https://www.reuters.com/markets/us/fitch-downgrades-fannie-mae-freddie-mac-after-us-rating-cut-2023-08-02/

Did not know or see that. thanks

Lawyers only need to state the government wants to capitalize and preserve and conserve the GSE's so badly that they are robbing them to death.

Say that about 6 times a day in court and the jury will have fewer doubts

They should have added a slide showing since 2008 through to 2023 zero dividends for both shareholder classes

I gotta pretty good feeling the Charlie Munger FAKE sleeps on a couch in an apartment with 4 others, in Miami, and hangs on the beach all day, in a fanniegate HQ shirt that needs a good washing.

Sweeny was the judge who became expert at running out the clock for shareholders! She was no judge. It's obvious why she was moved up inmposition while she still had shareholders over a barrel, postponing everything shareholder and alliwing government massive lee-way. Lamberth is just more obvious than Sweeny was, Sweeny loved creating false hope for shareholders while allowing government eons of time for rebuttal or other garbage the government threw at her. He allowed the government lawyers a ton of orders that added many years to the case she handled (can't remember which case), in her court plantiffs were always one step forward and two steps back, while the opposite was true for the government lawyers.

Amazing any court is allowed to disallow information and ludicris it can allow redacted information...the term truth in justice burns in a dumpster fire in Lamberths court. Gotta hope his special place is ready for him....down below.

you got that right! Those in JPS need to smell the coffee. Each quarter that goes by with NO CONVERSION gives them thinner and thinner ice to make their argument. The capital raise banshee cry used to be 200 billion and everyone realizes that was unrealisric THEN, and is un-needed NOW....look where we are! Look at the profitability!

The government will absolutely not release until they have confidence (sound and solvent condition) in GSE's to be financially self sufficient, even though the banks keep screwing the housing market pooch about every 6-8 years or so. Government/treasury are way too affraid of bank runs, hence slap on the wrist for them, yet FnF is being built to a fortress of solitude capital level, wink, wink, just in case the government clown pose needs to cover for their banker buddies again, because hey! That's where all their campaign contributions come from now, lmao. Look no further than the constant migration of X-bankers to treasury and X-treasury people to banks. Doesn't take genius IQ to figure out what is going on.

Ignoring political ramifications is detrimental to your investment in this.

Ironic and unbelievable they bring up FnF's previous congressional lobbiests sometimes! The GSE's did and have done far, far less damage lobbying, to the housing market, than the banker cartel has done via numerous historical financial crisis's.

Why is any capital raise needed? The stress tests all point to negative need for that and there is no reason for a par payoff of JPS if government relinquishes it's made up debt owed by the GSE's. JPS keep pushing this capital raise scenario, and have been since the first allowance of retained earnings, now at over 110 billion!!!. THE GOVERNMENT HAS BEEN COMPENSATED IN SPADES! They absolutely know this and it has been verified by a handful of folks in government. Also, releasing the GSE's while needing a gigantic capital raise is not keeping with the conservators job of putting in a "sound, solvent condition" BEFORE releasing.

People can dream of large capital raises and outrageous conversions, but that is not the end target of a true conservatorship, no matter how much you want that to be. Understand that no shareholder currently wields any power over the government since they have "assumed our rights and privileges", and even though we all know this is more of a nationalization than a conservatorship, the government gets away with the nationalization for 15 years by using conservatorship.

What would the networth capital be if the GSE's were not being drained by the gigantic leech and keeping the lights on at the FHFA (1,000's of useless government hires there)? What would capital and networth be if the GSE's were not financing a department of justice (aka joke) legal battle with GSE's for years? They are involved in this, it's not just FHFA legal people. Lastly, what would be the networth capital if all the governments stolen funds were returned? I know, wishful thinking. How many politicians got paid off with cozy positions at banks, or $$$ ?

How are they using it?

The government says a minimum capital needs to be attained before release, yet no one really knows that number or a max number, and they keep running stress tests that say the GSE's have more than adequate capital already....hmmmmm. do ya think maybe, just maybe they'll end up released with way more capital than they need? The goverment announces that they are over capitalized at release,,the stock prices go up, and their warrants are canceled. That would give them seniors, which they could, yes convert, but not liberally, or they risk scaring true investors away, but if stock flies high enough, they could cancel some seniors and convert the rest as a buy off to get the hell out of the GSE's . This would be a win, win, win for government, current investors and new investors, but leave jps as is. There are absolutes in this formula...government must get out of owning anything GSE or investors will assume an anytime take over - again. The capital raise is on going, yet no one is comparing real world stress tests the GSE's went through, to capital on hand. Don't be surprised when JPS stay as they are until a dividend to them is announced a year or more into release. Jmho

Why can't lawyers pull that quote about salting the earth from his book? How could Lamberth deny lawyers information that is not governments and out in the public domain?

This is what's amazing! It's not like the government did just a one off bad thing DURING the consevatorship, it's the whole plan and execution of the conservatorship and the administrations that were all involved. The courts can't justify either parties administrations going in and "customizing" the GSE's to suit their end means every 4 years. They basically keep ruling HERA is open ended (MQD nightmare) so as not to piss either party off. Courts are too afraid what needs to really be done. We have criminals, being overseen by cowards, and the companies being run as flavor of the day corporations, sometimes by incredibly unqualified individuals . The banks kind of deserve this for sure, and they're being upset about it... But we sure as hell don't.

Maybe the best way forward is to challenge that presidential prvelege lock on the documents still being hidden? An FOIA case.
https://www.foia.gov/foia-statute.html

Then there's the cache of documents judges are CYA'ing for government that would blow this wide open. How many miscarriages of justice will be counted and how many judges reputations put in the crapper when those documents get revealed? Come on wiki leaks, come on hackers!

Why are the plantiff lawyers also not revealing this little factoid to the jurors? Very simple to explain that shareholders and the companies are financing the whole crappie FHFA, therefor paying for FHFA's legal council to fight us. I think the jurors would see the ludicrous optics of that, and be more biased towards shareholders claims. Also the total unfairness of it all.

Done also!

Basically in the tank for the government position again, just like last time. I'm really, really hoping it gets jury hung again, then maybe those lawyers will wakey, wakey and demand a new judge.

Curious to see how Lamberth "instructs" (muzzles) the jurors later by telling them to ignore stuff or other ludicris instructions like he did last time. At least last time 4 saw through the skewed judges instructions.

Exactly! In all those movies where a legal battle is going on in the courtroom, it's usually the lawyer throwing out numerous objections that is found to be in the losing argument, and ends up losing. Cross our fingers

Do those slides reflect current updated numbers?

Does anyone have a current list of the current GSE law suits, the on going one's?

I still wonder about all the suits which were dismissed prior to all the different court rulings that have taken place over the years, including SCOTUS. I would think a few could be viable and could be reopened in the current legal decisions world.

Much appreciated the updates Rob. Take a can of air freshener spray and something that beeps. Everytime the government bullshits, beep and spray. The judge should have no need to even ask. Lol

Agree, it should be a simple majority. Unanimous works in the governments favor especially in DC

True. A win though would probably shake the government a bit, depending on what is allowed, reward wise. Since FNMA (commons) is not in this case, shareholders could always follow up with their own suit that would focus more on maximizing a reward value.

Lamberth put his finger on the scales in the last trial numerous times, including capping rewards. I don't think he'll be changing his "MO" much during this trial. If this trial goes to another re-trial, the lawyers for plantiffs must demand a new judge and trial location. Any unanimous decision that says government is right would be extremely skeptical considering the current publics approval opinion of government hovering at about 15%.

Just break(er) it down to simplify for everyone like this:
If 6 jurors (minimum allowed by end of trial, any less and it's a re-trial) then 6 MUST be unanimous in their decision.
If 7 jurors by end of trial, then 7 MUST be unanimous in their decision.
If 8 jurors by end of trial, then 8 MUST be unanimous in their decision.
If 9 jurors by end of trial, then 9 MUST be unanimous in their decision.
If 10 jurors by end of trial, then 10 MUST be unanimous in their decision.
If 11 jurors by end of trial, then 11 MUST be unanimous in their decision.
If 12 jurors (max jurors allowed) by end of trial, then 12 MUST be unanimous in their decision.
Example: If 10 jurors are selected and 2 drop off during trial, then that leaves 8, so 8 jurors must be unanimous in their decision for or against plantifs at the end.

There is verification from navy that 8 jurors are selected. 5 women and 3 men. If more than 2 drop off the jury, then retrial. If all 8 stay, all 8 must be unanimous in their verdict.

Is this spelled out clear enough? Does anyone not understand? Do you agree Breaker? Let's get past this....

That's definitely messed up! Maybe another reason why they want to bury these cases? Maybe one of the big banks Goldman, JP morgan or some others were doing this?

Not if rigged to a big GSE HQ kite! Look for it cruising I-75 northbound from Miami to DC

Gotta be careful though, those overpasses can be brutal

Agree! Exact-a-mundo

Why post this Navy? KT19 could have told you EXACTLY what Lamberth would do.
....... Sarcasm

He's making stuff up as always Brooge
Every admin said congress at some point

My conspiracy theories are just like yours! Unproven. Funny how that works Eh?
If you would have read (RIF reading is fundamental,). I stated JMHO.
OBVIOUSLY you are not aware of the meaning. It's also what you neglect to state every time you seem to want to correct someone to YOUR opinion.

You have no idea how this ends, so everything you state is non factual until it ends. AND THEN it will be a lucky guess on your part, if in fact a few things you state come to fruition. Anyone's guess how this ends irregardless of THE LAW. Laws were made to be changed, challenged and dropped, and believe it or not, they don't need your permission. Lol

No. Much n said congress needed just before the election. He said they needed to get them out, but stated congress, but just before end of Trump's term.

Quit worrying about how right someone is... It will help your problem. So yeah, you're 100% wrong in my book and any law you quote at people is comical, since the current state of affairs makes a mockery of justice. Anyone with ears and eyes knows that.

So good bye cram down, conversion, restructure, fulcrum, etc

As everyone here knows...why does FHFA and Treasury keep talking in circle jerk fashion? Let me explain! Why do they keep saying CONGRESS has to blah, blah, blah? Why did all previous administrations refer back to congress? They all knew THE LAW needs CHANGING! Who changes the law? Congress. So how much faith do you have in the current HERA law and all the NON-LAW BS that was added through the ages? ( MQD self dealing amendments and letter agreements anyone)

Biden can not release, even if HIS lacky treasury and FHFA heads get behind him. Why? Congress will expedite a law so fast, as your head can spin to stop the administrative move....WHY? BECAUSE they can. No mortgage business or bank will transact with an administratively released GSE that has pending congressional law that goes against administrative release. I gurantee you the current congress probably, most likely, has legislation ready to go at a moments notice if Biden, treasury and FHFA try to release without the current Congress okay.

Ignoring the current politics and DC dysfunction will have detrimental affect on ones investments. Thinking you have the market cornered on all political and law variables and varriances is bull-pucky.

Jhmo, as always

Yeah, those laws are worthless. They've proven they can amend, cancel, change at will pretty much, when they're determined enough to get what they want done. So go ahead and quote sections until you're blue in the face. He who makes the laws wins. Absolutely NOTHING is keeping them from changing that minimum capital or max capital standard.

Prophetic picture....

Be careful basing your investment decisions based on "made up government numbers" in a "made up false conservatorship". As someone on here always used to say, "you're not seeing the forest for the trees".

If anyone here admits this conservatorship was not necessary, invalid, concocted, or otherwise not necessary, then assumptions about non existant bankruptcy restructure is irrelevant. The restructure has been taking place right under your nose.....smell the coffee.

Exactly! Also, it will be the dropping of the capital standard that releases us! We build capital currently, and I fully expect the next administration will have the FHFA head drop the capital standard to 3% or below. Not the current 4+%. Then JPS will have zero legs as far as restructuring nonsense. If released with adequate capital based on a new rule, no capital raises required to dilute and turn shareholders off. The key will be not hurting the GSE's while still providing a decent dividend to both share classes after release, once they are deemed capital heavy and are able to pay out dividends both share classes will recover.

I've been saying this for years...JPS will stay as they are, common also. The only value that will be realized will be as we close in on an adequate capital number, which will propel the release. Now..... if you're a betting officianado, which share class jumps the most on release? (sans dividends, since that will be another year or so down the road)

The government knows it's in a catch22, and pissing off the shareholders, the market, or stealing to infinity is not how they get this done securely. Probably why they have the courts losing face to kill any and all law suits.

Whoa! Good find Navy. You'll never even hear a whisper from any JPS holder. Some may be curled up in a ball, rocking back and forth...lol
I have some JPS, but only for the dividend, wnen (if) it resumes