST PEOPLE HAVE NEVER HEARD OR SEEN BEFORE
********NOW THE AFOREMENTIONED SPEAKS LARGE GREEN LANGUAGE**********
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Moderators Large Green xoom GO4AWILDRIDE stoxjock ron_66271 |
Mr. Cooper Group Inc. (NASDAQ: COOP) provides quality servicing, origination and transaction-based services related principally to single-family residences throughout the United States with operations under its primary brands: Mr. Cooper® and Xome®. Mr. Cooper is one of the largest home loan servicers in the country focused on delivering a variety of servicing and lending products, services and technologies. Xome provides technology and data enhanced solutions to homebuyers, home sellers, real estate agents and mortgage companies.
Upon completion of the merger between WMIH Corp. and Nationstar Mortgage Holdings Inc. on July 31, 2018, WMIH became the parent company of the Nationstar Mortgage Holdings Inc. family including Mr. Cooper (Nationstar Mortgage LLC, d/b/a Mr. Cooper), Xome and Champion Mortgage (Nationstar Mortgage LLC d/b/a Champion).
As of October 10, 2018, Mr. Cooper Group Inc. is the new name of WMIH Corp. On July 31, 2018, WMIH, now Mr. Cooper Group, became the parent company of the Nationstar Mortgage Holdings Inc. family including Mr. Cooper (Nationstar Mortgage LLC, d/b/a Mr. Cooper) and Xome.
As early as late 2006, WaMu would begin to become a victim of what would eventually become the worst recession in US history since the Great Depression of 1929. WaMu's aggressive business strategy would begin to unfold throughout the end of 2006 and become increasingly disastrous through 2007. As housing rates were at all time highs before the recession began, WaMu would use its considerable leverage and assets to make large amounts of loans in both subprime mortgages and subprime credit cards. The banking division of WaMu at one point before the end of 2007 had nearly 336 stand-alone branch buildings where various types of home loans were processed and approved. WaMu would eventually over leverage themselves due to the high number of Adjustable Rate Mortgages (ARMs). As the US economy slowed down, the number of home loan defaults began to rise in quick succession. This coupled with the falling home prices throughout most of the US meant that even with foreclosures and the properties back in the hands of the company, they were unable to sell them back into the market, or were not able to derive enough revenue from the sale to cover the loan that was made on them. In the mean time, the credit card division was also seeing a surge in the number of late and non payments being made.
By September of 2008, WaMu's stock price had fallen to $2 from its previous highs of around $50 just two years earlier. Amid strong voices from the shareholders, then company CEO Kerry Killinger was dismissed by the company board. In the meantime, the company went looking for a buyer for part of its banking division. WaMu had been unsuccessful in finding an appropriate buy until its seizure by the FDIC. Overnight the companies banking division was bought by JP Morgan Chase in a secret deal brokered by the FDIC for 1.9 billion dollars. Washington Mutual Inc. has reorganized to Washington Mutual Holding Inc. WITH SHAREHOLDERS INTACT
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