Replies to post #457543 on Tornado Alley (PROG)

[zab]

Now focus on the reality of the situation in Gaza. Where do you think all of these Palestinian people go as Israel keeps destroying everything they can see. Just how many 1000s must actually die before Israel stops this senseless destruction.

How come Israel never posts anything about all of the Hamas soldiers they keep killing each day. It has almost been three months and it is odd that these numbers are never in the forefront of each night's newscast.

Meanwhile the television screens do show lots of children being killed in the rubble, or just simply being removed from all of the buildings that have been blown away.

In this war it always seems to never even be a part of your posts. You do not even give a shit about all of those deaths. Israel lost 1400 in that initial start of the war, and everyone would agree that is a tragedy. But now it has been three months of Israel blowing up everything in sight. Gaza looks like a war zone. What has happened in Israel during these three months, a few missile attacks, most have been shot down by that Iron Dome that American taxpayer's pay for. You also keep leaving that out of your equation. It is American taxpayer's paying that bill. You hardly ever acknowledge that in your posts.

Different points of view is what happens in this forum, that is why you have a problem with many of us. You only want to see your view. Please tell us that Israel is always ok with everything they do, no matter what we see on the television screens, or read each day. Please tell us that women and children being slaughtered is just fine with you, month after month, as the citizens of Israel go about their lives. Please ask Israel to say thank you to all of America to providing all of those warships in the area, and all of those servicemen and women who are their defending Israel.

[sortagreen]

"Where should the millions of Israeli Jews go when you dismantle the Zionist entity?"

How about they find a way to share the land? Obviously you won't expect that Israelis, especially within the 1967 are going to evacuate Israel, but the settlements? Absolutely. Jerusalem? You have to share it. A late friend of mine, who was in the IDF at one point, was of the opinion that Jerusalem had to remain an open city.

Edward Seid had some interesting thoughts, which I wish I had saved, but you will need to start with recognizing the other peoples' humanity. It won't be a 20% Arab nation at that point, but it was 60/40 before the pogroms of 1948. You're going to have to absorb them. They live there.

And by the way. You saying that Arafat came up with the right of return is not a point of view. It's merely incorrect. The UN asserted that in 1948 (I think 1948)

"people who can’t see any validity in anyone else’s point of view."

You have a lack of empathy bordering on the sociopathic, and that's being kind. Would you shoot a child in the face yourself, or are you just comfortable having soldiers do it for you? Better to drop 2000 lb bombs in the middle of a refugee ghetto and claim you told them to move?


Hitler had a point of view. Mao and Stalin and Hap all have points of view. I don't have to view them as valid. I don't have to accept yours either.

[Zorax]

As a total outsider not related to any of these people, all I see is one fanatic group of a few hundreds invading another country by a land bridge of other non related people, killing 1,200 mostly innocent citizens of that target country and the attacked country retaliating against the fanatic group by killing over 20 thousand women and children of the non related people who aren't the fanatics while trapped on their land.

What's wrong with this picture?

All my life from my Jewish friends I've heard how Israel is forever persecuted and has nothing. Yet all my life, Israel has prospered and profited well and done pretty damn good for being persecuted and kept in the woods.

Looks like you are defending a dictator like putin or hitler, or wannabe shitgibbon. No one kills a third party who happens to be in the way by accident. Wouldn't surprise me a bit if Netanyahu didn't set this up. After the Palestinians, who's next?

[fuagf]

brooklyn13, No one is talking about dismantling Israel, so don't include it as one
of your strawman distractions. And, your "only point" as stated below is invalid.

"Seriously? Fuck off. Life is too short to deal with people who can’t see any validity in anyone else’s point of view.
You do the same thing with Conix, Hap, etc. they’re idiots and morons and stupid for having different opinions."

When opinion is at odds with established fact it is fair to see it as moronic.

" Where should the millions of Israeli Jews go when you dismantle the Zionist entity?
If it’s apartheid then so is America, Australia, Ethiopia, Iran, China et al. You doing a BDS
about China? Stopped buying the cheap shit at Walmart that comes from there?
My only point has ever been that it’s a double standard when it comes to Israel. "

There is no double standard. Other countries have been targeted by human rights groups. Certainly China has been
criticized mightily for their treatment of the Uyghurs. Ethiopia and Iran have been targeted by Human Rights groups.

When the topic is Israel your mention of other countries is little more than a distraction. You have been shown clearly how Palestinian citizens of do not have equal rights under law as all Americans do, and as all Australians do .. https://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=173504617 . That is not to say blacks in America and indigenous Australian are not discriminated against. That's a totally different discussion.

Noted you ignore most all fact-filled posts as the one linked just above. You have no legit
claim to accuse others of ignoring facts. Back - again - to Israel and the apartheid label.

The argument that Israel practices apartheid, explained

Some human rights groups have reached this conclusion based on how the crime is defined in international law.

By Li [e-mail] Oct 20, 2023, 6:30am EDT

[...]

Some Israel scholars and former Israeli officials have also started using this designation. In 2022, Michael Ben-Yair, a former attorney general of Israel, said that “it is with great sadness ... I must also conclude that my country has sunk to such political and moral depths that it is now an apartheid regime.” Earlier this year, Tamir Pardo, a former head of Mossad, Israel’s intelligence agency, emphasized, too, that “there is an apartheid state here” featuring “two people [who] are judged under two legal systems.”

In protests and critiques of the Israeli government’s military actions this month, political leaders and activists around the world have often referenced the term while condemning the country’s policies.

The Israeli government, meanwhile, has argued that any claims that it practices apartheid are “preposterous and false,” antisemitic, and dedicated to singling out the country. (Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International have also condemned and examined apartheid elsewhere, including in Myanmar, where the Rohingya minority group has faced a great deal of violence.)

Israel isn’t alone in its criticism of the term,...

[...]

“Israel does not have a racial segregation implemented by law,” Haaretz opinion editor Anat Kaam wrote in the Daily Beast in October 2022. “There are Arab citizens—citizens with full, equal rights—in the Israeli parliament, the Knesset, as well as in the Israeli court system, including the Supreme Court. There are Arab doctors, professors, policemen, teachers, and countless other professions, working side by side with Jews.”

[Insert excerpt from above link:
The new law is about longstanding disputes over borders and identity
[...]
But while they certainly enjoy more rights than Palestinians in East Jerusalem, who in turn have it better than Palestinians in the West Bank, who have it far better than Palestinians in Gaza, Arab Israelis say that since the state’s founding, in practice they have not been afforded the same rights as Jewish Israelis. This is one reason why many Arab Israelis refer to themselves as Palestinians with Israeli citizenship.
https://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=173504617

]

This argument was expanded upon at length by the American Center for Law and Justice’s Jay Sekulow, a Trump attorney, and Robert Ash, in a 2023 paper. They argue that the fact that Arab citizens of Israel have an opportunity of success in Israel — structural factors complicating that reality aside — undercuts the claim that the government uses race in its policies. Instead, they too claim that Israel’s policies in the occupied territories are driven by the ongoing conflict between Palestinians in these areas with the Israeli government.

Such assessments, however, fail to acknowledge the ways that Israel discriminates against Palestinian citizens inside its borders, human rights groups say. Again, Palestinians in Israel face restrictions on the land they can buy and barriers to certain social services as well as family reunification. Inside Israel, despite Palestinians comprising around 20 percent of the population, Palestinian municipalities make up just 3 percent of its land, Human Rights Watch says. And while Palestinian citizens of Israel may have more rights than Palestinians in the occupied territories, experts emphasize that the disparities they experience are undergirded by the same institutionalized racism at their core.

“If there are 7 million Israeli Jews and 7 million Palestinian Arabs under the rule of Israel, and Israel is meant to be a Jewish state, then there is no other explanation than race and ethnicity to explain the treatment of the 5.2 million Palestinians under occupation without rights and the 1.8 million Palestinian citizens of Israel with second-class rights,” says Lynk. “None of this is acceptable under any modern understanding of democracy.”

https://www.vox.com/23924319/israel-palestine-apartheid-meaning-history-debate