Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
A couple of questions.
1. If AMD runs into problems with the 90nm SOI line they are planning to start production with next month, can they run it at 130 nm as an interim measure?
No. 90nm and 130nm are not interchangeable. Different tools, Different Chemicals, Different Energies. I wouldn't waste my limited money, qualifying a 130nm process on 90nm tools to begin with. Unless I was desperate.
2. When the 90nm line is working well, can they upgrade the 130nm line to run at 90nm?
Yes. intel's Fab12 in Arizona is currently undergoing a similar change.
Semi
Interesting Info On Power Management Chips
http://yahoo.businessweek.com/technology/content/mar2004/tc20040312_8843_tc121.htm
The faster processors of increasingly powerful computers are starting to generate enough heat to melt circuit boards -- a problem that's more and more difficult to manage. But as often happens, one company's problem is another's opportunity. In this instance, International Rectifier is the beneficiary. The El Segundo (Calif.) outfit makes chips that manage power consumption and heat in electronics products........
Semi
Semiconductor firms find leakage current a problem at 90nm
Richard Ball
http://www.electronicsweekly.com/default.asp?=http://www.electronicsweekly.com/issue/techview.asp?vp...
The transition to 90nm is proving painful when it comes to leakage current. A paper from Intel describes some of the techniques it was forced to use in designing Prescott, the 90nm version of Pentium 4........
The result is that leakage accounts for about 30 per cent of the overall power. When IBM Microelectronics transitioned its PowerPC 970 from 0.13µm to 90nm (the 970+) there were several issues........
Semi
Just because something is technically brilliant, doesn't mean it's going to compete well in the marketplace. You need the whole package of product, support, infrastructure, and validation. Intel does that VERY well, AMD doesn't.
Would that be.... "The Betamax Syndrome"?
Semi
Links To Chipmaking Info
Since the previous link got..... ummmmm deleted, Here's the link again to how chips are made.
http://www.intel.com/education/makingchips/index.htm
Other Interesting Chip Info
http://www.intel.com/intel/intelis/museum/exhibits/index.htm
Semi
Bob Colwell Stanford On Line University Discussion
http://stanford-online.stanford.edu/courses/ee380/040218-ee380-100.asx
This guy was one of the Architects of PPro, and his discussion not only gives an insight into the way chips are designed, but through his comments about discussions he had with Andy Grove, and what went on in the meetings he attended, also gives an insight into the workings of the intel corporate mind. Very interesting. Caution: The technical portions of the discussions can be a little dry for the non geek.
Windows Media Player. Works best with High Speed Internet Connection. I sat through it all, so here are the time indexes of the relevant discussions:
Start: Introduction, and Moores Law vs Power
16 min: IA64 Discussion
30 min: IA32 Discussion
39 min FDIV Bug and Public Reaction
43 min: The CPUID Fiasco
48 min: Issues with partners
52 min: Marketing and other Gross Generalities
1:03:30: Questions
No need to thank me
Semi
Wonder where he got the money?
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=14706
AMD's Jerry Sanders says 64-bit switch to take "months, not years"
Donates $2.5 million to UI
He also announced a $2.5 million donation to the university for a chair in electrical and computer engineering.
Semi
OK, Without the retort......
I think the addition of 2 metal layers is being done to extend the life of the 0.13u process. It's clear that intel wanted to have everything up and running full steam on 90nm by now. That obviously hasn't happened. What should intel have done, sit on their hands? let their competition take away market share? Or, get the design guys to re-layout the 0.13u metal layers? If you can do it, then it's a no brainer, IMO.
The pros, IMO, are additional metal layers most likely means shorter metal paths which always increases speed, and generally improves yields. Adding additional metal layers apparently does not require a redesign of the pre-Metal layers, and most likely, pre metal layer lots already 1/2 way through the line, can be transferred onto the redesign without shutting down portions of the line. Intel also has their own mask making operation, so the reticle layout changes can be done in-house, vs. AMD which works with Dupont.
The cons, IMO are that additional metal layers brings additional processing, additional defect densitiy fallout, and increased costs. There's not much that you can do about the two additional trips the lots need to make through Thin Films, Litho and Etch, though on a mature process like intel's 0.13u, I expect they've got production costs, and defect densities under control by now. They better be.
So, once again, circumstances dictate that intel must swallow their "pride" (cough) and do what's best for the company to make money. Bad Bad intel. I'm sure the AMD fans are no doubt pleased as punch, at intel's "embarassment".
Semi
I bet this won't make the Inquirer, eh?
Doug,
these extra metal layer tweaks by Intel are following the same pattern of the P3 botched notched gates episode.
Of course with the same management team running the show, I didn't expect any changes.
Mysef
No, notched poly gate, was a major process change to the transistors, that required quite a bit of requalification. It took allot of time, and process engineering effort. This won't. It sounds to me like a metal layout change.
All that needs to be done IMO, is make the new additional reticles, and add a few operations to the automation flow. And the best part, is that you can most likely switch over production lots that are already half way through the line, prior to Metal 1. No design change, remember? Done deal.
But hey, maybe I should cut ya some slack. I notice the AMD fanboys have always had a problem seperating the design from the process, so I'm not surprised that you don't seem to know what you're talking about.......
Again
Semi
They call this journalism???
Journalism? I don't believe that the phrases "The Inquirer" and "journalism" have anything to do with each other, more like an oxy-moron if you ask me. And as for cast of intel bashing characters the article quoted...... I'm not surprised. All the usual bashers, with typically expected comments. The only thing surprising to me, is how did Mysef and Dan3 manage to miss out on the party?
I also notice that they used the byline "The Enquirer Staff", which in the past has mostly meant, Translation: I write for the Inquirer and I wish to be biased, Sling Mud, and spread FUD, but I'm too cowardly, and embarassed about what I'm doing, to actually identify myself. End Translation.
Semi
Scott McNealy's Days Numbered?
http://www.thestreet.com/_yahoo/tech/kcswanson/10148379.html
Sun Microsystems' (SUNW:Nasdaq - news - research) shareholders have long grumbled the company might be better off without veteran CEO Scott McNealy. With investors more willing to agitate for change these days and Sun still lagging its peers, the time seems ripe for the malcontents to raise their voices.
At present, any "fire McNealy" movement is far from an inferno and appears unlikely to spark the kind of headlines of the recent shareholder revolt at Disney. But that doesn't mean it's nonexistent or without justification.
Semi
Intel preps Xeon chipset with discrete memory manager
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/3/36206.html
Intel's upcoming 'Twin Castle' chipset separates the memory controller from the North Bridge chip to yield a three-chip product rather than the usual two-chip set-up.
Semi
Reminder
Sometimes publications get a little PO'd if you post their copyrighted material. And since iHub and SI share ownership, Abstracts only please.....
http://www.siliconinvestor.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=19903058
The post to which I am responding is in the process of being deleted at the request of the San Francisco Chronicle. It contained the full text of their (or in some cases, some other media outlet’s) copyrighted material.
Was that an abstract of an abstract? Abstract squared? Abstract+1?
Semi
And he's hoping for many more early adopters. Last week, during a speech to solution providers at the summit in Las Vegas, Otellini told them he essentially wanted North American channel sales to more than double over three years to $3 billion by 2007.
"It's important for us that the channel is capable of selling the breadth of Intel's product line," Otellini said in the interview.
I think we should really take what Otellini says he wants for intel as gospel for the direction the company will be going. Looks to me like he'll be stepping into Barrett's shoes in the not too distant future.
GO INTEL!
Cha-Ching!
Semi
When you know their points are nonsense there's no reason to feel you need to argue with them. It's really easy to just ignore those who bring no value to the thread.
Try it, you'll like it.
Doug's been ignored for awhile, and yes, I do like it that way much better. I just kept Mysef around, because he amusing, and often makes me laugh. The best one was where he "accused" someone else of "not contributing anything" to the thread. Did you see that one? Whew...... LMAO over that whole "Pot/Kettle/Black" thing, but perhaps you're right, it may be time for a re-evaluation, and an addition to the list. I'll think about it.
Semi
This thread is degenerating.
Instead of posting information, this has become a forum for taunts and counter taunts.
Lemmie guess..... Taunting on the intel thread...... Doug's involved....... Right?
You're right, things have been pretty good over here recently, and an evaluation of the last few days shows that IMO, things will most likely go back to that way, as soon as Mysef and I'm sure Doug is doing it also, get tired of baiting the intel fans, and go away. Hang in there, shouldn't be too much longer now. Would happen quicker, if people ignore them (guilty myself).
Semi
the whistling in the graveyard from Intel employees is getting loud enough to wake up the dead. And the media.
Mysel
Haw Haw Haw, And obviously, someone's sour grape whine is continuing to ferment.
Semi
This was confrirmed by the family dog
Baloney.......
I heard the confirmation wasn't from the dog, it was the cat.
So There.........
ROTFLMAO
Semi
You know... I didn't believe you until you mentioned the dog... everyone knows dogs never lie...
No No No..... He's lying about the dog........
It was really the cat..... Told to him by the parrot.......
Who read it on SI........
So there you have it......... it must be true.
Semi
wbmw,
please enlighten us with what the extra unused half of Prescott is....
Mysef
Still Worried huh?
You should be.
Actually, I called up someone, "who knows", and they told me the unused space, is actually 128 bit circuitry, which will run all 64 bit applications at twice the speed, and all 32 bit applications at 4 times the speed. It will also be compatible with any and every piece of software written in the past, present and future, with no porting necessary. It also has security protection against anything, and everything bad.
I told the story to my Springer Spaniel, and she wagged her tail the whole time, and get this...... for an additional 5 minutes afterwards, so Whoa..... maybe there's even more.
Semi
Intel says it won't support China's Wi-Fi rules
Wednesday March 10, 7:00 am ET
By Doug Young
http://biz.yahoo.com/rc/040310/tech_china_intel_1.html
HONG KONG, March 10 (Reuters) - Intel Corp (NasdaqNM:INTC - News), the world's largest chip maker, said on Wednesday it will not develop applications based on Chinese encryption standards for wireless computing, taking a hard line in an ongoing dispute between U.S. technology companies and China.
Semi
If I'm not mistaken, I think it goes like this:
Take Intel's price 6 months ago then subtract 15%! Oh, BTW, that happened the six months before that too!
Cha ching!
Smooth
Actually, it's look at what the price is at the beginning of the 6 month period, then look at it again at the end of the 6 month period, and then subtract 15% from the Lower Price. It's a 15% discount...... minimum. Could be more.
Semi
How money cups of coffee wasted on Itanium?
How many Intel employees ruined by poor management?
Triple my options, I'm doing so great running Intel into the ground.
Make it so,
Mysef
No employees were "ruined" by management, except in someone's fantasy. And as far as intel's running into the ground..............
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Jerry and Hector WISH they could "run" AMD so well.
Ya know...... That "Whine" you've been making around the threads for the past few weeks, probably isn't going to taste so good, being made out of sour grapes and all. And what it really comes off sounding like, is not that you're pissed off about some meaningless stock option grants, or who's "ego" (cough) is hurt by being first, or who's leading and who's following. No........... what it really sounds like, is....... you're worried.
You should be.
Semi
Mysef - poor little ole AMD.
The company that compeltely reversed Intel's 64 bit plans.
That and a dollar will get Hector Ruiz a tall house blend cup of coffee at Starbucks.
Wesef
Only a dollar? I think they charged me more last time...... Speaking of "more money", that reminds me of the main discussion point.....
More Money for intel..... More Money for intel..... More Money for intel..... Yaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyy!
Cha-chingsef
Just Noticed This.....
http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20030415corp.htm
Looks like Q1 2004 projections are certainly an improvement on Q1 2003.
Semi
AMD gets to gloat and Intel gets to come in and make all the money. Everybody gets what they want....
It's what you call win-win...
My point exactly. I'm in it for THE MONEY. I guess I'll just have to use that all that future cash to salve my "wounded ego" (cough)......
On my way to the bank.
Cha-Ching!
Semi
Yeah Jerry,
poor little ole AMD.
The company that compeltely reversed Intel's 64 bit plans.
Mysef
Who Cares......
http://www.computerbusinessreview.com/todaysnews/cb7b4a5bf1c4e3bf80256e4d0038520f
While Unisys is eager to embrace the new Xeon-64 chips, the company believes, as does Intel and HP, that over the long haul the enterprise server future will be one dominated by Itanium.
Cha-Ching!
Semi
That said, Unisys has designed the ES7000s to support whatever processor architecture it seems necessary to drive revenue, including its Sperry and Burroughs Clearpath mainframes and Xeon and Itanium processors. Feverston says that for the companies that Unisys is chasing with Windows Datacenter Server who already have RISC/Unix servers in the datacenter, going with what is most like what they currently have is what they will choose.
I wonder how they do this, is it just multiple sockets on the same motherboard, and just pop in and out ROM BIOS and Microprocessors?
Semi
Not once since I left.
Ya wanna know something? I just looked at my posting history, and I noticed that recently I experienced very lopsided thread shift over to here too....... I knew I was feeling better for some reason. Love that ignore list now too.
Semi
Sometimes I think they should call this place Intelville.
Ronster
Ummmmmm...... sorry, Chandler/Ocotillo Az already snagged that title, when you guys weren't looking.
Didn't ya hear the Governor came down to announce the F12 300mm upgrade?
Hummmmmm..... Maybe it should be called...... "Intel City"
Semi
How much development of I2 is done is Oregon and how much is done is MA?
As I understand it, the MA Fab17 was purchased from DEC, and the last I heard, after intel's deal obligation to manufacture DEC's product for a certain period expired, F17 was gutted, and made copy exactly for the 0.13u P4 Process. I haven't heard of any Development work going on there though. I could be wrong.
Semi
Intel Dominated 2003 Chip Market; Motorola Falls
By Mark Hachman
Intel Corp. easily maintained its position as the top semiconductor supplier in the world in 2003, holding a market share roughly 2.5 times larger than its nearest competitor.
Can't be...... They're not "first" in in what "really" (cough) matters....... IA32e, NX, PDSOI.....blah blah blah...... intel is toast..... Haven't you been reading the other thread?
Semi
No, but the AMDroids won't admit to this article of truth.
60% gross margins is, nonetheless, remarkable. It's like printing money. I can only think of a handful of companies with better GMs than this (MSFT, CSCO).
I actually am pleased with the guidance, since historically Q1 has been intel's worst quarter. I was sort of expecting mid-quarter guidance to be below intel's previous minimum guidance.
The GM holding is very good news IMO, it indicates to me that despite the reported slowdown in Q1 Laptop Sales, ASP's must be holding up, and even possibly improving, indicating greater availablity/sales of higher end parts. Exactly opposite of what "some" think.
If intel wants to sell tons of Celerons also, that's OK with me too. Got to do something with those 200mm fabs now that they're paid for, eh?
Semi
So now I'm waiting for the cries of "I wonder how much Intel paid for that report"...
Wait Wait, I know....... intel sent their "Black Shirts" to also pay for this one too!!
http://forbes.com/technology/enterprisetech/2004/03/03/cz_dl_0303linux.html
Sun On The Run?
Daniel Lyons, 03.03.04, 9:52 AM ET
NEW YORK - Gerry Louw is a longtime fan of Sun Microsystems and its powerful Unix-based computers. In fact, he has been running Sun's pricey machines at various companies for more than ten years. Yet today, Louw, chief information officer of VMS, a 1,000-employee company in New York, is ripping out hundreds of Sun servers in 16 locations and replacing them with inexpensive servers running Intel processors and Linux, a free operating system.
Semi
Intel confident on move into consumer electronics
Thursday March 4, 4:52 am ET
http://biz.yahoo.com/rc/040304/tech_intel_1.html
TOKYO, March 4 (Reuters) - Intel Corp (NasdaqNM:INTC - News) said on Thursday it was confident of repeating in the consumer electronics industry its success as the top chip supplier for computers, shrugging off concerns about its potential in the new field.
Intel plans to move into the living room with liquid crystal on silicon (LCoS) chips, a hybrid technology using both silicon microchips and liquid crystal displays (LCDs), for high-definition televisions.
Intel, based in Santa Clara, California, has said its chips could slash the price of a 50-inch projection TV to $1,800 by next year, compared with $3,000 to $4,000 for a standard microprojection television.
Semi
Intel will outsell AMD 64-bit chips by year end
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=14499
Better OEM and reference support
By INQUIRER staff: Thursday 04 March 2004, 07:42
PETER GLASKOWSKY, the chief editor of the Microprocessor Report, comments on Intel's announcement of 64-bit extensions in the latest issue of the subscription only newsletter.
But even though he believes Intel is playing "catch-up" with AMD64, he thinks that because of its far better OEM contacts and platform designs that by the end of this year, Intel's 64-bit X86 chips will outsell AMD.
Semi
If you look at the pattern of these insider trades it seems you have to give intent to sell/buy i.e. 'planned sale', Herb's trades show this best. The fact that he has decided to sell only half what he planned to is the big question. Maybe Rivet will issue a downgrade today based on Intel's flash price-cutting or some other news like 90nm delay and then he will sell the other 200,000 or he could have just changed his mind or even made a mistake ?
So mas, the reason I ask, is based on past history of this board. Before you came around, Jerry made a 300,000 share buy in AMD, when nobody else was buying. At the time, it was hailed by all the usual suapects around here as a major positive indicator for AMD, so I was curious to see if the planned sale of 400,000 shares, when nobody else seems to be selling, would be viewed by these same people as some sort of negative indicator. Apparently not. Thanks for the feedback.
Semi
He didn't have to sell, but if he didn't he would have had to cough up a cool $2.7 million to pay for the shares from the exercise.
That's a reasonable explanation for the 200,000 excercise/sell. I was trying to determine what you thought the reason was for the 400,000 share "planned" sale. By your calculations that would be an additional cool 5.4 million sale, not required to pay for the shares from the excercise.
Semi
I see that Jerry Sanders has started dum... I mean selling his AMD shares. This has traditionally been a leading indicator of trouble.
I looked at it, and part of it was an option exercise (200,000) so maybe in that case, if he didn't have the cash, he may not have been able to buy. Someone suggested that he "had to", which is the possible option expire reason for the 200k. Of course, that doesn't explain why he also sold 400,000 shares "planned sale" on the same day. Maybe I'm missing something, so I asked about that part.......
http://investorshub.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=2489291
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/it?s=AMD
INSIDER & RULE 144 TRANSACTIONS REPORTED - LAST TWO YEARS
Date Insider Shares Transaction Value*
11-Feb-04 SANDERS, W.J. III
Chairman 200,000 Sale at $15.62 - $15.68 per share. $3,130,0002
11-Feb-04 SANDERS, W.J. III
Chairman 200,000 Option Exercise at $13.44 per share. $2,688,000
11-Feb-04 SANDERS, W.J. III
Chairman 400,000 Planned Sale $6,284,000
Still waiting on the 400K feedback.
Semi
Probably options expiration as others have pointed out. If you look at his exercise price of $13.44 and see that he sold at $15.62-$15.68, that is the only thing that makes sense. Who would exercise and sell options for only a $2/share gain unless they had to?
I bet he is annoyed he had to sell at $15. AMD should be trading above $20.
HailMary
Help me understand. Why did he have to sell? As far as I know, An required option expiration excercise means that you can buy and hold all or part of the option exercise. You can even sell part, to buy and hold the rest. My impression is that it is not absolutely necessary to sell. My options don't require a sale at expiration excecise. If I come up with the cash, I can buy the shares. I don't think Jerry's hurting for cash.
He excercised and sold all 200,000 shares, PLUS sold 400,000 more on the same day, that was noted as a "planned sale", not as an excercise. Why did "he had to sell" not only the excercised shares, but 400, 000 additional shares?
Semi