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Re: arizona1 post# 158159

Saturday, 10/29/2011 9:06:19 PM

Saturday, October 29, 2011 9:06:19 PM

Post# of 485146
Though maybe written by a conservative, i'm not sure if all stated defined benefit systems are unsustainable and he says they are .. this site looks useful for a reference to situation re collective bargaining in the USA. 27 states covered here .. below is Ohio ..

Ohio

A yes vote will restore control of government budgets to taxpayers. Dispatch.com. October 17, 2011. ..
http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/editorials/2011/10/17/state-issue-2.html ..

Ohio wages fierce fight on collective bargaining. NYTimes.com. October 15, 2011. ..
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/16/us/in-ohio-a-battle-over-public-employees-bargaining-rights.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all ..

An editorial in The Columbus Dispatch said that a yes vote on SB 5 will restore control of government budgets to taxpayers. Dispatch.com. .. http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/editorials/2011/10/17/state-issue-2.html .. October 17, 2011. Ohio wages fierce fight on collective bargaining. NYTimes.com. .. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/16/us/in-ohio-a-battle-over-public-employees-bargaining-rights.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all .. October 15, 2011.

The Ohio Secretary of State announced that enough signatures have been gathered to put Gov. John Kasich's recent public-sector collective bargaining changes to a statewide public vote. National Review Online. .. http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/272659/statewide-vote-public-sector-collective-bargaining-coming-ohio-christian-schneider .. July 25, 2011.

Poll- Majority want repeal of Ohio Bill (SB5) that limits government employees collective bargaining rights. In the poll, 54% of registered voters said the collective bargaining law should be repealed, while 36% said it should not. And with the law potentially headed for a referendum in November, it looks like they may get their wish. TPMDC. May 18, 2011.

Ohio Education Association imposes $54/member dues hike to generate $5 million for a referendum campaign to fight SB 5.

Governor Kasich signed into law SB5, a collective bargaining law on March 31. Key provisions of the bill:

Prohibits "public employees" from striking. Requires the public employer to deduct from the compensation of a striking employee an amount equal to twice the employee's daily rate of pay for each day or part thereof that the employee engaged in a strike.

Prohibits employees of community schools from collectively bargaining, except for conversion community schools

Permits public employers to not bargain on any subject reserved to the management and direction of the governmental unit, even if the subject affects wages, hours, and terms and conditions of employment. Prohibits an existing provision of a collective bargaining agreement that was modified, renewed, or extended that does not concern wages, hours, and terms and conditions from being a mandatory subject of collective bargaining.

Prohibits a public employer that is a school district, educational service center, a conversion community school that collectively bargains, or STEM school from entering into a collective bargaining agreement that does specified things, such as establishing a maximum number of students who may be assigned to a classroom or teacher. Requires collective bargaining agreements between such an education-related public employer and public employees to comply with all applicable state or local laws or ordinances regarding wages, hours, and terms and conditions of employment, unless the conflicting provision establishes benefits that are less than provided in the law or ordinance.

Prohibits a collective bargaining agreement from prohibiting a public employer that is in a state of fiscal emergency from serving a written notice to terminate, modify, or negotiate the agreement. Prohibits a collective bargaining agreement from prohibiting a public employer that is in a state of fiscal watch from serving a written notice to modify a collective bargaining agreement so that salary or benefit increases, or both, are suspended.

Prohibits an agreement from containing a provision that requires as a condition of employment that the nonmembers of the employee organization pay to the employee organization a fair share fee.

Prohibits a collective bargaining agreement entered into or renewed on or after the bill's effective date from containing provisions limiting a public employer's ability to privatize operations.

Prohibits a collective bargaining agreement entered into or renewed on or after the bill's effective date from containing provisions for certain types of leave to accrue above listed amounts or to pay out for sick leave at a rate higher than specified amounts

Prohibits a collective bargaining agreement entered into or renewed on or after the bill's effective date from containing certain provisions regarding the deferred retirement option plan.

Public employees pay. Generally eliminates statutory salary schedules and steps. Requires performance-based pay for most public employees, including board and commission members, and makes other, related changes. Requires performance-based pay for teachers based, in part, on evaluations conducted under a policy that is based on a framework for teacher evaluations that has been recommended by the Superintendent of Public Instruction and adopted by the State Board of Education

Limits public employer contributions toward health care benefit costs to 85%

Abolishes continuing contracts for teachers, except for those continuing contracts in existence prior to the effective date of the bill and revises the law relating to limited contracts

Prohibits a public employer from paying employee contributions to the five public employee retirement systems.

Removes consideration of seniority and length of service, by itself, from
decisions regarding a reduction in work force of certain public employees.
http://www.statebudgetsolutions.org/the_williams_report/detail/state-collective-bargaining-update-october-25-2011

=======================

This is old information, but a good one on the fact that state employees and their unions are not at all
to blame for the underfunding of state defined benefit funds .. especially page 3 below wraps it up nicely ..

The Wisconsin Lie Exposed - Taxpayers Actually Contribute Nothing To Public Employee Pensions
2/25/2011 @ 11:56AM |396,347 views

PAGE 3 ..

But is this the fault of the state employees? The pension agreements are the result of collective bargaining. That means that the state has every opportunity to properly calculate the anticipated lifespan and then add on some margin for error. What’s more, the losses taken by the pension funds over the past few years can hardly be blamed on the employees.

Take a look at what Sue Urahn, an expert on the subject at the Pew Center on the States, has to say about this when describing the $1 trillion gap that existed between the $2.35 trillion states had set aside to pay for employees’ retirement benefits and the $3.35 trillion price tag of those promises.at the end of 2008-

"To a significant degree, the $1 trillion reflects states’ own policy choices and lack of discipline:

• failing to make annual payments for pension systems at the levels recommended by their own actuaries;
• expanding benefits and offering cost-of-living increases without fully considering their long-term price tag or determining how to pay for them; and
• providing retiree health care without adequately funding it"

Via Pew Center on the States
.. http://www.pewcenteronthestates.org/report_detail.aspx?id=56695

That is the point. While the governor of Wisconsin is busy trying to shift the blame to the workers in an effort to put an end to collective bargaining, the reality is that it was the state who punted on this – not the employees.

Further, by the state employee unions agreeing to the deal proposed by Walker on their benefits (as they have despite Walker’s refusal to accept it) they are taking on much - and possibly all – of the obligation out of their own pockets.

As a result, the taxpayers do not contribute to the public employee pension programs so much as serve as insurers. If their elected officials have been sloppy , the taxpayers must stand behind it. But if the market continues to perform as it has been performing this past year, don’t be surprised if the funding crisis begins to recede. If it does, what will you say then?

Contact Rick at thepolicypage@gmail.com

link to page 1 .. http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2011/02/25/the-wisconsin-lie-exposed-taxpayers-actually-contribute-nothing-to-public-employee-pensions/




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