Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
I hope they do something, today isn't off to a great start. But, from what I heard last week, we may have that double down dip again before moving back up. Plan on holding this for a little bit anyways, so I might as well sit back and wait it out.
would have thought the info this morning was good and hopefully the result of the meeting they are doing tomorrow will help even more
just have to wait and see. definitely not going to happen over night.
Saw this report this morning. Just some additional info. Not sure if this is positive news since they announced some of this last week, just more details now and a meeting tomorrow on it. I would think this would start to move up now, but so far its staying down. I see a lot of good buying this morning, but still staying low
RLPC: Patriot Coal sets DIP bank meeting
By Billy Cheung
NEW YORK, July 23 (Reuters) - Having received court approval on July 10 for its $802 million debtor-in-possession (DIP) facility on an interim basis, Patriot Coal (PCXCQ:$0.205,0$-0.014,0-6.39%) is launching syndication of the DIP with a bank meeting set for 1:30 p.m. Tuesday. After rescheduling the deal last week, the company will hold the meeting at the Intercontinental New York Barclay.
The DIP facility consists of three components: a $125 million revolver based on a borrowing base of receivables and cash, a $375 million term loan and $302 million in letters of credit. Only the revolver and term loan will be marketed more broadly.
The DIP revolver would be priced at 325bp over Libor with a 1.5 percent Libor floor. Upfront fees have not been announced. The term loan would carry an 800bp spread to Libor with a 1.5 percent Libor floor. No offer price on the loan has been set yet. The DIP facility maturity can be extended to December 31, 2013, but has a 15-month tenor.
The DIP revolver would refinance the $52 million in letters of credit under the company's prepetition securitization facility. The first draw down of the DIP would also repay $25 million in funded borrowings under Patriot's prepetition credit facility. The remainder of the DIP proceeds would be used to rollover prepetition letters of credit and fund Patriot's ongoing business and general liquidity needs in bankruptcy.
Use of the DIP is subject to minimum liquidity, operating earnings and capital expenditure covenants. Citigroup, Barclays, and Bank of America Merrill Lynch are serving as joint lead arrangers for the DIP financing.
Patriot Coal (PCXCQ:$0.205,0$-0.014,0-6.39%) is a leading producer and marketer of thermal and metallurgical coal in the eastern U.S., with 12 active mining complexes consisting of 19 surface and underground mines in the Appalachia and Illinois Basin. The company controls an estimated 1.9 billion tons of proven and probable reserves.
A final hearing on the DIP has been set for August 2. (Editing By Jon Methven)
then that is a good relief. Looking at some of the values, no way they are going down without a fight and would do everything to get every penny of their money back.
doesn't mean it will happen, but we have a good shot with their help. The EC is a huge step and then the fight begins. Never know how long that will take for all of it to happen, beginning to end with a decision. At least, I'm not sure of any time frame having no past experience.
This is excellent info, thanks for sharing.
Its nice to know we are not alone and that major places own millions of shares. You know they can't be happy that this is in the position it is in. Not sure if this will help to get a price settlement or anything of that sort for all share holders. Never will know I guess.
One thing is for sure, with the millions of shares worth millions of dollars, you would think they won't go down without a huge fight to get their money (or most) of it back. Not sure if that will help the rest of us. I would think we are ALL in the same boat per se.
thanks again for providing this link!
Sorry, forgot to update about the email. So far, no response. I figure IF I get a response, it won't be until next week. I know a lot of people on here are saying I won't, and they are right.
I figure I at least try and see what they say. I have a feeling it will be a "no comment" or "we can't comment, you have to obtain all your information via the web site or public court documents", or something to that affect.
I also understand its a "conspiracy theory" about how people are selling to keep it down. Like I also said, it could be a coincidence. I'm sure it's bad timing and just so happen to have people sell at whatever point. My opinion is the majority have most likely dumped already.
My big question is, are their any huge financial banks or major investors that own millions of shares, still in this? Who knows. If they are, then I'm guessing they think they will get some, most, or all their money back. I doubt most or all, but they may get some. Not sure, I'm assuming we will never really know.
If I hear anything back about the email, I'll share right away.
I believe Im just going to hold on to this until the end of the month to see if anything progresses and then asses my next step from there. If bonds keep going up AND that just so happens to show the PPS is also rising with it, then it may be worth on staying a bit longer. If it gets to a point where I break even, then I may just sell and be thankful I got my money back. I'm not going to get rich here, but was hopeful that I would get something. So that being said, I'm going to be looking to get out even, and if I just so happen to make a few bucks, then I will consider myself lucky. If this pops to over $1 or higher and I missed out, Im not going to kick myself about it. Going to keep saying it could be worse and not get greedy, be smart, and thankful for a lot of people like you, chevy, lostball, etc, on this board that have been gracious enough to provide good input and guidance.
Hey Stanner. I mellowed out because a lot of people on this board are right. This isn't going to jump up to $1 or higher range over night. We have to get past the .20s, then .30s, etc. I know when it starts to move, it will definitely pop. But, as we are all seeing, someone or something is keeping it from going up. Timing it perfectly to sell to keep it down. It could be "coincidence", but the fact that I've seen this pattern all week, that concerns me. I'm hoping it stops soon and we can move up.
Perhaps they are wanting to keep it really low to show the courts just how bad of a situation they are in. Or, perhaps if someone does want to buy out PCX, and this keeps staying low, then they can low ball it and get it. A lot of reasons to do it and manipulate the price. I'm definitely watching and trying to keep tabs.
thanks!
yah, I know right. Someone is doing it. I liked how it shot up 50% over a week ago, but now its shot down every time it tries to head north.
someone is doing it and it almost feels like its done on purpose. Its not even done at a day traders 10% area. I know some day traders might be selling, but if they are, they aren't making that 10%. So someone is doing it to keep it down IMO, and no clue what the reason is
I know bonds are good key to see this go up and I'm sure it will, but for now, someone is trying to keep this down for a reason. very odd and interesting at the same time
Yeah, I know it's a long shot with my email. But, if I can get any response at all, it will be interesting to see what they have. I can't say it will be an "indicator" for us common share holders as they may not be able to make any comments due to the proceedings.
I'm "hoping" to get some sort of feedback and perhaps get lucky that they may mention a possible committee for us share holders, or something positive. Who knows, they may even reply with something saying "we hold our common share holders with great respect for having faith in our company and won't do anything to hurt them"
That's not really saying much, but its something. Who knows what they will say, if anything. Any kind of response is better than none.
One of the things I did put in my email was stating "even though I'm not a huge bank of financial institution, I would hope us common share holders will not be left out in the cold, or be last on the list, especially after being faithful by believing in the company to invest our own personal money"
Its definitely a true statement in which I hope to get a good response
Understood, and excellent points. I believe you are right and I'm going to trust in that it will eventually follow.
Definitely going to take awhile. I've put down the screens to watch this every minute and have walked away. This won't happen over night and its pointless to watch all the time.
Need to be able to tell myself, waiting longer to get my investment back, or at least most of it, is worth waiting longer. Being impatient, I will only lose most if not all my money.
So that being said, going to keep listening to you all, keep reading the posts on this board, and keep doing my DD.
once again, thanks to all of you that have been kind with sharing info to me (and others). This is definitely one of the better boards I've been part of where people are nice and helpful.
I'm hoping to be able to return the favor and share as much as I can to help everyone else
thanks!
thanks Sam. I actually found this info on their site
For all questions pertaining to the administration of these Chapter 11 cases, please contact GCG at:
Patriot Coal Corporation, et al.
c/o GCG
P.O. Box 9898
Dublin, Ohio 43017-5798
Toll Free: 1 (877) 600-6531
International: (336) 542-5677
Email: PCXInfo@gcginc.com
I know many of you already saw that too. But, I decided to send an email to them and see what they said. I made it clear that I understand that they can't tell us everything, or say if the common share holders will get anything. However, I asked if there is going to be a committee to represent us, and if not, what we needed to do in order to get a committee assigned to represent us.
I asked a lot of questions, voiced many concerns, and made it clear that myself (and many others) still believe in this company and hope that a company such as this, would not let down their investors and leave us all in the cold.
If I hear anything back, regardless of what they say, I will share it ASAP
obviously everyone has already read this:
http://www.patriotcoal.com/assets//files/PCX%20Chapter%2011%20FAQ%20-%20Investor.PDF
I know we are all taking a chance by holding our shares IF they decide to emerge from BK and start from scratch. It also states there is no word or guarantee any of the common share holders will be compensated for their current shares.
I understand those risks, but feel that IF this is to happen and we can get "screwed" out of the shares and get nothing from them, it won't be for at least 6 months to a year (if not longer).
However, I'm looking for an email address or someone to contact to see if anyone is fighting for us. I know we don't have a committee, or anything of that sort.
As others have mentioned, financial banks or other investment banks have also put money into PCX. I'm sure they are holding millions of shares. They appear to be in the same boat, but I don't think they will go down without fighting for their money back, or some sort of compensation.
Does anyone know, or heard of, a company that has personally paid those banks back, but never paid individual investors (such as us)?
I know its a long process and I'm going to wait it out for awhile. But just seeing if anyone knows a place we (investors of the commons) can voice our concerns and get some sort of feedback. Or are we just left in the dark and have to keep following all the dockets and court proceedings? Without much PR or updates by the company directly anymore (probably none at all) it will make it difficult to see where this is at
I'm still digging around to see if there is anyone we are able to get some sort of feedback from, but so far no luck.
Yes, agreed on that as well. It looks like its either day traders or someone keeping it down for whatever reason.
I'm hoping they are pretty much all done by today and we can start moving up. I know on Friday's it can be tough and it seems the overall is down anyways. So that being said, gonna go low with a nice up later on.
It may be a little bit before we get to the .61 area, probably another week or 2, or even more. Once we get rid of the day traders and shorters, we'll be just fine. We all know this is still worth a lot more than where it is now.
going to finally listen to you all and not concern myself with it going all over the place. It will happen, just not going to happen over night.
yes, I fully agree. My problem is, obviously, I'm not being patient enough.
So that being said, I'm gonna just shut up and not worry about the day by day due to the shorters. I'm sure that big leap will be coming and I'll just have to wait on it.
I may just cash in if it does, or keep riding and waiting for higher. But, at the same time, not getting "greedy". Be smart about it and be happy that I got something, and not left with nothing.
Once again, many thanks to you, and so many others, for your input.
I'll try to chime in here and there with some good info. Anything I find during my DD and other research, I'll share with everyone here
many thanks Ernie. My avg cost right now is at .31. So I'm not in a bad area, just the normal frustration with trying to get this back up and watching it go in that direction, to only get squashed by someone dumping a ton of shares.
I'm still planning on holding for a little bit, but definitely not a year.
As you said, and several others, I may just cut my losses, or wait until it gets to the .31 and just break even. By the way its going, it can be tomorrow, or next week, or week after.
Im not really in a "hurry", but just annoyed on the horrible ups and downs...which turns out to be mainly "downs".
thanks!
guess the $1 by the end of the week isn't gonna happen
Oh well, I didn't really expect it to...just "hoped". A lot of "hope" out there.
I'm still intrigued on the talk on here about buyout at $2.50. that seems like it will never happen. Would be nice, but how can anyone think that would even happen, especially with the current price it's at now? Who is fighting for us to get that number?
What about those that hold shares at a much higher price? Who is fighting for them to get that price higher?
not sure, but a lot of doubt going into it. You would think with all those bonds prices going up, and a lot of exposure on some boards I saw this week, we would have been up to the .50s by now. We can't even get past .25 without someone dumping everything and their mom to push it down. A gap up on the morning, or some other day? who knows. So far I've never seen it here since BK, but then again, its only been a week or more since official BK.
if anyone has some good news, would be awesome to get some. Doesn't sound too good for us common share holders. Trying to keep positive, but good lord, its getting tough
that would be nice, but tough when we keep getting huge sell off chunks. Just saw about 400k or more total get dumped to push us way down again. There is a pattern there. Every time we bump up, someone sells off a huge chunk (150k or higher) to push it back down. Not sure if this is done on purpose to keep it low or what. Can't catch a break if no one lets it climb.
We have a chance for this to pop and do a gap up in some areas, but if people keep selling massive chunks like that, its going to be tough and take a lot longer
this does sound like good news, but the stock is still sucking at the bottom. Very disappointing as I was figuring we would be in the .30s by now.
It does appear that the "shorters" are causing and keeping this down. I'm not sure why, but it is obvious. Anytime we see some good uptick, someone dumps 150k or more shares and dumps us way down again. Its like clock work. We go up, start moving up more and then BAM, someone dumps a HUGE amount of shares to bring us way down again.
Not sure what is going on, but hopefully they will be done with all of this soon. getting old and annoying very fast
to the one who PM'd me earlier with good info (and you know who you are), thanks again. Very appreciate all the sharing! Excellent points and statements made, and I agree 100%.
excellent share, I'll keep reading up on the older stuff then and hopefully get more educated on it to better understand!
Thanks Stanner. I read them before I made my post. But still trying to get my head around this correctly without making a total fool out of myself. I don't want to misinterpret anything the wrong way, and therefore, look to get some clarification from others. I'd hate to chime in, or think that something could be great for others, but turns out that its nothing that I thought it was in the first place.
I've been reading up a lot more than usual with this. google is definitely my friend in this case. always tracking the main site and the other site they have for the BK info. But, you can only get so much that is out there.
thanks again for all the help, assistance, and info that many others keep sharing. I'm hopeful that we don't get the "shaft" and we can get something out of this. The "buyout" post sounds like a good possible idea. But then again, it may not happen, or it could be who knows how long away from happening, etc.
That's another thing I'm trying to read up on even more is IF that is a possibility, what are the likely time frames for judge to make a ruling on it, etc. Not even sure that this is even on a document to a judge to even MAKE a ruling on. Especially if we don't have any representation to push it for the common share holder
good info, thanks for sharing. I see you've been posting this on other boards. Hopefully this will help push the stock price up. so far it doesn't seem to be happening though.
I'm interested in the gap at .61. That would be a good key piece for it to keep climbing
reading through all the posts, but I wanted to reply to this one
Are you saying that, there is a possible chance that there could be a "$2.50 share buyout" for all current shareholders (of PCX and PCXCQ)?
If that is true, you are also saying it can be passed without really any representations.
If that is the case, what is the time frame we are looking at here? Or is this still way down the field and not even on the radar yet.
Or am I reading all of this incorrectly.
I'm all for an early exit and for everyone to get $2.50 (or more, especially for those who have been holding for so long). This way we can stop wasting time on what's going on. Get us all out of this situation and let them keep moving forward on BK proceedings and if they want to start all over from scratch, then at least we won't be all stuck holding an empty bag
good info, thanks for sharing. I was actually thinking about GM and Ford for their issues. I believe Ford actually took themselves back to "private" status, so that wouldn't be good either.
I noticed you've been on PCX for a long time and a moderator. You still holding shares here, or did you cut your losses and sell?
I guess holding for the week or next won't really cause any issues for me. But if I'm looking to hold for a month or longer, I guess then that's where I will be taking a big risk in getting the "shaft" and losing everything if we are all left out.
thanks again, as always, to you and others for sharing good information.
I've been searching around and doing other DD on PCX, and other BK situations. Its nice to see some played nicely for others, who is to know if this will also happen here. I posted a link earlier for the top penny stocks to trade, and PCX was #1 on the list. When I saw it, I saw we started to rise about an hour or so after. Was hoping that was going to lift us very high, but apparently fizzled out again
So, what you're saying essentially is, if the husband finds the new wife, he's going to forget about the old wife and the "kids"? And the "kids" being the common share holders.
The husband/father is going to start all over again, with a new wife and eventually new "kids", and the old "kids" don't get jack crap? no child support, etc?
damn if that is true, that is harsh.
Then I'd like to know how PCX will eventually get new "kids" in all this. How will they find new faithful "kids" (investors) knowing that they no longer care about their older "kids".
If I was someone that was not already in this, and then saw PCX come out of the BK and get back on its feet. Then I would want to invest and see that they gave the "shaft" to the old "kids", then why would I want to invest? Knowing that it could happen to me that they totally just abandoned the old "kids" and moved on without anything at all.
Kind of f'd up. I know it's a brutal market world, but if you truly want a company to grow with future investors, you would think that "loyalty" would be on the highest on the list. If they did that, I would hope they wouldn't get anyone to invest in it. I would have no problem making sure people are aware how shady it can be. yes, I understand the "risks" when you invest, but disclosing just how bad they are to others would raise the risk level even higher.
yah, I'm assuming its a day trader. We were on our way to .27 and kind of stalled there a bit and then that didn't help
oh well, tomorrow is another day and hopefully we can keep moving up.
well we HAD a chance of making it in green today....almost past .26 and climbing, but someone had to dump a ton of shares and force it down again. I'm assuming day traders making their 10%.
Not sure if we are going to be able to keep climbing out if they keep doing it over and over. Force it down and dump at 10%, not letting it keep climbing. how depressing
oh well, gotta keep head up and watch for it to climb eventually. would be nice for a gap up somewhere and build up to an even bigger climb. Saw the 50 to 60% climb last week, which is awesome. Hopefully we'll get lucky and get that, or even more.
here is to keeping and being positive!
here is something interesting. We are #1 on the list
http://www.stockstobuy.org/profiles/blogs/penny-stocks-to-buy-7-19-12-july-19-2012
thanks for keeping us posted!
I'm definitely interesting in watching the patterns as well. Haven't heard anything about the meeting today. I'm trying to google something and checking their sites to see if they posted any updates. I'm not counting on it though, but wouldn't help to keep looking to see.
I see some good and big buys and its on its way up, but then someone sells a little and keeps it down. I don't have access to L2, but something looks like it's keeping it from popping much higher. Just when we got good momentum, it pops back down. Was definitely looking to see this go up to almost .30 today, but guess I was wrong.
volume still looking well though
sweet baby geezus, thats a good sign. I know everyone is saying the bonds are useless on the stock price, but its nice to see that its going up and hopefully that may "help" the price go up in the long run.
I'm hoping it does keep going up and others are right in thinking its going to end in the .30s today. Would be nice.
don't have access to L2 stuff, but saw a huge sell off this morning which drove it down. it was moving up a bit again, and once again, big sell off. very annoying
hopefully we'll have a good afternoon/late push up to .30s, but who knows.
I love your positive outlook, Sam. I would hope that is something they would do to ensure the good outlook of the company going forward.
They have got to have plenty of people harping at them about the current price and where its at right now. I have no doubt huge financial investor companies have tons of shares in this. Some I'm sure have MILLIONS of shares at the higher prices (2 to $3 range or higher). They must be waiting patiently to see what happens, or have already sold out, who knows. But they must be looking to see what happens and get back on track
would be awesome if they made some great positive announcement like this.
In an hour, is that where they finally do the committee?
If that is the case, then let me extend my "thanks"
I'm hoping to be able to enjoy the ride with everyone.
many thanks blhawk! I'm still going to hold this for a little bit. But, at the same time, not get greedy and hold off for a huge pay day. If its stalling and not doing well, bonds are going lower, and I still have a chance at a profit, I may just say "forget this" and hop out.
I still believe there is a good chance to make out huge. However, I can't let greed and "hope" get in the way of common sense. If this isn't going to go anywhere, don't hold it for too long and lose everything
Everyone has been great with support, comments, feedback, advice, and some PMs with great info (thanks, you know who you are!).
Can't thank you all enough. I REALLY hope this gets out of the cellar and gets back to where it should be. Even IF I'm not in this for a long extended period of time, I hope those will get their money back, and then some
hopefully the uptick yesterday is a start of good things to come.
thanks to all again!
-Frank
Yah, good advice. My commission is only 7.95 a trade, so its not much. I own a lot of shares and was looking to ride this for awhile and I may be doing that
however, not being THAT dumb/naive, if its not going to keep floating up like it should be (.30s or even up to $1 or higher), then I will either try and break even, or make a few bucks. I'd take that as appose to taking huge losses.
I still believe this baby will keep going up, and perhaps well in the .30s and higher. But, as I'm sure you are well aware, any profit is much better than none. It may have to cut losses and move on.
many thanks for all the help!
haha ya I saw it jump and then I saw the typical "dump". People taking their 10% or whatever and dumping it. I'm in at .26 with avg of .31, so guess I'll see where it goes
how depressing...guess best question is, why am I still holding?
Anyone else have a "light at the end of the tunnel" comment?
I'm assuming if anyone is holding, don't hold on to this for too long then. If it goes up a little bit, I guess just sell and get out. Not sure how to take on this. I know it's in BK and this is risky/tricky.
But from the sound of it, its not good. I'm trying to stay and keep positive, but I'm not that experienced as many of you.
Understood, thanks for all the help, info, and sharing
I think the site is this:
http://www.patriotcaseinfo.com/
At least that's the one I look at to see what's going on and gather all recent information that they keep up to date
excellent info, thanks as always LostBall.
I've been following the court docs as best as I can. They have the link on their site for the court filings and also I see, as you pointed out, the committee is being done on the 18th (tomorrow).
I am concerned about all of us getting the shaft and this goes away. I know this a risk, but I like to think this is a better stock than some others out there. Hopefully this will play out for us all. I'd hate to have myself, and everyone else lose our investment that quick.
thanks again!
many thanks RoboTrader, good information to know.
I've been reading some of the docs, not all. There aren't too many, but haven't gone through them all yet.
As you mentioned, they are looking on the good side. The news released yesterday with the judge approving was good news, at least IMO. I think if the judges keep approving as it keeps moving along, it will stay on the positive side and keep moving it up.
thanks again!
What's your take on this LongBall? i would think there would be some sort of PRs or some info shared to all shareholders as to the progress.
In addition, I guess there is a risk in everything you invest in. I was playing a little bit here and there with penny stocks, which is VERY risky. I made a few bucks, not much. But like you and others say, it can be wiped out quickly
Like the equity and other funds with this, we can easily go lower, or go higher. IMO, with this, its a little "less" risky as appose to many other penny stocks. I still don't consider this a "penny stock" as it should be in the $2 or $3 range. Its just bad luck with the BK.
But, I think with the majority on here, the chances of this getting back on its feet is much better than going away all together.
once again, I've accepted the risk going into this since i jumped in again AFTER the BK had happened.
Hopefully we can keep going up. Looks to be stalling and falling flat, not much here, just like another said. But we can see a jump pretty easy. I'd like to have some good news to further help it along, but who knows.
With those other stocks that were quoted that did a good bounce back, did those do many PRs? What helped them pop back up really well?
I also think this is in better situation than the others, but then again, what helped those other stocks do such a good turn around? And is PCX doing the same thing to bounce this back?
outstanding! This makes perfect sense. This is what I was thinking about and what it meant, but I think I was over thinking it as to be something else.
This is definitely a good sign then. It looks like we are moving up a bit. Was definitely looking to see that we get above .30s today. Still early so it can happen. Still hoping to be in the $1 by the end of the week, but at the same time, as long as it keeps moving up positively, then that's also cool with me. I don't mind waiting another week or longer for it to get to $1 or higher range
once again, can't thank you enough for taking time to share this info
kind regards,
-Frank