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Moskowitz has NOT given me the #. I never talked to the guy or even tried to talk to SM, MM/ IR or anyone connected with the company. Period.
In July 2009 there was 722m O/S per the PR.
You can point to no document whatsoever that proves that the O/S were over 2 Bil. in Aug. If you can, what is it??
Hang in there Drew.
Again, that is not what I asked. Please read my post again. I would really appreciate it. Thank you.
To begin with there is nothing I have said directly or have implied as to label you as anything. I am trying to honestly reply to your posts. I hope you understand that.
To begin with the A/S has nothing to do whatsoever with the float. Period. The float has everything to do with a portion of the O/S which are available to trade on the open market.
In July we knew that there was 722m O/S. And based on the various calculations people have made starting from there, and subtracting the RME shares of 277m, that would give us 445m shares. Subtracted from that would be those shares owned by SM/MM, the 18m+ shares, leaving 427m. Then we have the shares of DF's mgmt group of 41m, leaving 386m. Then if we count the 300m shares DF says he owns we get down to 86m shares. Give or take. Some say the float is 149m. If we go by what I indicated the approx. float # is 86m. Other people have their calculations, I know spongeboy, or z or carp had their own. This is just my estimate.
Plus we cannot forget the 7/27 spng PR indicating the buyback of up to 150m shares thru 9/5. We do not know the outcome of that. The company would be buying back O/S from the market at market prices.
So, whether the float is 86m or 149m, in between, or less due to spng's buyback program, The point is that the volume traded in 1 day is normally more than the float.
So does it make any sense to you that 100% or more of the float would be traded day after day after day. That is just not possible. So that is where these air shares come in to play. There are supposed to be over 1 Bil. of such, and that would account for the high volume daily.
I hope this answers some questions for you. Remember for sure that the A/S has absolutely nothing to do with the float.
IMO. Spino
Fire Lane: I would very much appreciate a reply to my post to you #217229 from yesterday, which you may have gone to bed before seeing it.
To refresh your recollection, you ADMITTED that you POSTED that there was a secret SEC investigation as to spng PRIOR to EITHER the SEC announcing it and PRIOR to when spng announced it in its 8K.
So my question is does such an admitted PUBLIC DISCLOSURE of an SEC investigation in ADVANCE of when it is generally known to the public such as you did violate any SEC rules or regulations or any other nondisclosure provisions of the SEC??
Thank you in advance for you reply. Kindly, Spino
Peace and Serenity
Why would or should spng or the SEC show its hand as to the NSS?
The investigation gives the SEC subpeona power and all focused parties will find out in due time.
That each day or every two days the volume exceeds the float should be a telling sign of NSS verifiable from company records of the float.
Plus the upcoming 10K when filed would include the O/S number giving pause to a lots of folks I would think if what ERIC71 is correct as to his conversation with SM yesterday.
JMO. spino
I completely disagree with you as to SM.
If you separate out the "OR OTHER PERSONS" from the rest, then if sould become clear. that is why the, IMO, the and/or phrasing is included. The securities laws violations does not have to be by the company. spino
Eric71: I've been out, trying to catch up on posts, and finding your GEM here. This is great news.
And goes along with what I have been posting is my supposition as to both the reason for the SEC thing and that the O/S will be 500m. I already believed the O/S figure.
THANK YOU!!! Peace and Serenity to all longs!!! Spino
FIRE LANE: You missed my point altogether. My point is that you admitted that you POSTED that there was a secret SEC investigation as to spng PRIOR to either the SEC announcing it or PRIOR to 9/18 when spng announced it in its 8K.
So, my question was does such an admitted PUBLIC DISCLOSURE of an SEC investigation in advance of when it is generally known to the public under the above circumstances violate any SEC rules or regulations?? Spinoi
And you are saying that pre-announcing a secret SEC investagation in a public forum prior to either the SEC making it public or in this case on 9/18 when spng put it in its 8K is within the SEC rules and regulations, and not outside any of the SEC rules and regulations?
Fire Lane: So your answer seems to be yes. Then my question is didn't you then post on a public forum the existence of a secret ongoing SEC investigation prior to either the SEC or spng in its 9/18 8K announcing it? Spino
Did you post prior to 9/18 on iHub that spnge would be investigated by the SEC?
Sales figures for spongeboy square pants in Canada won't come out until 1qtr 2010, in the 10Q. The 10Q is NOT audited FYI. Spino
question: What would be different of a post from Alfie then the recent informative post by no_BS. IMO no_BS can provide more factual information about what is happening than could Alfie. In the end neither knows what's going on. But no_BS has some actual experience in this area. JMO. spino
WEll said. In addition, Metter is already wealthy as he apparently has some clothing business. Spino
Nice to hear from you. Good luck to spnge.
Thank you for your post. I believe no_BS's analysis of the situation as being accurate, and right on the money as far as I am concerned. He has daily experience in these matters more than anyone else on this board. I trust him. I do not trust the naysayers. That is JMO. I am holding long. period. And will not be scared out of my shares.
Pease and Serenity. Spino
no_BS: GREAT POST. This is absolutely one of the best informative posts you have made. And one that us longs desperately need right now to quell the fear, confusion, anxiety over the SEC investigation and negative posts from the naysayers. Thank you for setting the record straight and setting for some facts here Peace and Serenity. Spino
AB: Thank you very much. Spino
What are your facts, please? Point to some filing. Or other spng PR. Thanks.
You are confusing A/S as to the SOS with O/S. You have to understand what you are talking about before replying: A/S vs O/S.
They said they were going to reduce it to 30% below 722m per the 7/27 PR. Never has 300m been said by the company. You made that up.
You have NO facts to back up this statement. None. And I don't know why you would post numbers for the O/S that you cannot not personally verify.
Thank you very much.
If you posted on a public message board any information directly connected with any SEC investigation -- meaning evidence or facts, or knowledge of the circumstances, etc.--I don't think the SEC would think kindly of that at all. SEC Investigations details are supposed to remain nonpublic until completed.
Thus, whatever it is that you are posting is, IMO nothing to do with the facts or circumstances of the SEC investigation of spng "or other persons."
You have NO facts whatsoever to back up that statement. And if you do out with them now. If not, let's wait for the 2009 10k.
GG: I am not afraid at all. From the information we know thus farm and reading the 8K, it would seem that spng may have asked for the SEC to step in for deal with with shorts.
I personally so not think MM/SM violated any securities laws. They have well paid securities lawyers to advise them properly. They have D&T coming onboard for the 10Q.
spng has spent millions on worldwide advertising, not the kind of thing you would expect from a scamming co.
I think the hedge funds involved in creating air shares and key employees will get subpeonas, as well as their mm's, along with all kiond of records.
I am holding. I do not care what happens to the pps this week or next. I'm here for nasdaq, basedon spng's fudamentals which have not changed one bit -- except to get stronger.
We'll see when reaudit is done and 10ks are filed.
Holding strongm completely without fear!!! Spino
If that's what you believe OK. LOL!!
But I believe the O/S the 3rd week of Aug. was 722m shares, or less, bgecause at the end of July the # was 722, then mgmt. increased its buyback program ended 9/5, to get the O/S down to 500.
The 10K for 2009 will reveal the real number.
The A/S # has no direct relationship the the O/S. The 10K could still show the O/S count at 500-550m, with the A/S at the 3 Bil. The A/S are neither issued nor outstanding. I will wait for the 10k ro see what it show.
Look up A/S and O/S in wikipedia to understand the difference if that helps you.
Oh contrare. When spng comes knocking on the SEC's door and asks for and get an investigation into the existence of the hedge funds floating air shares, that give the SEC subpoena power to subpeona documents, records, cell phone records, messages, banking records, brokerage firm records, AND employees of hedge fund records pertaining to the massive amount of naked air shares which have been floating for so long, IMO. The SEC WILL use its subpeona power to investigate "other persons" for securities violations as stated in the 8K and not only the company.
This is a very good thing indeed, IMO. And if spng voluntarily submitted documents to SEC already, it could very well be its factual evidence of the air shares. I would not want to be anyone creating and shorting air shares in this stock at this time. YES, IMO the SEC investigation IS a good thing!!
Peace and Serenty. spino
IMO, S/Hs need to leave mgmt. alone to do its job of getting out the required reaudit and 10K filings. It does not need all of us S/Hs to waste their time right now, IMO.
The reaudit and the 10Ks will be done/filed when their ready and anything we say will not change that, IMO.
And, IMO the SEC investigation is a very good thing, as it gives the SEC subpeona power not only over spng, but also over the hedge funds., its employees (bashers?), and mm's, as thet pertains to shorted air shares. This could possibly end up to be the precipiateing event to expose the shorts, and cause a ss. JMO
Peace and Serenity Spino
How would you be aware or not if such a search warrant was served? Thanks in advance.
That sounds delightful. I'll be going over the spng posts over the weekend, and fretting about Monday's trading activity or not. I probably want to turn off my L2.
But I believe spng mgmt. will prevail with all of these roadblocks , beginning with the reaudit and filing of 2009 10K, announcing the O/S (500-550m shares), then the 10Q, moving past this SEC stuff, and on to bigger and better things, such as the nasdaq.
I still believe that SM/MM have not lied to us and are trustworthy until proven otherwise. Which I will see soon enough with the results of the SEC stuff.
bwog: JMO but I think you might want to be careful in using any criminal terms at all directed at anyone whatsoever with respect to anything to do with spng. Just a tip.
I do believe that the naysayers or anyone on Fri. and now do not have any important or real information or facts about the SEC investigation. For if they did they would not, as you are trying to say, post it on a public message board, for a variety of reasons.
Peace and Serenity. Spino
Thank you.
How do you know about the number of hedge funds shorting spng? Further, and even if are few those few can be responsible for the vast majority of the floating air shares of Spng.
Using the "other persons" language from the SEC investigation anouncement, I would think that the brokerage accounts and banking records of the hedge funds who floated the massive amount of air shares would be far more important than spng's, IMO. spino
You should know by now that it will be announced in the Subsequent Events Section of the 2009 10K when filed.
True GG, where there is smoke there is fire. That is the saying. However, you have to consider the source of the smoke and whether or not the fire was arson.
In my metaphor, IMO we have the fire in fact being arson caused by the naked shorts, continuing to float air shares for a long time now. The smoke are the smoke screens continually set up by the naysayers, bashers, trying to scare longs into selling the stock.
Further I do not personally believe that mgmt. would have released such a bold and direct PR on Fri. referring to the shorts and things written about the company if there were not in fact shorts.
As to the SEC investigation, although of course I will wait until the facts are disclosed, until then I believe spng is innocent of violations, and that the focus of the investigation is "Or others". JMO Spino