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Theirs other terms also
Extinguished meaning the debts in their entirety are gone. This can be achieved by debtors paying creditors in full or if creditors forgive the debt.
Discharged meaning the debtor is discharged from the debt and does not have to pay it.
You could instead Revise what I said to say “extinguished” instead of “discharged”
The wordings are similar because technically in the discharge scenarios, the creditor is being released from the debt.
So more accurately the debt is extinguished not discharged. Which is why I told toogood “discharge meaning the debt is essentially cancelled” because wither either word: discharge or extinguish, they both mean the debt is being cancelled
Lehman would essentially be playing monkey in the middle. The irs being the monkey in the middle and the NOL being the object.
Discharged meaning the debt is essentially canceled.
the way I’m interpreting it is, the value of the shares to be distributed will depend on the amount of nols that are left. Because NOL certificates are to be linked to the shares that LBHI distributes. So if all cash is distributed. And all that’s left to distribute is the plan trust stock, the only asset left will be the companies NOL. Once all shares are distributed , this will this satisfy the debt in whatever amount the company determines with their analysis. And then once all shares are distributed, whatever is left from the nols (which can even be $0) will be used to offset the cancelation of debt that was not paid in full from the cash+ stock. That is how I’m interpreting it. Which by definition = no CODI because if the nols are given to the creditors and the nols are to be reduced at the end of the liquidation (after all plan trust stock has been distributed) the creditors will own the NOL therefore the NOL can’t be reduced because it is the company who has to reduce the NOL according to the tax laws, creditors do not reduce the NOLS. By doing this method, Lehman will have $0 worth of nols at the time they are to discharge and cancel whatever debts that weren’t paid in full because creditors will own the NOL. CODI would be of no bearing because under chapter 11, CODI is excluded. But if the company elects to exclude this income, they must reduce NOLS, however, if a company has no NOLS to reduce, the cancellation of debt income recognized would just be eliminated according to the IRS. Meaning: Lehman gives $50bil NOL- equity linked to creditors, let’s say theirs CODI income since everyone was not paid in full, the NOLS do not get reduced because they are owned by creditors, the remaining CODI is simply just eliminated. It goes into a black hole. Then the new or reorganized company still has the benefit of the NOL with no debt but has issued equity.
From the IRS IRC:
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/26/1.108-7
The only way debt can be converted to equity is if the debt is discharged
Joe stocks I’ve been proving you wrong for the last year/two.
https://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=171273459
Proved this wrong. And to confirm the way I was comprehending it, I even put it in chatgpt and bard. I asked both of those to comprehend it piece by piece. And they both had arrived to my same conclusion years ago.
Remember this about NOLS?
https://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=171076463
Face it you don’t wanna debate you wanna argue. Just how I busted up mellowbird so bad he just kept repeating “apologize! Apologize!” Pfft
I know have the worlds most advanced AI’s at my disposal that agree with how I’ve been interpreting things.
I just think they will exchange the debentures for non-cumulative preferred. And the stock would tank because I don’t think they’ll pay dividends on them out the gate. So more waiting would be needed to receive FV of $25 per share because the only way you’d be able to sell them at $25 per share is for the new company to pay dividends on them.
Great post Linda!
Hopefully people here listen to you (someone who been filed a lawsuit) to explain to them what is really happening here
almost there! LOL
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this is why CT’s have an allowed claim. The guarantee for cash was expunged and was replaced with a guarantee for equity.
I don’t know why he keeps coming here yapping the same thing over and over when it doesn’t make any sense.
ECAPS 1-3 lost their court ruling to get paid so even if he got what he wanted the CT’s still wouldn’t have received any money.
They didn’t get anything. The guarantee that calls for a cash distribution is replaced with a guarantee that calls for a preferred equity distribution.
There was no secret NDA settlement.
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That’s the year they projected when they’ll be done with everything
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When those here are able to link:
I don’t think any of that is necessary. Lehman doesn’t know who holds the preferred shares. All they know is BNYM is the ones with the asserted claims. Who holds what will only come into play once everything is basically finalized. And even then I don’t think LBHI will be the ones to do it. I think it will be BNYM who sees who are the holders.
I know for a fact though LBHI has no clue who any of the holders are because I emailed and asked and that’s what they told me
Thank you for confirming
Hopefully those here who thought it was a secret settlement got their answer
Another “I was right” I’ll add to my Lehman folder! LOL
another lbt issued claim.
im started to assume all lbhi related claims are satisfied in full and all that is left are LBT claims + classes 10a-11.
https://document.epiq11.com/document/getdocumentbycode?docId=4174662&projectCode=LBH&source=DM
What’s this fintel stuff about?
I’ve been seeing but not reading lol
bard is ok, just tried it, ill do bing some other time, overall, im getting the same results
Where is the wording that says something on the lines of "when satisfied in full is reached holders will still receive distributions until they are paid in full" who here knows what i am referring to? can someone please post it
I still stand by debt for equity swap. it will happen. CT holders never have and never will receive any actual cash for their claims. stephen restelli didn't receive anything. 4w's didn't receive anything and they never will. All lawsuits that those here file are just BS shenanigan's. They have no standing and never will.
The court will never order the cash guarantee to be reinstated under BK law. it is just pure uncut delusion to believe anything other than that.
Ct's only hope is for a new company wherein we receive new preferred stock.
I'm positive I am correct/ have been correct on this whole thing for the past years. I'm glad chatGPT came out as it is an unbiased AI that was trained on 47 terabytes of data. So now I have a tool that even backs up my theories/comprehension of all the lehman text and articles I have read in the past.
This will end when all lawsuits are done. I don't know when that will be. if Lehman appeals the Assured Guaranty case then its safe to say this will last 2025. I'm positive on all of this. I will continue to use chatGPT as my sidekick since those here can see it and determine what they believe for themselves. Chatgpt confirmed all my thoughts and theories as being possible. nothing is for certain as it IS an investment. I am 100% confident in new shares. but the investors side of me will always say "anything can happen". I will continue to wait in peace for my preferred's.
Look at what LBI is referring to as "satisfied in full" https://document.epiq11.com/document/getdocumentbycode?docId=4099770&projectCode=LBI&source=DM
These are 40 cents wtf
How much were each paid and why were they paid?
which preferred got paid???
Told y’all this won’t end until all lawsuits are finished
A reminder that unpaid dividends can be paid with stock
Whatever unpaid divies are will just be included in new share price issuance