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I hope she rips the gov't a new one.
Tells them to get off their blooming arse!
You, know.... before the old age kicks in!
Until the share price resets, based upon freedom, canceled warrants and returned money raising outside cash is a fail.
What are they going to sell 30Billion shares at $1 a share? These people are not smart.
This windfall... business is questionable.
So, the governemnt is allowed to get a wndfall a massive 150Billion + windfall.. for effectively risking 0; absolutely nothing!
and a true investor that risks $10,000 can't look to earn $$ on their investment?
Remember,..
The government not only injected money they didnt need but TOOK control of the entities... that never needed it!
While we risk $$ without taking control!!!
And they call what we expect as investors as a windfall???
No.. stop it they embarrass themselves.
What they have taken has been a windfall what we are to earn is called a risk based return on a calculated investment.
Their narrative is BACKWARDS!
problem is the greedyment changed the rules... sure keep your money, but now you owe it to me as liquidation pref.. in a sense its fools gold.
Until something is changed....
Really... now its the end of 2020 before they'll do anything... this guy is such a shmuck. Can you imagine if the boss came to you and said, order me a cheeseburger. And you tell him that you are going to buy a calf ..... and once you slaughter the thing you are going to plant the wheat for for the bun... This guy is a total liar.
Get off you rear end and get this done already. Stop stalling!
Criminal the behavior.
A financial settlement that resolved all of the lawsuits in a massive class action would be ideal.
What would it look like.
1. NWS canceled.
2. Warrants canceled
3. Intereset rate reset to market rates (retro releif)
4. Gov't debt repaid with prior payments
5. Excess $$ returned to companies
6. cash to preferred allocated over 12 year holding period equal to dividend's not paid plus another 30%
7. Cash to common allocated over 12 year period equal to $1-$2 per share per year plus 30%
I'd expect preferred market value to be just that.
As for common it too would trade at value.
How much money will it take to fix the government's problem? Billions.
Ya know...
i read this statement by this idiotard and its repeated so often like a cramer ideaolog... and its frankly Cow Patties...
However, it seems to have dawned on everyone “in the room” that a $40bn-plus payout to Wall Street speculators would be a bad look" ya think? $FNMA US housing finance is stuck in a complex knot of contradictions https://ft.com/content/27c08be9-a2a2-4247-a16b-b664bdbd2d2c via @financialtimes
Why is that?
Because simple.
The government made this mess. Not the shareholders not those that beleived in the companies.
The government owns this mess. They caused it they did this and you know to bad if the government screwed the pooch..
its 100% a Government mess and the fact that they "can't" stand the mess they did...
Well
Suck it..
Too Bad.
Own it
I'll believe it when we see it.
Lots of delay delay tactical words mean nothing until action.
Want some solid action rather than more words.
All of this could be done or have been done anytime long time ago.
Hope mnunchie isn't just blown smoke
Quite a few 401K plans have American Growth fun in their retirement plan options.
I'd say there would be a lot of pleased retirees when this fire gets lit.
FandF investors are quite plentiful, they just don't know it.
Its actually not a hit piece but a slam of the government and more phony accounting they were / are doing.
Its really just a matter of telling people they are cooking the books... again.
Nothing that honesty can't fix.
Sunshine... sure cures lots of ills.
Watch the cockroaches run and hide
What i don't get is...
if this is really true.. and i would like to think that other smart people are involved (believers in the rule of law, the american way of life, etc. etc.
That the share price would have to be going up and going up in a good way a big way, that people would be investing and holding.
Sure we've moved up and retraced where we were a few years ago, but its not what normal companies do.
BC...
Welcome back...
Your analysis is spot on.
JPS will get par value based upon dividend yield .. so may actually trade higher than par, won't be converted and could be "redeemed" or repurchased in the market.
The upside for JPS is limited.
The upside for Common is unlimited - not infinite but could be a multiple of 40-50x current price. (Price...not value)
Yep
And accomplished in a year... what could have been done in two weeks.
Warrants will never be used.
Juniors will eventually be redeemed for cash at par. No reason to convert them.
With that
How am i wrong?
A normal valuation at around 12 pe... would be what?
$130? Maybe a little less for the pref shares outstanding?
And people want to raise money at $3 a share? Wow... incredible lack of intelligence.
Once all the noise is eliminated this thing easily trades on up there.
Sorry,
Disagree.
Valuation restored will make it easy to raise money in this money maker. It made money (CASH FLOW) from operations for / since it came into existence (Not sure, but certainly over the last 20 years).
True valuation will make it easy.
Once the road map is set.
The chains that bind will be released
Once that occurs, when the warrants are canceled and its freely trading based upon true value of Earnings Per Share and without the cram down that is happening now the share price will reset to what it should be be based upon fundamentals...
Then the share price will be a function of eps / pe and expectations. Right now its being tamped down purposely.
After the announcements, the shares trade a fair value, which it does not trade at today. That share price will be a lot higher than it is today.
Thus to raise $$ the, offering will be at value. Then, that money raised will be used for the company and not given away to government and that money a lot of it will create additional income so, not all of it will be wilted away.
Look for a houligan lowkey to figure this out, its not complicated.
Demarco was sort of a mindless twit anyway. Had he been worth a tinkers xyz he'd have done something positive for the preserve and conserve mantra he was charged with instead of giving away the farm for what was what?
Nothing.
What a tool.
So, today we'll announce that in 6 weeks... something that's already written and approved will be released?
How stupid.
Get on with it already.
Let my people go.
Problem for fhfa and treasury is...
if ...
unconstitutional then prior acts are void.
If prior acts are void. Then so is the nws amongst others.
And that would be a good thing for shareholders.
Well
Fair value of the Commons as is ... returned to the share holders, without the warrants, and with $ returned to the company after the NWS is canceled (SPS repaid - as they've been)
For fannie.. 1.2B shares outstanding EPS is $10+ a share. So, 12x would be...
Fair value should easily be north of $120...
But, I'd be happy as a lark at $65...
BD - when i wrote 10 years i was rounding... down. I've been in this thing since September 2008.
I was one of the few advocates for f and f on the early yahoo board that pointed out the lunacy of the excess reserves -v the charge offs and how fandf were so violating accounting standards.
So, i've run numbers, analyzed the balance sheets, the disclosures and recalculated the loan interest.
I put good money in this when those like jim cramer were calling them zommbies. Stupid journalists were writing nonsense articles and well its been a time.
So, good, luck all
DB - hey, i like many are so overly frustrated by all 10 year delay.
I want this so badly to be righted....
I want it for not just me, my family, but for all of those that have been shafted for so long.
So, i was commenting essentially for them to grow a set and say NO more.
But, yeah you are not wrong.
Sorry i have to disagree...
The plaintiffs have agreed to all the stalling to
Not once to my knowlege have the plaintiffs said...
Enough already lets get on with it. Neither the judge nor the plaintiffs have put any pressure on the situation to move it along. Which is why we are 10 years in...
Time to get on with it.
The reason the gov't wants this is to stop the trial. and to prevent a verdict against them.
its totally a selfish idea and i hope it backfires!!!!
If the gov't stops being greedy and lets thing happen they way they easily could. Yes 100 a share for common could occur. Yes, this is as is no splits.
Problem is...
I just don't understand what is actually taking so long.
I mean,
if they really wanted to do it.
get it done.
why stall out.
Agree.
This is likely the best conversion deal the preferred are going to be getting.
However, eventually.... it will probably get 4 ($25) prefs for 1 common.
As those 3.339 common they could get tomorrow will possibly be 13 prefs...
Could happen this year... or next?
So why wait.
JB...
You know. I get it. I understand it..
but, there are many who don't.
The stock doesn't reflect the warrants being dead, because until they are some gov't hack will try and then we'll have lots of lawsuits.
So, what the issue is...
in order to recap the companies...
they have to be done done.
no one will put any new money in without certainty that some stupidity won't rule.
And yes.. when in then history of this country has one government entity given another government entity 80% of a company for $0. one they don't own but "control". See, it crazy.
Its the FHFA;s duty to make the warrants dead dead. That should be houligan lowkey's prime objective.
The big problem here is that once again T Howard does not address the simple fact that the warrants will have to be resolved before any third party money is raised.
The warrants will have to either expire worthless or be tendered back to the company to make the capital structure work.
Treasury / FHFA will have to become shareholder friendly to make this work. Otherwise they'll face a daunting up hill battle. Only real way to do that is to settle, pay homage and do what is right.
While gov't will outlive everyone so they are in no hurry, but eventually, they'll figure it out.
Predicting ... 4 $25 preferred for 1 Common at fair value.
If the NWS gets unwound and the $$ is used to pay off the pref then the government is overpaid and owes $$ back to each entity.
The warrant is really the elephant in the room.
If not for that money grab by govenrment this thing is so much easier to resolve.
I think that has to be taken into consideration and will represent more of a taking. Thus the best thing to do with that is to void them. Makes the absolute best sense to all concerned. Otherwise more uncertainty will abound. This is not what the government truly wants.
This is so wrong.
The warrant itself is not ripe for a claim until utilized, until then they are an intangible nothing.
If the treasury tries to use them that is when an injunction could be filed and lawsuits fired up.
Until then, they are really a nothing.
And yes, they'd be a taking, in that they represent 80% of something of value that would be taken. Yes, its an intangible thing a value, but it has value and it can be measured at value or inkind. Its the inkind remedy that could be very expensive.
These people are dreaming if they really think they'll dilute the common shareholders into oblivion without spurring more lawsuits. Lawsuits that will prevail and be very expensive to the government.
Plus, in order to raise any money they, just will simply have to settle the lawsuits and create absolution.
Only way that happens is to open the check book and take a look in the mirror.
Government here is the problem.
They are greedy.
Its got to stop.
Something to keep in mind.
if the entities need 50 Bil and raise 50 bil with re or a raise they will have $50bil with which they'll each earn another 2.5B off of or more so annually, thus yes a raise will be dilutive, but they'll earn with so ... its not just dilutive...
Also, at fair value... around $100 a share or more they don't need to issue that many shares to raise that 25 Billion.
From seaking alpha article
Expects Fannie to price common shares in the offering at $5 each and Freddie to price at $4.50 apiece.
Are these people off their rocker? If a 20-1 forward split.. but this is crazy nuts.
You've got entities earning 10B a year with 1B outstanding shares ?? Gives me some $10 Earnings per share price ... should yield a share price so much higher than $5...why would you ever issues shares at a multiple of 1/2?
How insanely crazy...
ODG!
My experience with these people is not favorable. They are not good for the companies they represent, they are not good for the employees, not good for the shareholders, they are only good for the debt holders in the way the' did business, again in my experience.
Its kind of scary as they really are beholding to tehmselves and the debt holders in this case treasury. They really could not have picked anyone more unfavorable to the owners / shareholders than these people.
Lets hope this time the spots are changed.
GRrrrrr...
I could see a sell off
Not favorable...
fingers x'd.
More free money to the government ... no
The government is greedy.
They've been fully compensated for this travesty
Your second notation about no "current" challenge may be true. But, also there is no "current" challenge does not mean there won't be a challenge.
There is a difference and the challenge isn't ripe yet, which is fine. If it is, there will be lots of challenges and the cost of that will be steep to the government when they lose as they most certainly will lose.
That is my opinion, they will lose.
The question as to damages or rescission if they do could be very large. For all the reasons stated by so many, the government after being repaid their blood money, will have no claim to what they loot they took.
It will just get uglier, provided we live long enough to make it happen.
Totally agree.
However, i was responding to the thompson discussion on the warrants and what he didn't say.