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Anyone who says they know where this is going, near term, is blowing smoke…these near term bumps are impossible to predict - people like to pretend they can chart these nano-caps etc…it is 100% BS…sure a broken clock is right twice a day, but that is all it is…
Now, long term the trend is obvious….down…down…way down…
Now, the big question is : “can they reverse the long term trend?” Not some near term trend so we hit .007 or some crap…but the long term trend so this truly reverses and goes multiples higher, can sustain those gains, and the company actually has a future…
Something like that will take significant, real, news from the company on the 2023 PIKs and the battery tech…only the battery tech, IMHO, has the interest and potential to truly change the fortunes of this company before it is too late - everything else is just a distraction- they tried making bank from other uses of the clay and all it got us is nearly $50M in debt…they need to close some deals on the battery tech angle and relatively soon to reverse course here…near term gyrations aside.
Good question - people usually have to start giving their shares away at stupidity low levels before this one turns - are we there yet? I hope so, but probably not.
With end of year tax loss selling this month, unless the company comes out with something real good, it could be another tough month…
Applied owned the mine well before they took out these loans - back when they were Atlas mining - back in 2005 Atlas bought the mine for $500k - the Applied of today took over from Atlas in 2009…
About 10 years ago they started with these PIK loans - first for about $10M…
In 2013 and 2012, the Company had accumulated deficits of $38M and $28M, respectively, as a result of unprofitable operations….they have been trying to dig themselves out of that hole (no pun intended) ever since…
So it isn’t like they bought the mine with that money - they racked up huge debt rather quickly via incompetent management through failed, unprofitable operations…it is entirely accurate to say this debt was for nothing and Applied has nothing to show for it -
true, we have the mine, but we had that before…and…for much, much less than $48,000,000…
Agreed - they need to actually put up this time around - doesn’t look like they will have a chance for a “next time” if they miss the target this time around…
Page 16-17 has details of the $48M maturing (basically) on Aug 1, 2023…they will have to do some work on that and what to do there to restructure…
I do note that: “As of September 30, 2022, Geoffrey Scott, a director of the Company owned $4,642,137 of principal of the Series A Notes.”
Don’t remember seeing that before, but I could have just forgotten…
I won’t have a chance for a deep-dive for a day or so - but I noticed $730,000 cash on hand (which equates to more than a third of the share value being cash) which makes the share price look even cheaper here…despite upcoming debt maturity coming mid next year…
Still no fidelity into what we paid the investor relations firm $70,000 to accomplish…
Page 20 has the list of stock issuances for the period (along with note 11 on page 22) - if anyone is interested- no real surprises- just confirm that BMI was issued the 20M as part of deal…they are also financing their insurance premiums as well…
They have refined their business description to now, at least, mention the battery tech: “The Company believes its DRAGONITE halloysite clay has potential use in lithium-ion battery formulations. In particular, halloysite has been shown to be an effective precursor of porous silicon for use as anode material, a coating to improve the conductivity of separators and an additive to improve the conductivity of solid polymer electrolytes.”
Also a casual mention: “In August 2022, the Company received a $1,150,000 U.S. DOE STTR Phase II award to develop a process that produces halloysite-derived porous silicon for use as anode material” - no further elaboration….
You sure you want it deleted? It could be valuable information for others thinking the same thing...
Agreed, expect the 10Q today/tomorrow.
Assuming they still conduct the annual with the Q&A, I will change-up my strategy this year and ask multiple smaller questions rather than compound questions with context.
For the record, I have sent e-mails on the Mr. Z subject - radio silence. I have sent other emails on other topics in the past year as well; radio silence.
It appears the annual Q&A, no matter how poor a forum and how poor their responses are, is the only way to get SOME kind of answers to questions.
In the letter to DoE, Mr. Z says “Halloysite is also plentiful in the U.S. indeed, our Utah sit(e) is the world’s largest high-purity halloysite deposit in the world.”
Like I said - I agree with RazorBoy, he is either delusional, lying, or AMNL is involved -
As per AMNL’s website: “Applied Minerals through its ownership of the Dragon Mine property…The 267-acre Dragon Mine, located in the Tintic Mining District of Utah, is one of, if not the, largest measured resources of halloysite clay in the western hemisphere…”
So, what is the Utah site with the “world’s largest high-purity halloysite deposit?” The Dragon Mine? IMT’s site? Or are they one in the same….somehow???
Yes I agree - the whole “owns and operates one of the world’s largest deposits” - even if Mr. Z opened a competitor mining operation at a separate site, how is it “one of the world’s largest deposits” - and even if true, where did he get the capital to buy “one of the world’s largest deposits” ????—-things do not really seem to add up…either Mr.Z is making things up or somehow AMNL is involved here, though logic would say they are not…we simply don’t know….
I am not sure I share your enthusiasm for competition in a, so far, un-proven tech area.
Also, the idea that Mr. Z didn’t take any IP from AMNL to start IMT seems suspect as well…
I hope the company is protecting its rights, but we have no indication either way…
This is concerning because a rip-off company can take over an area from the original company while the field is still not established …. Like Angry Birds was/is a complete rip-off of “Crush the Castle” (that was made first) - but slick marketing and good timing and the rest is history -
I don’t welcome competitors who try to use our tech and our product prior to us even getting off the ground yet….Chris needs to take Mr.Z’s ability to eff everything here up seriously….
I just don’t get the silence from the company (but I guess that is nothing new) - like I said previously, it is like if the former CEO of Coke starting a company selling “Zoke” soda (that looked and tasted like Coke), you’d expect the new Coke CEO to do/say something…
I mean the guy even went so far as to contact the DoE begging for a deal…sound familiar?
pretending all this ain’t happening and hoping he goes away isn’t going to work….
As an aside, I do have website envy - their’s is all slick and ours hasn’t been updated since Windows 3.0….doesn’t mean much, but as you said it is all about marketing….
I find this part particularly interesting:
“Zeitoun has studied Halloysite and its potential applications for over a decade. The company (assumingely IMT) owns and operates one of the world’s largest deposits of high-purity halloysite located in Eureka, Utah, and processes the mineral at its pilot plant in Vineyard.”
Check out “Exploration Agreement” on page 7 of this filing:
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/8328/000157587222000465/amnl-20220331.htm
Check Twitter instead, they are on there. <EOM>
Indivior to Acquire Opiant Pharmaceuticals
https://www.indivior.com/en/media/press-releases/INDV-OPNT-111422
Congratulations on your first post.
Whatever dude - GL2U - EOM
Oh I agree - but makeup and hair dye etc we have been there with these fringe applications before - these apps won’t be enough in tonnage or $$ - only major shift into an area like battery tech and a large, long term, deal for the clay in relation (size in both tonnage and $$) will permanently change the direction of this company and truly be a “different” path for this one…that is why I am here, if they dropped that pursuit I wouldn’t stick around for the hair dye, sorry that is just me….
100% agree - just like the “game-changing” deal with BASF that amounted to exactly $0 in revenue after 5 years and expired….
In John Templeton's timeless 16 rules for Investment Success (published in 1933) he states: “The investor who says, 'This time is different,' when in fact it's virtually a repeat of an earlier situation, has uttered among the four most costly words in the annals of investing.”
Battery tech is the only thing that will change the direction of this company and the only thing “we” as shareholders should care about - JMHO…GL2UA….
Yes - PRs are needed to get new attention as Twitter really only hits the audience already following - like today’s tweet…
JMHO - I think you have to use the right combo too….
I hope so - I am honestly surprised we are back sub-penny after the last run - i never thought I’d be able to load .004s again - but there they were…
I think we have a good chance at leaving the subs behind for good with the right battery news…
But let’s face it, the other stuff is nice, but the battery tech is the only thing that is going to send this multiples higher and change the company permanently long term…
I hold out hope that one day they will come through on that front…
I wouldn’t call it complaining - when you state a fact it is just that - a fact - not complaint…if you are taking it that way that is on you…
You want complaints? Anyone in this stock for more than a minute would have plenty of those…
Look… I have been here since 2017 - sorry if I have doubts - i have made an enormous amount trading this stock off of (so far) failed promises - I am in now because I hope they can ultimately deliver on a 5 year promise and I’m here for it — but I think most people would agree that they have a whole lot to prove beyond, yet another, promise to communicate…
They have had their moments of communication just to fade out - hopefully they are now reinvigorated?? while some CEOs are better than others - the jury is still out on Chris —- I will say one thing, we have lost over 90% of our stock value since Mr. Z left, and that was only after he tanked the stock 90% during his tenure - just facts…
Glad company told you they will communicate more - just stating that they have said/done that before - I asked them tough questions at the annuals that they always have had flippant responses too - that is just the truth. I have also emailed them multiple times with tough questions that they have ignored - just stating facts.
Folks can draw their own conclusions and frankly I don’t care…Anyone looking at a 5 or 10 year chart can see management has not done much for LT shareholders…just the facts here…
I understand you are excited cause you just visited and they made some promises to communicate with us - great - hope it pans out and history is not indicative…that would be a good thing, and as a shareholder I welcome it…
All that said - I liked the trading Friday and look forward to a ST pop here into the EOY annual call…GL2U.
It is good you have more clarity for yourself as to their operations from your trip -
I asked for more Twitter use two years ago at the annual - they will use it from time to time, but then inevitably fall off - with the state of Twitter lately, it might be best to stick to PRs….
in any event, lack of communication has been a constant theme for this company - there really wasn’t much doubt about the authenticity of their operations, just their lack of telling anyone about them….
I had some hope early in the year when they posted some pictures and was hitting up Musk on Twitter about their product, but that died out after a couple of weeks…
Not a bad day here - 9M volume and up 31% - I’ll take it…
Awesome - look forward to your thoughts - thanks again.
Thanks! Good luck - maybe in-person they will be more forthcoming- we usually have to wait for the annual to get any questions answered by them, and even then they don’t give the best feedback….if you have time, also ask if they are aware of Mr. Z’s new venture and their thoughts on that…
oh wait, sorry, it isn't you that is visiting - maybe the other guy that is visiting can ask?
Great question to ask while you are there...maybe they will answer in person, they don't seem to respond to emails....at least not to me LOL .
Seems like we are here in the same place at the end of every year - looking for answers to important issues the company is silent about, asking about them at the annual, and getting flippant/incomplete answers....I expect more of the same this year - unless they do away with the Q&A section all together....
Hey Razor - we are privy to so little here it is hard to say. If the tech is owned by the University and we licensed it, they could, theoretically license it to someone else (Ionic) unless we had some kind of exclusivity provision in the license that prevented them from doing so-
Much depends on who owns the IP (AMNL or the University) and what is being used - also, it is possible Ionic is using some other method it claims is independent of the AMNL licensed process - we just don't know.
It would be helpful for the company to comment - maybe they will.
I cannot agree enough - I am not scared at all if Mr. Z is our competition. Mr. "We are at least three years away" in 2018, along with downplaying the battery tech initially, are big reasons Applied has been hit so hard these past several years.
Ionic's PRs read a lot like the 2017 Applied PR that Mr. Z was never able to cash-in on...However, that said, if he is stealing the tech or anything isn't fully on the up-and-up, I hope AMNL steps in and protects its/our interest here.
The DD on ionic mt was a good find, good job, it was news to me and I am pretty up on this company - I am very interested in what Applied management has to say about their old CEO's new venture.
To me, it is like the CEO of Coke leaving and then popping-up two years later with "Cool Refreshing Zoke Soda" and just pretending everything is on the up-and-up....it is all just a wee bit sus if you ask me...
However, I agree that there is ALOT going on behind the scenes with this company, the tech, and the competition - the company was doing a good job earlier in the year keeping us informed, but has been trailing off - hopefully all of this kicks Applied into a higher gear overall.
The 267-acre Dragon Mine in Utah is one of, if not the, largest measured resources of halloysite clay in the western hemisphere - but not the "only relevant source". It is Applied's tech along with its access to Halloysite that makes it so valuable, but you need both.
If Mr. Z went off and started his own competing company, fine - however, how he is doing what he is doing with Ionic and their apparent tech, without Applied's OK and not infringing on its intellectual property, would be very interesting to know.
Maybe there is a partnership there after all??? Or maybe they will just be competitors - Competition isn't necessarily a bad thing as long as Applied does not allow the competition to steal its tech without consequence, if that is what is happening here.
Yeah, the “former CEO” part is what concerns me…
Unless Applied comes out and says something it appears the old CEO took the tech and started his own company while Applied sat on its hands the last couple of years - if not affiliated, it smells of a massive IP legal problem for both companies….
I see nothing off the bat to prove the two companies are connected - hopefully, the company will issue a PR and officially weigh-in…
https://secure.utah.gov/bes/displayDetails.html
snazzy website...still would like to see where relationship (if any) with Applied is spelled out. Seems like logical relationship, but does not appear to mention Applied at all...
OK, new company run by Applied's old CEO "Mr. Z".
I get the obvious implied relationship, but do you have anything that explains how the two companies are affiliated? You state "Applied Minerals new company"....where does it say they are a subsidiary of Applied and not just a new competitor launched by the old CEO? Thanks.
100% Jimbo, if the past is any indication here, retail will be giving away their shares before long at stupidly low levels, as we wait on management to update us. Silly, impatient, new holders will work their shares back to folks that have seen this movie many times before.
I do hope that the company will truly update something significant this time around so we do not simply "pop and drop", yet again... This one has so much potential if they can finally work a few deals and close the gap towards commercialization here. I am still holding out hope that management can, and will, surprise us all. GL2U.
Agreed Masta - I am comfortable with my avg. base-position, and the gains I have banked over the years with this one - but we have been waiting since 2017 for that much needed PR/deal to send this to new levels. We have had our pops and drops along the way, and opportunities to trade around - but I believe that is mostly the product of the P&D folks on twitter and the like taking the low float stock for a ride for a bit, then dropping it. True, those folks are probably long gone.....for now....and why we are back to our typical anemic volume days. Folks with actual knowledge about the company, who have been following it for years, are still here - we have just seen this before...have our base positions....and are just waiting...
The stock seemed to take off after announcement of DoE deal, but we on this board knew about that grant like months ago - it really was nothing new. Smart investors took advantage of that knowledge and sold to folks hearing about this company for the first time - hey, it is what it is...
That said, the company has the means and the tech now, and the money - to finally put things together here - If we actually get news, real news...a continuation of that October 2017 PR type news....this bouncing around will mean nothing compared to the rise - IMHO, folks will be chasing for sure; and we go many, many multiples higher.
This is one of the few truly legit companies on the OTC - not without issues, but legit. That doesn't mean they will be successful, just cause they are legit - they have a lot to prove, but I am betting they can put something together in the next couple of months to really turn this company around...that is why I am still here. GL2A.
I understand you are down big and didn’t check the filings - but this company has had a lot of debt for a long time and they have managed to keep O/S relatively reasonable. It is only in the past year or so that O/S has really gone up - still reasonable if you ask me…they also have a good deal of larger funds that hold lots of shares…I wouldn’t be so doom-and-gloom….we are actually in better financial shape than when we rose to .14 a couple of years ago - still think we have a major move with the right news in this one, despite the debt situation….JMHO - GL2U
Nothing new - we have been talking this for awhile now…
Look, there is a reason they are sub-penny
There is a reason they hit .003
If they had no issues, no debt, no convertibles this would not be a penny/sub-penny stock…
However, they have cash now to pay the bills and, hopefully, partner and get the new tech to market - all the while selling clay in other areas to keep the lights on…
THAT is what you buy when you buy stock here…
It is not a perfect company. They do not have perfect management- but I believe their M/C based on the promise of the tech alone should be about 10 times the current stock price -
No, I know with the purchases today I am not buying a $5 stock - but I think with a-little luck and management getting their act together, we can see multiples from here - debt and all -
One thing that some people have pointed out is that only a real company with real promise would get the multiple DoE grants…this is very, very true…
This is not a $5 company right now, but it isn’t a sub-penny company either IMHO -
GL2A