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If he wants to compare Fan & Fred
to banks, let him
Quit comparing FnF with the banks, will ya?
FnF are congressionally-chartered private corporations with their own bailout mechanism to finance their operations (either buying Debt or Equity) as a last resort, in the same section (Purposes of the Charter) with their Public Mission that made them take on more credit risk and not properly compensated, with the authority of Treasury to purchase obligations at a rate that takes into consideration the Treasury yields, as of the end of the month preceding the purchase (subsection c)
There is not "govt backstop of the real estate market" or Govt Implicit Gtee on MBS, as stated by the plaintiff Joshua Angel in this board a few days ago, but a UST backup of FnF upon "capital deficiency" (SPSPA), that is, negative Net Worth (watch the chart with Freddie Mac below to see how it played out)
The law professor Nielson, SCOTUS-appointed amicus representing the FHFA in the important case Collins, spotted it right away.
The hedge fund managers that you know, forgot to pay him off.
I have it that
FNMA will end close the week at $1.72
FMCC will close the week at $1.57
Oh wow. What’s the plan for this week Captain TightCoil ? Will we visit the moon ? Or will it be a crappy week ?
FNF repaid the un-needed loans.
Jps chart best ive seen in years. Moving higher now
Cool the gov sold airline warrants & people acting like because of that we should be worried about the. Doing the same to us! But my question was going to be did the airlines also pay back all their loans? Because I believed FNF paid their loan! Are there any scenarios where the gov cancels warrants? Or is this a falacy!
Decent week up 7%! Slow and steady gains building momentum!🚀
My advice to people like you is to quit watching CNN/MSNBC and start watching your pocket book. The party that spends the most/sends the most overseas is the party that's bankrupting you. Figure it out. Always vote for your wealth, not freebies and vote buying for others.
Is it written aNywhere that it will not be done or ever considered as an option/solution?
Fight, Fight, Fight
Fight to Right the Wrong done to Shareholders
Fight to make it Right
I still can't find the spreadsheet with the breakdown of the warrant repurchase program. Attached is an article that summarizes the proceeds from buybacks and auctions in early 2010.
https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN20148970/
since I believe it is legal for Treasury to declare the SPS paid - then selling it for 1B (huge discount) to F and F would be legal
but is that approach written anywhere ?
all the articles I have read said its very hard to turn office space to rental or condo. For one thing there is way too high a ratio of space without windows. People want windows in their rooms. The economics are not easy to pencil out. In Chicago private and city money are trying to convert four major large commercial buildings to housing. It should be interesting to see how they do it
prices are supply and demand
years of insane crazy low 3-4 percent mortgages - held by owners of many houses - keeps them from offering their houses for sale. A strong (yes inflation but jobs and wage growth) economy keeps the demand high - relative to this reduced supply - even at 7% (which in historical sense is not that high)
If Treasury agrees that FnF have paid down the SPS, Treasury still owes them over $30 billion in overpayment of the 10% dividend.
I am not greedy and securities law is securities law
GOV - Treasury has every ACCOUNTING right (not moral right of common sense right) to call every penny sent from F and F to Treasury a dividend. As such in an accounting sense - the GOV can always claim all of their "investment" still belongs to them and is not paid down
IMO - the GOV can declare the investment paid down --- it just can -- AS IT IS the investor and the investor can say - you owe me nothing. DONE.
At that point I am not in a hurry to look a gift horse in the mouth. WTS and a few Billion are weights on our shoulders that still leave us that day - with at least $20 a share.
Again - GOV can argue in any court that we - equity owe them a fortune. I want - wish - hope - they call it paid off - but that is for them to do for political or economy reasons
And in what hiding spot can we find the SEC in all of this?
"the President has clearly stated that his objective is to dispose of the government's investments in individual companies as quickly as is practicable.”
See, the trick is in that last part "as quickly as is practicable". That time never has nor never will arrive.
"“The exercise price was set at the average of the stock price during the 20 day period preceding the day that Treasury granted preliminary approval to participate in the CPP program”
Why not just make the exercise price ZERO since the 100,000 shares/dollar was so terminally, laughably ridiculous. I would have bought Fannie Mae myself if the government would have sold at their so-called "exercise price".
All info is controlled these days
Paid for hire info only is allowed for the tbtf narrative to win aka steal more $ from shareholders
Agree for the most part. But why would he remove my post about the warrant repurchase. If it doesn't apply, he could just comment on it.
Treasury actually received warrants from all the institutions they "bailed out" and then allowed them to repurchase them once the SPS had been paid. Most bought back their warrants. Bank of America was one of the few that didn't repurchase their warrants. Theirs got auctioned off. Obiterdictum once provided us with a spreadsheet of the amounts received by Treasury from the buybacks and the auctions. Can't find it. I tried the Treasury website. Couldn't find it readily. Maybe others might have better luck.
He doesn't want his comments section like IHUb with all kind of accusations without backing evidences, is my guess. After all u like IHUb, he is responsible for everything happening on that page and accountable. So when you say fraud by TDY, unless you prove it with evidence, he wouldn't do it. He is just looking for intellectual discussions mostly in the comments section unlike IHUb or stocktwits etc. Not trying to downplay your comments or intellectual level, but that's my guess on His standards and policies of his comments section
Tim Howard previously took down my comment about Treasury allowing the warrant buy-back. Now he took down the one where I said they were issued fraudulently. Looks like gas lighting to me. Why is he doing it? Don't know. But I no longer trust him. Lost faith in Pagliara long time ago. Right about the time the Moelis Plan came into the picture.
Ooooh. Blind homerism?
We can do that..
very true. and paulson, berkowitz want gazillion shares for each of their pfds. not happening. moelis isn't going to be allowed to collect billions in fees either who are backed by paulson.
i am conflicted about tim. he appears to have straight line to some in the white house as he has written before so he will have connection to paulson if he becomes treasury secretary. that is a big 'if' as you know. he has filed amicus brief on behalf of hedge fund berkowitz. we have to be careful to parse out his viewpoints. i would be surprised if he is manipulating his large following after what he went through. who knows.
I agree. Practically everything they've done is illegal. The people who should speak up for the corporations (e.g. Tim Howard) are for personal reasons (possibly bought and paid for by hedge funds) suppressing any mention that the warrants are illegal. If Treasury agrees that FnF have paid down the SPS, Treasury still owes them over $30 billion in overpayment of the 10% dividend. At current prices FnF could buy back the warrants for less than $10 billion. That gives them an additional $20 billion towards their capital. Politicians can claim the profits they made from their "investment" is $301B-$187B-$30B+$10B = $94 Billion.
The reason Ackman, John Paulson and possibly Berkovitz legitimize the warrants is because they probably want to buy the warrants from the government. Ackman and Heroic it's previously made offers to buy them. And Moelis Plan was a thinly disguised plan by John Paulson to buy them cheap.
who are these 3 ? very curious
“Treasury has retained 3 asset managers and intends to use other outside consultants to assist Treasury in enhancing its process and independently assessing value of each repurchasing bank's warrants. “
interesting.. there are so many ways they can exit, completely subjective and speculative
Q: Is the number of warrants subject to reduction or adjustment?
A: Yes, a bank can reduce the number of warrants it issued to Treasury by 50% if it completes a qualified equity offering
no capital raise as it dilutes their stake
“The warrants are also subject to customary "anti-dilution" adjustments in the event of other changes to the Company's capital structure, which is designed to ensure that Treasury's interest is not "diluted" by such changes.”
what does this mean? they did in aig case.
“For publicly-traded institutions, Treasury receives warrants to purchase common shares. Treasury has not exercised these warrants.”
“The President has clearly stated that his objective is to dispose of the government's investments in individual companies as quickly as is practicable.”
isn't it then illegal for them to take warrants at $0.00001 ? or does the comment below only applies to exercise price? it is kind of unfair to take 79.9% at $0.00001 with 300 billion already taken
“The exercise price was set at the average of the stock price during the 20 day period preceding the day that Treasury granted preliminary approval to participate in the CPP program”
https://www.fhfa.gov/Conservatorship/Documents/Senior-Preferred-Stock-Agree/FNM/warrant/Fannie-Mae-Warrant.pdf
https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/200962612255225533
Going to have to turn commercial business buildings into real estate I’m guessing.
I don’t think the government can rob the gse’s again.
It seems this disaster of empty office buildings should have already happened but is delayed somehow.
I have a few of questions.
1. What will happen when the obvious commercial real estate disaster happens.
The skyscrapers are 50% empty. They have a few years left on their 10yr 2% loans. The banks are going to own them and they are worth 50% of what they were.
How will this affect Fannie Mae in the economy at large? Does anybody imagine a different scenario? It seems to me as sure is nightfall day collapse is impending in all cities.
Is there a way to make money betting against commercial real estate?
2. It’s strange that the 7% interest rate hasn’t dropped home values more than it has. But I believe it will. Thoughts? I’m in LA for example and work in the film business, at least I used to, but suddenly starting a year ago all Production left Los Angeles. Everybody I know in the business is out of work. And about to sell their houses.
3. What other Trump trades are there? I think I’ve made it clear that I’m not a fan of Trump. But from the looks of the swing states the election is his to lose. I actually think the New York case is a bullshit case of selective enforcement. The 130,000 is small potatoes. Even with a conviction, I doubt that’s going to change. I was originally happy to see him going to court, but if I’m any barometer, my opinion has changed. I think his position position in the polls will be strengthened whether he wins or loses.
If he wins and is found not guilty, then the case was a nuisance case. if he loses, it looks like political persecution at worst and selective enforcement at best.
" they paid like $0.001?"
You wish! Be more free with the 0s.
"i don't like either candidate but if one of them will at least partially right this wrong I'll take him."
Sorry, one of the candidates thinks Fannie and Freddie are some of his snotty neighbors in Delaware.
Shareholders here are like those two knot-headed brothers on Oak Island. Everybody tells them to sell and move on but they know there is a treasure there . . . . somewhere.
"I think the sherwin-williams reference is
Very accurate for what the MM’s are
Doing to us. Maybe we should name them
The SW MM’s will be less irritating for you."
What the MMs are doing to us, what those in government are doing to us, and what those in the judiciary are doing to us is more readily found on a porn channel rather than a paint store!
Then how do you explain all the graffiti?
lol
Sorry I couldn’t resist
Golf
Why the focus on WTS that dilute equity 4:1
Should the focus be on the 200B dollars of obligation that Treasury could convert to equity ---- being say a 100:1 dilution
?
Thank you
and if GOV kills that obligation (v F and F pay cash to kill it) ---- ? can F and F then buy back for pennies the WTS
my sense - if GOV decides (Treasury) to say PAID BACK --- they will do it as ONE same step with exercise of the WTS and share ownership of 4B shares in their pocket
?????
could be
key word - given last four years he was in office (With control on Treasury and Justice all four years !!!!) - this is a trade (buy if you believe and get ready to quickly sell - if there is no real solid news in say 4 months )
Help
Those CERTAIN provisions suspended seem tiny to me - relative to CORE (95%) business
what would be seriously interesting - ? -- if anyone can find the "amendment or rule change or ?" that said keep the cash and write the IOU on ALL profit ?
Cancel the warrants
Govt Should be deemed paid back
IMO
IMO
any move at F and F ---- like second mortgages (or lending on equity - which is same but here F and F are the lender) --- or ...
likely have no impact on the economy between now and NOV
but - one move could both have impact - reduce inflation - and GAIN massive positive PR ---- for Biden now or say DJT if he wins in year one
SUSPEND THE FEE FOR ONE YEAR --- mortgage rates drop the next week by noticeable amount
HUGE PR - and take credit (right or wrong !!!) for STRONG IMPROVED F and F that can afford to do this !!!
which is why release will be done down here, below institutional prices. and Ps will be nowhere near par cause they wont go up unless commons go up. their fantasy will be gone, KTCarneyCorkerShellGamer Amateur hour will be over.
When Treasury deems that the SPS has been paid, Fannie and Freddie can buy back the warrants based on previous 20 days average closing price.
https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/200962612255225533
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