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And yet you are still on this board after 20 years of being invested in LQMT!
LMFAO!!!!
Simple .... The bigger the innovation the longer the first bite of the Apple takes and the longer the adoption takes and the longer EVERYTHING takes ..... So check your history on how long the adoption of other very disruptive materials took and this is probably far ahead of the curve on progress... Just have to keep things in perspective and you can have reasons to be thankful instead of going somewhere 24/7 to bitch and gripe.
I sure hope those other two or three door knocking endeavors the LQMT sales reps find pans out a heck of a lot smoother than this one. And I sure hope this current one can correct itself soon like in the next quarter.
Otherwise it’s another Zyris type deal. You know reoccurring orders and then poof! The rabbit disappears and the top hat collapses and LQMT alerts no one.
As someone recently posted. You need a leader to succeed. From what I read unverified, it looks like LL is succeeding in leadership. If he doesn’t have the answers he finds someone who does. At least in China. Hopefully one day soon he will remember his roots and realize there are a few hundred million people here who also cook with pots and pans.
Back to the 10K.
Is your thesis why you have stayed glued to LiquidMetal so long ... or could it be your livelihood or your 'fortune telling' of some kind is tied up in something that new materials such as 'LiquidMetal' will maybe make obsolete in future years....
Research,
When I suggest that someone buy, I get told to go to my box!
No respect for yellow Tomcats!
Tomcat
So why are you suggesting someone sell? Why not suggest everyone buy? Selling is negative. Buying is positive.
Buy on bad news. Sell on good news. :)
Ring company hits another new low 0.389. I can see clearly where you draw your conclusions.
From historical facts.
The knowledge of these facts imo, keep the new potential investors away from this once promising endeavor to now a high risk dice roll. They want proof of success and not more proof of potential success and are willing to pay a lot more for it, when and if it ever does succeed.
"Those who sell at any price are not very good and not very nice!!"
IMHO - Tomcat
Sounds like what is happening. One can control private testing. But when you experiment with 4000 customer orders and they are not shipped, that is a huge problem. Then you have the comments from consumers who have the product and you don’t know if the negatives are due to lack of knowledge, high expectations, bias from competitors or actual defects. But we do know right now since their last PR, there has been PR silence in all areas to address the concerns of both the consumer and their shareholders publicly. Leaves a huge void and leads to more questions. There seems to be a lack of understanding how the product works and a lack of explanation of what does not work from the company. Even from an unbiased report that supports the ring. The individual needed to contact the company for clarification on how to use the ring effectively.
Watts,
If you truly think LQMT is a scam or a con as you say, then you shouldn't hold any shares!
IMHO - Tomcat
Birds of a feather flock together. Con artists love each other. I have so many products made of liquid metal that have been discontinued after only a few months of production, whether it is golf clubs, modems, cell phones or miltner-adams knives. Liquidmetal has no staying power. The only product still sold are the oilfield coating business which Steipp gave to John Kang. Scams attract scams. Half-baked Chung attracts half-baked companies.
Hard to say what exactly is the case here. Social media has it's share of posters who for various reasons wish to cast doubt about new products, especially the competition.
Could the lack of shipped product be from an underestimating the initial demand? It takes a bit of patience for a new product like this. Imagine trying to fix a bug or make improvements...can take some time before all ahead go on the production that also may need adjusting. So as things are developing I cut Morvano a little slack here early on. It is impossible to know everything that may occur that requires adjustment with the introduction of a new product and compounded in today's world of fast changing tech.
thanks. and if that is in fact what is happening ..not good. Movano will figure that out.
Regardless, it does not take away from the expansion of liquid metal due to Movano
notoriety and of course Evie rings are still being sold. Growing pains!
The play-by-play analysis while sitting in a BaseBall Stadium and still bitching about the absence of Goalposts is hilarious .... So did anyone actually think that the first so called rollout would go perfect ?? ... The good thing is that there are probably at least 50 other 'early adopters' throughout various market segments who are fully educated about the benefits and are ready to hop aboard ..... and as the fine-tunning takes place more and more interested customers will be keeping a close eye on the progress as the refinements continue and those on the sidelines who are waiting to hop aboard will continue to grow to many hundreds. Never ceases to amaze me that someone can use their time 24/7 staying on these boards for decades criticizing and bitching about how somebody else is supposedly failing to use their time wisely with their efforts to pioneer new billion dollar and trillion dollar innovations.
Research,
I agree. A declining MOVE price is not going to help LQMT stock go up!
IMHO - Tomcat
I don’t know where your data is from. If true then the ring company has a lot of headwind up ahead.
I came across this article. Not sure if it is biased or honest. If true the ring company seems to be backing it up with their silence.
https://www.reddit.com/r/eviering/comments/1asy8wy/some_comments_on_the_important_evie_ring_shipping/
This too will only drag LQMT down as well, especially for all expecting more revenues from it as a reason. Could be why volumes and sp of LQMT headed south instead of north.
TC imparted what he believes lies ahead for LQMT 2024. The picture painted by him was a rosy one as well as very risky. The sp right now is stuck in too much risk.
Unless the ring company can get its act together. LQMT might be better off knocking on more doors to open up.
The Evie ring is not being well received by most redditers. People are complaining of inaccurate steps, inaccurate sleep data, and poor temperature that leads to very basic menstrual,tracking, something that was supposed to be a feature. Movano may have figured out Liquidmetal but they have miles to go before they have mostly happy customers
Well said! None of the cash received by LQMT’s non earned revenues has ever helped to grow the earned revenues from parts sold. Thus never increasing shareholder value, but forever decreasing shareholder value. It is the only reason why the share price peaked on expectations to about 0.44 cents seven years ago and continues to decline to present day, taking a pause only, when LQMT releases a pr.
Good luck to you.
Surely, you jest.
You still bag holding?
Very few of the remaining bag holders refute that statement today.
I also stated unequivocally that the purchase of Lqmt by Luger li was a scam.
This new potential should begin to increase trading volumes again and bring in new interest as the potential for LQMT’s share price is no longer speculative. Couple this with the expectations from TC for the year ending 2024 and hype will have added value as well.
Looks also like they tweeked the casting formula to expand better to suit the expanding/contracting of the female digits. The ring also won many awards which of course gathered lots of attention in this rising female health industry. I would assume sales will increase.
Research & all,
I saw a low bid of .031 per share in 2023!
A low share price in the .03s was predicted by a "Hanging Dead Man" technical chart pattern that appeared and was pointed out by an electrically named poster to this board some 12 or so years ago!
FYI - Tomcat
The purpose of business is more than just having capital last, chippy. It is to have capital grow from net positive earnings. Please expand your vision of success and don't settle for bidenomics.
Put this in the context of LQMT….
Looking at the “Titans of Industry/Commerce” we see Rockefeller, Ford, Kellogg, Walton, Jobs, Gates, Bezos, Musk plus or minus. What do they have in common?
They are “founders” of their industry
They are male (a hint)
They were/are obsessive with the task
They were very analytical
They were not fun people
They lacked “people skills” to mesh with society.
WAY out of my area…they may have been borderline/mildly autistic.
Where is this going? We have no “founder” to drive the process so the ownership of achieving success is a little less motivated. You can’t throw money at someone and create the same level of commitment that a founder has. No amount of bonus or stock options can get there…..this is a big problem.
ANECDOTE…Personal experience…I worked for a “founder owned/operated” company that started in 1935 (depression) and was successful in spite of the economy. After 20 years or so, it was decided that we needed “professional management” so we hired a raft of MBA’s who transitioned through the business (typical 3 years) …it was HELL. The popular term at the time was “Opportunistic Tourists” and you could rank commitment by where they chose to live. The company was headquartered about 20 miles from a major city and if they chose to locate in the city suburbs, they were less committed (options open) than if they chose to live closer. We sifted through manpower for about 2 DECADES before things stabilized…..chaos.
THE POINT…..We have no “Founder” with sufficient fire in the belly to make success happen and you can’t just go out and buy one.
I first invested in LQMT in 2014 and I have yet to see a profitable quarter and I see the next major milestone for the company is to reach breakeven. Any steps to lower the B/E bar is fair game….raise the rent, go for 4.5% vs. 4.0, increase sales, reduce travel…anything up to and including a car wash
.
Annual loss for 2023 was $2 million which is down from $2.3 million in 2022. Its trending down on a quarterly basis but SOOO SLOWLY.
”Surely somebody, somewhere, is making money from this cutting edge technology”
Metglas is the only company anywhere that is continually successful manufacturing and selling BMG.
Did not forget at all, but it is not the purpose of this business, or why I bought shares. California commercial real estate, debt securities, yada yada, there are better ways to do that. What is the accumulated deficit at this point? Must be around.$250 million. Where is the income from BMG and the IP, to finally establish a viable business? Surely somebody, somewhere, is making money from this cutting edge technology. For sure it isn't Valencia, and it isn't us. It seems to me that the well known conflicts of interest and our dependence on the Chinese interests are the elephant in the room. Somebody somewhere will call the shots on who gets what, not the free market we are accustomed to. IMHO.
You forgot $23 million @ 4% and the real estate appreciation….remember TC mentioned that the $7.8 million building has appreciated by 50-100% since purchase. Our cash pile could easily last 20 years. I won’t.
Will Tom Selleck do a $15 million reverse mortgage on an industrial building?
Excellent points. We have actually been in the business of equipment depreciation, and commercial property rental. Not to mention the real obsolescence of that equipment which last I heard is under tarps in Arizona. Far as we know, it has never produced any revenue.
Our 5 year agreement with EUCTECTIX is due to expire in January 2025. The royalty/commission schedule for this arrangement was 6% + 6% which looked good at the time but has yet to return a DIME. What is the value of free equipment storage for 5 years? …..at least we got the depreciation!
I would have rather have had outrageous sales at a lower percent return. We could be renegotiating the fees for the next 5 year term right now.
There has to be a simple explanation for why no terms are publicly in print or were discussed on the CC. Might have something to do with the share purchase. I detest speculation. Years ago it made sense. Not so much today.
I can throw another curve ball into this game…..9 month revenue for 2023 was only $224k so the uptick in Q4 was more like $280k…..how much of that increase can be attributed to the ring opportunity….no way to tell.
The trick is to reach valid conclusions with only partial input.
Based on those assumptions and LQMT’s numbers 40,000 rings may have been ordered.
A more accurate picture will have to wait for a PR from LQMT or Movano accounting for sales.
I say this only because $3 to $5 dollars per ring on approximately 4000 rings sold does not get LQMT to $127,000 earned as stated in the 10K.
Here it is no spin. 10K page 24 very clear and without any ambiguity. It is amazing when only a few read the 10K. No guessing required. Chipboarder, you are correct.
So if Movano sold X amount of rings. One then would get a fair estimate of what LQMT earns per ring based on the income they reported for those rings in the 10K. Would that be a fair way to nail it down? I think so.
From the 10K page 24…
“Revenue. Total revenue increased by $127 to $510 for the year ended December 31, 2023 from $383 for the year ended December 31, 2022. The increase was attributable to increase in product shipments primarily related to the launch of health monitoring rings utilizing our technology.”
It pays to do your DD. $127,000 dollars and the only guess work involved is the number of rings ordered. We can fairly ascertain that between 4000 and 4200 were sold. How many were ordered or what the terms are between LQMT and Movano Health requires more DD.
Chipboarder, your viewpoints on the earnings regarding the ring are spot on 100%.
My guess based on what Movano stated if the revenue is based on what is sold, is around $30 per ring. If it is on how many were ordered for manufacturing,then the earnings per ring are going to be less.
Either way, if the unknown terms of the agreement remains as is, this should be enough to stop the share price from heading down and to reverse the trend of the past seven years.
Meaning there is real potential for TC and LQMT to finally achieve LL’s goal for increasing shareholder value. Imo, once the share price increases to around 30 cents a share the floodgates of new investors will open up again.
This new potential should begin to increase trading volumes again and bring in new interest as the potential for LQMT’s share price is no longer speculative. Couple this with the expectations from TC for the year ending 2024 and hype will have added value as well.
That spells out quite well the normal order of things, but then there is LQMT and the maze. It sure seems like this ring business originated in the USA, and Valencia is writing it. What is to stop Yihao from over charging Valencia for manufacturing, and expatriating the dollars? Now I doubt that would happen for a pittance, but if this gets to be serious money, the various agreements’ we have with Chinese entities are vague and for that matter can be modified, canceled, or just ignored by the controlling interest. As expressed many times, LL is never going to sue EON or Yihao for performance. IMHO. But somebody is going to decide who gets what.
Your background is in fact very helpful. Mine is global M&A. Lots of different perspectives here, a good thing.
Now regarding the 10k and the ring. The rest remains factually unanswered. As only 3 customers are mentioned always without any accounting breakdown. Plus no new agreement regarding any compensation from a fourth major customer.
If revenues from a new customer impacts growth to the tune of 15% 20% or more and it is not reported in a 8K or as a normal event, then it has to be reported as an extraordinary event. Otherwise they got big problems head on with the SEC. Again, as some people assume they might be ignorant. I don’t believe LQMT would want to attract the attention of the SEC again. To assume that revenues are being received by a source unreported is beyond stupidity. Even if there were an NDA. It would have to be reported as such.
Imo. They may an agreement based on future sales and kinks to be worked on if any. But zero money at this time. Otherwise accounts receivable would be through the roof.
Yes that does answer the time a non invasive product part can be approved for production.
!
So no one checked! Maybe it would have been easier if it was stated the high was 0.09 and the low was 0.09 for the year 2023.
Almost certainly 5% in U.S
I did use the word “guessing” and the royalty/commission details of the manufacturing agreement haven’t been disclosed so we are going to pile assumptions on guesses on so it’s worth about nothing.
A typical manufacturing cost structure starts at 100%….of that 25%-33% represents the cost of raw materials…..another 25%-33% is labor and the remainder is G&A, profit and other. The “other” is where the commissions/royalties fall.
Here comes the guesswork….
If the application were to originate in China and sold in the US (our exclusive territory) I would expect something like 3%.
If the application were to originate in the US and sold in the US….I would expect 3% + another 3%-5% for the legwork.
The big guess is the selling price to Movano Health….I picked $25-$30 which represents roughly 10% of the selling price of $269 and probably 20% of Movano’s manufacturing cost …the electronics from OSRAM are probably 40%-50% of product manufacturing cost. The rest is G&A etc.
Recognize that I’m not an accounting person but my background is manufacturing engineering which may be useful.
How much does Yihao take for the manufacturing? And who decides who gets what?
Joshua used a number of $1 million/year impact on LQMT. Frankly, that may be light…It’s not beyond the possibility that Movano can sell a million units this year @ $269 or $269 million gross revenue. I’m guessing the selling price of the LQMT portion will be $25-30 per ring and our cut is $3-5 per ring. That could easily be $3-5 million.
Halve the numbers and it’s still monumental.
FYI…not really true about the 10Q…..the ring was included as the reason for the bump in revenue just below the Income Statement. See page 24 of the 10Q or my post 232147 on 3/15/2024.
Someone is in the background watching... Is loaded with Cash... Could Buy Move and LQMT at once !.... The A ring...
Apple would be inclined to let it go if: 1) They have no intention of making a ring; 2) They think it’ll handicap other ring makers such as Samsung and Oura; 3) It’ll test the American market for Liquidmetal and people’s response to it as a material (from a marketing perspective_do they care?), and 4) If it helps develop and strengthen the Liquidmetal manufacturing expertise, preparing them for truly huge jobs. Personally I think all four are the case.
Or Tony forgot and Lugee will be mad when LQMT gets sued.
LMFAO but another week passes….
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Moderators PatentGuy1 Almosthere |
Liquidmetal® Technologies (ISO 9001:2008 certified) is a leading force in the research, development and commercialization of amorphous metals. Our revolutionary class of patented alloys and processes form the basis of high performance materials in a broad range of medical, military, consumer, industrial, and sporting goods products.
Discovered by researchers at the California Institute of Technology, Liquidmetal alloys’ unique atomic structure enables applications to achieve performance and accuracy levels that have not been possible before. The revolutionary class of patented materials technology redefine performance and design paradigms institutionalized by traditional materials.
As Liquidmetal Technologies controls the intellectual property rights with more than 70 U.S. patents, these high performance materials are dramatically changing the way companies develop new products.
LINKS
Featured: Automotive Pressure Sensors, 9.36 billion market by 2020
1. LiquidMetal Website
2. LiquidMetal Manufacturing Facility
3. OTC Market Report
4. Engel Liquidmetal Forum (Nov 2015)
5. ENGEL Symposium 2015
6. ENGEL Interview on Liquidmetal
PATENTS (USPTO)
1. Search Crucible Intellectual (Apple and LiquidMetal R&D)
2. Search Apple and LiquidMetal
3. Search Cross-license Patents w/Eontec
4. Search Vitreloy
5. Search Pre-grant Patents
VIDEOS
1. OMEGA Liquidmetal Bezel
2. ENGEL e-motion 110T
3. Liquidmetal Bouncing Ball
CORPORATE GOVERNANCE - BOARD OF DIRECTORS
Professor Lugee Li, Chairman
Professor Li was appointed as a member of our board of directors in March 2016 and became Chairman of our board of directors in October 2016. Professor Li is the founder, Chairman, and majority stockholder of DongGuan Eontec Co. Ltd., a Hong Kong company listed on the Shenzen Stock Exchange engaged in the production of precision die-cast products and the research and development of new materials. Professor Li founded Eontec in 1993 and has served as Chairman since that date. At Eontec, Professor Li is responsible for strategic development and research and development. Professor Li is also the founder and sole shareholder of Leader Biomedical Limited, a Hong Kong company engaged in the supply of biomaterials and surgical implants. Professor Li serves as an analyst for the Institute of Metal Research at the Chinese Academy of Sciences and serves part-time as a professor at several universities in China.
Abdi Mahamedi, Vice Chairman
Abdi Mahamedi has served on our board of directors since May 2009 and became Vice-Chairman of our board of directors in October 2016. Since 1987, Mr. Mahamedi has served as the President and Chief Executive Officer of Carlyle Development Group of Companies (“CDG”), which develops and manages residential and commercial properties in the United States on behalf of investors worldwide. At CDG, Mr. Mahamedi evaluates and supervises all of the investment activities and management personnel. Prior to joining CDG, Mr. Mahamedi founded Emanuel Land Company, a subsidiary of Emanuel & Company, a Wall Street investment banking firm, and served as a managing director for Emanuel Land Company from 1986 to 1987. In 1983, Mr. Mahamedi received his B.S.E. degree in Civil and Structural Engineering from the University of Pennsylvania, and in 1984 he received his M.S.E. degree in Civil and Structural Engineering from the University of Pennsylvania.
Isaac Bresnick
Currently serves as Legal and Regulatory Affairs Director for the Leader Biomedical Group, a private company based in Hong Kong and operating from Amsterdam, the Netherlands, and has served in that role since October 2014. At Leader Biomedical, Mr. Bresnick is responsible for the direction and management of legal affairs, regulatory affairs, quality control, and quality assurance, as well as for advising executive management of Group companies. Mr. Bresnick also currently serves as Director of AAP Joints GmbH, a private company in Berlin, Germany, and has served in that role since July 2013. Mr. Bresnick received his J.D. from the University of Connecticut School of Law in 2013, and his B.S. in Industrial Design from the University of Bridgeport in 2008. After completion of his undergraduate studies and continuing through his enrollment at UCONN Law, Mr. Bresnick worked as Senior Arrangements Designer for Electric Boat Corporation, a subsidiary of General Dynamics, from June 2008 to December 2012.
Vincent Carrubba
An experienced corporate leader and serial entrepreneur with extensive senior executive, technical and manufacturing experience. Mr. Carrubba has created and guided new products to success in the consumer goods, electronics, automotive and construction industries and has conceptualized, financed and built factories and developed new manufacturing technologies throughout Asia. From September 2014 through the present, Mr. Carrubba has served as the CEO of Admiral Composite Technologies Inc. (“Admiral”), where he has developed new technologies for environmentally responsible and innovative building materials which represent Admiral’s product lines. Mr. Carrubba has also served as Admiral’s Chairman since its inception in 2009. From September 2014 through the present, Mr. Carrubba has served as the CEO of Asia Sourcing & Communications USA Inc. and he has served as its Chairman since its inception in 2013. From 2002 through August 2014, Mr. Carrubba served as the Director of R&D for Interdynamics Inc., IDQ Holdings, where he was responsible for all R&D and QC matters, including the management of engineering, legal, patenting, regulatory, insurance and consumer relations matters. From 1989 through 1992, Mr. Carrubba designed and installed the New York Stock Exchange telecommunications and information technology systems. Mr. Carrubba has held engineering and executive positions with Xerox, General Electric, Bristol-Meyers Squibb and AT&T and he is the inventor of several patents related to telecommunications, professional tools and consumer products. Mr. Carrubba received a Bachelor of Arts degree in Engineering Science and a Bachelor of Science Degree in Mechanical Engineering from Columbia University SEAS in 1982.
Tony Chung
Mr. Chung was appointed to our board of directors in August 2017. Mr. Chung had previously served as the Company’s Chief Financial Officer from December 2008. Prior to joining the Company, Mr. Chung served as CFO at BETEK Corporation, a real estate and investment subsidiary of SK Engineering and Construction, and as CFO of Solarcity, a company providing advanced solar technology and installation services. Mr. Chung is a Certified Public Accountant and served eight years at KPMG as an Audit and Consulting Manager for several large multinational companies. He received his B.S. degree in Business Administration from the University of California, Berkeley. Mr. Chung is also an Attorney at Law and received his J.D. degree from Pacific Coast University School of Law.
Reporting Status | U.S. Reporting: SEC Reporting |
Audited Financials | Audited |
Latest Report | August 4, 2020 10Q |
CIK | 0001141240 |
Fiscal Year End | 12/31 |
OTC Marketplace | OTCQB |
Market Value1 | $129,851,894 | a/o Sep 24, 2020 | |
Authorized Shares | 1,100,000,000 | a/o Dec 31, 2016 | |
Outstanding Shares | 914,449,957 | a/o Sep 24, 2020 | |
-Restricted | Not Available | ||
-Unrestricted | Not Available | ||
Held at DTC | Not Available | ||
Float | 487,690,350 | a/o Dec 31, 2017 | |
Par Value | No Par Value |
Shareholders of Record | 217 | a/o Dec 31, 2017 |
Volume | |
Day Range: | |
Bid Price | |
Ask Price | |
Last Trade Time: |