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willy throws a fit every other week
and leaves "for good," just like me
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
you said I don't understand english
and my posts are meaningless. This is a personal attack as per matt. I made less of a personal attack against someone else and I was put in jail. Why is it okay for matt and his buds to make personal attacks and if I reply, I go to jail? This is arbitrary enforcement of the tos and total bull.
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Matt, if others are allowed to attack people
what example am I to follow? You allowed muell to personally attack me. You allow bull to attack willy. You allow willy and hollen to do it also. If you want me to never personally attack anyone, don't let them attack me or else you are sending mixed messages.
Again please be specific about what is a personal attack and what is not. I realize that I can't call a certain poster a wrinkly old lady who sounds like a truck driver gargling hot asphalt but if she posts a total lie which I prove, can I call her a liar? What if a paid stock promoter is posting without his disclaimer. Can I state that he's committing securities fraud or would that be a personal attack? If an independent pump and dumper posts that I'm a paid basher and I'm currently being sued, can I call him a liar? Where do you draw the line between personal attack and honest description? We must refer to the posters as they are directly relevant to what they have posted.
p.s. you do realize when we are typing the ads are flashing/changing like three times and we never see them. Is this fair to your advertisers?
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willy is suspended? news to me
maybe there should be a list of suspended posters, kinda like a hot hot hot list
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right here muell, I posted this before
If a personal attack is any negative adjective or word used in describing or commenting about a poster then you most certainly did that.
"muell, you just posted that I don't understand english
and my response was meaningless." That is a personal attack which would make you a hypocrite.
My point is that it is impossible to never mention or refer to the person who makes the post. The person who makes the point has direct bearing on the post. If a stock promoter sued by the SEC for fraud is posting that POS company is a great company, it should be posted that they were sued for fraud and are probably lying. That would then be a personal attack and not allowed as per Matt. My real point here is that Matt allows these personal attacks against others and myself. I am just not allowed to do the same people a bunch of whining stock promtoers complain and give matt a headache so he takes the easy way out. The fact that one of the promoters is also an advertiser helping matt out by putting his ads in his stock promoting newsletter is also a factor in matt's decision. Matt does not care that the the ads were in the same newsletter as the fraudulent and illegal promotion of npct. Willy misleads in his disclaimer and is posting information from the company which I'm sure he realizes is not truthful.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Here are personal attacks
by bullrider and willy. A few of their posts which were much worse were deleted yesterday yet these are allowed to stand. I made one post which was not even as much a personal attack as these, and I was suspended for over a week. Why are these people not suspended? I personally believe it's because Matt does not enforce the terms of service fairly. If I said this stuff, I'd be permanently deleted. Heck, bullrider was even using obscenities yesterday and he's still here. As I've been here over a week, I'm giving up. Matt just doesn't want me to post here because it makes all the promoters whine and bug him. Don't forget that willy the promoter is also an advertiser and he's doing his big npct push right now. I believe that is also part of hte issue.
http://www.investorshub.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=281254
http://www.investorshub.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=281180
http://www.investorshub.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=281164
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You did call me names, muell
I would think that would be hypocritical, wouldn't you?
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xxray, you don't understand
The person stating they bought the stock at .86 and now it's at .18 or whatever is company paid stock promotion. They are paid to say "I bought this great stock." They keep posting that they're buying, in this case astn, from $18 to .08 They are probably lying and are definitely misleading people into buying more as the price sinks to zero. People who are paid to lie to investors about fake buys deserve no sympathy.
Your post if full of nasty personal attacks. YOu are a hypocrite, just my humble opinion, as always.
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The poster is very relevant
If someone posts "this is a great stock!!!" and they are listed as paid company investor relations and all of their touts have gone to zero, it should be mentioned so people can decide whether or not their posts should be taken seriously. I actually don't have a problem with people calling me a "basher." They do it on RB all day and all night. The thing is if they can use negative adjectives describing me, then I'd like the same treatment.
When someone posts that npct is a naz stock with $1.8M in cash on 2/20/02 when it's an otcbb stock with $1.8M on 12/31/01, that is obviously a total lie. If you are of the mindset that everything is just opinion, then why would you care if I called you a hypester?
You sure are cranky, matt. What's up?
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
muell, you just posted that I don't understand english
and my response was meaningless. THAT is a personal attack, do you agree? If that is considered a personal attack, then matt will have to delete 99% of the posts here and suspend 99% of the people.
These boards are about debating people. How can you debate if you can never say anything negative ever, even if it's the truth? Every post here just about is a personal attack except when certain paid promoters just kiss each other's behinds, "great post!" "wonderful dd" "sign me up!" "I'm nibbling." You want ihub to just be full of the happy stock promoter posts? Is that it?
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
My offer: no personal attacks
We do need some clarification here. If someone states they bought a stock at .86 and now it's at .18, can I call them a bad investor? If someone states a bold face lie and I prove it, can I call them a liar? If someone has been hyping a bunch of total stock scams, can I call them a scammer, con man, hypester, pump and dumper? There is no way that anyone here can post without using any negative adjectives. Please be specific as to what constitutes a personal attack. If the use of any negative adjectives is considered a personal attack, then you must delete 99% of all the posts here right now. Remember, you had better apply the same standards with everyone else as well.
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Bull, did you change your mind about some posts?
editing yourself? Interesting.
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bull, not alienating anyone
You and others post the same stuff everywhere. It's just that if I, mmmary, a female post hte same stuff, I get suspended because Matt doesn't like it personally.
It was earlier today on npct. The exchange was deleted. See all the missing posts?
Attacking me already just because I questioned Matt's enforcement of the rules?
I thought you weren't even going to read or reply to my posts anymore? Didn't you post that earlier? How'd you see my post?
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Matt, it matters because....
investors should not believe what those hypesters have to say because they are just momo players. This means when they're yelling "buy, buy, buy" they are selling, selling, selling, as sara proudly boasted about her sell into the rally on the board. They only hype pump and dump stocks. People need to know the source of the posts so they can take what they say with a grain of salt. They need to know that willy, kloock are company paid stock promotion because they don't disclaim it on the board. You have to look at their profile, dig deep around the sites and maybe you'll see that they were paid by the company in a half an hour or so. These people post that people should buy and hold long because npct is a strong, successful, honest company when the opposite is the truth.
just an aside here but bullrider has been personally attacking people, calling people POS and such and he is still posting. Why the preferential treatment?
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The post in question below
What gets me is that two other posters said the same exact thing and then some and they didn't go to jail. They have since PM'd me that I just shouldn't mention the person by NAME and my post would be fine. I shall do that in the future. Anyone who mentions my name or user name in any negative manner at all will also be reported for personal attack.
"Just because bull isn't hot on npct
does not mean that we are the same person.
If you were to show npct to 1000 regular investors, 99.9% would go "that's a lousy company." The other .01% would be someone who thinks they can do a little momo jobbie on the small company and maybe steal a penny or two from some unsuspecting fool. That is how a regular investor would look at it. I know that rubber, danny, hollen, sara are into momo jobbies. For instance, sara invested in astn, lfza, and npct. They are all otcbb companies with basically no income and definitely no profits. She's obviously not in those companies as real investments as they make no sense as real investments. She's looking for momo, that's all. That's all npct is at best, a momo play."
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I've been in here a week
no one has ever told me what my sentence is. My supposedly horrible tos violation is still up, so are other posts which are far worse than mine. If I'm in here permanently, let me know so I can just leave.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Koikaze, yes, heard Asensio story
I got this email last week from his group
"On Tuesday during my testimony Judge Sheppard asked me "How do you say 'please' in Cuban?" Cuban is not a language. I am Cuban. I speak Spanish. I also speak and understand English. The jury heard the judge's comment. I remained silent. Later, after the Jury was dismissed, I raised the issue with Judge Sheppard. Judge Sheppard disagreed with my opinion that his statement was biased and harmful to my case. Despite this bias and the unlawful restrictions placed on us by Judge Sheppard, Asensio & Company, Inc. was completely exonerated and won the jury's verdicts on each of the 15 counts!"
Thanks for the specifics. That stock sure sounds like iveh.
FTR I used to be sweet and nice in my posting until I was attacked relentlessly by the paid touts and independent pump and dumpers calling me every name in the book, talking about digging my dead mother up to rape her, threatening to find my cat and rape him, death threats, spam, crank calls... I know I should just post my info and leave it at that but if I don't refute the ridiculous lies of the promoters on the boards, they start with the mind games "she refuses to answer the question..." and twist it to seem like I'm paid when I most certainly am not.
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NW: good one
I guess the line between being intentionally conned and being remiss in your dd efforts is kind of grey. Perhaps that is why we have courts and governmental agencies to figure these things out.
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As joemonkey is still here after his attacks....
no comment
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
NW: If I as a licensed broker sell a house
and do not honestly fill in the fair disclosure statement about what the owner and I know about the condition of the house, we both can be held liable for anything which we knowingly omitted. We always recommend that they get an inspection and make them sign off stating that they were advised of this. If their inspector did not find a certain defect, the buyer can sue the inspector. If the buyer did not get an inspection, let's say he was rushed by the seller for the "good quick deal," then he is responsible for any damages found which the owner and broker did not know of. An inspection takes one day and everyone gets one as they're cheap so that doesn't happen often cept when one buddy is buying another buddy's house without a real estate agent. Generally the escrow company will help them fill out the fair disclosure statement and have them mark off about getting an inspection or not. I'm quoting CA RE law so the law may be different in your state.
Basically you can't knowingly con someone as a licensed real estate agent, appraiser or owner.
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NW: some people are born suckers
I've had clients who were wayyyyy too gullible. One of them thought I said 16% commission when I said 6% and he said yes at 16%. Should I have charged him the 16% because he was gullible? No way. I shouldn't have and I didn't. I've had people ask me what real estate to buy and I could easily snooker them. Do I? No, because it's wrong.
Someone may be a sucker but they still don't deserve to get suckered. Is it okay to cheat a drunk? No, it's illegal. What if you see a woman on drugs. Is it okay to rape her? No. What about taking advantage of an old person and have them invest in something that they think is a bank but it's just a scam? I think it's wrong. That's why we have agencies to protect people like these. I don't think anyone deserves to be taken advantage of.
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I'm not paid anything for researching or posting
No one pays me anything in any way, shape or form to research or post about any company.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Here is the disclaimer you edited out willy
the last "report" was paid for. You really edited that thing, didn't you?
Schneider Securities, Inc. acts as a Corporate Consultant to NANOPIERCE Technologies, Inc. and as such has been paid a cash fee and received warrants to purchase shares of the company's common stock as compensation for acting as the company's corporate consultant.
Schneider Securities, Inc. (SSI) has prepared information contained in this reports by James W. Creamer, Research Analyst. This information has been derived from sources considered reliable, but is not guaranteed as to accuracy and does not purport to be a complete analysis of the securities, companies or industries involved. The financial projections and estimates herein represent SSI’s independent analysis based upon information believed to be reliable in conjunction with NPCT’s publicly available financial statements (Forms 10K, 10Q, Proxy Statements and Business Plan). The information in this report is subject to change without notice, and we assume no responsibility to update the information in this report. The forward-looking statements in this report are made pursuant to the safes harbor provisions of the Private Securities Litigation reform Act of 1995. Actual results may differ materially
due to a variety of factors, including the company’s ability to produce and market products and/or services and other risks detailed from time to time in company’s reports files with the Securities and Exchange Commissions. This report is for informational purposes only and is not to be construed as an offer to sell or a solicitation of an offer to buy any securities. Schneider Securities, Inc. or any of its affiliates, officers, employees and members of their families may have a long or short position in these securities mentioned in this report and may act as principal, principal market maker or agent in the buying or selling of these securities. The securities mentioned in this report are considered speculative and should be considered only by those who can afford the risks associated with such investments. NO WARRANTIES, EXPRESSED OR IMPLIED, ARE MADE REGARDING THE SECURITIES IN THIS REPORT.
http://www.schneider-securities.com
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NW: re: personal responsibility
I have met some message board posters who are just plain extremely nice, trusting, gullible people. The CEO of a scammy company and his stock promoters told this person that he will make a guaranteed return of 300% in six months. They told him false production, COG numbers and told him about the millions that will be made. The ceo told him "your patience will be rewarded, thanks for your support." Then the CEO and stock promoters even told the guy that I'm a flat out liar in my posts and they're suing me, which of course was not true. My projections for the company were within 3% of actual and mine were higher. The company and promtoer's projections were way, way, way off, millions in losses instead of profits. This guy believed them because the CEO was an attorney, a ceo, he couldn't lie and not be held responsible. He believed the stock promoter because he'd been on wall street over 30 years and had a nice website. This guy lost his entire retirement. I know, he should have done his own DD. He shouldn't have invested his retirement in a penny stock but this "well respected wall street" guy said it was money in the bank. He even encouraged people to mortgage their house and buy shares on margin.
I still don't think anyone deserves to be lied to, conned, cheated, robbed. Does a mentally retarded person on the street deserve to be robbed because they're stupid? What about a midget, do they deserve to be beaten up because they're small and weak? Some people are just basically too trusting. They can't help it, it's like a financial disability. That's why we have the SEC, FBI, Police, CIA, to protect people from others. That's also why I will post about con jobs on the boards. Nobody deserves to be ripped off, even if they aren't the smartest investor in the world.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
No one hired me, liar
I work for no one. No one compensates me in any way, shape or form to post. You are a total liar. Please prove it. When I say you are paid to post, I include the SEC reference to your payment for investor relations services. Please post the same for me.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
excuse me, willy?
cree $32 to $13 and
cien $21 to $8?
neither situation is good for the investor. If the investor at $32 knew that the CEO had been sued three times for fraud by the SEC, knew that the company had never met one of their projections, knew that the PRs were just fluff knews, then he could have sold at $32 and not be losing at $13.
that has nothing to do with you and your misleading and fraudulent posts.
as per SEC documents
6/3/99 Common Stock 100,000 Investor Relations Harold Engel, Jr.
as per your site and profile, you are Hal Engel Jr.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Agree and disagree, NW
I agree that people should do their DD when investing in the stock market. If they lose, it's generally their fault for not doing proper DD. BUT most people don't do DD and this is what companies count on. They don't even know that they should do more than look at P/E ratio and PPS. I have people ask me about stocks at parties and I always ask them how they heard about a certain stock or investment. They will tell me that a buddy, client mentioned it or that they got an email, saw a PR in the paper. When they get it from sources they know, they generally don't check it out much at all. Heck, they have jobs, families, hobbies; not that much time to do proper dd on investments. They may read some press releases and look at basic numbers but that's it. Not everyone can take apart an SEC doc and see what's really happening. I've noticed for the last year that HDI has been shuffling their numbers. You need to closely look at three reports to notice it. I've been yelling about it for a year now and finally after Enron, HDI may be having to make some adjustments. I posted about this and everyone said I was crazy.
Investors don't like hearing bad news. Investors don't like doing homework and/or don't have the time. Investors just want to hear that they're gonna make a ton of money. That's the way most investors here are and the companies know this which is why they get away with it, time and time again.
People who invest in the ultra risky super speculative things like gold mines, revolutionary new technology, amazing new pharmaceuticals, pyramid schemes, nigerian bank fraud plans... are dreamers just asking to be spanked hard. I bet only .01% of those things ever amount to anything, if that.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Why there's so much stock fraud today
Enron a Rerun of History
Financial fiascoes and 'creative accounting' are nothing new to American investors. Booms often can set the stage for scandals.
By PETER G. GOSSELIN, TIMES STAFF WRITER
WASHINGTON -- When former Enron Chairman Kenneth L. Lay invoked the 5th Amendment against self-incrimination last week, he seemed to put the finishing touch on the energy trader's transformation into the biggest, baddest corporate scandal ever to befall the nation.
But America has a rich history of financial fiascoes that foreshadowed Enron's, and could even have provided the firm its playbook. Most involved extravagant claims of never-before-seen strategies. Many required "creative accounting" to turn losses into gains. Some featured generous campaign contributions. Virtually all came after long stock market run-ups.
More is at stake today: Three times as many Americans have money in stocks now as did during the last truly big bust in the late 1960s and early 1970s. But don't count on legions of bruised shareholders to push through reforms that will put a stop to financial debacles. In the end, policymakers, economists and historians suggest, debacles may be the largely unavoidable price of America's anxious love affair with its wide-open financial markets and their booms and busts. "Booms bring out situations that breed financial scandal," said former Securities and Exchange Commission Chairman Arthur Levitt Jr. "A culture of what-can-we-get-away-with takes hold."
When that happens, Levitt said, regulators come to be viewed as "professional naysayers and doomsday predictors, and they lose credibility.
"That's unfortunate," he said. But, he added, "there is not much you can do about it."
In its heyday, Enron went to considerable lengths to portray itself as something unfathomably new and, at least implicitly, deserving of special treatment. But its techniques came straight from the history books.
To help clear away what the company viewed as outmoded regulations that blocked progress, executives flooded politicians with campaign contributions, almost $2.5 million in 2000--most to now-President Bush--and almost $6 million since 1990.
To drive home the notion of the company's uniqueness, executives adopted the latest business lingo, a nearly impenetrable "new economy-speak."
Jeffrey K. Skilling, the Harvard Business School graduate and one-time consultant who became the company's chief executive, regularly described Enron as an "asset- light" market maker and risk manager able to trade anything from energy to advertising.
In doing so, he glanced over the company's distinctly heavy investment in such things as an Indian power plant, an English water business and a Brazilian electricity distributor. For those who sought to square the mismatch, he reserved a special kind of generational scorn.
His views were summed up in an explanation he offered for hiring the unusually young Andrew S. Fastow as chief financial officer: "We didn't want someone stuck in the past, since the industry of yesterday is no longer."
On such talk, Enron eventually ballooned from a mid-size regional company into one of the largest corporations in America.
So did the highfliers of a previous era: the conglomerates of the 1960s. Both the men and the methods behind Textron, ITT, Ling-Temco-Vought and other hot stocks of the "Go-Go Years" bear a remarkable similarity to Enron's.
In each instance, the players claimed they had hit on something entirely new. In the conglomerates' case, it was the then-unheard-of idea of plastering totally unrelated businesses together.
In each, executives offered elaborate rationales for what they were doing. The conglomerators talked about "synergy" and claimed--wrongly--that their companies were more stable than conventional ones.
The results ranged from disappointing to disastrous.
Yankee Royal Little took a placid New England thread-spinning company called Textron and turned it into a corporate behemoth by snapping up producers of zippers, pens, snowmobiles, eyeglass frames, silverware, golf carts, metalwork machinery, helicopters, rocket engines, ball bearings and gas meters.
The company survived, but only after spending the last two decades selling off most of what Little had bought. Investors who purchased their shares at the height of the conglomerate craze took a bath.
Harold S. Geneen at ITT carried the conglomerate approach so far that by 1972 Time magazine was noting that a consumer seeking to avoid the company "could not rent an Avis car, buy a Levitt house, sleep in a Sheraton hotel, . . . use Scotts fertilizer or seed, eat Wonder bread or Morton's frozen foods."
Like Enron, ITT was a big campaign contributor. But Geneen's idea of how to use political influence made Lay and associates look like choir boys. In 1970, the company offered Republicans $1 million and consulted heavily with the Nixon White House and the CIA when Chile's new socialist president, Salvador Allende, threatened to seize the ITT-owned Chilean Telephone Co. Allende was overthrown with U.S. aid.
ITT started selling off parts of itself in the mid-1980s and split in three in 1995.
Oklahoma electrician Jimmy Ling discovered the wonders of stock by selling shares in his contracting business from a booth at the Texas State Fair in the mid-1950s, and in just more than a decade turned Ling-Temco-Vought into the 14th-largest industrial company in the nation with 120,000 employees.
Like Skilling, Ling insisted that only young, fresh minds could appreciate his strategy. When a leading Wall Street analyst questioned his methods, Ling demanded the man appear before him and, discovering he was middle-aged, dismissed him with a contemptuous, "What could I expect from someone over 40?"
By 1969, LTV was selling $1 billion of meat, $1 billion of steel and $700 million of planes and aerospace hardware. It had become the world's largest manufacturer of sports equipment. It made chemicals, cable, drugs and stereos. Its stock reached $136 a share.
Today, all that's left is a bankrupt steel producer.
Few things about Enron have attracted as much attention as the company's extraordinary talent for painting whatever financial picture it wanted by hiding debt, converting losses to gains and making whole operations vanish at will.
Unluckily for ordinary investors, the company's off-the-books partnerships, stock-backed deals and less-than-arm's-length transactions were not unique to it. A substantial number of companies use similar practices, despite the fact that some contributed to many of the greatest corporate crackups of the last century.
Perhaps the clearest link to past debacles involves Samuel L. Insull, the British-born onetime private secretary to inventor Thomas Edison.
Insull is widely credited with figuring out how to make money from the new electrical technology of the early 20th century, and with assembling one of the largest regional power distribution systems in the country during the 1910s and 1920s.
Lay, Skilling and Enron could rightfully claim to be Insull's historical heirs. They, more than anyone, pressed for taking the next logical step from where Insull left off, linking the country's disparate regional distribution systems into a single national power grid. Their proposal, for which they lobbied heavily with the Bush administration, lies buried in the fine print of the president's yet-to-be-acted-upon energy plan.
But Enron executives were much more interested in following Insull's lead in another area, creative accounting, and the result was a tottering financial structure that ultimately collapsed.
Details of the two groups' methods differed. But their aims were the same: to ensure that insiders maintained control over their respective empires, to ensure that they did so with other people's money, and to attract as little unwanted public or government notice as possible. Their fates were also the same.
Insull's debt-laden empire crumbled in September 1931 in what newspapers at the time said was "the biggest business failure in the history of the world." The collapse took 600,000 shareholders and 500,000 bondholders down with it.
"People felt so swindled they never went near the market again. There was a lost generation of investors," business historian Ron Chernow said.
More than Enron's political clout or its dubious accounting practices, what most outrages the public about the company's collapse is the idea that top executives could walk away with millions of dollars while ordinary employees lost their jobs and retirement savings.
"Americans have always been deeply ambivalent about capitalism," Columbia University historian Alan Brinkley said. "Most people see it as fine as long as it is working for everyone. But they get very distraught if it is not working well or seems to be serving only the top few."
That distress was fed mightily by news that Lay, Enron's former chairman, sold $100 million of company stock last year even as he was trying to persuade company employees to hold on to their shares. That was substantially more than previously reported.
But even with the latest report, the executive who ultimately could come in for the nastiest criticism may not be Lay or Skilling, but former finance chief Fastow.
That's because in addition to designing many of the off-the-books partnerships that fooled the public about Enron's true financial condition, Fastow and an associate are accused by their own board of tweaking the arrangements to draw tens of millions of dollars out of the company for themselves.
In authorizing Fastow to set up key partnerships, the Enron board appears to have allowed him to treat them almost as personal property, even letting him name them after his wife and children.
If board members had looked at similar deals from the past, they might have seen what was coming.
During the 1920s, Albert H. Wiggin, the head of New York's giant Chase National Bank, created a series of private companies, including two named for his daughters, to speculate in Chase stock.
When the 1929 crash occurred, Wiggin was put in charge of propping up the bank's share price. But he used his private firms to take out loans from the bank with which to bet against the stock. During the darkest period of the crash, September through November, he made more than $4 million.
Analysts agree that stopping the likes of Wiggin in advance may be nearly impossible, but some argue that the addition of new laws and regulations over the years has helped discourage fraud by raising the cost of getting caught.
"I doubt any of the principals of Enron or the partnerships are going to look back on this and say, 'Boy was that a wild ride, but was it worth it,' " UC Berkeley economic historian Brad DeLong said.
It remains to be seen whether anyone forfeits his fortune. Ex-junk bond king Michael Milken, who spent almost two years in federal prison for securities fraud and paid more than $1 billion in fines and penalties, was recently estimated to be worth $800 million.
Officially, the Enron hearings underway on Capitol Hill are to help members of Congress decide whether new laws are needed to prevent such a collapse from happening again. But as almost everyone involved understands, they are really morality plays intended to reward good and punish evil.
Most of the executives who have been paraded before the committees and the cameras, including Lay and Fastow, have taken the Fifth and endured hours of insult. Skilling took a different tack and denied knowing of any improper activities or even financial problems, and was ridiculed for his claims.
Lawmakers and historians say that such public pillorying helps build momentum for political change. In Enron's case, the company is quickly emerging as a symbol of business excess that's already helping to prod passage of campaign finance reform, and probably will result in new controls on corporations, pensions and accounting.
But some of the regulators who have won broad new powers through the hearing process argue that, in the final analysis, it is not the extra laws or regulations that are most important, but the public glare on the rich and powerful.
"Whatever rules we pass will not assure us that we will not have another cycle" of Enron-like scandals, Levitt, the former SEC chairman, said last week. "In America, humiliation and embarrassment tend to change behavior faster."
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people still embedding images
I was told you are not allowed to do that and now sara, hollen and joemoney are doing it. You told me only charts from public sources are allowed. Can I embed images? Let me know.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Here you go, Matt
I don't think everything is a fraud and you know that. I invest in solid companies and I don't think they're frauds. I do think that quite a few of these otcbb companies are frauds. So far I've been right in calling frauds astn, jnot and now npct. You can't look at npct and say it's an upstanding honest company, can you?
willy is committing stock fraud by posting an "analyst report" without its disclaimer that he also knows to be wrong. The report states it's a naz stock with 1.8M in cash as of 2/20/02 when it's an otcbb stock with 1.8M as of 12/31/01. They probably have pennies now in cash. Willy knows this yet he posts this. That is securities fraud.
I didn't say you were committing fraud by running your ad in his newsletter. I believe you are condoning it by allowing him to post when he should be suspended for personal attacks. I believe you didn't suspend him BECAUSE you had an ad in his newsletter. I also believe you are conding fraud by having his ad on your site. Look at his picks. People LOSE money on his picks because he hypes stocks that he knows are dogs, for money. He gets paid to hype npct and the rest. Why? Because they're scammy bad investments. You are helping Hal fleece investors, investors reading ihub.
Remember the jagfn thing? You wanted to work with them, scammy jagnotes, so you made their board moderated so any post could be deleted for any reason. It was a public company at the time. You are just as bad as the rest of them, matt.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Why would you swap ads with a promoter?
anyone who posts here? Remember all the problems with the stupid jagfn thread? That is total conflict of interest. If SI were to do the same thing running tokyo joe's ads, I'd say the same exact thing. I don't think you should be running members ads, major conflict of interest. Perhaps that is why willy can attack people and not get suspended.
I said that willy is committing stock fraud and it looks like you condone it as you allow him to violate the tos without suspending him AND you have his ads touting his crummy promotions on the site. Why not sell drugs and kiddie porn if you're gonna be selling securities fraud investments.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Yes, willy posting fraud
I called the guy who wrote that article and asked him where his disclaimer was. He told me to ask the ceo paul. I called IR for npct, left a message about report and disclaimer and no response. I emailed paul and no response. I found other reports from the analyst and they were all paid for.
That guy and willy are intentionally trying to mislead investors by not having a disclaimer and having the incorrect numbers in there. Notice no price projection on this report, not like npct has ever met a price projection.
I also posted the track record of the analyst. When he says buy it means strong sell. All his picks go down by at least 50% instead of up by 400% as he generally projects.
They are getting desperate. Now I do think they'll run out of funds before my estimate of june. I was a little conservative as I used the old burn rate when currently it's higher.
thanks for the post. I was getting lonely in here.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
matt, can we attack and curse in here?
let me know. I've been saving a lot of stuff up for some choice idiots here.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
I didn't say breach of fiduciary relationship
I said conflict of interest. His site is supposed to just be independent people posting their opinion about stocks when really it is a paid vehicle to help stock promoters fleece investors with lies.
your post was a personal attack.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Matt taking ad from company stock promoters
now that is a huge conflict of interest. This is the ad I just saw http://www.willywizard.com/26flash50.gif Willy Wizard is Hal Engle company stock promoter for NPCT. Right now Willy is hyping NPCT . I was suspended yesterday for supposedly a personal attack and today an "analyst report" is released about NPCT that has verbiage from Willy's report in it besides tons of inaccuracies to the point of securities fraud. The report states they have $1.8M as of 2/20/02. They had 1.8M as of 12/31/01. That is stock fraud and it looks like Matt condones it and is in fact being paid for it in ad revenue.
Obviously ihub caters to company stock promoters.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
I just saw willywizard ad!
I don't think he should be allowed to post. conflict of interest! matt and willy, should have known
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
Is this a personal attack?
this is why I'm here. I don't believe it's fair at all. I will start reposting all the attacks against me. They are FAR worse and those people are still there, posting fraud also.
"Just because bull isn't hot on npct
does not mean that we are the same person.
If you were to show npct to 1000 regular investors, 99.9% would go "that's a lousy company." The other .01% would be someone who thinks they can do a little momo jobbie on the small company and maybe steal a penny or two from some unsuspecting fool. That is how a regular investor would look at it. I know that rubber, danny, hollen, sara are into momo jobbies. For instance, sara invested in astn, lfza, and npct. They are all otcbb companies with basically no income and definitely no profits. She's obviously not in those companies as real investments as they make no sense as real investments. She's looking for momo, that's all. That's all npct is at best, a momo play."
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
matt, people committing fraud on npct baord
"someone" stating the last audio interview was not paid for when it was. A company paid stock promoter posting the new speculative buy rating. That guy was sued for fraud by SEC, securities fraud. You are allowing these people to committ fraud on this board.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
while I sit here, con men committing fraud on npct
http://www.sec.gov/litigation/admin/337318.txt
is this why I'm in here? To keep quiet about this? matt and willy been talking?
Securities Act of 1933
Release No. 7318 / August 1, 1996
Securities Exchange Act of 1934
Release No. 37511 / August 1, 1996
Administrative Proceeding
File No. 3-8798
------------------------------
:
In the Matter of :
:
RODGER E. THORNTON : ORDER MAKING FINDINGS
: AND IMPOSING SANCTIONS
:
:
:
-------------------------------
I.
In this proceeding ordered pursuant to Section 8A of the
Securities Act of 1933 ("Securities Act") and Sections 15(b),
19(h) and 21C of the Securities Exchange Act ("Exchange Act")
respondent Rodger E. Thornton ("Thornton") has submitted an Offer
of Settlement ("Offer"), which the Commission has determined to
accept1/. Solely for the purpose of this proceeding and any
other proceeding brought by or on behalf of the Commission or in
which the Commission is a party and without admitting or denying
the Commission's findings contained herein, except as to
jurisdiction and paragraph II.A, which he admits, Thornton
consents to the entry of this Order Making Findings and Imposing
Sanctions set forth below.
II.
On the basis of the Order for Proceedings and the Offer
submitted by Thornton, the Commission finds that:2/
A. Schneider Securities, Inc. ("Schneider"), is a Colorado
corporation registered since 1985 as a broker-dealer
with the Commission pursuant to Section 15(b) of the
1/ The Order for Proceedings in this matter was instituted
September 6, 1995.
2/ Any findings herein are made pursuant to Thornton's Offer
and solely for
the purpose of these proceedings and are not binding on any
other person or
entity named as a Respondent in this or any other proceedings.
Exchange Act. Thornton, a resident of Colorado Springs,
Colorado, was a registered representative for Schneider
from about 1988 to about October 1991. Thornton was
employed as a consultant by Stat-Tech International
Corp. ("Stat-Tech") during about November and December
1991.
B. From in or about October 1991 through November 1991,
Thornton willfully violated Sections 5(a) and 5(c) of
the Securities Act in that he directly and indirectly
made use of the means and instruments of transportation
and communication in interstate commerce and of the
mails to offer to sell, sell and deliver after sale, or
to cause offers, sales and delivery after sale, to
members of the public, certain securities, namely
shares of common stock of Stat-Tech, when no
registration statement was filed or in effect as to the
said securities pursuant to the Securities Act. As
part of and in furtherance of the aforesaid conduct and
activities:
1. While a registered representative for Schneider,
Thornton effected or caused sales of 1,900,000
shares of Stat-Tech stock for Therese M. Lamb
("Lamb"), the wife of Raynard M. Fenster
("Fenster"), president of Stat-Tech;
2. While a consultant with Stat-Tech, Thornton
effected or caused sales of 1,900,000 shares of
Stat-Tech stock, the certificates for which were
in the name of Esther Rogers ("Rogers"), a nominee
for Fenster and Thornton. Thornton was, at the
time he directed such sales, a consultant for
Stat-Tech, and Thornton and Fenster shared part of
the proceeds of the sales.
C. The Commission has reviewed Thornton's sworn financial
statement and other evidence adduced by Thornton.
Provided that he has submitted a true, accurate and
complete sworn affidavit establishing his inability to
pay concerning his financial condition, including his
assets, liabilities, income and expenses, the
Commission has determined that Thornton does not have
the financial ability to pay disgorgement of $83,000 or
a civil penalty.
III.
Based on the foregoing and the Offer, the Commission deems
it appropriate and in the public interest to impose the sanctions
specified in the Offer.
ACCORDINGLY, IT IS ORDERED THAT:
Effective on the second Monday after the date of this Order
Thornton be suspended from association in any capacity with any
broker, dealer, municipal securities dealer, investment company
or investment adviser for a period of six months.
Thornton cease and desist from committing or causing
violations or future violations of Sections 5(a), 5(c) of the
Securities Act.
Thornton pay disgorgement of $83,000, plus interest, at the
legal rate, dating from the date of his violative conduct to the
date of the Order, provided, however, that the payment of such
disgorgement is waived based upon Thornton's current demonstrated
financial inability to pay disgorgement. The Division of
Enforcement may, without prior notice, petition the
Administrative Law Judge to reopen this matter to consider
Thornton's inability to disgorge funds if the Division of
Enforcement obtains information that the financial information
provided by Thornton was inaccurate or incomplete in any material
respect as of the time of such representations. In connection
with such petition, the Administrative Law Judge may consider
ordering Thornton to pay $83,000 in disgorgement, plus interest,
and a civil penalty. Thornton may not, by way of defense to such
petition, contest the allegations or findings in this Order or
assert that disgorgement and/or the payment of a civil penalty
should not be ordered.
Thornton comply with his undertaking to provide to the
Commission within thirty days after the end of the six month
period described above, an affidavit that he has complied fully
with the sanctions described above.
By the Commission.
Jonathan G. Katz
Secretary
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Just say NO to stock fraud!
"Respond to the message, not the messenger!"
If only people could heed their own advice.
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Just say NO to stock fraud!