Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
dbth0,
PP stated earlier that he was taking a break from the boards, as I imagine many are.
ne14, last I checked, had his status changed...click his profile.
Right...therefore, if they make up their own shares, when the exchange move occurs my shares will still be safe. Right?
something seems wrong with that. If the employee has certs, why wouldn't Paul just give the guy .02/share for the certs and transfer them in person using the TA? Why go to the open market? That doesn't make sense to me...
47K shares traded in 2 hours? I dunno, maybe it's just me, but that doesn't sound like a floodgate
my source tells me pigs are flying out of my butt and Ray Charles just arose from the dead and ate George Bush's head from 100 yards using a night scope and a go-go-gadget fully-capped jaw of whoop-ass
'kay, just needed to get that out...feel much better now.
hehe, funny...
market makers can margin it, but if I did not purchase my shares on margin, how can they margin my shares out?
IGTN is also not a marginable security with E*Trade. Let it be known from here out that I DO NOT BUY on margin, EVER. But especially with the pinks (even if I could, which I can't), because that is just a disaster waiting to happen. You'd get margin calls 10 times a day...
dilute at the top, buyback at the bottom....don't I keeping seeing posts about "buy low, sell high"...well if anyone is in a position to do so...
Cowboy, do you believe that a cash account will be immune to the 'naked short share vacuum'?
I know, my message was referring to margins in general. But I have heard that some people with certain financial standing with E*Trade are allowed to margin on pinks. Haven't verified that.
Regardless, I suggest everyone call their brokerages (including E*Trade) and ask the same question I did. I'd be interested in seeing if the response is the same between customer service reps ;)
right, Cowboy...I was aware of that. I've never purchased any stock on margin, I've always used available cash.
dude, you got the SEC and the NASD to go to bat for you?
Dang, I gotta hang with you more often. Think they can get my ILE and IGTN money back? ILE is getting sued and Sand is a non-public expletive.
and, if I recall correctly, if you buy on margin and your stock price dips below a certain percentage of your buying price, E*Trade reserves the right to force a margin call...it's in the margin account agreement form.
also, do you have alot of money and have an incredible credit standing with E*Trade?
I tried to margin it once and the system wouldn't let me do it.
I'm interested in hearing this....will you tell us the whole story?
about naked shorting:
I just got off the phone with E*Trade. This is what they told me:
E*Trade will not margin stocks that are under $3/share. Because of this, you cannot margin trade those securities AND THEY CANNOT LEND YOUR SHARES OUT. I asked him point blank: is there any risk whatsoever that if there is a forced cover due to an exchange move, that I may lose my shares? He replied "No, absolutely not...not with the stock you are referring to." (PBLS in this case) This is a *company* policy however, and other brokerages may allow you to margin whatever you want.
In addition, he told me that there have been instances where shares were lost due to naked shorting. It can happen on margin trading accounts, but again, only if the brokerage margin trades the security.
He also said that there have been reports in the brokerage, but many of them were speculation and verification was challenging...
now you (board in general, that is) understand why I was upset on Wednesday and why I feel marginally better as of last Friday.
sure I might...but again that's conjecture. We don't know that is actually what is happening.
I have no reason to doubt that, but what makes you so sure? I'm not bashing the company, but some of us learned the real hard way that management will say whatever they want over the phone, and not a word of it needs to be true.
I would like to believe that, of course, and it would make sense given the PRs, but there is no way to verify that at this time.
well, I don't know the correct answer, nobody does. But there are a lot of factors that could have contributed, none of which are verified whatsoever:
1) many pinkers sell on good news (we did see a small move up to .022 that day)
2) the company is diluting
3) the MMs really *are* naked shorting
4) the sentiment that began with a lousy PR when the Progas closing was announced (the non-dangling carrot came a couple days later) is continuing
5) alot of sub-penny folks are still selling shares
6) sentiment surrounding the BrassBulls involvement is scaring people off
7) alot of high-profile members of the boards bailed, and that scared people off
8) bad bad bad PRs prior to last Friday scared people off, but they want to return and are waiting until they see some support to buy back in (which may be happening today, who knows)
9) hundreds of other reasons, I'm sure
welcome to the board...there are no details whatsoever except in what people have heard over the phone. nothing verified....
The details of the Progas deal, while having a few almost hidden gotchas, were not a dangling carrot. If Progas has audited net profit of $400K for FY 2005, and Phoenix paid in restricted and preferred shares, and is paying 'in installments' (whatever that means), that does mean that at least they have a company in the black in their arsenal. And I can't imagine Progas would've agreed to the acquisition if Phoenix was a chump company, unless Progas believed they were going down for the count...
No, last Friday's PR was the first carrot in the mouth, so to speak...I hope we'll have more.
they also could not afford to lose investor buying interest...a R/S would certainly do that
well, there are a few missing...so far PBLS has not reported any debt. Progas apparently has close to $400K/year net profit. If Phoenix wanted to maintain shareholder confidence, they could indeed support a buyback, which they already PR'd that they would do (even if PR'ing something like that in the pinks doesn't mean they'll actually do it)
to me one thing seems clear: with all the positivity that management has been putting out via phone calls, if they announce a R/S that will be the sure sign of a scam.
let's hope that day never comes...
yep, read the article. Karl isn't convinced how rampant it is. And neither am I. If Phoenix is being naked shorted, all they have to do to prove it is ungag the TA and let us find out for ourselves. Karl did mention that cash accounts will not fall victim to failed deliveries, but margin accounts do. So, perhaps it's time to convert our margin accounts to cash accounts. No biggie...
About the Global Links affair...I imagine one reason naked shorting is kept sort of legal is that if a company bought the entire outstanding share base and pulled its certs, and nobody naked short sold, the stock price would shoot to infinity because nobody would be able to buy a share at any price. If MMs can't naked short at least a little, that volatility becomes boundless, and it keeps companies from raping investors with a barbed-wire pole.
As far as PBLS, Phoenix has not released financials of any kind, and MMs are probably more attracted to shorting companies with no audited financials to back up their share price. I'll bet they're even more attracted to companies that have absurd PRs, which we have seen many of in the past 4 months. Also, so many companies like Phoenix go through reverse splits prior to filing that many MMs think it's a matter of time before the price gets so absurdly low that a buyback can happen without denting their pocket change.
If Phoenix is really earning the kind of money that merits a much higher stock price, let them prove it by issuing audited financials (and the Progas ~$397K net is not sufficient), and maybe even moreso by issuing a dividend.
Much of the buying in the past 4 months has been due to sentiment resulting from dangling promises. And every promise that is sort of half-met is followed immediately by another promise (in a couple months everything will be great! just wait a little longer...etc).
Phoenix obviously needs acquisition capital. AND THAT'S FINE. I don't mind companies diluting for capital provided their acquisitions have merit. Progas? Well, since everything appears to be debt free (though most of us missed the 'in installments' clause in the PR, which essentially means debt), and they will be a great resource for inside cost elimination, I'd say at the outset that it was probably a good move for them. However, the market seems to have echoed a sentiment I started making to myself a couple weeks ago: is Phoenix really for real or not, cause we're not convinced.
And I refuse to believe that a company with no profits or booming revenues to report (cause ya'd think they'd report it if it was there) has a low PPS because of naked shorting exclusively. Unless, of course, the MMs know the company is full of it and are naked shorting the snot out of it because they know they'll never have to cover...
I guess we'll see ;)
bereal,
I've heard many people mention this...but as of yet nobody has ever given some concrete and well-documented examples of this. Can you offer some?
thanks,
griz
there is a provision in the SEC guidelines that basically allows naked shorting on smallcaps and non-reports. I forget the link but it's either on the IGTG board somewhere or on this board somewhere.
But would a broker like E*trade suffer from this? I can't imagine E*Trade would not be able to give out certs even if there was a ton of naked shorting
This is the highest volume we've seen since September 21st
I believe his status has changed....check his profile.
Honestly, I'm not sure you can force one any other way....at least not in the pinks. In the upper exchanges I believe the SEC can step in and do something. There have been other companies who I'm convinced short sold themselves and then drove the price down via R/S to allow themselves to cover. I do not believe that will happen here, however...
At this point it's irrelevant since they can still naked short it. It becomes important when going to a new exchange and everyone has to cover their positions. If PBLS can pull that off, it's likely you will see an upward correction provided the MMS haven't covered by then.
I was posting that as a favor for another poster (see message I replied to). I wasn't posting it to re-iterate or bash, because I don't bash this stock. I'm sure you are right and everything will be updated.
you can find it in several places in the history...but to save you the trouble:
https://esos.state.nv.us/SOSServices/AnonymousAccess/CorpSearch/corpActions.aspx?CorpID=178744&CorpName=PHOENIX+ASSOCIATES+LAND+SYNDICATE
brassbulls:
Needs a proofreader. if you google search "phoenix associates land" on news.google.com today you'll see the following article:
http://www.biotech-intelligence.com/html/html/f1f4645cceaae6f6a7ebfd33850279d9.html
At the end is the disclaimer which mentions Phoenix and not Nanologix:
Those statements include statements regarding the intent, belief or current expectations of Phoenix Associates Land Syndicate, and members of its management as well as the assumptions on which such statements are based.
OOPS.
The amount of immaturity on this board is absurd. This is supposed to be a place where people come to offer information and insight, strategies and tactics, experience and (supposedly) fun.
I paid for membership here because when I first got into PBLS, AMEP, IGTN, AAPL and a few more, this was a great place to discuss things. People could bring hope, doubt, experience, newbie questions, news, funny and apropo links, and even potentially damning info, without getting attacked, banned, insulted or childlike. I found it to be an invaluable resource for information that was both encouraging and discouraging.
Some of us went to great lengths to dig up some information on this company...information that is public, in writing, and cannot be scrutinized by opinion or rumor. What we found was less than satisfactory. So some of us decided to let the rest of the investor community know because as shareholders we felt the company needs to answer to these questions. There is NOTHING, and I mean NOTHING, wrong with that attitude. Bringing someone to task is always positive.
Some people should have thanked us for this. Instead, we got brutally attacked by bloodthirsty pump-whores. What has happened to all of you? Even some of the people I respect on this board looked like high school kids last week.
I never thought iHub would turn out like RB. I guess I was wrong. Shame on all of you for bringing this kind of boneheaded mentality to this board, and shame on the rest of you for not trying to put a stop to it.