is... a buy and hold investor of dividend US and Canadian stocks
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but it all gotta go to the same place there bud.
listen, what baout these questions..
1. who are the customers for the ships buddy? THey gotta have buyers? ALl I read was JV agreements.. who are the buyers..?
2. same with ADA agreements.. worht nothing. We need contracts man.. firm contracts..
LOI's suck.
so you know more than the uN? LMAO>.. right
if I were an oil industry expert and felt that way I would buy this stock. I am not.. and I choose not to believe in one guy.. or one company. I just think that the article posted by JJ would be very informative.. that is ll.. better than I could come up with.
let me read it, then I will tell you what I think of it..
because that is what they are competing with.. that is the compteition.. it is a SWOT thing. You tend to oversimplify. They have to be competing with somebody.
It is likely not that simple... in the first place the spot price is the highest possible price they would get.
They are competing with exploration cost of $49. So they seem to have a huge advantage... that is what I was trying to research (whether that was true).. I could not really find an answer.
I was actually trying to be complementary to JBii.. not sure why you are so upset..
i know. I just posted that the $10 competes (or it seems to compete) with the $49 exploration cost... that was what I was researching..
help me to understand BRIG.. you don't care about what an objective report on the P2O industriy contains... you would rather just believe JBI. ANd the P2o industry as a whole has nothingto do with JBI. THe industry as a whole does not impact JBI, is that it? ANd lastly.. it is not reasonable to form an opinion on partial informationon JBI's machine..
makes sense to me.. lol ROFL.
Hi Guys I'm BACKKK .. good post JJ. I had a brief look and I must say it looks like the best objective research document on the P2O business I have seen. I took a couple of tries to research this to form a more informed opinion on JBII but really did not have any luck.
I found a couple of good posts on crude oil cost structures. I know that the "lifting cost" of a barrel of oil (the cost to get it to surface) is about $5. The transportation cost is $3 I think. Exploration cost is $49 or something ridiculous, which makes me wonder about JB and his oft-quoted $10 cost per barrel.
ANd I found a great link about varous kinds of transactions (spot contract etc.. )
Bottom line is although I could post a few things most people already know.. I can't really add to it.. don't know if JBII is for real or not.
I will read with interest..
yes it is great PR for them.
I got it!! Actually JB has a team of guys to do all his communications! He is not one guy, but 10! they all sit in a room and are on Facebook and gmail all day, typing messages and responses to all the investors. Yeah, that is the ticket.. LMAO.
I am not lazily pissing on JB or his company. I am making observations. If you are looking at a large number of stocks you must adopt a certain skepticism in order to make choices, that is not lazily pissing. In fact I think I am trying to be nice. If most published company information is positive, it may appear to be lazily pissing, but I am just making observations.
ANd when one does make a decision how sure can one be? It is bound to be made up if it is outside of company-supplied information.
If it is based on positive rosy company predictions, then one cannot be wrong.
so if people on this board are buying JB based on a belief on their rosy view of their future, you cannot be wrong.
Well congratulations then. I hope it works out.
well..i worked in a refinery.. anyway. what ever. You did not understand what i am saying. You are so trusting...
He can only produce small volumes at this time, or when the quote was made. THere is no data available to substantiate what he can do in large volumes, nor what refineries would do with large volumes.
I find it hard to believe that he will get WTI less $3. ANd if refineries are being nice in agreeing to buy his current (small) volumes then maybe they are simply being nice and that does not apply to larger volumes.
That is all i am saying..
when you are looking at hundreds of stocks the only thing you have to rely on is your life experience in industry and accumulated knowledge. Reading all the info available on a company is only the final step in a decision process.
My experience does not tell me that JBII is a good bet at this price at this time. Risk is too great.
If you want to view that as crap that is up to you.
I am not here to prove you wrong. I may play JBII on the ups and downs. I think it may spike again. like I originaly posted though.. i think it will head lower before spiking back up.
as much as he can produce is a small volume... JB cannot be accused of lying.
If i was short the market would take care of me. My posting here would make no difference. I am not short on jBII, nor do I know the other two posters, nor am I the other two posters.. sigh.
actually I am sitting in a winterized cottage north of ottawa on a really slow computer. I have no iinterest in shorting JBII, nor am I nieve enough to think that my posting here would make any difference to the SP. Just conversing about it. Not sure what kind of thoughts you are thinking though.. enjoy.
is it possible that stock promoters could buy this stock on the open market, then promote it and pull the same trick, all without the knowledge of JBII? Completely beyond the control of JB.
i have posted before that possibly what the CEO has said may be true if he is talking about small volumes with the refineries. this is meaningless in lterms of the LT business plan. Maybe the refineries are saying that to be nice to the little green environmentally friendly company.
WHen CEOs "lie" it can be a fine line. I am sure that John Roth (CEO NOrtel) made sure he could nbever be accused of lying. I worked in that company and knew that some people simply did not want to listen to bad news. I heard that about him. lo and behold the price was $120.
So no I am not accusing JB of lying, just saying that there should be some other reason to invest hard-earned money other than what a CEO says, like personal knowledge of an industry or something.
good post except that I would not agree iwth the comparison to biotech. From my knowledge of biotech, that is like a casino where lots of drugs are attempting to get something approved by the FDA ro whoever. once they get that (multi-year process) the winners get rich and the losers.. well..
I don't see it that way. If they are supplying crude oil to refineries they are competing with lots of other suppliers in a commodities market. THere are no big winners or losers, only steady profits.
I don't think we have enough information right now on the economic viability of this product iN LARGE VOLUMES. Not small lots as we have talked baout to date.
NOt sure the validation really answers the economic question.
IR people do not know anything. They are paid to trot out the company line.
As for JB, I have on experience with him personally and have made no attempt to communicate. ANybody that takes the time to do that is aces in my books.
But, I still say that any company source is suspect. Best to find some way to see this company vs others in a sector and make some kind of objective comparison. THey all have a golden story to tell, every single one of them.
AZD - hybrid drivetrains. electric vehicles. Diluted monster with great promise.
WPUR - water from air.
JBII - plastic to oil
check out the charts... all have spikes.
Great promise... no economic viability in the long Term.
well you can think that, because my view of the world is not as myopic as yours. I spend my time outside the ibox.
Speaking of which, what do you think of Diagnos?
btw, updates are incredibly important. i would say material. Most senior managers I know don't even have time to provide updates. I am one of the ones that tries to get progress from people. I can't imagine a person at that level reporting to individual investors... unimaginable.
Appreciate your feedback. Soldier on.
what kind of a CEO would spend time on Facebook? I can't get into hotmail and Yahoo at my work, much a social networkign site. and he is right, it is the public domain, hence dangerous for releasing material information.
bad day for JBI.. I may just buy a few shares!!! I think it will go lower though. Too much downward momentum, and likely crossing a threshold for uplisting?
I don't think so. I quote from a text book written by John Hull, a professor at the University of Toronto.
"Factors Affecting options Prices
There are six factors affecting the price of a stock option:
1. The current stock price
2. The strike price
3. The time to expiration
4. The volatility of the stock price
5. The risk-free interest rate.
6. The dividends expected during the life of the option."
From "Introduction to Futures and Options Markets", John Hull, Faculty of Management, University of Toronto, 1990, Chapter 8, p. 241.
It is numbers #1 and #3, as stated in a previous post. Stock prices move with Supply and Demand, therefore so do options.
Unlimited supply? Doubt it. For there to be a transaction, a buyer and seller must be available. For most penny stocks there is no options market. In Canada the only options market is in Montreal and they only trade mature stocks like Nortel (formerly) and Bombardier. No penny stock I have ever traded is options-eligible.
So I would wonder on what exchange options on JBII would trade.
those things are not true. Price is based on the price of the underlying security and the time to expiration date for the option. So if the price of the underlying security moves, the price of the option will move. Therefore if the price of the underlying security is based on Supply & Demand (which any stock is), then the price of the option can be viewed as being dependent to a large extent on Supply & Demand.
Prices are not fixed plus a premium.. since when? I have not looked at a textbook in awhile and do not trade options, but they are based on the price of the underlying security plus a time value for the time to expiration.
"Anybody can write them"? Since when? Like any transaction, for anything to happen there has to be both a Buyer and Seller. So for someone to create an option betting that JBII will go down, there has to be someone willing to make the same bet in the opposite direction and buy the option that the creator writes.
For most penny stocks there is no market for options hence options on them cannot trade. I am not sure how the US works, but in Canada the options exchange is in Montreal and the only options that trade on there that I used to know were solid established stocks like Nortel (.. not) and Bombardier. None of the Canadian penny stocks that I trade have an options market.
So I would bet that there is no market for options on JBII. Go ahead and create an option for JB... on what market do you intend to trade it and who is buying? that is why options are irrelevant for this stock.
well he might be a great guy but everybody at that level is at heart a businessman, and there is a certain ruthlessness there. He will do what ever he has to to get that stock price up to where he needs it to be to fulfill his greater plan, what ever that may be... only time will tell.
This whole situation is very much like another stock I followed for several years (uWink). That company had a visionary leader (nolan Bushnell) who was the founder of Atari and Chuck E Cheese. He also has had a number of total flops in his career as well. alot of people put their heart and soul into uWink (and their money unfortunately) only to lose it, or worse, to not have the guts when the time came to sell and lose everything.
Anyway you can do your DD and look that one up to find the parallels, but they are there. That business had fantastic business plans for expansion that the average person was liable to believe, it was only after a year of losses and futility that the truth became apparent. In both cases there was unwavering belief in a leader that in the end did not deliver as promised. Not by a long shot.
In that case they did a Reverse Split to get the stock onto another exchange, followed by an equiy offering. The equity offering was a total failure, s the offering price had to be so low as to make the targetted exchange unrealizeable. The stock then fell to pennies after loss after loss, no business plan that was credible, and no consistent business direction and strategy.
At present I see great promise and direcion and strategy, but it is not mature enough to really evaluate where it is at, especially not at this price. The viability of the P2O technology remains to be seen in hard evidence. Without that it lacks a real winner.
We will see as this unfolds.
anybody ever consider that al this publicity and PR is intended to raise the JBII stock price in order for it to qualify for a new exchange? How many times have we seen that game...
actually it is interesting that you should mention volatility, because i know someone who used to be an options trader, and he described to me a strategy based on the volatility of an option. I forget whether i was the option or the underlying security, but the whole strategy was based on the volatility ("vol") and not based on the (option or stock) price. In fact, price or price movement had nothing to do with it. I think it was the volatility fo the option (not the stock) and had to do with trading between the option and the stock itself. THere was a numerical measure fo this "vol". I do not think this would apply to this stock, as it is likely not option-eligible. I didn't understand the trading strategy described... I don't think it applies here becaue JBII is likelty not option-eligible.
it is getting out at a ridiculous loss that is the problem. Probably a Wall Street firm could not tolerate anything more than 10 or 20% loss. Big bucks usually do not do these penny stocks. Penny being less than $5, but still..
I actually agree with you about brokers in general. They are not any smarter than the average person who applies himself and the research they get is biased. But, I find it interesting that there is all this talk about shorting, when the basic point that this IS a negative signal gets missed. Their 3-minute analysis is about all it takes to form an initial opinion, which in this case was negative. Don't forget, these guys look at alot of stocks. In 3 minutes they can perform a series of quick checks that is pretty accurate.
i might add, this is the same way i do things. I have a series fo steps I do to take a quick evaluation of a stock. it takes a ew hours at most. I form an opinion. It may not be deep, but if you are looking at hundreds of stocks, it works. For one thing, if you use a stock screening tool it makes it easy to quickly look at large numbers of stocks and pick the best on parameters. After you have done that, you don't really need to know every last detail about a stock to put your money down. You have done a good analysis of a sector where you have experience or intuitive knowledge. And, I do find myself at odds with lots of posters on these boards, who know everything about a particular stock but can't see the bigger picture (that there is better out there)..
I know you know this, but I would trust that the fact that an initial look at JBII did not impress these guys is significant.
thanks for the information. that is an interesting link, but I think that is a very specific, and rare, situation. If a securities firm is doing an offering and decides to short the stock within a few days of the offering, well I can see how they can manipulate the price of the stock.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naked_short_selling
However, I do not see that this applies to this situation. In this case the brokers simply question the liquidity of the stock (their ability to cover the short sale). The basic premise that they believe it to be headed down is still true regardless.
without worrying about the technicalities or details... the basic point of shorting is to make profit from the stock going down. Is that not the case, regardless of whether or not it is naked or whatever. I have not picked up a textbook in 10 years (or more..) and I do not do options or margin selling, so I may not be aware of the details. But the basic point is these guys think it is headed down. Am I not correct?
so what you are saying is: the Wall Street boys think it is headed down... is that right?
so what is left, just the one restaurant in Hollywood Hills?
new to the board, just posting. interested in canadian high-tech stocks
anybody know anything about OCE - Open EC Technologies? it is on the TSX. it is an inactive company that has been doing something lately... not sure what. They sold off their revenue business (in China) last fall. No alarm bells, debt, etc...
hi. new to the board... My interest is in Canadian high tech stocks... I will have lots to say.
hi. New to the board. My interest is in Canadian high-tech stocks..
hello. new to the board. My interest is in Canadian high-tech penny and other stocks. I have been doing this for about 5 years now and have lots to say...
hi. New to the board. Interests are Canadian high-tech stocks...