is...retired
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You clearly have no idea what dilution is. VRUS is an SEC filer. If it was selling shares out of the AS, there would be a filing. The OS is not increasing, so there is no dilution, period.
You might want to turn yourself into "Stock market, 101"
There is no one shorting a trip zero stock. First of all, no brokerage would let you. And who on earth would short a .0004 stock in the first place? At $2.50 per share margin, it would cost $2.5 MILLION dollars to short 1 million shares of this stock, and if it went to .0005 you'd be screwed. No one in their right mind would short a stock that can go up or down 25-50 percent in one click.
MM's of course, do short - but they generally cover within microseconds. If they don't cover by close of the day, THAT goes into the short interest column, which is reported twice per month to Finra. It is virtually meaningless - it cannot be used for ANY kind of leverage - it only indicates that the stock is trading.
911 trades are meaningless. It is simply MM's finishing filling an order. The OTC is fully automated - no one looks at these stock, and computers calculate the spread they set.
There are NOT MM reps signaling to each other for shares by the size of their trades. And, yes, MM's do trade at 5 digits, while we trade at 4.
There is nothing in that filing to indicate garnock's shares are now registered. But with a 7.5 B AS, the additional shares that ARE now registered can be used in acquisitions, etc. So, the registered shares are able to be sold by the company now.
Garnock's shares (ARJ) can not be sold until and unless his shares are registered. His personal shares, as well as his wife's shares are presumably registered, since they were acquired on the open market.
Expect to see another S1 around the end of November, when Garnock's note matures...
etrade is not suppressing the stock price. Anyone can buy the stock by simply making a phone call.
There is an issue that is a violation of etrade rules, which is why online purchases are not allowed right now. It is up to VRUS and possibly the TA to 'fix' that violation, if they want to remove the restriction.
I still suspect the sale of unregistered shares as the prime reason. That was illegal for many years, but the SEC has made some exceptions in certain cases. Garnock has unregistered shares, and etrade may not tolerate that. Who knows? It costs money to register shares, and VRUS/Garnock may simply not want to pay for it. What other reason could there be?
If anyone remembers when the restriction first showed up, we could track the etrade restriction against the filings to see if we could spot the cause.
That doesn't make sense - in an RS, your value does not change, but the share price is multiplied by the split ratio. And THAT is when it starts to drop.
I would never hold shares through a reverse split. At best, I would sell all, then wait for the split, then wait for the price to settle down, and THEN buy shares back if the price warrants.
In almost every case, after a RS, the price drops, sometimes significantly, right after the split. I have seen many of them, and have not seen even one that improved after the split.
In any event, most times the price drops some, and that is when I buy back in, usually able to get more shares than I would have had from the split alone.
Uplisting or not, people sell after a split and the price drops. Also, in an RS, the ticker changes to add a 'd' to it, and you cannot trade it until a few days after that change because it has to promulgate through the market first. In that split, ALL of your current shares are recalled, and NEW shares are given to you. The TA must recall all shares then issue the new ones, which takes time.
Yes, I know the S1 is effective. What I asked is how do you know Garnock's unregistered shares are now registered? I have seen no documentation on that at all.
It used to be illegal to sell unregistered shares. A few years ago, the SEC changed the rule to permit is in specific instances. I think Garnock fit the new rule and got unregistered shares. That 'might' be what Etrade is concerned about.
So, again, why do you think Garnock's shares are now registered?
Why do you think Garnock's shares are now registered? I didn't see anything about that.
You have to have a margin account in order to short. You have to have a LOT of money in the margin account if you do short. Lastly, none of the US brokerages will permit shorting penny stocks and foreign brokerages must follow US rules on US stocks.
Here is what etrade says:
Can You Short Penny Stocks on E*Trade?
Short selling of OTCBB and Pink Sheets on E*Trade is not allowed.
Those of you with other brokerages can ask yours.
Etrade sold that unit years ago...they no longer HAVE an MM unit. Geeze, catch up.
Etrade divested its MM unit years ago. They are not dealers, they are a brokerage.
It means nothing. MM's fill orders with the best price available, but often have 'leftovers' to complete an order. Since people buy and sell in even chunks, the leftovers are often similar.
The OTC market is fully automated, and there is no need for MM's to 'signal' each other about certain stocks.
Remember, MM's trade at 5 decimal places, we are at 4. They always get their commission, so what looks like even trades to you generally isn't actually.
I have not once claimed to know what the etrade issue is because I don't know for certain. I have only pointed out issues that 'could' be behind it. I have repeatedly said that volatility is one possible issue, and that the selling of unregistered shares 'could' be the issue. Or it could be none of the above. None of us know what it is, I have just been pointing out possibilities.
Under specific circumstances, unregistered shares can be sold. Easy enough to go read the rules. I posted the relevant ones. So, from what I can see, Garnock qualifies to buy unregistered shares by way of his wealth and experience. Hard to guess what Etrade thinks of this, but I would not be surprised if that was the issue.
Etrade no longer owns an MM unit, so they cannot 'manipulate' share prices, as you claim. They PROCESS your orders, then hand the trade off to the pool of MM's. (not just etrf)
Etrade doesn't care what any stock does. All they care about is that they make their commissions on all buys and sells. They make a lot more on agent transactions than online transactions. MM's don't care what any stock does either, unless it stops trading. Then they must 'make a market' by buying and selling among MM's to improve liquidity.
That is a blanket statement that is not true. But, Garnock's shares are not registered.
The SEC issues rules that all brokerages must follow. Each brokerage then issues its own rules which cannot violate the SEC rules, but control how that brokerage operates. It is obviously a brokerage (etrade) rule that is in violation, not an SEC rule (in my opinion).
Etrade has been fined by the SEC in the past, and may have specific rules related to that. Who knows, they don't post their rules.
What on earth? It SAYS in black and white that garnock, the buyer, understands that the shares are not registered, and cannot be sold unless the following conditions are met. The point is that Garnock is the owner of those shares, and they are not registered.
Unregisteres shares:
Unregistered shares have fewer investor protections and different risks compared to registered securities. As a result, companies can only sell unregistered shares to "qualified investors." Qualified investors consist of high-net-worth ($1 million or more) and/or high-income ($200,000 per year or more for individuals; $300,000 per year or more for married couples) investors that the SEC considers savvy enough to make such investments. In the past, soliciting or advertising unregistered shares was prohibited, but in 2013, the SEC adopted Rule 506(c) as part of the Jumpstart Our Business Startups (JOBS) Act, allowing certain unregistered securities to be solicited and advertised.
The sale of unregistered shares is typically considered a felony, but there are exceptions to this rule.
Again, I don't claim to 'know' the reason for the Etrade issue, but there ARE unregistered shares in Garnock's portfolio, and that 'could' be the trigger.
As far as etrade, each brokerage has its own rules, under the umbrella of 'protecting' investors. Just because one brokerage has a specific rule does not mean others do. For instance, at least one brokerage won't let you buy shares AT ALL if a company is pink stop. Etrade does not have that rule. But they obviously DO have one rule that is in violation, or online trading would not be halted.
I have read some of the etrade rules, but they are well buried. I know that stoppage of online trading can be caused by volatility, or by other financial transactions that are against their policy. I don't claim to know what the problem is, but it HAS to be something. It is possible that the TA is involved as well, since the TA handles all the shares. The TA is the one that controls the gates. Garnock's (and his wife's) shares are not registered, because the filing says so. The recent S1 was meant to register some shares, but it appears to me that they are not yet all registered. (Can't tell if Garnock's shares are being registered under the S1: (1,174,253,333 shares)
The shares of our common stock being registered hereunder are being registered for sale by the selling security holders named in the prospectus. Under Rule 416 of the Securities Act of 1933, as amended, the shares being registered include such indeterminate number of shares of common stock as may be issuable with respect to the shares being registered in this registration statement as a result of any stock splits, stock dividends or other similar event.
And, in the recent updates S1, it says:
Our Common Stock could be subject to extreme volatility.
The trading price of our Common Stock may be affected by a number of factors, including events described in the risk factors set forth and in our other reports filed with the SEC from time to time, as well as our operating results, financial condition and other events or factors. In addition to the uncertainties relating to future operating performance and the profitability of operations, factors such as variations in interim financial results or various, and unpredictable, factors, many of which are beyond our control, may have a negative effect on the market price of our Common Stock. In recent years, broad stock market indices, in general, and smaller capitalization companies, in particular, have experienced substantial price fluctuations. In a volatile market, we may experience wide fluctuations in the market price of our Common Stock and wide bid-ask spreads. These fluctuations may have a negative effect on the market price of our Common Stock. In addition, the securities market has, from time to time, experienced significant price and volume fluctuations that are not related to the operating performance of particular companies. These market fluctuations may have a material adverse affect the market price of our Common Stock.
We know VRUS is selling unregistered shares because of their filings. From the Garnock SC13DA of June 2019:
(g) Transfer or Resale . Buyer understands that except as provided in Section 5 hereof: (i) the Shares have not been and are not being registered under the 1933 Act or any state securities laws, and may not be offered for sale, sold, assigned or transferred unless (A) subsequently registered thereunder, (B) Buyer shall have delivered to the Company an opinion of counsel to Buyer, in a form reasonably acceptable to the Company, to the effect that such Shares to be sold, assigned or transferred may be sold, assigned or transferred pursuant to an exemption from such registration, or (C) Buyer provides the Company with other reasonable assurance that such Shares can be sold, assigned or transferred pursuant to Rule 144 promulgated under the 1933 Act (or a successor rule thereto) ( “ Rule 144 ”); (ii) any sale of the Shares made in reliance on Rule 144 may be made only in accordance with the terms of Rule 144, and further, if Rule 144 is not applicable, any resale of the Shares under circumstances in which the seller (or the Person (as defined below) through whom the sale is made) may be deemed to be an underwriter (as that term is defined in the 1933 Act) may require compliance with some other exemption under the 1933 Act or the rules and regulations of the SEC promulgated thereunder; and (iii) neither the Company nor any other Person is under any obligation to register the Shares under the 1933 Act or any state securities laws or to comply with the terms and conditions of any exemption thereunder. Notwithstanding the foregoing, the Shares may be pledged in connection with a bona fide margin account or other loan or financing arrangement secured by the Shares and such pledge of Shares shall not be deemed to be a transfer, sale or assignment of the Shares hereunder, and if Buyer effects a pledge of Shares, it shall not be required to provide the Company with any notice thereof or otherwise make any delivery to the Company pursuant to this Agreement including, without limitation, this Section 2(g).
Etrade is not the problem - selling unregistered shares is one of the problems. Etrade doesn't want to lose business, but there is a violation of some kind stopping online trading. It is not yet fixed. SOMEONE knows what the problem is - but they have chosen to proceed as is, for now.
No, etrade is not 'short'. Etrade no longer has an MM unit, it was sold 5 years ago. ETRADE IS NOT A TRADER!!! It is a brokerage. All their orders are handed off to MM's.
And, most likely, the Etrade issue will go away. I'm convinced the issue is unregistered shares, which we know is a rule trigger for some brokerages, and VRUS has been doing that.
Why don't you just read it? It is probably what has caused the Etrade issue. Selling unregistered sells is a problem, and the S1 is used to register them. But as far as I can tell, it did not cover all of them.
Quite simply VRUS has been selling shares that are not registered with the SEC. Even if they are given away, that is a problem. ALL shares are supposed to be registered in order to be tracked.
If he has shares, and they are not restricted, they are part of the float. In other words, if he can sell them on the open market, one of us could buy them, which means they are in the public float. If they are restricted, they can't sell them and we can't buy them.
No, no one is shorting these stocks. If you STILL believe people short penny stocks, which would make no sense in the first place (for reasons I have stated before), then just TRY to short 1000 shares and see what your broker tells you. Over the years, not ONE person has proven that they shorted a penny stock, although one person lied about it and provided no proof.
To short, you would need $2.50 PER SHARE in a MARGIN ACCOUNT. Don't have one? No shorting period. If you DO have a margin account, your brokerage won't let you short a penny stock.
If they WOULD let you short a penny stock, let's say VRUS, and you are willing to bet it would drop 5%, you would make a $$1.30 on 1000 shares, and that ONLY if it dropped that 5%. ($.026 X .05 X 1000= $1.30). To make that $1.30, you would have to pay for the stock and put up $250K in your margin account. In other words, you are betting a quarter million dollars to make less than $5...and that ONLY if it drops 5%. If it doesn't drop, you can lose big time.
If you used that $250K to BUY the stock instead, you would get 9.6M shares. If the share price dropped, you would not lose anything unless you sold at that dip. But if it increased 5%, you would be ahead $12,500 if you sold it.
So, let's see, put up a quarter mill to try to make $1.30, or buy shares instead and go for $12,500??
Penny stocks are very volatile, and no one in their right mind would even consider shorting one, if it was even possible. Oh, and don't tell me foreign brokers will do it - they won't. They have to follow the same rules as US brokerages. And NONE of them are going to do it without taking a higher commission than you are likely to even MAKE.
So, repeat after me - no one shorts penny stocks. No one shorts penny stocks. No one shorts penny stocks. Oh, then tell me the mm's short all the time. Yes, they do, but it is an automated trading system, and the cover usually happens in under one microsecond. Not one eye is on this transaction - it is all automated. How else would a handful of MM's process billions of shares per day among 10,000 companies?
Oops - Google changed my search term to venus… for verus, there is only verusspirits.com.
Small print on a big screen with 75 year old eyes...still should have caught that.
Here's a few more Verus websites recently minted...
venuscarerx.com
venusginseng.net
venushelps.com
venushomedecor.com
venusminifarm.com
venussecuritysolutions.com
venusvortex.com
I wouldn't make too much of it until Verus says something...
Institutional investors don't invest in penny stocks. They would have no clients if they did. Generally, institutional doesn't invest in anything lower than about $5, which usually means NYSE or NASDAQ.
There are two ways to reduce the OS - RS and buyback. A profitable company that can borrow millions of dollars is expected to pay the loans back with profit, not shares. Once the notes are taken care of, profit can be used to buy back shares. We will learn more near the end of the year when the notes become due. They can be paid, shares can be given out, or the terms can be renegotiated.
VRUS has already uplisted - I don't expect another uplist in the near future - it takes time and money to do so.
It's not a dumb question - it is simply a matter of timing. The systems are set to trade during public hours, anything after that is finished with a T-trade. You can buy just before close of market, and the system will try to fill your order right up to the close. In the process, the MM may be short (not necessarily) right at the close. They can then cover after hours. They actually have an extra half hour to clean up their business for the day.
They don't cover at the end of the month. The whole OTC market is fully automated, no one even looks at anything except the spread, adjusting as the market moves either way.
They cover in microseconds - at worst, at the close of the market if trading is right near the end. That's what most T-trades are about - covering at market close, or just after. (The market is open after hours for MM's, and some brokers...)
I have no idea where you are going with this, but if shareholders don't sell, the stock becomes illiquid, which means MM's will trade among themselves, which is mandated by law. That is what is meant by 'Making a market'. Or Market Maker. Or MM...
OTC companies with billions of shares in play are unlikely to go illiquid when there is a decent business plan in place and clear milestones being met, such as VRUS.
What you actually said is that if no one sells, MM's can't cover. That is not true. Especially since most of VRUS shares are held by 'outsiders', not IHUBbers...MM's can always cover if buying and selling is happening. If no one is selling, no one can BUY either.
I would not use NSAV and 'skyrocket' in the same message...they are antonyms..
Totally untrue. First of all, most of the shares are held by others than IHUBbers, so thinking you can 'team up' a bunch of ihubbers is a myth. Secondly, a lot of people try to 'protect' their shares by putting them up for sale at a high price. That's all MM's need - they either have to find shares that are for sale, or find them in a margin account.
They don't 'buy' those shares, they borrow them, then return them microseconds later. So, it is impossible to 'protect' shares by putting them up for sale. And, they only have to BE in a margin account even if not for sale. That's just how it works.
It is still old news, and etrade no longer buys and sells shares. They are a broker, and have no way to affect share prices. If they did, they would not be spending their effort in the OTC where there is literally no money to be made. Etrade makes its money on commissions now, at least in stocks.
The current issue between VRUS and Etrade has not been made public, so it is anyone's guess what the problem is. It could also involve the TA -
The most common reasons for stopping online buying is because of volatility, which does not seem the be the case here, and something that triggers a safety rule, such as selling unregistered shares, which VRUS HAS DONE, and may continue to do. VRUS and the TA need to get those shares registered. Obviously, if the 'problem' is fixed, the restriction will be lifted. VRUS doesn't seem to want to do what is necessary to lift the restriction. The reason for that is anyone's guess, too.
Old news. Etrade spun off their MM unit years ago.
There are also several hexagon holdings companies - some private, some public, some Canadian - As I said when he first mentioned hexagon holdings, he should have picked a name that has no duplicates. What a waste to pick a name that can result in bad links.