Waiting for the storm in Baghdad
NBC NEWS
BAGHDAD, March 25 -- Journalist Peter Arnett, one of the last reporters affiliated with an American news organization still in Baghdad, says he does not fear for his personal safety, despite the U.S.-led bombing raids and the possibility of street fighting. But Arnett says if U.S. troops are forced to battle block by block in the Iraqi capital, they will receive a very hostile reception from average Iraqis.
ARNETT, 68, WHO IS reporting from Baghdad for NBC, MSNBC and National Geographic Explorer, answered questions by telephone for an hour Tuesday from reporters around the U.S. Below is an edited transcript of the conversation.
How will U.S. forces be greeted in Baghdad? You have to look at what has happened so far in the conflict to make a judgment. Iraqi officials are glorying in the fact that there has not been an explosion [of Iraqis against Saddam Hussein] so far. Tariq Aziz last night talked about how somebody at the Pentagon said the Americans would be welcomed into Iraq with music and flowers -- he said it would be bullets that would greet them. As far as Baghdad people are concerned, I spent a lot of time prior to the war talking to them… They said, "What can we do?" We're talking about people who don't have guns in their houses. What you'll have is passive acceptance. Will it be a situation like in Palestine against the Israelis? I don't think so. There's no history of that here of that kind of antagonism. If by some miracle some political arrangement was done without fighting, conceivably Americans could come in and they would say "Hey, how are you doing?" This is a town of business people and educated folks. But if they have to fight their way in and the buildings are demolished and there are dead in the streets, there will be no flowers and music for the Americans.
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Have you been threatened on the street? Do you feel you are in danger? I haven't had one shred of indication that I'm unwelcome here and I move around the city during the day, I get out with my team. You have several scores of antiwar protesters from around the world here, from Japan, Denmark, Scandinavians, quite a few Americans… there's a real animosity from them toward the U.S. but I don't take it personally. But there are no Iraqis around the Palestine hotel shouting anti-American sentiments. This does not mean to say that sooner or later as the battle for Baghdad develops, that there won't be danger for journalists. But right now if you have a minder with you, you are safe.
Are you worried about working from the Information Ministry Building? Since I got here six weeks ago, it has been rumored that the Information Ministry was going to be a prime target of the Pentagon. Last Friday just before "shock and awe," one news organization called and said, "The Information Ministry will be destroyed at 8 o'clock." The Info ministry people are furious. They say this is a serious, civilian operation. There are 100 journalists in town, a lot of them Arabs, along with a handful from the U.S., and some from Europe. Today I've broadcast a couple of live shots for the "Today" show from the roof of the building -- I was the only reporter on the roof. I believe the U.S. government won't target that building, certainly while journalists are there. Maybe they'll do it at 4 in the morning.
What's the difference between now and the first Gulf War? The big difference now is that every day of bombing brings a massive American ground force toward Baghdad. The first Gulf War was a different game. There was intense bombing for the first few nights, then continuing bombing for the next 40 days or so. But reporters here traveled around the country, went to Basra, Mosul, Nasiriyah, checking out what was going on. But now, there's a battle coming right through the heart of Baghdad. As far as I'm concerned, the worst is yet to come. Before "shock and awe," we were waiting with trepidation. It was horrendous, thunderous and frightening, but it was all half a mile away and there were very few casualties other than those who remained in those buildings.
Today, four days beyond that, there's not really been a bomb dropped since in Baghdad, but we know there are bombs to the south directed at the Republican Guards who will try to stop the powerful American force. Then there will be changes in this city that are totally unpredictable. The bombing we can handle. But in Gulf War II there's another whole prospect of street fighting and government change. It will be dangerous but an incredibly exciting story to cover.
I'm relying on the Iraqi authorities to be with us. Their being with us is a guarantee of our safety. They play a protective role.
I personally have been in quite a few cities where there has been mayhem. I was in Beirut, in Saigon during the Tet offensive, in Chechnya. I got through those and I think a lot of the journalists here will get through them too.
Do the people of Baghdad have any idea what's coming? They don't have a sense of what is to come. What you see on Iraqi television is patriotic dirges or biographies of Saddam Hussein, or maybe press conferences by Iraqi officials or material from the battlefield -- such as the capture of the American prisoners. But they are not aware really that this city will be invested by an American invasion. They are tuned to Arab broadcasts. But the enormity of an American occupation … Americans are actually going to be coming into this city and be sitting at intersections in tanks with a four-star American general in charge.
This is a city that has known suffering. They are inured to it in a way, they hunker down in their houses. They're frightened of it but they adjust to it. People are out in their front yards right now, they go to the corner store and hunker down with their families and say this too will pass. "Inshallah" -- It's in the hands of God… Whatever happens, he will take care of it and that's it.
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What kind of censorship are you under in your reports? This time around, they are requiring no censorship at all but what they do require is for us to attend a morning press conference or press briefing every morning.
I'm sitting here on the hotel phone. We can talk on the phone freely. The Iraqi officials may be monitoring it on some capacity, but I've never been asked about any conversation I've had or report I've given in the month I've been here. There's been no attempt to interfere with what I was saying, no attempt to monitor the news packages I was putting out.
The reason they're fairly relaxed is that they're not giving access to any locations except those that are newsworthy, which means locations where civilians have been affected by the bombing campaign, or to news conferences. We do have a minder so we can go and talk to families to ask them how they are getting along as the war progresses, and the minders are listening so these people are obviously going to frame their answers with that in mind.
Satellite phones are restricted to use in the information ministry but occasionally, such as after the Tariq Aziz press conference last night, they said we could have limited use in the hotel. In terms of live coverage on camera, it has to be done at the ministry. In terms of shooting pictures, we're allowed to shoot with the minder wherever we're taken to. But just can't get in a taxi and take pictures of the city.
Of course you have no embedded reporters with the Republican Guards, and I would not volunteer for that role. But I think we have a good opportunity to see all of the action without being impeded by Iraqi officials. I predict as things progress, there will be less and less visibility by Iraqi officials. We should be freer to talk with the families we are following. If we can survive the next few weeks, it will be an interesting journalistic picture.
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What do you think about disinformation on both sides? Saddam said we can hold the U.S. in place and force them to retreat. You have to accept that, since they're trying to build the spirit of their people. As far as Um Qasr, they were restraining the U.S. to some degree, so they're getting as much pride as they can out of it.
Another point -- the conduct of Iraqi soldiers. The U.S. media is portraying the Iraqis as unfair fighters, fighting unethically -- how can you take your uniform off and put on civilian garments and go and shoot someone. It strikes me we're looking at a guerilla war operation here. Months ago the Iraqis were telling me, when the Americans come they may get through us, but they're going to pay, we will use every way we can to kill them, we will kill them. What an Iraqi feels is a brave and noble act and what the Americans feel is a brave and noble act depends on the point of view. The type of war the Iraqis are waging is portrayed as unacceptable. But there have been three major B-52 strikes all around the perimeter of the city. One of the Iraqi officials said to me, "The Americans talk about weapons of mass destruction that we now have, but what about the B-52s?" They have destroyed in 10 minutes what Saddam spent 30 years building.
Does you believe embedded reporters are a good tthing? When you're with troops, I don't think you can get away with a lot of patriotic rubbish. You've got to tell the truth because the troops know the reality. Beyond all of the patriotism, the real reality is when you're riding in the back of a vehicle and getting shot at. Reporters are reflecting that on the front line. To that degree I am impressed with the embedding process.
Is there a danger that embedded reporters are just giving us a snapshot of what's going on ? The only way you can do it is get a snapshot -- the big picture is back at headquarters. But a lot of snapshots will add up. You get those snapshots and then you can start interpreting through your own vision of what's going on.
What did you pack that you didn't need? In the gulf war, on the first night, all of the power and water went down, all the telephones went down. Suddenly we were in the hulk of a hotel that didn't work. You needed everything. You couldn't get laundry done, you had to eat crackers and cheese. There are rooms here filled with thousands of bottles of water and all sorts of crackers and cheeses and as it turned out so far, the utilities have held up perfectly. You can go to the restaurant downstairs and have breakfast or go to one or two restaurants around town still open where you can get decent kabab.
How are you holding up? It is a long day, it's an eight-hour time difference. You get up and go to the Information Ministry and go on trips. But it's 3 p.m. here before the "Today" show starts. By the time "Nightly News" comes on it's 2:30 in the morning and "Dateline" is at 6 in the morning. You could spend 24 hours a day easily gathering news and dispensing it. And I did that -- me and my team did that -- for the first four days. I was on the phone at 4 a.m. with Tom Brokaw and could say the sirens were sounding and from then on for four days I don't think we got 40 winks. But since then, the schedule has been more reasonable.
How much are you being charged for the hotel room? The Palestine hotel is charging $40 a day, the al Rashid was about $80 a day, but it was a little better quality. The hotel rooms are seedy and sort of noisy. I can hear someone in the next room reporting to his home office. But I'm not complaining. We have a great view across the river. From this room here, these few rooms here, we were half a mile away… it was the perfect vantage point.
