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well I can almost 100% guarantee that the price of gfci will be 1.89 times the price of CTBG on May,1 2006, unless they don't file the paperwork that they have committed to.
So either they're FOS, or GFCI has to go up-CTBG goes down, or both until they meet.....
where's all the buying???
I thought this was the confirmation everyone was looking for?
OR is everyone "averaged down" without dry powder?
Where's the woo-woo crowd?
not,
I guess we'll see how it plays out then. Because right now, there is a HUGE inefficiency in pricing between the two.
Either CTBG has to go wayyyyy down, or GFCI has to go wayyyyyy up
they should be 1.89ctbg right now, or as we approach the record date.....
Peeker,
I bought 50,000 shares yesterday at 18,19
that's why I'm here
If we break 100dma I'll add, if not, the market views it as another fluff PR with no substance, and I'll sell and move my money on again.....
I would like to see some PR on the CTBG side of things with a revenue estimate or something......
I disagree
but,
whatever
weren't you privy to the "information" that came out that said that CTBG financials were to be filed this week? Seems everyone else was.
As for the share price, I do not believe there are any people shorting this stock. All this talk about "the shorts" is amusing but unrealistic. No one shorts pink sheets without defensive hdges in place and these guys haven't done a PIPE since lyamec and from the PR, all their shorting has been covered and now they want to run it back up.....IMO
no they would be priced the same that day. The day before, yes, the shares would be differently valued, maybe not all the way, but differently.
You're argument is that if they cancelled the spinoff of shares into new accounts, and that there would be 10MM shares (example, still haven't gotten an answer to that) active/registered, instead of 85 MM shares, the price of CTBG would instantly jump to $1.40 from where they are today? Because if the dilution is fully priced that is what would happen.
So Dr. Bill, what you are stating in fact is that after the 75 million CTBG dividend shares are distributed, the price of CTBG will be reduced to 12% of .21, which represents the increase of stock from 10m to 85m.No. I am stating that the price will be reduced to approximately 12% of the price of the stock on the day after the shares are declared effective. The price may be .21, it may be .51, who knows? There is a BIG difference. Therefore, CTBG will be priced at 2.3 cents per share. see above. If the shares were dec'd today, yes. It won't matter what the financials provide in terms of earning per share, EPS will matter very much, they will just be divided by 85 millions shares rather than whatever they are being priced as today. as that calculation will be thrown out the window because you want it that way.tell me where i said anything remotely close to the EPS calculation being thrown out the window! That is something that you conjured up!
Please, don't make me laugh. OKEEDOKEE
stocksbonds
This is simple math.
If a company is worth $1000 with 10 shares of stock worth $100 each, and they add another 1000 shares of stock, their market cap doesn't just automatically jump to $101,000.
Otherwise what's stopping them from issuing a Billion shares and being the first ever Trillion dollar market cap company?
Crank up the printing press guys!
seriously, stockbonds, I know that my wry seense of humor gets lost on people here with thin skin and way too much money on the line, in the above example, the stock in the company automatically gets repriced by the market, by arbitrage, if there is any discrepancy. The share of the above company, with an addition of 1000 new shares, would be worth $1.01, down from $100. Same with a stock split, they split 2:1 the stock is cut in half. Well, not exactly the same, but similar.
The new shares simply aren't worth what the old shares are, otherwise the company's with the largest SOS would be the ones with the biggest market caps.
Thank you Roland. I find it educational rather than fun, but it is sometimes entertaining. I still have yet to have a straight answer to the question, nit-picky or no, the market cap( Z )of CTBG is $.215X, X being the current number of shares oustanding.
Now, we know that there will be some 85 MM shares after they are dec'd, so Z divided by 85 MM will give us some accurate price of where the CTBG share value will fall. This will enable the enterprising young investor to ascertain what twice the value would be, or a starting price to remove the enterprise value of GFCI post spinout and come up with some ballpark figure of what to pay for GFCI stock today.
You see, most people who like their money use that old fashioned method of mathematical calculation for their purchases, rather than push the button, pray and pump the shit out of it on a few message boards!!!
TO THE MOON works great for amatuer and small fry, but we pro's need to have some starting point from which to begin an estimation of what the heck GFCI is worth today, and why it isn't trading there, where is the market finding uncertainty and why?
how many shares are currently outstanding in ctbg according to the company?????
And Yes, I did buy 50,000 shares of GFCI today at 18, and 18.5 the last few went at 19.
I was expecting to see the 100dma broken and the fact that it didn't is a BIG red flag. I'm already planning my exit. It should cross tomorrow or I'm gone. "someone" said that financials would be out this week. I'm wondering about the credibility of that poster.
Hey Roland!
Alleged meaning, according to some person who really cannot offer proof.
Notice how the word, expects, expected, showed up before, during and after each talking point in the GFCI PR today? You're not on their case for it, are you? Why not!!!???
They are alleging a certain number of shares that are already outstanding and or trading. Once there is proof, I will speak on that point accurately, as I always do.
how many shares does ctbg have OS now.
I'm wondering what dilution factor CTBG gets from the declaration of the additional shares, because I don't think that's priced in. So if they have 10 MM now, and they're going to 85 MM you divide the market cap by that many more shares and price drops accordingly, right?
I've never held a stock that dilutes by 8 times.
CTBG now .22, divide by 8 get roughly .04 per share. Twice that for Grifco 1.89 plus ongoing business of GFCI makes it appear fully valued here, unless the market was way underpricing CTBG. I doubt the dilution was already priced into the pps.
Thoughts?
oracle those shares haven't been dec'd yet
how many now?
Question:
how many OS of CTBG are alleged at this time?
thanks
peeker Im not going to talk about a lot of OT stuff
the rat was sick before they tested it so, it doesn't seem to be a big deal.
The market cap vs revs is a common thing with pipelines, you're buying a probability of final approval times approximate sales x years out. Options are the only way I play those most of the time, except this recent plunge I bought a few....easy 50-75% coming up, and if the Euro market approves it's a slam dunk, IMO
thanks
peeker if these guys pull it off I'll be the first one to get aboard the happy train.
Once again, I have no idea why Dial would NOT authorize the TA, if everything was known, and above board. It didn't really protect the shareholders if that's the case.....which is his job. I'm slightly curious why the price hasn't gotten above 20 cents today, if the news is as significant as some are hooting about, it would seem that the entire run down from 40 was not called for. One Friday two weeks ago GCFI traded 5 some Million shares, with no news. I would have thought the "concrete" information would have brought the wait and see crowd out of the woodwork....
CTBG = .2
1.89 * .2 = ~.42----- given the uncertainty factor of whether or not it's going to happen, you might get a nice swing trade of GFCI of .2 to about .3 from it, gotte be nimble, though.....
problem is, there's not a distribution date
you have to own shares of GFCI on May1, but don't know when you'll get those shares, if they get it done at all.
Still nothing concrete. Expects the Sb-1 in April, 2006?
The fishy factor is down by 1/3 this morning, but soemthing still has that faint whiff....
Well. it's truth time-
There have been several FOTC (people who the management doesn't seem to mind sharing inside information with) claiming that we're due for a defensive PR by Grifco, Itl. and we're due for CoilTubing financials THIS WEEK!
Here it is, in a nutshell
selected posts from the RB board:
weximon:
Did the big share holders see this coming, yes, natural penny BBB others. Did this take you by suprise? If so why?
walkerbald:
The main reason for my confidence in this company, has been & continues to be this board. Over these many months you, txtowers, BBB, B2B,BTL, & many others have given their all to keep us informed.
I have to admit than I am a little worried that we have not heard from BBB since the attack on Dial. I would like to have his advice before I buy more.
BBB: unbelievably quotes Dial, who has not shown one ounce of honesty in the year I have been following the company
e look to immediately move forward on expanding our market reach through Lyamec by reviewing and finalizing applications on Tunis, Qatar, Jabal Ali, and Morocco and to establishing corresponding logistic and point of sale offices in the North African coast,
and here's the clincher...
We have at a bare minimum a $2 stock in GFCI! It is just that most people don't know it, yet! We have at a bare minimum a $1 stock in CTBG!
there you have it folks, at bare minimum. $3 for 12 cents....
no "it might be"
no "IMO"
no "i think"
just a rock solid valuation based on nothing
Then, his math goes screwy. 2 + 1 equals?
So, you can buy $4 for $0.12?? You have got to be kidding me!!
now there's something wirth repeating
So, you can buy $4 for $0.12?? You have got to be kidding me!!
So, you can buy $4 for $0.12?? You have got to be kidding me!!
So, you can buy $4 for $0.12?? You have got to be kidding me!!
Jim? you should tell him now.........
eleven point five cents
this is getting ugly
Has anyone talked to Jim Dial lately?
Back2basics
I feel badly for you that you're losing your money on what you thought was a sure thing. Notice however that I have continually refrained from calling you names. Meanwhile I have been berated repeatedly. For being right, and against the grain of this phoenix rising from the ashes, I have taken more abuse.
I still feel badly that you're losing money that must have taken years to save. I will refrain from lowering myself to the level of cutesy slightly derogatory names for you. I'm better than that.
Funny, I have been talking about how severely Jim Dial is damaging the company's image and stock price for months.
Now, Lyamec is putting out PR's about how bad the corporate strategy is and has been. Meanwhile BBB and B2B have been singing the praises of the man endlessly. "JIM DIAL IS GOING TO TAKE US TO THE AMEX" etc etc etc.
Hmmmmmmmm
Personally I think Swinford and Griffith want OUT of Grifco, and want AWAY from JimDial as fast as possible. I think that's why the merger fell apart, and is now being undone in the form of a spinoff. I wonder if Jim will tell the two of them how many shares are outstanding?
sam
the factors that are potentially involved here are many, obviously. There may be some differences of opinions between the two companies and their managements.
Also, if the stock spinout is with shares that are priced with 20 cent price range with (supposedly) huge potential the people holding them might be willing to wait 2 yrs, just like management teams that sit on options for years before exercising them. Just because Jerry Griffith is willing to sit on a few million shares for 24 more months doesn't mean that people in GFCI stock are willing to do the same.
Restricted shares might be fine if you're employed with the company and planning on staying for some time. Different story for investors IMO.
Also the shares of grifco might take a huge dive when the stock goes ex-div and you've got your restricted dividend and don't want GFCI any more.
SAMNOT
The real question, is what is happening with the dividend or spinoff.
IF they spinout restricted shares I expect that people will quickly sell grifco stock to buy CTBG, assuming that the Jet Motor goes with CTBG, simply because the fact that people won't want their stock/money tied up in something that they cannot sell/hedge with options for however long.
This is really confusing, which is why I'm not thrilled with it at this point. Management could easily do some explaining to the market, which they're clearly NOT inclined to do, which is at least a yellow flag at this point.
I offered to moderate the board and it looks like I was tapped. I will allow all points of view, both positive and negative, but I don't think that insulting each other is appropriate.
No I don't work for a hedge fund.
Good Luck!
I admit that the fact that Leonard has actually shown up, and that he has past experience with Boots and Coots is good. I wasn't sure that he actually worked there. I don't know about the one man auditing firm, though. Seems fishy. I would guess that CTBG is the way to go for the best bet, but we still don't know the Jet Motor status and wehere it will end up, GRifco, or Coiltubing.....
we'll see
You still haven't figured out that the people working for the hedge funds are the ones that are pumping stocks for all their worth? Hedge funds don't have any trouble moving a stock down, that's easy. You should be far more wary of people who claim to know things from an "inside the industry" perspective, you know, knows someone who knows someone??????
hey sparky!
more great insight I see! I also see that you're keeping your remarks to the non-libelous format, too. Smart move.
Here's some more hysterical stuff
volume sales of grifco
726.000
353.000
309.000
196.000
138.000
652.700
376.000
1.248.900
5.766.200
last 9 days trading
9.765.100 total shares traded
$1,562,146 total money
less than two weeks
hysterical
I think it's f'in hysterical is what I think.
This has ALL the signs of being a classic scam, there isn't one sign missing from the picture, yet there's still people holding on for dear life.
Yeah but Jim Dial did _______
Yeah but Jim Dial did ______
there's no one that has seen a bank account, or legal documentation of the supposed transactions that have taken place, I can 99.99999% guarantee it.
SO how do you know? Jim Dial told you. Ok dokay.
The assumptions that people are making here are all paper thin. If they're lying the SEC will get them. Well Rocker and co. are stealing millions of dollars per month and the SEC doesn't give a shit.
I just cannot believe people can be this blind.
The reason Dr. Bill, 10 Bagger, etc keep posting here with no stake is because they think they are smarter and better than the investors of GFCI and want to rub these investors' collective noses in the drop in shareprice.
the reason I post here is because "someone" thinks that this is a completely sure thing. I think it's almost a completely sure thing in the other direction, and I think that I have a lot to learn in the market and investing (despite a famous record at investing and picking stocks) and I want to have a record of what my thought process is and was. I can then review and determine where I was correct and incorrect. I can also guage the investors response to my thoughts, and use it in future reference regarding BB's, sentiment on the BB, and my intuition on the share price after having followed my intuition.
I don't give a rat's ass about putting someone's nose in it, and I don't give a crap about being right or wrong, I simply want to learn and grow.
I also learn about who is a spot on amatuer in the market, who is "learned" and who to listen to.
I think there's a lot of people who will be surprised when (IF) information comes to light.
The old PR whereby Jim Dial was listed as a "investor relations" contact for litfiber is quite telling IMO. Same bunch, same tactics, same result, is my opinion on the matter, and that cememted it.......
IMO GFCI stock will go under .03 per share and undergo a RS for 1:100 or something like that......
I ask in jest where is the CNBC special or Al Haig but they just scratch the surface of bad information put out by the company.. I realize that many are long and are willing to accept the results,, good or bad but the question I ask is WHY.... How could anyone face the facts and not heed the reality,, that information at hand does not stand up to any form of investment criteria.. It beats me how this issue trades in the volume it does without any follow up releases to the promises of the GFCI cheerleaders...
Dude, they don't want to contemplate such issues, heck they won't answer them think about them even ask the tougher questions. The fact is that they don't care. All they want to do is talk about a "Vegas bust out party".
I noticed a LONG TIME AGO, when people on the MB are talking about a "Vegas bust out party" it is almost one sure sign to sell a stock and run, don't walk, away from it.
It's a classic sign of a stock infested with amatuers and people way over their heads.
BUT!
not to fear,
filings are close!
any minute now
clever
you know that I have respect for you. I will tone down my negativity. In fact I am about as confident as I can be that nothing will happen, ever with this stock, that I'm about done with it.
What on earth is there to be bullish about grifco? You've been hearing, and saying, that news about filings is due out soon, for the past two months. What does "soon" mean? Didn't we hear from the FOC that Dial said that the audit was done about 5 weeks ago? (friends of the company)
at some point I have lost all hope that this will ever present a good buying opportunity for me.
No one else seems to care, so don't bother doing anything with me in mind. I'm as outta here as I can be.
Some day someone will say, "you know, Dr Bill was right on the money with this one."
Roland I can understand the frustration. I fell in love with a stock once, too, and despite all the evidence to the contrary I thought it was going "to the moon". I can see why you're so upset, after all there hasn't been a meaningful PR out of GFCI in months, they've got the power turned off, the phones don't work right, they are listed as having an address where a "tire shop" is, they've missed out on a HUGE bull run in energy, no one can find out where the share count is, and for some odd reason the CEO won't let anyone talk to the only person who could actually PROVE how many there are, management is secretive and seemingly only talks to "friends of the company" (Jim Dial won't return my calls) despite almost every law there is on the SEC books, there is only one officer, who is the secretary treasurer and president all rolled into one powerful position, the founder of the company doesn't know if he's on the board of directors or not, I mean the list goes on, and if this were MY company I would be REALLY WORRIED as well.
But please, leave the insults for somewhere else. I haven't insulted you, and expect the same courtesy from you.
Thank you, and good luck. I think you're going to need it.
From another board, I just kept thinking grifco grifco grifco
I personally dont think there will ever be a filing, or financials from grifco.
here's the quote================================
Ever wonder why a particular company is made to look like the greatest thing since sliced bread? That sentiment is manufactured.
Newsletter writers are hired -- either secretly or not -- to cheerlead a stock. PR firms are hired and let loose upon an unsuspecting public.."podium time" to hype you on their stock. Funny little "hype" messages are posted on Internet newsgroups by the same cast of usual suspects. The more, the merrier. And a little "juice" can go a long way toward running up the stock price.
The HYPE is on. The more clever a stock promoter, the better. Little gimmicks like
"positioning" are used. Example: Kitty Hawk just like Microsoft!!!!..sound familiar??
(famous for "Avis: We Want To Be #1" and "We Try Harder" and other such slogans). These advertising/PR executives must have stumbled onto this formula after losing their shirts speculating in a few Canadian stock promotions!
The only reason you have been invited to this seemingly incredible banquet is that YOU are the main course. After the market manipulator has suckered you into "his investment," exchanging HIS paper for YOUR cash, the walls begin to close in on you. Why is that?
AS SOON AS THE MARKET MANIPULATOR HAS COMPLETED HIS DISTRIBUTION (DUMPING) OF SHARES, HE WILL START A BAD NEWS OR NO NEWS CAMPAIGN."
Your favorite home-run stock has just stalled or retreated a bit from its high. Suddenly, there is a news VACUUM. Either NO news or BAD rumors,,this is when retail gets shaken out and I cover!!
You'll also see the stock drifting endlessly. You may even experience a helpless feeling, as if you were floating in outer space without a lifeline. That is exactly HOW the market manipulator wants you to feel. See Rule Number Five below. He may also be doing this to avoid the severe disappointment of a "dry hole" or a "failed deal." "Nine out of 10 businesses fail each year and this IS a Venture Capital Startup stock exchange." Don't think it wasn't contrived.
So, how do you know when you are being taken?
ANY STOCK THAT TRADES HUGE VOLUME AT HIGHER PRICES SIGNALS THE DISTRIBUTION PHASE."
Folks IMO, you have been taken!!
Sam
I saw your post at RB. I understand the sentiment, but it ain't gonna happen my friend, at least not IMO.
There's a lot of people who would sell everything at 50. Even more at 40 and probably some millions of shares that would be singing a happy song to get out at 30 and call it a lesson well learned in inept management and stupidity on their own parts for getting involved with a potential stock printing scam like this one.
Here's something to figure out, I run a half a million dollar a year practice, and the phones are always answered, either by staff or an answering service. If caller happen to get to the phone tree, they always get a good message and can listen and make changes before they hang up. These guys are supposedly running a 50-100 (depending on which shady PR you are relying on) MILLION dollar a year business, and they cannot even keep the phones answered during normal business hours.
Besides, even if the revenue pumps were true, it takes market savvy and a great deal of skill to take a company from the pinks to BB much less to AMEX, and Dial hasn't shown one whit of any of the required skillset to get you there, IMO.
AND he's got the job of the secretary and the treasurer to hold down, too!
Not to mention the other few businesses he is purported to own!
Step back and take a real hard look at the big picture here.
What a joke............
Let me get this straight
The power's off, and the secretary is forwarding the calls to her house? The phone doesn't get answered a LOT of the time. The phone answering system doesn't work at all. The Website hasn't been updated in a LONG time.
This is a company that is supposedly awash in revenue. 48 million per year from just one of thousands of products.
PT Barnum was right.
I have been advised by legal counsel to 1)ask for anyone that may have been swayed into NOT purchasing my newsletter, NOT subscribing to my website or to QUIT subscribing to my website, or to refrain in the future from purchasing goods or services from my company/firm/commercial enterprise by the words of BBB or anyone else who claimed I was a "LIAR", to e-mail me at any time. Those of you who might be affected know the address I use commerically or the "contact us" link at my website will work as well. Reference in the subjectline "BEEN BURNED BEFORE LIBEL GRIFCO", please.
and 2)to Refrain from further interaction with BBB, B2B as this proceeds, both to avoid any potential conflict and to keep my patience and temper in check.
I do not tolerate things like this.
The real "hard truth" (if you must really know what I mean) is this: Grifco's share count is less than 37 million o/s!
where is the proof of this?
thanks
AND,
I have given your chance to admit that I wasn't lying. There are laws to cover my rights against someone unfairly maligning me or my reputation. Calling me a jerk is one thing, as often I am, and can admit that freely. Calling me a liar is completely different. If I can prove damages, you're in real trouble, son.
This could cost you. $$$$$$$$$$$
You have no idea who I am or who I work for.
twisting and perverting the hard truth
BBB what is the "hard truth"?
thanks
BTW, I posted the share count that is stated on the website,
par share count 200,000,000
how is that lying, in any way, shape or form?
if you're going to call me a liar BBB you had better some up with some real damn good excuses, or reasons for doing so. I want justification on that comment immediately, as I have a reputation here, I have people reading this material that depend on my insight and knowledge. This is a VERY serious accustaion BBB, one that you had better have good reason for. Calling me a liar has gone too far.
BBB
I said who in their RIGHT mind would keep money in this thing, not the deluded pumpers who are desperate to paint this situation in as good a light as they possibly can. There is NOTHING good going on with this company, and the people who are overloaded are really having to reach for anything good at all to say.
Why does Jim Dial think it's ok to "RegFD" people who are calling him with information on the Jet Motor, the filings status, the CTBG plans etc etc, but not to send out public information to the market.
Do you know what Reg FD is? Do you know that Jim is probably IMO breaking the law by talking to selective people on the phone?
Is Jim Dial honest??????? IYO of course.....
https://esos.state.nv.us/SOSServices/AnonymousAccess/CorpSearch/CorpDetails.aspx?CorpID=507716
Oh My Good Lord!
Secretary - Jim Dial
Treasurer - Jim Dial
President - Jim Dial
Shares - 200,000,000
This is amazing
Who in their right mind would keep money with these guys?