Stuck and Screwed!

[BigBake1]

There are several that will accept them now, it used to be only two larger brokers, one was HDSN and the other was VERT. As you can see they were broker dealers, there are now many more brokers that offer such services as long as the security has a Form 211.

[Bansky]

I understand that the paper is from debt swaps and such. So then, what are the two brokers that accept DTC chilled certs?

[BigBake1]

That is correct, regular retail cannot deposit or transfer existing physical certs. They also cannot transfer electronically from broker account to another broker account on these penny stocks.

The only retail allowed to deposit physical certs are those who are financiers or debt holders that show documents of NEW share issuance. It used to be only two such brokers accepted such NEW certs on DTC chilled securities and the haircut made it cost prohibitive to do so, 25-30% of total deposit value was required. Then the cert was held for a 30 day holding period.

Then the NSCC increased their fee to 20% from 10% on all deposits for DTC eligible securities. This caused a vacuum for competitive broker rates for these certs. Now there are several smaller brokers that will take deposit of new certs at lower rates than the NSCC and larger brokers. That is as long as the security in question is not a greysheet or unsolicited quote security, so a valid Form 211 must be on file.

[Bansky]

I find this board interesting. Are there any stock brokerage companies that actually take in physical certificates of DTC chilled stocks? I do not think so. IMO, If there were they would charge a fortune in fees and make you wait months to pay out the sale proceeds. Any thoughts on this?

[goldenrule4me]

Is being on the NSCC list the same as being on the DTC Chill List? If not how can I tell if a stock is on the NSCC list?

[goldenrule4me]

Is being on the NSCC list the same as being on the DTC Chill List? If not how can I tell if a stock is on the NSCC list?

[$$$TOCK 007]

ICNB -alerted $0.0004 at 05/04/2012 on this board, please try.

http://investorshub.advfn.com/Penny-$$-Tiny-Float-*-Low(OS-&-AS)-24974/

[DYNAMITE DAVE]

How can i get info from on a OTC
issue, and see if it has been
CHILLED or not ?

when i go to DTCC.gov i am still
unable to get the info

any suggestions?


i agree, the biggest problem wiht the
chill, is LACK OF LIQUIDITY...

and COST OF broker transaction could go up



this is still Wild wild west, but will not change anytime soon


let me know if u have a way to get IMMEDIATE info
on an OTC stock to see if its a Chill or not


htnkax


chereees

gr

[lowman]

"if everything you say is true why not just shut your mouth and let it die"

So more suckers don't fall for the RFMK kool-aid and therefore lose money....like the ones who bought .0051's yesterday, and because of the kool-aid and company incompetencies, are now down 20% on their 'investment' in just one day.

FWIW, I didn't get banned for spewing garbage. I got banned for excessively posting the truth.

What part of "immediate and significant" over 2 months ago is so hard to understand?

What part of 100M merciless dump is so hard to understand?

What part of "no more dilution" yet o/s still increases, don't you understand?

What part of DTCC chill despite having a DTCC expert on board, don't you understand?

What part of a $5.3M 2 yr budget with no assets to show for, don't you understand?

What part of 100M free and easy shares for the ex-CEO who never accomplished anything of significance don't you understand?

If my posting about this stuff is garbage to you, you seriously have problems evaluating a stock.

[jotis]

Haha your funny man, get banned from the RFMK board for spewing garbage so you bring it someplace else...

You must be getting paid a ton or decided you were gonna get rich shorting a pink and that is blowing up in your face.

Like honestly what's the point of this if RFMK is such a garbage company why keep giving it sooo much attention?

There are plenty of other stinky pinks that you could go rant on about but instead you feel the need to keep the name alive, if everything you say is true why not just shut your mouth and let it die?

[Siforus]

Can I hide here for awhile?
I can't read that rapid fire junk no mo

[lowman]

It's funny how they're all rookies with stars (moon?) in their eyes.

Any hope of reasonable equity funding is history, and any non-equity funding is going to be so astronomical, it won't even leave any growth profits afterwards. Whatever 'profits' exist after paying for funding will all go towards operations.

IMO, RFMK has well established they're competencies (or lack thereof) with the unaccounted $5.3M 2 yr budget with nothing to show for it. Toss in the easy 100M shares Mike earned for doing nothing substantial, and the story is told.

You'd think with that 100M that was dumped back in Feb, they'd atleast have $100K-$200K working capital for a sizable first order. Not.

[BigBake1]

Agreed, the first clue is anyone posting the Daily Reg SHO and claiming the percentage shows the security is being shorted. All of those trades are covered within minutes if not by the end of the day, in fact they have up until T+3 if need be. But here in the OTC it revolves around risk exposure, and MMs will mark newly issued shares “short” all day long to avoid a rejection fee and a 130% trade value for T+3 being withheld from the respective MMs account. Risk exposure is the number one reason to mark a trade “short” here due to the number one means of finance here in the OTC, debt conversion.

It is all relative to the company and it’s dilution, there is a reason for high percentages and high volume correlate to the latest debt conversion.

Although the chill does not stop the company dilution it certainly costs them a lot more in shares to capitalize. Now a Global Lock and well call the company “Done”, sure it will trade for a few months maybe, but without a means to deposit shares anywhere the company can no longer capitalize itself.

[lowman]

LOL, RFMK investors have a better chance of seeing a cow jump over the moon, than a short squeeze ever happening.

You can always tell who the rookies and deceiving pumpers are by who is hollarin' "short squeeze".

[BigBake1]

Hmmm, all the clearing firms are “participants”(4500+ US Brokers) of the DTCC, whether they use the DTCC for clearing and settlement or self clear is entirely up to that self clearing firm. You are correct that Penson is the largest OTC online clearing firm with the most brokers (437) under their umbrella. Pershing is the largest overall clearing firm (840+) but their only trading platform online is Sharebuilder and they mostly represent institutional brokers. But TDA for example uses the DTC for clearing and settlement but when a security becomes non DTC eligible they no longer process buys for that security, they will however self clear and settle sell transactions.

Now not all Penson trading platforms completely restrict trades when they are chilled, Zecco for example will still allow trades but if you are selling expect those nice pass through fees about 3-4 weeks after a sell transaction to appear in your account.

The trade for trade designation does apply to all trading the security, it just means the brokers cannot use the DTC for locate purposes or expect the “bank” to cover regular Market Making activities. As you said short volume now becomes about Newly Issued shares and not regular market making activity on existing shares.

[lowman]

Penson is the only entity that I know of that uses the DTCC, but I'm sure there are other, smaller clearing houses. Penson just happens to be the largest that clears thru the DTCC and has the most brokers.

[BigBake1]

Right, I understand the Trade for Trade designation but I was wondering about the statement "it only effects Penson", is that your statement or is that a statement posted on the board. I should have clarified it more.

I found it ironic the guy leading the “Remove the DTCC Chill” is now the CEO of such a company. So apparently the strategy is not proactive but in fact a reactive one if they are even trying to do anything…lol

The legend of chill removal is more of making a lot out of nothing. He did not get a T4T designation removed, in worked out a DWAC issue for CBAI, which is not a big deal in comparison to an exited CUSIP from CNS and T4T designation.

[lowman]

The 'trade for trade' is where the exorbinent fees come in. Those who use brokers that go thru the DTCC must physically locate the shares and 'certify' them, which is why it's so expensive.

Trade for trade basically means you get your shares in physical certificate form, though your broker will usually hold them.


You're largely right about the stalemate scenario. RFMK longs are so drunk on the kool-aid being served on that board, they haven't the sense to realize when they're stuck in the mud, and mud is exactly where that stock is.

It's nothing short of hilarious to me how they seem to think their CEO is a god, yet with all his DTCC consulting skills, he can't even avoid the chill.

I dunno if stupity gets any worse than that.

[BigBake1]

I agree ignorance of what the DTC Chill really impacts seems to be the cause of most of the bad information out there. People just do not understand the focal point is not trading but in fact the very thing needed here to provide liquidity. Newly issued shares are the target, not existing shares, and the DTC Chill has nothing to do with restricting the trading of existing shares. Existing shares however are impacted by two clearing firms, Penson and TDA, those are separate actions and self imposed policies for trading restrictions.

The impact is over time here in the OTC as liquidity slowly dries up, without ease of issuing new shares and at greater costs and time, the company burns through more shares in a shorter period of time. Eventually the PPS declines to a point that the bagholders cannot sell and the company has no valid reason or lacks shares to issue. Without new shares coming into the market the security attracts no new interest and the bagholders have no reason to sell for a loss, and it is a stalemate for the most part. Sure occasionally trades go off as one of those bagholders has had enough and some poorly informed trader picks them up thinking they will flip for a quick double on a “bottom bounce”.

Could you clarify what you meant with Trade for Trade designation, I was not sure if that is your statement or those at the RFMK board.

[lowman]

See what I mean, now? RFMK's 'best' PR to date and the stock can't even hold a gain. No doubt, the DTC chill doesn't help matters, either.

It's a POS.

Face it.

[lowman]

No doubt, I got screwed by RFMK. A good stock wouldn't have screwed me.

A good stock wouldn't have dumped 100M shares in 3 days, only to get chilled by the DTCC days later. And this, on top of the fact that their current CEO is supposed to be a DTCC consultant. Talk about a slap in the face and a major red flag of incompetency.

Don't tell me about trading kiddo. I know a good stock when I see it, and I know a POS when I see it, too.

BTW, isn't the o/s up over 800M now? And didn't the CEO just say no more dilution a few weeks ago, when the o/s was 750M?

Unless you're flipping that POS, you can not tell me it's been a wise investment for anyone in the last 1.5 months, despite all the 'going to the moon' BS talk that's been going on for the last 4 months. There's Sellers in that stock. If it's not the new dilution that's bad enough, then it's certainly the 300M restricted shares that are losing their legends and creating the upward resistance.

Plain...and simple.

But that's ok, 'cause kool-aid drinkers always find excuses for the company's incompetencies, lies, mis-truths, shortcomings, and exaggerations.

It's a POS and the sooner you accept it, the sooner you might start flipping it for a profit, 'cause as long as they stay DTCC chilled, RFMK is never going to find good financing terms. Any non-equity terms will take so much outta the potential profit, nothing will trickle back to the s/h's after Tom and Mike take their cut. You can be sure that o/s is gonna keep creeping towards that 2B a/s.

BTW, has Tom granted himself a 100M free and easy shares yet? Like Mike did?

[nvidiaforgames]

Seems like you got Stuck and Screwed by RFMK. Too bad you didn't trade it well enough. I think somebody needs to hit the trading books :(

[lowman]

Funny how all them RFMK jokers keep acting like the DTCC chill won't affect the stock...but the stock has hardly even broken .006 since the chill (much less the .0093 pre-chill pps) and the Cannacig is closer to market than ever before!

Reminds me of the proverbial donkey that won't drink what's good for 'em, but would rather drink kool-aid.

From time to time, I read the board and I see so much mis-info. The 'trade for trade' pertains ONLY to Penson affiliated brokers, yet they all seem to think 'trade for trade' is across the board. Funnier yet, they seem to think 'trade for trade' is even good. Sure hasn't done anything for the stock price.

And the shorting they keep yelping about. They don't seem to realize that every time NEW shares hit the market, they show up as short shares on the Reg Sho list. This is because the MM fills buy orders first, and then gets recompensated by the 'Seller' afterwards, giving a misleading (short) appearance.

And to add stupity to ignorance, they actually think the now-non principal ex-CEO is still bound by principal SEC laws/rules. Fact is, if he's not a CEO, CFO, COO, or director, he's not bound by any laws and can sell up to his entire position in one day, though of course, he's smarter than that, and will just bleed investors slowly, instead.

RFMK has been my worst play of the year, having both lost and tied money up in that POS far more than I should ever have. It's a compelling 'story' but bottomline is, the red flags outnumber the green flags by atleast 5 to 1.

Approx. $6M worth of stock issued and sold in the last 3 years and their only asset is 500(?) cannacigs?

What a freakin' joke.

[Siforus]

Howdy Lowman,
I got the TA on speed dial
The RFMK show is about to start again
Rs and Os went up again last week
What's ol' Tommy gonna whip on em this week?

The regulars tried to write it off as old news and I about died laughing.

[Zardiw]

Just saying that that's a lot of fing companies to be doing that......I can see maybe 50 or so......but not hundreds/thousands........seems like there's other reasons for the dtc to f up the trading in certain stocks.......z

[lowman]

Probably alot more have sold unregistered shares but just haven't been noticed yet.

After a heavy day of dilution (2 months ago), RFMK was blacklisted shortly after. Kinda seemed like the merciless dilution is what caught the DTCC's eyes.

[Zardiw]

Seems hard to believe all those companies are guilty of selling unregistered shares........z

[lowman]

While this board is not exactly the ideal board for RFMK discussions, I will agree with you that RFMK appears to be pulling some wool over blind eyes.

Tom A., the new CEO, who was supposedly affluent in DTCC consulting matters, landed a DTCC chill upon his very own company. Not exactly a show of competency. His 'competency' (or lack thereof) has seriously handicapped RFMK at raising future funding needs at a reasonably acceptable rate.

Makes ya wonder about his competency and anything he says, going forward.

While the RFMK saga appears to be a good ongoing story to the uninitiated, the truth is not quite so convincing. A study of the company's PR and website updates illustrate incompetence in the least. Outright fraud, with clarity.

The reasonably unexplained resignation of the recent CEO, with his now free-trading 100M share salary, has gone unquestioned.

To that, all I can say is, I could only wish I could skate away from my duties so profitably.

(100M shares. Watch for small blocks of 2M-5M to pop up on ask. Mike's not stupid. He knows better than to put 100M up all at once.)

[Siforus]

Stuck & Screwed in fantasy RFMK land
The land of Tom Allinder and his handful of believers.
I can't make this stuff up but he sure can
Baaaaaaaaa.

http://rapid-fire-marketing.com/

[lowman]

Latest Non-DTCC eligible stocks as of 3-16-2012:

CYOE
EXPU
LFBG
MSMY
PDPR
TAMG
TRON

[jwez]

Thanks, appreciate it.

[lowman]

Link to DTCC changes:

(look for 'Cusips to be exited'.)

http://www.dtcc.com/legal/imp_notices/nscc/2012.php

[jwez]

Thanks

[lowman]

You can't, other than right here or a few other IHub boards. No website publishes a simplified list as such. The list is an accumulation of stocks that have been added or the years. I haven't updated that list in about a month, so...

[jwez]

Where can you get that list? TIA

[lowman]

All Non-DTCC eligible stocks as of 2-17-12:


AAVG
ACHM
ADCS
ADOT
AEGY
AEMD
AERN
AFTI
AGHD
AGIJ
AKYI
ALGF
ALTO
AMNG
AMNE
ANWM
APRM
AQUS
ATNP
ATPT
ATTD
AXGC
BBDA
BEDA
BEHL
BESR
BFRE
BIHC
BKPR
BLUG
BNPD
BOCL
BRMC
BRZL
BVRG
BYOC
BYRG
CAEJ
CCME
CCWF
CDGT
CDIV
CDOI
CGFIA
CHJI
CIST
CLDR
CLXM
CLYW
CMCJ
CMGR
CNEX
CNUV
COPI
COUV
CPHG
CPMCF
CRWV
CTTD
CWRN
CYGX
DGMA
DGRI
DIAAF
DMTA
DPDM
DTGP
DTSL
DVME
ECDP
ECMH
EDEP
EDLT
EDWY
EFIR
EFLN
EGOC
EGOH
EHSI
ELCR
EMLL
EMPM
EMPZ
EMXC
ENTS
EVCA
EVSO
EWKS
EWPI
FEEL
FFGO
FLTT
FNXC
FOGC
FTEG
FTRM
FXPT
GARB
GBRC
GETC
GELVD
GGII
GGMC
GHLV
GLER
GOIG
GPPL
GRBG
GRBT
GRDO
GRHU
GRPS
GSLO
GSHN
GTLA
GTLL
GVDI
HDSI
HELI
HIRU
HLXW
HMGP
HNSS
HPNN
HRNF
HRTT
HSCO
HSTH
IDOI
IFCR
IFXY
IHGP
IMDS
IMJX
IMGR
INAR
INCC
INDR
INNP
INOL
ITCJ
IVVI
IVOI
IXMD
JVDTQ
KGRI
KKUR
KORE
KRMC
LCOL
LEXG
LFXG
LGSL
LHPT
LKEN
LLBO
LLEG
LVLV
MCCI
MCDA
MCHU
MCLN
MDOR
MDRG
MDYO
MGLG
MHLI
MIKP
MILV
MMTC
MNDP
MNSI
MSGI
MSOA
MTEK
MVBY
MWIS
NEGS
NEOM
NPWZ
NSHJ
NTBS
NUBL
NVAE
NWMT
NXOI
NYMH
OCBM
ONCP
ONFI
OPGX
ORRV
OPTZ
OTFT
OTOW
PASO
PCLO
PDOS
PELE
PGCN
PHMB
PGNE
PIHN
POPN
POTG
PPTO
PRMO
PRPM
PPYH
PSGI
PSRU
PTEL
QMIN
QOIL
QURS
RBDC
RCCH
RFMK
RGTX
RINO
RLAB
RMBM
RMTD
RSOU
RXPC
RXPCD
SAVW
SAVY
SDRG
SEHI
SFIO
SGLS
SIRG
SLIF
SLRW
SMCE
SMEV
SMHS
SMPP
SNRS
SNRY
SNWT
SOLI
SOPV
SOUP
SPFM
SPLT
SPQS
SPZI
SREA
SSHS
SSPT
SSTC
STWS
SUGO
SUMM
SMVI
SYMBA
TAON
TCLN
TEMN
TGGI
THRA
TIVU
TLAG
TSNP
TSPG
TWVH
UBEX
UBRG
UDSG
UFBV
UNCO
UNGS
UNDT
UPCP
USOG
UTEM
UVFT
VCAN
VCRT
VCTY
VIPR
VIVK
VLCO
VLXC
VPLM
VSHE
WGAN
WHEN
WHKA
WNCG
WRIT
WSCH
WTCT
WWBP
WWNG
XDSL
XNEZ
YNGR

[lowman]

Link to DTCC NDE changes:

Look for: CUSIP's to be exited from CNS and future trades designated trade for trade.

http://www.dtcc.com/legal/imp_notices/nscc/2012.php

[lowman]

All Non-DTCC eligible stocks as of 2-04-12:


AAVG
ACHM
ADCS
ADOT
AEGY
AEMD
AERN
AFTI
AGHD
AGIJ
AKYI
ALGF
ALTO
AMNG
AMNE
ANWM
APRM
AQUS
ATNP
ATPT
ATTD
AXGC
BBDA
BEDA
BEHL
BESR
BFRE
BIHC
BKPR
BLUG
BNPD
BOCL
BRMC
BRZL
BVRG
BYOC
BYRG
CAEJ
CCME
CCWF
CDGT
CDIV
CDOI
CGFIA
CHJI
CIST
CLDR
CLXM
CLYW
CMCJ
CMGR
CNEX
CNUV
COPI
COUV
CPHG
CPMCF
CRWV
CTTD
CWRN
CYGX
DGMA
DGRI
DIAAF
DMTA
DPDM
DTGP
DTSL
DVME
ECDP
ECMH
EDEP
EDLT
EDWY
EFIR
EFLN
EGOC
EGOH
EHSI
ELCR
EMLL
EMPZ
EMXC
ENTS
EVCA
EVSO
EWKS
EWPI
FEEL
FFGO
FLTT
FNXC
FOGC
FTEG
FTRM
FXPT
GBRC
GETC
GELVD
GGII
GGMC
GHLV
GLER
GOIG
GPPL
GRBG
GRBT
GRDO
GRHU
GRPS
GSLO
GSHN
GTLA
GTLL
GVDI
HDSI
HELI
HIRU
HLXW
HMGP
HNSS
HPNN
HRNF
HRTT
HSCO
HSTH
IDOI
IFCR
IFXY
IHGP
IMDS
IMJX
IMGR
INAR
INDR
INNP
INOL
ITCJ
IVVI
IVOI
IXMD
JVDTQ
KGRI
KKUR
KORE
KRMC
LCOL
LEXG
LFXG
LGSL
LHPT
LKEN
LLBO
LLEG
LVLV
MCCI
MCDA
MCHU
MCLN
MDOR
MDRG
MDYO
MGLG
MHLI
MIKP
MMTC
MNDP
MNSI
MSGI
MSOA
MTEK
MVBY
MWIS
NEGS
NEOM
NPWZ
NSHJ
NTBS
NUBL
NVAE
NWMT
NXOI
NYMH
OCBM
ONCP
ONFI
OPGX
ORRV
OPTZ
OTFT
OTOW
PCLO
PDOS
PELE
PGCN
PHMB
PGNE
PIHN
POPN
POTG
PPTO
PRMO
PRPM
PPYH
PSGI
PSRU
PTEL
QMIN
QOIL
QURS
RBDC
RCCH
RGTX
RINO
RLAB
RMBM
RMTD
RSOU
SAVW
SAVY
SDRG
SEHI
SFIO
SGLS
SIRG
SLIF
SLRW
SMCE
SMEV
SMHS
SMPP
SNRS
SNRY
SNWT
SOLI
SOPV
SOUP
SPFM
SPLT
SPQS
SPZI
SREA
SSHS
SSPT
SSTC
STWS
SUGO
SUMM
SMVI
SYMBA
TAON
TCLN
TEMN
TGGI
THRA
TIVU
TLAG
TSNP
TSPG
TWVH
UBEX
UBRG
UDSG
UFBV
UNCO
UNGS
UNDT
UPCP
USOG
UTEM
VCAN
VCRT
VCTY
VIPR
VIVK
VLCO
VLXC
VPLM
VSHE
WGAN
WHEN
WHKA
WNCG
WRIT
WSCH
WTCT
WWBP
WWNG
XDSL
XNEZ
YNGR

[wrenchman]

Hey Bull,good to see you here and thnx for the pm, as for this list i went on Mastertrader and questioned its accuracy at first but i own MCLN which was on it and volume was way down almost to nothing (non-dtc eligible is why i am sure) until last week and it picked up so i am not sold totally on that list as our gold drama stock is there but it seems to me something has changed with my other,hopefully with FFGO its our turning point and just so you know i always read everything but post little as they capped me and when i post i say things that get me deleted LOL i cant hold back i guess!!!

[srm4u]

"future trades designated trade for trade"

http://search2.dtcc.com/?i=1;q=future+trades+designated+trade+for+trade;sp_k=imp_notices;x=13;y=9

[srm4u]

http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=71657510
http://www.dtcc.com/legal/imp_notices/rss/all.xml

[srm4u]

lol....:) i have 1 for you that is up 25% from mid dec and their on 3 exchanges, not on any us exchanges......if your interested you'll have to see my most resent posts on my profile, since i can't post tickers here.....:)

[lowman]

If I traded 2 "F" stocks in all my life, that'd probably be one more than the truth. I have a hard time putting faith in any company that comes to the U.S. to raise funds because they can't raise sufficient funds in their own land. It's hard enough finding a good U.S. stock. Expecting better returns from a foreign one is like finding a true beauty of a mail-order bride.

[srm4u]

that all depends....if it is a foreign stock that is non dtcc and not traded on a us exchange your broker will charge a large commission.....thats what i have learned with etrade

[lowman]

Only brokers who clear thru Penson charge the ridiculous fees. All others are fine, as far as I know.

[srm4u]

this makes total since and would make a big difference.......:) going back to paper trading and abolish electronic trading
lowman Member Level

Share
Monday, October 17, 2011 4:47:03 PM
Re: maddogs post# 34
Post # of 263
When the masses get sick enough, they'll stage an event like Occupy Wall Street to DEMAND(!!!) the abolishing of MMs right to 'maintain and orderly market'. No single action will make a larger impact on the market than that alone. Next would be the requirement that all TAs issue ONLY registered shares. Two simple actions would clean the market up beyond comprehension.

[stockmasterflash]

I can't buy AAVG or AEMD

ADOT
ACHM

are invalid symbols

I doubt this list is accurate

[srm4u]

thanks, been through that routine......:) guess i have to rely on my broker to be honest, sence they would be the first to know if a dtcc chill has been lifted

[stockmasterflash]

You usually get a valid/invalid trade message

at the final confirmation screen. Cancel the order at that point

I enter an order, and get a "this security can only be closed" message at the confirmation screen.

if I don't get it. then it's trading. I then cancel my order/do not send the order

Try it with IMDS and PDOS. I just tried orders on both a minute ago.

[srm4u]

true, but wouldn't the commission be higher per trade? the broker would be holding the stock in their street name, making them accountable.....im more interested in a dtcc chill