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We can also relate the "Gov policies bankrupting patriotic businesses" very well to FnF.
Essentially FnF are highly successful US companies supporting the US economy and US jobs. Without FnF it would have been very difficult to stabilize and revive the economy. Instead of rewarding FnF for serving the nation, Gov is punishing FnF and bankrupting the companies in support of multinational global companies who caused 2008 crisis through reckless practices.
One simple thing Gov can also do is to ban betting against important American companies and businesses. Short selling is one the WMD used against such companies and Gov should make sure that short selling does hurt important American companies and businesses.
MannSinger,
You are 100% correct. Because of Gov policies, bankruptcy is the cost for being patriotic. Even when businesses want to make in USA, buy made in USA, and hire US workers, Gov policies have made it impossible for these businesses.
Hope DJT will correct this corruption.
One needs to take broader approach to understand the problem.
There were many many deep rooted causes. 2008 housing crisis was one symptom. One should read FCIC report to understand some of these causes.
2008 Crisis was just waiting to happen with decades of mis-steps at public/monetary/regulatory policy level, multi trillion dollar wars, fraudulent practices at private institutions, consumers using home as ATM machines, highly leveraged public and private business models...
In addition bad economic policies, unfair trade and immigrant policies, wholesale outsourcing of manufacturing and service jobs combined with massive influx of immigrant workers made American workers jobless and without income. This resulted in few well connected, powerful and rich accumulating massive wealth while the income for the rest stagnated, declined or vanished.
US became mainly a consumer nation with borrowed money, cheap imports of goods, services and labor. People in charge were clueless and continued to believe that the good times will some how last forever and problems will self correct and resolve on their own.
In a free market economy, problems should self correct continuously without big crisises. But it was free market only in name. Over a period of time, it became rigged to benefit the few well connected, powerful and rich during good times as well in bad times. These people made tens of billions during good time and hundreds of billions during bad times.
Below is the template of the message to Mnuchin, please comment if it can be improved
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Dear Honorable Secretary Mr Mnuchin,
Below is a well written article that speaks from Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac (FnF) shareholders point of view.
Currently all stakeholders including FnF shareholders (pref. and Common) have very high hopes from DJT administration and especially from you to resolve these long pending conservatorship issues in the best interst of all stakeholders.
Other hopes are court rulings and these may not be the best optimal solutions for any of the stakeholders. In this regard please resolve conservatorship issues in the best interst of all stakeholders including FnF shareholders as soon as possible.
With best regards,
FnF Shareholders
Sounding The ‘Alarm’ on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac
Thomas J. Lauria, Contributor
Investment professional and author, “The Fall of Telecom”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/sounding-the-alarm-on-fannie-mae-and-freddie-mac_us_595fc0fce4b08f5c97d06936
*** Send a message to Mnuchin ***
Below is a very good article that speaks from shareholders point of view.
Those who are not articculate or do not have time, they can send such artcles to Mnuchin with a note.
Sounding The ‘Alarm’ on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac
Thomas J. Lauria, Contributor
Investment professional and author, “The Fall of Telecom”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/sounding-the-alarm-on-fannie-mae-and-freddie-mac_us_595fc0fce4b08f5c97d06936
************** Send a message to Mnuchin ******************
https://www.treasury.gov/connect/Pages/Message-to-the-Secretary.aspx.
************************************************************
It is plaintiff's response to stupid filing by FHFA.
Is not FHFA wasting taxpayers time and money by filing stupid court filings?
rek, thanks for your view.
There is a simple principle to find out whether managers are responsible for the fraud.
If it happens rarely with few low level employees acting on their own then managers are innocent. Otherwise managers are responsible. It is the job of the managers to make sure that low employees do not violate laws.
rek,
Please read:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernard_Madoff
"After Madoff's arrest, the SEC was criticized for its lack of financial expertise and lack of due diligence, despite having received complaints from Harry Markopolos and others for almost a decade."
If SEC can be criticized for its lack of financial expertise and lack of due diligence, then what about people who only study law?
"Judges definitely understand white collar crimes."
rek,
You are once again making up this. There are many glaring examples where the regulatory agencies were unable to detect frauds even when pointed out by experts. How could these Judges (mostly attorneys by profession) understand hundreds of other professional complexities.
Foe example SEC could not catch Bernie even when some one brought it to attention of SEC. Greenspan publicly admitted that he could not understand some of the complex of derivative business. In such situations how could a Judge write a well reasoned ruling.
If congress and administration choose to ignore the rights of the people, then courts can not do anything about it. In the case of FnF all the three branches of Gov and also independent Gov agencies (FHFA, SEC, Fed ...) choose to ignore the rights of the FnF shareholders during previous administrations.
The best hope for FnF shareholders is new DJT administration and SCOTUS. The hopes of getting any relief from Congress or lower courts is very low.
For the system to work as intended all three branches of Gov and independent Gov agencies have to be really independent. Judiciary is not really independent as Judges are appointed through political process and judges depend on other two branches for their career advancement. Same also holds true in case of independent Gov agencies.
FHFA seems to be the worst example for how independent Gov agencies should work and it can not go any lower.
"no the judicial bar is 100% of the explanation so far "
Marbury v. Madison (1803)
"It is emphatically the province and duty of the judicial department to say what the law is. Those who apply the rule to particular cases, must of necessity expound and interpret that rule. If two laws conflict with each other, the courts must decide on the operation of each."
—Chief Justice John Marshall
In general, no one is immune from Judicial reviews and judicial injunctions/orders.
Courts may allow exceptions based on merit of the case and refrain from interfering in genuine business decisions or executive decisions. Same things should apply to HERA and FnF Conservatorship.
Business decisions or executive decisions that involve lack openness, lack of tranparency, conspiracies, collusions, abuse of authority, violation of laws and self dealings are not such exceptions that deserve judicial immunity.
Clearly Judge Brown did not agree with FHFA's interpretation of HERA in Perry's appeal case and most probably SCOTUS will agree with Judge Brown.
Claiming broad and blanket immunity under HERA is clear violation of constitutional principles of checks and balances, separations of powers and bill of rights... Only in autocratic or despotic, tyrannical, dictatorial, totalitarian, autarchic; undemocratic countries such immunity exists.
In the beginning, Plaintiffs made the cardinal mistake of not challenging HERA under the U.S. Constitution. Recently filed court cases challenge HERA seeking "DECLARATORY AND INJUNCTIVE RELIEF" under the U.S. Constitution. It will be very interesting to see how FHFA Conservator will try to defend broad and blanket immunity under HERA.
"It's hard to prosecute when they didn't commit a crime... "
Then why did the FIs pay billions in fines and penalties.
Basically there was no separation between regulators and regulatees, or prosecutors and prosecutees because of revolving doors. It is the same people working on both sides helping themselves (self dealing) like SPSPA/NWS.
They come from and go back to the same companies/industries whom they were regulating or prosecuting.
FnF conservatorship is a unprecedentedly massive white collar crime that is matched only by the equally massive white collar crime by loan/PLMBS originators and rating agencies leading up to 2008 crisis.
The greatest irony is, it is the same foxes that are playing dominant role in trying to reform/fix housing finance and GSEs, and protect taxpayers from FnF and FnF shareholders.
rek, thanks, good response.
Judges lack expertise to understand complex white collar crimes. That is why no one was prosecuted for 2008 crisis. Same is true in FnF case.
In FnF case Judges not only lack expertise but also lack willingness to see the inconvenient real truth when presented during day light.
It really requires honest, brave and patriotic judges to rule in favor of powerless FnF shareholders and against all powerful vested bureaucrats. Can any one imagine what would have happened if big investors were not to sue the FnF conservatorsip?
It is better to have some hope in DJT administration and elected representative than politically appointed Judges. This is a mess created by the previous administrations using mostly unsuspecting lawmakers.
"No. There is really no value in posting or reading this message board either. I personally only do it for fun and as a hobby. Otherwise I would have just been holding this stock for the last decade and that would be boring."
It clearly shows up in some of your esoteric arguments.
There is no better source than this message board for FnF related matters.
Tim is very good in FNMA matters and financial technical analysis.
But not a expert in financial forensic analysis and legal matters.
FnF conservatorship is a unprecedentedly massive white collar crime protected by courts using HERA, lack of transparency and openness. If FnF conservatorship were to be run by private parties, all Gov agencies would have been chasing them to the end of the earth.
It requires expert forensic analysis to understand the crime committed by the past FnF conservators and public officials from previous administration. Many times Tim tries to be politically correct and limits the discussion on some topics. This is where Tim falls very much short.
Judges are busy with their careers or returning the favors.
DJT administration is a better hope than courts.
FHFA is doing the bad things for the people in power.
These people provided bar on judicial review so that FHFA can do bad things with impunity.
Do you have any additional information?
Why have you suddenly turned pro FnF?
It is shocking that FHFA and its private attorneys have stooped to such low levels. FHFA is no less than a RICO organization to come up with such anti-public arguments.
Power tends to corrupt and absolute power has corrupted FHFA absolutely.
It is time to abolish FHFA. FnF should be regulated just like any other private finance/insurance companies using State corporate laws.
Wherever and whatever bureaucrats have tried to do is total failure and is waste of tax payers money. DC bureaucrats only know how to create more problems at the cost of public. Any continued fraudulent conservatorship will cost the nation dearly.
It is small investment of no significance.
'Buffets motto? "Be Greedy when Others are Fearful" '
These one liner stock tips are just for public consumptions.
All these big investors have their insider sources or they use lobbyists to influence the decision makers. He is no saint or investment wiz. Most of the time, the large liquidity position helps them besides their old boys club connections.
Besides NWS, one should also consider general agreement amongst all that FnF needs to be fixed rather than be replaced. These is the final rational agreement after all "bridges to nowhere" proposals. Lawmakers are aware that courts may claw back NWS (spoils of conservatorship) payments.
Gov explicit guarantee proposals are DOA. The mortgage system has worked without Gov explicit guarantees for decades. The 2008 problems were due to fraudulent practices by loan originators. Any system is vulnerable to fraudulent practices. So reforms should focus on preventing frauds.
It is just a reasonable inference.
Casual use of bad language does not make it any better.
It only suppresses free exchange of views.
These people are the most dishonest people.
WC seem to be two jesters keep on appearing on stage whenever FnF PPS goes up.
These banksters just want to make more profits at the cost of borrowers. The main problem is these banksters control the lawmakers and Gov.
Most likely Mel chickened out with the thought of dancing alone.
Anything is possible with fake conservatorship.
The current pps is based on this assumption.
So after confirmation it may go up little bit.
Is FHFA authorized to create such a fund?
There will be some more lawsuits.
wdereb79
I was not referring to you. I was referring big short traders.
"That case rulings should be binding on lower judges is based on the legal doctrine of stare decisis."
Who cares about the stupid doctrines if it is not in the constitution..
"The legal system has ALWAYS worked this way since the American Legal system was founded. So you are wrong."
You are 100000000000% wrong.
To begin with, founders wanted legal system to be simple to be understand by all and so they made it constitutional right to demand jury trial consisting of fellow citizens. Also in the beginning they did not have countless confusing case laws created by courts.
So the current legal system is not same as it existed when it was founded.
It has become old and antiquated.
It appears that these people work in concert with short traders.
The moment these people come up with any stupid bill, traders bring down the price to highlight the bill. Another "Dog and pony show"?
It is not even few lawmakers, It is just two lawmakers who have shorted FnF. Any proposal is DOA.
CNBC:
"A Republican and a Democrat team up to split Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac"
It is not congress, it is few lawmakers who have made short bets on FnF.
They are trying to attribute it to congress to gain respectability. In 10 years congress has refrained from doing anything because there is nothing to do.
This is the game they have been playing with FnF to make money on short bets.
Rek,
Where in the constitution it says that the case laws should be binding on judges?