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Great! Now look at the list of outstanding ICC warrants and let us know where on the list is Assad (the son) or Xi or Khameini, for that matter.
https://www.icc-cpi.int/defendants?page=0
Mostly, though, Israel bad.
You know I think Netanyahu belongs in jail, but the ICC is a joke. W Bush on the list for Iraq? Get real please, one can find shite on the internets to support any sort of nonsense
https://theflatearthsociety.org/home/
That was one of those “joking” things. Didn’t expect anyone would take it remotely seriously, but I guess I don’t know the room
Apparently, The Gaza Health Ministry is claiming that Israel shot down the helicopter and there were also 200 women and children from Gaza on board who died
Wtf? Do you not understand that I’m not criticizing Biden, that I’m describing criticism of him?
So, you’re not hearing Biden being called “genocide Joe”, because of US aid to Israel? That’s happening at places far removed from campuses, yet derive from the same precepts. The new twist on war casualties of calling them part of a genocide happens on this board, too.
Did America commit a genocide in Vietnam or Iraq? I still haven’t heard Russia’s war with Ukraine called a genocide. Was Britain accused of genocide in WWII? Assad? China? Crickets. See what I’m getting at?
I guess you’re not following what’s going on at college campuses.
There was a move to have her banned from Eurovision. And there was a move to have Israel barred from the Biannale in Venice, although you probably don’t know what that is. Do you not read posts before insultingly commenting on them?
I didn’t insult you, the other thing of worldwide belief is that you shoot before you look. What the fuck do you think divesting in Israel means?
Well, that’s a start, I’m sure everyone here is looking forward to the time when you pronounce various screeds as “anti-Zionist b.s”. Unless I’ve missed it already.
In other pop culture news, the Israeli contestant in the just completed Eurovision competition won the popular vote in 14 countries, including Australia. As I’m sure you know, there was a move to have her banned from the competition.
So maybe the idea of worldwide revulsion at all things Israel has been a tad overstated? If you’ve been fooled about this by social media, it’s understandable, with the emphasis on “you’ve been fooled”
Meanwhile, back in the real world, the Saudi Arabian-led coalition, using American made weaponry (including planes), has killed at least 20,000 civilians in Yemen and hundreds of migrants attempting to enter that country.
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/08/21/saudi-arabia-mass-killings-migrants-yemen-border
But, why should we care, it's not like American taxpayer dollars are going towards this, so not our problem:
https://magazine.columbia.edu/article/war-atrocities-yemen-linked-us-weapons
https://goodjobsfirst.org/this-is-how-american-taxpayers-subsidize-international-conflict/
https://www.nationalpriorities.org/pressroom/articles/2023/04/19/ordinary-americans-subsidize-military-industrial/
As of 2 years ago, must be more by now, can't really find more recent stats:
" According to the Yemen Data Project, the bombing campaign has killed or injured an estimated 19,196 civilians as of March 2022."
This is why we are seeing protests at various American universities calling for divestment in companies that deal with Saudi Arabia and an end to the humanitarian crisis in Yemen. Oh wait, it's not Israel, never mind
"According to the UN, over 150,000 people have been killed in Yemen, as well as estimates of more than 227,000 dead as a result of an ongoing famine and lack of healthcare facilities due to the war."
If Hamas can't come up with an accurate count of how many of their hostages are still alive, or where they are, how do they manage to have such a preceise count of the number of Gazans killed by Israel?
#metoo - believe the women when they say they've been sexually assaulted. (unless, of course, they're Israeli women, in which case doubt the veracity of their claims and check to see if they've gone to rape crisis centers)
It takes one to know one. I do question your reading comprehension, I wrote that I’m a registered Dem, so obviously I think we are less corrupt. Obviously less corrupt but not corruption free. Which was my point, after all. That was my point, both parties have dirty laundry.
But Mayor Adam’s, Sen Manchin, Sen. Menendez, Alcee Hastings, Rod Blogojevich, RFK Jr,, et al, are not shining examples of political integrity.
Why would I spend more time here, with you? It’s not like you ever expres an original thought. Trump bad! Israel bad! Does that about sum it up?
You’ve never conceded any point I’ve made, even when you completely misread the post about children and grandchildren. After you criticized my reading comprehension.
I’m the aggressor ? Well, boo fucking hoo.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but basically you’re saying blah blah blah.
I was born in the hospital named for Boss Hague’s mother. You know basically zero about Democratic Party members corruption, historical and contemporary.
Mayor Daley, anyone?
No, I realize that few, if any, are interested in my opinion, I’m not delusional. I post these things on the outside chance one of them might give pause for thought. I’m sure you’ve heard of the concept of “another opinion “. I wouldn’t have minded if the other guy disagreed with me for whatever reasons, but to simply call me a narcissist as a response is a waste of everyone’s time
Love or, more likely, hate them, I try to source with links to unbiased sites. If you, for example, don’t like my recent post about the UN, your beef is really with Amnesty International, I’m just the messenger.
Aren’t we all about freedom of expression, anyway?
Well, gee, if you say so, I mean when are you ever wrong?
Did you even read what I responded to? I’m a registered Dem, but the list of idiots in our party is long. If that opinion makes me an idiot, too, then I can live with it.
What are you, anyway, some kind of amateur American?
Well I certainly disagree. In short, Dems weren’t holding up aid to Ukraine. Nuff said.
There are self centered idiots in every aspect of governance and politics. To try to claim that it’s more prevalent in one party or another is, no offense, childish
You refute the facts I posted by psychoanalyzing me. Well played!
I won’t forget that in another one of your brilliant posts you once wrote that I must have a Star of David tattooed on my dick. So, please, fuck all the way off.
You have me confused with someone who’s interested in your opinion
And, because, no doubt, you enjoyed my last post so much, here's another:
https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2024/04/09/hamas-run-gaza-health-ministry-admits-to-flaws-in-casualty-data/
"The Hamas-run Gaza Ministry of Health said on April 6 that it had “incomplete data” for 11,371 of the 33,091 Palestinian fatalities it claims to have documented."
So, that, apparently means there have been about 22K deaths, minus maybe 10K of them, who were fighters. The reality seems to be that in an area of:
"The estimated population of the Gaza Strip for 2023 was around 2.1 million people."
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1422981/gaza-total-population/#:~:text=The%20estimated%20population%20of%20the,per%20woman%20as%20of%202022.
12K civilian deaths out of 2M is a little more than 1/2% of the total population killed in a war Gaza started. That's a heckuva genocide, amirite?
Another fun fact, is that NYC is about twice the size of Gaza and has about 3.5X residents. Not sure why Gaza is considered so incredibly densely populated.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/30/opinion/screams-before-silence-sheryl-sandberg.html
"There is Rami Davidian, an emergency medical worker at the Nova site: “I saw girls tied up with their hands behind them to every tree here. Someone murdered them, raped them and abused them, here on these trees. Their legs were spread. Everyone who sees this knows right away that the girls were abused. Someone stripped them. Someone raped them. They inserted all kinds of things into their intimate organs, like wooden boards, iron rods. Over 30 girls were murdered and raped here.”"
But, but, The Intercept (and one useful idiot here), insists it never happened because so few women reported their attacks to rape crisis centers.
Next time you feel inclined to cite actions by the UN to support your cause, consider this:
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2024/03/saudi-arabia-to-be-appointed-chair-uns-gender-equality-forum-amid-ongoing-assault-on-womens-rights/
and this:
https://www.reuters.com/world/irans-appointment-chair-un-rights-meeting-draws-condemnation-2023-11-02/#:~:text=Iran's%20ambassador%20to%20the%20U.N.,rights%20council%20spokesperson%20told%20Reuters.
Ok, sorry to intrude on your various other serious and more meaningful conversations, never mind.
Here are a few things that honestly can’t understand about the pro-Palestine demonstrations.
- what does “free Palestine” actually mean? If Israel completely withdrew from Gaza tomorrow and it continues to be run by Hamas, how is that “free”? That seems like defining freedom down if you consider it being run by an Iranian proxy death cult. Plus, even in its revised Charter, Hamas calls for the destruction of Israel, so wouldn’t that be tantamount to being in a state of perpetual war? What sort of freedom is that?Are the protestors just so anti Israel that they don’t actually care what Gazans want?
- The continuing use of the word “genocide” seems to be out of the same playbook as the MAGAs continuing insistence that the election was stolen. Genocide is a specific legal term that must include intent to wipe out a group. Despite the fevered imaginations of some about Israel’s intent, if they had wanted to genocide then the Gazans would all be dead by now. Repeating it doesn’t make it true.
- The continuing belief in the casualty numbers provided by Hamas. How in the world can people be so gullible? Yes, there have been horrific civilian deaths but they don’t distinguish military from civilian, aren’t being verified, and, they seem to bother American college students more than Hamas.
- how can posters here, who were in a military that napalmed Asian children, bombed neutral countries, and invaded Iraq, cop any sort of moral attitude at all?
Maybe it's me, but I can't tell if you actually are this dense or just pretend to be for your fans.
Let's step back and look at a larger picture of these protests. As far as I know, they are mostly centered around divesting in companies that do business with defense contractors that sell to Israel and / or defense contractors in general. Fair enough.
At some point you have to ask, or might ask, how are these kids tuitions being paid? Maybe their parents are successful business people and, therefore, are probably invested in the stock market. Warren Buffett, for example has been quoted numerous times as believing that one should buy all-market mutual funds (or etfs) and let them ride. Ok, how about the Schwab Total Market fund, SWTSX, that has $22B in assets? It holds $44M worth of Lockheed Martin and $86M of GE Aerospace, two of the largest defense contractors in the country. Or how about the Fidelity Total Market, FSKAX, with about $90B under management? They own 1.9M shares of GE Aerospace.
Or, maybe their parents are in unions? How are union pension funds investing their money? Per Nasdaq.com, getting back to LM, the California Public Employees Retirement System owns 989K shares. It also owns 940K shares in General Dynamics. The NY State Common Retirement Fund owns 945K shares of Boeing, another major defense contractor.
And, of course, all the major investment banks own millions of shares of all the top defense contractors, so if you're invested in anything that holds bank funds, guess what, you own shares in companies selling missiles to Israel. Don't believe me, look it up.
So, these kids are attending schools on their parents money, not all of them, but a lot. And that same parents' money, the money that pays tuition, is often invested in exactly the same companies that these same kids are demanding their colleges divest? Only kids (and you) think that makes sense.
Now getting back to the Survivor you highlighted, how is she paying for her rent and food? She appears to be retired and I'd suggest it's entirely possible she's being funded, at least partially, by a lot of these same companies she's protesting against.
Moral relativism much? Even if I fuck off, you still have to live with what the military did while you were enlisted . We all have to live with what our military did there and in Iraq. Why so quick to judge others?
You’re the guy who was in the US military when it was napalming Asian children? Maybe you should sit this one out
And when you see African Americans for Trump, you probably think they’re idiots. See the way that works?
Maybe read, “What’s the Matter with Kansas”
You’re an expert at finding media sources that confirm your biases. You are absolutely no good at considering that different points of view have any merit.
During the course of these discussions, I have conceded that Netanyahu belongs in jail as do the WB settlers. You’ve yet to concede there’s any validity in anyone else’s opinion.
Whatever. It’s not worth the effort.
NY Times, 04.25.24:
"President Biden and the leaders of 17 other nations called on Hamas on Thursday to release all of the hostages seized during its Oct. 7 terrorist attack on Israel, an effort to raise international pressure on the group’s leader in Gaza to agree to a U.S.-brokered deal.
"In addition to the United States, the countries that signed on included Argentina, Austria, Brazil, Britain, Bulgaria, Canada, Colombia, Denmark, France, Germany, Hungary, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Serbia, Spain and Thailand."
Never seen a single post on this board, ever, to this effect.
Let's have more solidarity with Iranian proxies, like the elected officials of Hamas:
https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/25/middleeast/toomaj-salehi-death-sentence-iran-intl/index.html
https://nationalpost.com/news/world/israel-middle-east/son-of-hamas-founder-urges-israel-to-execute-his-father-if-hostages-not-freed
Putin just won an election too, at least he allows fake elections more often than Hamas allows fake elections.
https://www.hrw.org/report/2009/04/20/under-cover-war/hamas-political-violence-gaza
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2015/05/gaza-palestinians-tortured-summarily-killed-by-hamas-forces-during-2014-conflict/
"Death to America"
It’s joking around. Who gives an actual shit? Get a life
If you think Hamas was elected fairly and squarely, you’re just confused. Wow!
They came to power in the election in 2006. You’re going to vouch for the integrity of that election? More absolute wow! Want to buy a bridge?
How have they fared in the elections since then?. And, did you see, Putin recently won re-election too? Fairly and squarely.
Well, it just goes to show, again, that people will say anything. On both sides. It seems that Hamas wants to force Israelis out of Israel with the same fervor that the Netanyahu Gang wants to force Palestinians out of Palestine. In other words, welcome to the Middle East, this show has been running for centuries.
That people think there will be any sort of righteous victory only shows a lack of perspective.
Yes, Biden is exactly the right person to be President, now. If Trump were President there would be an actual genocide, not the social media performance about genocide that we see now. And full out war with Iran.
If you want to understand where anti- Zionism veers into antisemitism, consider this. Since this war has begun we’ve heard of numerous protests outside synagogues and kosher restaurants in America. By contrast we’ve seen zero protests outside Russian Orthodox churches or in Russian American neighborhoods about Ukraine.
And yet, Afghanistan was able to defeat "this (same) enemy".
I'm guessing most. Younger people have those "lives" things.
When I was a freshman in college, my first semester, there was a campus demonstration against the war in Vietnam. Some of the more excitable demonstrators took over the college Administration Building and were subsequently tear gassed. This was, of course, decades before social media, but the thing is, I don't remember anyone writing or even saying that they shouldn't have been tear gassed. Everyone knew there would be consequences.
The problem with on-campus demonstrations in cities is that it's impossible to tell who's a student and who's there for shits and giggles. My school was in a more remote area that was conservative so it wasn't an issue. Students have every right to protest on their campuses, outsiders don't have that right.
Questions about geopolitics in the Middle East and about the reaction to them in America:
- Is the Islamic Republic occupying Iran? They don't have legitimate elections, most people there don't want them ruling the country and they use brutal, repressive tactics to curb expressions of dissent. Not to mention what they're doing to the Kurds:
https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/irans-pressure-campaign-iranian-kurds-continues
https://www.wilsoncenter.org/article/another-engineered-election-iran
https://www.chathamhouse.org/2024/03/irans-electoral-facade
As an aside, the economy there has tanked, their currency is approaching worthlessness, and they are, basically, engaging in warfare with all of their neighbors. And
- where are the protests about the harsh treatment of Iranians? Do their lives not matter? I can't seem to find info on any campus protests expressing solidarity with the Iranian people, maybe someone here knows of some. Yes, there were some 2 years ago about that unfortunate young woman who was killed by state morality police for wearing her hijab incorrectly, but other than that?
Well, I don’t actually check in here that often. Being called a genocidal racist scumbag, etc, got old, believe it or not. People writing that I want to build a house in the ruins of Gaza or insisting that Netanyahu is my President. Good times!
I’m not particularly thin skinned but dealing with that stuff is pointless. If you get the New Yorker, Remnick had a good piece about Netanyahu back in January.
The only reason you perceive me as being over protective is that Israel is obviously being held to a standard that other countries aren’t, as has been pointed out here previously so I’m compensating.
Like the BDS crowd being fine with buying stuff made in China, etc. Or, supposedly pretending that don’t want their tax money spent on Israel, but not making a fucking peep about government subsidies to the fossil fuel and defense industries or industrial ag.
Anti- Zionism isn’t antisemitism per se, but it does provide cover for racism sometimes.
You finally post a well reasoned, balanced article about the situation in the ME by a serious journalist.
Will wonders never cease.
Takes one to know one:
"Indigenous people are significantly overrepresented in the criminal justice system, with Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islanders comprising nearly one-third of Australia’s adult prison population, but just 3 percent of the national population. In August, the Western Australia Office of the Inspector of Custodial Services found that Broome prison, where 80 percent of the inmates are Aboriginal, is “depressing, degrading and entirely inappropriate in a modern mental health service context,” emphasizing that such conditions were a product of underlying systemic racism. At least 19 Indigenous people died in custody in 2023, including a 16-year-old First Nations boy who died after self-harming in pretrial detention in October following prolonged solitary confinement.
On October 14, Australians voted in a referendum to decide whether to enshrine a First Nations Voice to parliament and government in the country’s constitution, which would recognize, for the first time, the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people as the First Peoples of the land and allow them to give advice to the Australian Parliament and the government on issues that affect them. The referendum was defeated in every state and was considered a major setback for First Peoples’ rights. Presently, Australia has no national treaty with Indigenous Australians."
"Australia’s “Stolen Generation,” the state-sanctioned removal of Indigenous children from their families, the over-representation of Indigenous peoples in Australia’s prisons, and the high proportion of Indigenous children in foster care, are likely to be among the historical and ongoing injustices examined."
"Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islanders are 13 times more likely to be imprisoned than the rest of the Australian population. Aboriginal women are the fastest growing prisoner demographic in Australia."
Notice the word "ongoing" used repeatedly. Nope, no two-tiered justice system in Australia.
Believe whatever the fuck you want, but never forget “Israel bad”
Well, to each their own. Atrocities of the past give context to what happens in wars, which Hamas might have considered before they started this one, except that they think Gazans' lives are expendable.
You're another one of those armchair generals who don't like what Israel's doing but aren't willing to share your concepts about what they should be doing instead, you'd rather just re-post long articles from 5 months ago.
I wrote that I think there's an opportunity for Gazans and Israelis to work together to get rid of Hamas and continue an alliance into peacetime. You find that tiresome? At least I'm trying, do tell what your ideas are.
From my point of view, you're a guy living comfortably in denial in a country that Human Rights Watch currently considers an apartheid state. And yet somehow you feel you have purchase to chastise other countries about how they should treat their own minorities. Now that's tiresome, you're a moral relativist.
Let us know when you get Hamas to agree to a ceasefire, ok?
I agree with you about being a child in Gaza today. That's also true of many other places in the world, like Ukraine, Sudan, Honduras,Syria, Yemen, etc. Remember all those young girls who were kidnapped from a school by Boko Haram in Nigeria?
Imagine how bad life must be in some areas of Central America if families are sending children on their own to make their way to America.
Sorry to hear that, I know a few people who drank themselves to death at relatively young ages, couple of friends and a relative.
Hey, since you enjoy our back and forth about Israel so much, I thought I'd share this, from today's NY Times. All I'm trying to do is present a different perspective from the one that's prevalent on this board, I mean we agree about Trump and his cult, I don't find it entertaining to continually bash his poorly educated followers:
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/18/briefing/israel-iran-middle-east.html
"And why are Arab leaders willing to be part of a coalition with Israel? As surprising as it may sound, many see Iran as a bigger problem than Israel, even if they don’t say so publicly. The network of extremist groups that Iran funds and arms destabilizes the region. The Houthis have attacked Saudi Arabia and the U.A.E. in recent years, for instance. Hamas is an offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood, which Egypt’s government has long loathed.
When Arab leaders worry about existential threats to their governments, Israel rarely makes the list. Iran and its network of outside groups do. “Many Arab leaders share the view that Hamas is a terrorist organization that should be destroyed,” said my colleague Michael Crowley, who covers diplomacy."
People are quick to criticize Israel's war strategies against Hamas, and I agree with some of the criticism, but I'm not hearing many ideas, actually, none, about what it should be doing instead. A ceasefire only works if both sides agree to it, which Hamas apparently won't, so that leaves us where we are.
When Sherman said, "war is hell", this is what he meant