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man, with a little attention, this could move real nice
lol-guess shares are hard to come by at these prices...can see it easily moving up to 9's as well
0.003 x 0.005 now. I bet ADVNQ will bounce back to 0.009 again since
only one MM asks at 0.005, one MM asks 0.007, all the other MMs ask
at 0.01 or above! The 14M shares OS is too low compared to ADVBQ etc
pretty thin here...18000 took out 0023
0.0022 x 0.0023. This is the lowest asking price I have ever seen! I
bet today will be the last day to be able to buy the shares at .002x
0.0023 x 0.0025. Ready to soar! Only One MM asks at 0.0025, 0.005, &
0.009. ADVNQ is extremely oversold and undervalued compared to ADVBQ
0.0023 x 0.0024. ADVNQ is ready to run soon! 0.009 will be the roof. Huge buying pressures and extremely oversold & undervalued now. Buy!
Worth watching, thanks. sc
ADVNQ has 14,410,133 shares OS vs ADVBQ has 29,070,563-share OS. "A"
(ADVNQ) has voting power vs "B" (ADVBQ) has non-voting power at all.
Will ADVNQ hit 0.009 again in the next week? Last week it did bounce
to 0.009 from the bottom price or 52-week low 0.0021. Oversold now!
Do you know why the ADVBQ (B) has performed better than ADVNQ (A)? I
was thinking the ADVNQ should be much more worth than ADVBQ because
the "A" OS count is less than half of the "B" and more voting rights
What is about the 8-K? Why the pos scam bounced to 0.009 from .0021?
Hundreds of thousands shares dumped at .0022~0.003. Who bought them?
52-week low 0.0021 was crectaed last week! Sell the CH11 pos scam at
the bid ASAP before it hit another new low 0.002. 0.009 is the roof!
Nada, Zilch, Nutt......at least recently as it pretains to anything of material significants.
"PEACE"
,,,,,,,Anything new??? I've been out of the loop
The resent FDIC receivership of Advanta's two former banking entities (fully expected), gives reasons to concentrate on what values the company has left to its disposal and/or worth towards any business plans going forward.
A most resent Advanta Corp. amendment to its schedules/statements list assets of $290,699,890.72 with liabilities of $233,910,953.74. Taken at face value and assuming all fair value estimates are met, this would yield $56,788,936.98 of positive equity left over for distribution to shareholder with all debts satisfied in a scenario of total liquidation of Advanta Corp.
However, Advanta's $291m(rounded) of assets is compiled of $177,146,298.24 worth of inter-company transactions (accounts receivables), many of which will not be fully collectible.
In re: Advanta Corp. Case No. 09-13931 (KJC)
DESCRIPTION VALUE
ADVANTA ADVERTISING INC $2,005,830.46
ADVANTA AUTO FINANCE CORPORATION $127.14
ADVANTA BANK $53,082.24
ADVANTA BANK CORP. $2,766,927.34
ADVANTA BANK HOLDING CORP. $2,222,843.44
ADVANTA BUSINESS SERVICES CORP. $5,803.14
ADVANTA BUSINESS SERVICES HOLDING CORP. $19,132,106.53
ADVANTA CREDIT CARD RECEIVABLES CORP. $41,171,591.22
ADVANTA FINANCE CORP. $964,985.87
ADVANTA INSURANCE AGENCY INC. $3,367.57
ADVANTA INSURANCE COMPANY $1,222.94
ADVANTA INTERNATIONAL CORPORATION I $1,044,068.70
ADVANTA INTERNATIONAL CORPORATION II $200.00
ADVANTA INVESTMENT CORP. $19,565,660.88
ADVANTA INVESTMENT CORP. II $6,681,625.21
ADVANTA LIFE INSURANCE COMPANY $30,512.07
ADVANTA MORTGAGE CORP. USA $1,882,726.85
ADVANTA MORTGAGE HOLDING COMPANY $7,025,171.54
ADVANTA SERVICE CORP. $27,438,196.96
ADVANTA SHARED SERVICES CORP. $6,320,686.45
ADVANTA VENTURES INC $200.00
ADVANTENNIS CORP. $20,545,452.63
BIZ EQUITY $2,028,572.21
BIZEQUITY CORP. $127,154.71
FIRST ADVANTA INSURANCE AGENCY INC. $419.64
IDEABLOB CORP. $16,127,762.50
Total $177,146,298.24
Rider B.16 - Accounts Receivable
Except for Advanta Credit Card Receivables Corp. with $185,721,781.13 of assets representing charge-offs, pre-charge-offs and current amounts due, all others have negative equity or inter-company transaction with a company / s with negative equity.
Possibly collectible amounts and the company which owe or listed below:
ADVANTA CREDIT CARD RECEIVABLES CORP. $41,171,591.22
IDEABLOB CORP. $87,150.14
BIZEQUITY CORP. $112,738.64
ADVANTA VENTURES INC $90.00
ADVANTA AUTO FINANCE CORPORATION $127.14
ADVANTENNIS CORP. $61,446.51
ADVANTA MORTGAGE HOLDING COMPANY $90.00
ADVANTA ADVERTISING INC $990.00
ADVANTA SHARED SERVICES CORP. $6,320,686.45
ADVANTA SERVICE CORP. $207,768.49
ADVANTA BUSINESS SERVICES CORP. $5,803.14
This implies that of the $177,146,298.24 plus assets listed by Advanta, only approximately $47,968,481.73 would be collectible. Adding this to Advanta's other assets, total value of approximately $117,849,046, equals $165,817,527.23 or approximately $68,093,425.27 short of satisfying all of its obligations. More could be collected through tax recoveries on loses of the total amounts.
More positively if Advanta Corp and all of it subsidiaries where liquidated and lump together, some $367,721,644.72 ($117,849,053.53 attributed to Advanta Crop. and $249,872,591.19 as the total of all the other joint debtor entities assets combined) would exist, this without the $177,146,298.24 of accounts receivables accredited to Advanta Corps. assets. Assuming amounts owed where forgiven or disregarded, leaving some $84,741,834.75 ($367,721,644.72 - $233,910,953) of equity available with all debts satisfied.
None the less, the company has indicated that it will must likely retain some assets as a means for continuing business going forward. So in that regard, any combination of possibilites exist as to which, what and how they will choose to proceed. IMHO.
It must be noted that there are no secured creditors or lenders. So as shareholders we have already move up the ladder in line for any equity that could be distributed.
"PEACE"
Advanta seeks permission for first asset sell, according to resent court documents.
http://www.advantareorg.com/pdflib/340_13931.pdf
101,419.878 shares of CRAIX mutual fund, with current per share value of $10.78 closed yesterday at $10.80, representing further liquidity of $1,093,306.30(Cash)
Just a note.
NAME AND ADDRESS TITLE NATURE AND PERCENTAGE
OF STOCK OWNERSHIP
EMPLOYEE STOCK OWNERSHIP
PLAN
WELSH & MCKEAN ROADS
SPRING HOUSE, PA 19477-0844
CLASS A (VOTING) 9.51%
ALTER, DENNIS
WELSH & MCKEAN ROADS
SPRING HOUSE, PA 19477-0844
CLASS A (VOTING) 31.62%
SOUNDPOST CAPITAL
MANAGEMENT
WELSH & MCKEAN ROADS
SPRING HOUSE, PA 19477-0844
CLASS B (NON-VOTING) 5.50%**
(Soundpost Capital has added 1,042,930 sense 12/31/09)
STONEHILL CAPITAL
MANAGEMENT LLC
WELSH & MCKEAN ROADS
SPRING HOUSE, PA 19477-0844
CLASS A (VOTING) 5.77%*
All still holding as of 12/31/09.
"PEACE"
This notation,from resent court documents fully explains the objectionts to the NOL's.
http://www.advantareorg.com/pdflib/333_13931.pdf
http://www.advantareorg.com/pdflib/332_13931.pdf
12. As is outlined in Advanta’s Objection, the board’s decision to waive the
carryback was made after careful consultation with management and the Company’s professional
advisors. The tax election, which ABC argues will result in a loss of a $54 million refund, will
prevent the creation of a potential $170 million unsecured claim, which in turn will help
maximize the value of the recovery for the creditors of the Debtors’ estates as a whole. In
addition, as further noted by the Debtors, the waiver of the carryback permits a carryforward of
the 2009 NOLs, which may provide meaningful value to the Debtors’ estates as well. While
ABC touts its status as an insider creditor to whom the Debtors owe a fiduciary duty, its papers
notably fail to draw the clear connection that – if ABC’s analysis is correct (a proposition which
the Committee disputes) – the action it is seeking to compel will inure solely to the benefit of
ABC, and to the detriment of all other unsecured creditors of the Debtors’ estates. As such,
Advanta’s prudent exercise of its business judgment to elect to waive the carryback should be
respected and affirmed.
What's next?
"PEACE"
[Remainder
This notation is of interest from resent court documents.
http://www.advantareorg.com/pdflib/328_13931.pdf
25. Plaintiff believes that it may be entitled to a significant portion of the nearly $54
million Anticipated Refund that the IRS will owe to the Consolidated Group if the five-year
NOL carry back election is made here. As such, the affirmative tax election by Defendant would
significantly enhance Plaintiff’s liquidity and its balance sheet, and will, in all likelihood, serve
to alleviate the FDIC’s concerns in large measure. Put another way, Plaintiff reasonably believes
that a potential termination of Plaintiff’s banking charter by prudential regulators may be delayed
- or quite possibly avoided altogether - if the Defendant elects the five-year NOL carry back and
Plaintiff receives its portion of the Anticipated Refund.
Question: Why wouldn't they want the 5 year NOL tax benefit?
$54 Million more toward equity, if pursued.
"PEACE"
Does anyone have an idea as to when the 10k annual report will be out? (to ask a question only an insider would know).
I was definately expecting it last week.
TIA.
"PEACE"
FYI.
According to court documents, while we wait for further information and/or business going forward from ADVNq, shareholders equity of some $77,453,583.48 dollars will be invested in a Dreyfus Money Market fund.
http://www.advantareorg.com/pdflib/319_13931.pdf
Specifically, Dreyfus Treasury Prime Cash Management fund (DIRXX).
This is a low risk fund, which carries an annual yeild or return of 1.49% at the end of 2009. With assets of 30 plus billion dollars and holds a AAAm Moody's rating, aaa rating from S&P.
Currently priced at $1 per share, so dollar for dollar 77,453,583.48 million shares held.
"PEACE"
According to court filings, Moody's has taken an interest / look at Advanta corp......to what ends remains a question.
http://www.advantareorg.com/pdflib/315_13931.pdf
http://v3.moodys.com/Pages/atc.aspx
Moody's Investors Service
Moody’s Role in the Capital Markets
Moody's Investors Service is a leading provider of credit ratings, research, and risk analysis. Moody's commitment and expertise contributes to transparent and integrated financial markets, protecting the integrity of credit. Our ratings and analysis track debt covering more than:
110 sovereign nations
13,000 corporate issuers
26,000 public finance issuers
109,000 structured finance obligations
Credit ratings and research help investors analyze the credit risks associated with fixed-income securities. Such independent credit ratings and research also contribute to efficiencies in fixed-income markets and other obligations, such as insurance policies and derivative transactions, by providing credible and independent assessments of credit risk.
Moody’s default studies validate our predictive ratings. Our published research and investor briefings draw thousands of attendees each year and keep investors current with the rationale underlying our credit opinions.
"PEACE"
I'm grabbing all the shares I can, when I can........IMHO, this is money in the bank.
Just my thoughts.
"PEACE"
Maybe had something to do with todays court hearing? Anyone listening in on the proceedings?
http://www.advantareorg.com/pdflib/295_13931.pdf
saw that 52wk hi, maybe new legislature to allow more flexibility in Q_'s????
Crazy, no clue
ADVNQ looking incredible!
$1.55, Love it Super C!
Great to see you here!!!
GLTU!
nice.... ADVNQ.04 248vs72k_vol10dayavg_52hi$1.55_OS>14mil
Good for you,happy trading.
"PEACE"
I am glad to have purchased over 300,000 cheap shares at 0.01~0.011.
Now I am up almost 100% and will sell at 0.022 ~ 0.03 to profit...
Below a link from ADVBQ board and a snippet from Nov. 09,09' 10Q filing, explains the difference.
Although both,currently,or apart of the same ship, which has run a-ground while sinking and quite possiblely will not survive .
Yesterdays trading saw very low volume on Class B shares, while the Class A's did not trade a single share?
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=43453596
STOCKHOLDERS’ EQUITY
Class A preferred stock, $1,000 par value:
Authorized, issued and outstanding — 1,010 shares in 2009 and 2008 1,010 1,010
Class A voting common stock, $.01 par value:
Authorized — 200,000,000 shares; issued — 14,410,133 shares in 2009 and 2008 144 144
Class B non-voting common stock, $.01 par value:
Authorized — 200,000,000 shares; issued — 31,390,494 shares in 2009 and 32,776,722 shares in 2008
The Class B's Outstanding have sense decrease by approx. 2 million.
"PEACE"
Could anyone tell why ADVNQ only dropped 33.4% from the previous low
0.015 to the new 52-week low 0.01 while ADVBQ dropped 45% from 0.02
to 0.011? Which one will bring the better return? I am considering to choose one of them for the investment target. It seems ADVBQ will
perform better since it dropped much more than ADVNQ. Will ADVNQ hit
the new 52-week low 0.0082 ~ 0.0083 to be fair to the ADVBQ?
It's not to confusing at all, if you followed the prepackaged BK of General Motors. This statement:
"As part of the plan to liquidate, the Company expects to create a liquidating trust or other entity or vehicle to hold certain assets that it may not be feasible or desirable to liquidate either now or in the future."
Implies that they want to seperate the more valued, profitable debtor entities from the less valued ones, and basically start a new company using the more valued debtor entities as the source of continued business. Probably with the intent of offering what they have called their "Stakholders" a percentage of the newly formed company, leaving the common shareholders without.
IMO, their problem is going to be getting a majority of the major voting rights shareholders, which included the following:
Stonehill Corp.
Vanguard Group Inc.
Dimensional funds
and may be
Dennis Alter as well as Advanta Corp. ESOP
Each of which directly or indirectly holds, with power to vote, 5% or more of the voting securities of the debtor.
Todays court filings shows that the "Offical Committe of Unsecured Creditors" making adjustments and requesting premission for more lawyers and accounts to prepare, IMO for the upcoming expected submission of any plan offered by the board.
http://www.advantareorg.com/
Unfortunately no such word of an "Offical Shareholders Committee" is fourth coming, at this time.
"PEACE"
Man that was on the money...very nice work!
real time DJ news feed from broker
I think it hit a news alert I had in Medved's Quotetracker for
the stock. Have QT set for a zillion feeds, both free and the
package kind. Just have to be careful since raw data, unedited,
can be flawed sometimes to trade on. Like news is incomplete or
soon gets contradiction.
Be careful.
My question? How did you get news 1 day before it hit the news pages?
That's a wrap....
Interesting comments, I think what one wants to do is wait untill after the BK. to recoup some of ones capital from what I'm reading here.
ADVNQ confused about Chpt 11
DMOST, I'm put off by this part of filing. Sorta sounds like a
freeze 'in place'. Nothing goes to nothing? They don't want to
fire sale, or write worthless, assets yet retain them for all possible time - maybe thinking those assets could be later collateral or used as a tax loss sale if anyone wanted to buy for such a purpose??
http://xml.10kwizard.com/filing_raw.php?repo=tenk&ipage=6691431
The Debtors intend to prepare a chapter 11 plan that will describe the liquidation of assets. As part of the plan to liquidate, the Company expects to create a liquidating trust or other entity or vehicle to hold certain assets that it may not be feasible or desirable to liquidate either now or in the future. The Company expects that there will be no distributions to the Company’s preferred or common stockholders, nor continuing interest in the Company (or liquidating trust) on the part of the preferred or common stockholders, as a result of any plan that is approved by the Bankruptcy Court.
Your decision is understandable.
I beleive that this is not dead yet. Look at last months MOR as filed, cash has increased form 99m to 103m unaudited of course, yet they have cut some cost, the real problem is that there does not exist any business or plans for one to generate any monies going forward.
"PEACE"
Your missing one key point and that is the assets are never worth what they say they are. You have to look at the earnings of late and there isn't any profits to speak off, but then you have to be careful there, and look over at the cashflow and I will tell you from my experiance it didn't look that good The last time they filed. Who knows what is happening now. Your right in the sense that they don't sell every thing cause not every thing the new buyer wants and it ends up in the hands of the bond holders to recoup there lost.
This is a crap shoot, a high risk play with ones pony money. If you can aford to play the horses. In this case the running of the pigs I would call it but with that there good be a few pigs that make it over the finish line but like I said I believe I picked the wrong pig this time. I will play it out and see what happens I'm in now over my head, not worth the cost of getting out if one can still claim it against your winners.
O.K.,so the initial BK filing listed
Assets of 363 million
Debts of 332 million
of which 100m in cash
14,410,133 Class A outstanding
29,773,697 Class B outstanding
http://www.advantareorg.com/pdflib/1_13931.pdf
It appears assets out weigh liabilites which would leave something to distribute. (32 million)
However,as it read the board "Expect" to submit a plan which calls for the liquidation of all assets, key word being "Expect", any plan would still have to be voted on as well as approved and decided on by the presiding judge.
Unless they plan on refiling a chapter 13 BK application.
Nor is it known if this was a unanimous decision by the board........Alter has plenty of class A shares and his wife owns the only preferred shares ever released, which do carry voting rights and there are still many institutions which hold shares as well as investors with the right to vote on any plan submitted. Not to mention the Committee of Unsecure Creditors which will most certainly raise some objection to such a liquidations if it leaves them out of the aquation.
http://www.sec.gov/cgi-bin/own-disp?action=getissuer&CIK=0000096638
http://www.mffais.com/advnb
The attempt here is to go the way of GM, but the big difference is, GM had the approval of all the majority holders involved.
IMHO, I just don't think such a plan has a chance of being approved.
"PEACE"
Advanta Shifts Gears to Try Liquidation
http://www.americanbanker.com/syndication/advanta-shifts-gears-1006083-1.html
Dow Jones 1/14/2010
Advanta Shifts Gears to Try Liquidation
American Banker (subscription)
Advanta Corp. is reversing its earlier pledges to reorganize under Chapter 11 protection and now says it will liquidate all its assets while in bankruptcy. ...
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