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I do not insult Americans in general, certainly not your country as a whole. Just a stupid, incompetent, irresponsible (may be even dishonest ??) and those supporting him and his actions blindly, whatever they cost in terms of lost of lifes, dollars.
As I said, That's it my friend. You're totally hopeless.
'knocking our President and oour country'.
Your president yes, your country not realy. Just those defending a view that cannot be supportable unless you're so blind you can't even think about questionning yourself.
That's it my friend .
No use arguing.
It's obvious you're one of these people who just cannot reason whenever their political color (Republican in your case but it is also true for Democrats at any cost) is at stake.
To see Bush as THE ONLY cause of the current mess wouldn't be right but seeing everyone but him and his team as responsible is quite illogical.
The whole world has judged Bush to be an irresponsible (to be kind and not use more appropriate but less polite qualifications) individual. Hard to beleive that they are all wrong ???
In any case, within a couple of years you Americans will have the opportunity to name yourself a new leader who hopefully will work toward gradually repairing the damages created by 8 years of bad leadership.
As a non american myself, I have no say in this but I can, as anyone around the world, have an opinion on the suject, because of the importance of your country for us, wherever we are on the globe.
You have the right to have your supposition as anyone. That doesn't make them right but everyone is allowed to be wrong in our democracies. Thanks God.
As for basing my opinions on what I read (and listen to) from analyst of all flavors, I assume that this is as good a way to 'research the subject' as any.
I asm sure you found many other ways to do it yourself (LOL!)
Whatever conclusions you did arrive to anyhow, I hope it does reflect the mess your country is now in after 6 years of Bush leadership.
P.S. Fun to discuss something other than Matin, the audit and all other insignificant topics we can raise currently discussing Veltex.
'no one appreciates criticism of our elected officials by outsiders'
That's something I generally agree with right now the policies (let's be polite) of your elected officials have created a mess of the world, do cost me (and many canadians) a lot and got us to have to send thousands of militaries to Afghanistans, most of them right now Quebecers.
'If you want we can invade Canada' ... No thanks but Alberta being a great source of petroleum, I bet Bush tought about it ... LOL!
Unfortunately, tariffs are not THE cause of the price of our French wines. You do not have the monopoly of crooks. We have plenty up here also.
As for VLXC, I would love to know how many shares (%) are owned by let's say the 10 largest shareholders right now?
Some polilically sold soul to a political party cannot reason anymore. You just proved it, trying to support someone who was stupid enough to get tens of thousands of people killed thru a war based on lies and at the same time got your country to have a all time record breaking deficit ... among zillion other stupid decisions favouring his gang and their personnal interests (Haliburton being just an example).
The Irak war (PC or not) against the will of 90% + of the world was an historical stupidity we have just started to see the real consequences of... Keep watching.
Your economics analysis is ... how do you say ? Oh yeah! talking out of ...
With people like you, your current leaders are just victims of past presidents, Greenspan and all others who came before Bush and (just an example) his tax policies.
After 6 full years as president the stupid is still a victim ... as all irresponsible people always consider themselves to be.
To bad your political RELIGION forbids you to reason somewhat logically! ('Just because Bush allowed Iraq to get screwed up by fighting a PC war instead of flattening places like Fallujah'). Wasn't it so sad I would have laugh but I sincerly cannot.
Not pizzed at americans in general but at the stupid Bush and those of his gang. This guy realy made a mess of your country during his presidency.
Let's hope the next one can repair somewhat the damages.
On the other hand, our government should also do something to help our dollar and our manufacturers in particular. Future financials of canadian companies living out of exports aren't gonna be pretty.
On your side, you are right but your imports will soon get more expensive and that could hurt a lot down south from here.
I hope that your government and ours will behave in a way favouring better $$$ values.
For those interested and not having time to read the whole filings:
Other interesting abstracts:
- Although we have no current agreements or letters of intent regarding potential acquisition targets, our strategic plan is to acquire additional companies or assets in our industry if appropriate companies can be identified and transactions arranged. In that context, we have begun to identify possible candidates but are not currently in negotiations with those candidates.
- Under current circumstances, ... If all of our preferred stock and convertible notes were converted on the date of this Consent Solicitation Statement (November 8), and the shares issuable to our officers were issued, approximately 107,919,345,893 shares of the Company’s common stock would be issued and outstanding.
- Our Board of Directors also approved the issuance of options, ... representing an aggregate of 10.5% of the available pool ... to the following executive officers ...: Wayne I. Danson, John E. Donahue, Steven J. Miller and Robert Coolidge.
- EXECUTIVE AND DIRECTOR COMPENSATION
Wayne I. Danson $ 337,500 (1) (2)
John E. Donahue $ 237,308
Steven J. Miller $ 179,615
(1) Does not include $310,000 of deferred compensation evidenced by a six year promissory note issued on August 17, 2007 to Danson Partners, LLC, an affiliate entity of Wayne Danson. Such deferred compensation includes $125,000 of unpaid fiscal 2005 bonus, $17,425 of accrued interest on such bonus and $167,575 of prior unpaid salary.
Note: Other very interesting reading under the heading '
Employment Agreements and Post -Termination or Change-of-Control Payments' (page 25 of the filing).
- The table below summarizes the compensation that we paid to non-employee Directors for the fiscal year ended June 30, 2007.
Dr. Michael Finch: $ 66,250 (1)
Jonathan J. Lichtman: $ 96,250 (1)
Randall Prouty: $ 106,250 (1)
Wilbank J. Roche: $ 96,250 (1)
(1) A total of $175,000 of cash compensation paid to the directors ($43,750 to each director) was used to purchase shares of our Series A-2 Preferred stock. In addition to the cash compensation described above, each independent Board member will also receive 50,000,000 options with an exercise price at our share price on the date of issuance or $.00075 per share.
Other information from previous filing:
ADVC UNAUDITED PRO FORMA FINANCIAL 06/30/07:
Accumulated deficit:($35,276,062)
NET(LOSS)TO COMMON STOCKHOLDERS: ($1,784,525)
Bad news, good news, facts. No pushing, no bashing.
For those interested here is what the filing says:
The bad news is that we have been very much diluted thru the recent acquisition.
The good news is that very few very large shareholders have most of the shares. We therefore should assume that they will want them to grow in value, taking us to the ride with them ???
- increase the number of authorized shares of common stock from 5,000,000,000 to 200,000,000,000 (X by 40) Never tought this to be the strategy they would take.
- changing our name to Encompass Group Affiliates, Inc.;
- increase in the number of shares of our common stock available for issuance under the 2005 Stock plan from 700,000,000 shares to 15,000,000,000 shares (X 21.5). They obviously plan to be less diluted than us.
As a result of the sale of the Series C Preferred in connection with the recapitalization described herein under the heading “Proposal No. 1: Approval of an Amendment to the Articles of Incorporation to Authorize Additional Shares of Common Stock”, ACT-DE, LLC acquired approximately 72.50% of the equity interests, and voting rights, in the Company (before dilution for stock options issued to management as described herein), subject to adjustment of the conversion rate.
Depending upon certain factors affecting the conversions ratios, the conversion of all our Series A-2, Series C and D Preferred will require us to issue an aggregate of between approximately 64,100,000,000 and 116,900,000,000 shares of our common stock to the holders of such preferred stock. If all of the preferred stock were converted on the date of this Consent Solicitation Statement, we would need to issue approximately 102,800,000,000 shares of common stock. In addition, conversion of the promissory note issued to one of our creditors (discussed above), as well as the conversion of a second convertible promissory note issued to the sole shareholder of Vance Baldwin, Inc. in connection with our purchase of that company will require us to issue an aggregate of 2,010,243,333 additional shares of our common stock. In addition, we have outstanding options exercisable for a total of 9,525,408,766 shares. Also, 80,000,000 shares of common stock are currently issuable to certain executive officers pursuant to their former employment arrangements with the Company.
The complete statement reads:
'Seven of our current stockholders are collectively the record and beneficial owners of:
- 2,525,494,252 shares (I add: or 50%) of our common stock,
- 572.91667 shares of our Series A-2 Preferred and
- 999.14 shares of our Series C Preferred,
which collectively represents 80.56 % of the votes which may be cast by all of the issued and outstanding voting capital stock of the Company.
05/11/2004 $ 1.39110 CAD = $1.52 US
11/08/2007 $ 0.91450 CAD = $1.00 US
This means that american shares I bought 2.5 years ago at let's say $ 10.00 US (I paid $1.3911 CAD) must have seen their PPS grow to $15.20 for me to get my CAD $$$ back, no gain, no loss. That means a PPS growth of 52% within 30 months. Beleive me, that's not what did happen with my INVESTMENT portfolio. Just over the last month (11 of oct - 10 of nov) The value of my portfolio (excuding variations of PPS) would have gone down 5.3%).
In your case, if everything is as per above, you summer trip to Canada will effectively cost you 50% + more since our retail prices aren't going down.
Some interesting phenomenas to observe right now because of the above:
- Somehow, the canadian consumer doesn't profit from the value increase of our $$$ (In the past we were told we were paying more than americans because our dollar wasn't strong enough). As an example, a CAD $ 45,000 car in US was costing CAD $ 60,000 in Canada. It still does. The US car dealers are FORBIDDEN by the manufacturers to sell car to canadian at the risk of loosing their franchises (And you tought only Matin was screwing people ???).
- Platsburg isn't very far from Montreal. Right now, during the weekends, between 35 and 50% of the cars on the parking of shopping malls out there have Quebec province's licences. People are makling there Chrismas shopping out there where PRICES are lower in absolute value, notwithstanding they are marked in US dollars. 2 days ago a friend of mine bouth a bottle of French Champagne for US $26 out there (about $24.50 CAD). On the same day, he saw the same bottle sell at CAD $58.50 at our (SAQ) liquor board.
Sherlock Holmes is going at it again !!! LOL !!! You realy have a lot of time to loose. I however, I enjoy the entertainment you give me with your funny posts. Thanks.
I haven't look at the RB board for months. First it was a ridiculous board and I dropped it a long time ago, second I have enough posters herein ventilating their frustration repeating on and on the same known ideas hoping to thereby get some kind of revenge for having been screwed by Matin.
Personally, as you know, I still have my shares in my speculative portfolio and I intend to leave them there till it's worth nothing or ... who knows what future is all about ???
Looking at the serious stuff however, my concern right now is with my real stocks, the darn US $$$ being worth sh.t. $1 US now = $0.92 or so. a very few months ago it was $1.05 +. That 15% loss in value hurts my US portfolio much more than whatever can happen to VLXC, beleive me. I assume that this is what happen when a country has been lead by a stupid individual for 6 + years.
Time to buy stocks in US $$$ is close if not already there. ??? Somehow our government will try to stop the much to fast value increase of our $$$ and then Bush will be out within 1.5 years or so. Then the US $$$ should get some value back soon and even more a couple of years from now.
I now am seriously looking at adding to my TSM position and buying back the EDS I sold at $27.49 last july (US $$ was at $1.05). Even the GLW I sold at $25 2 months ago, when US $$$ still was at $1.06, now look great at $22.00 ???
Seriously, what do I care if VLXC is worth $0.125 or $0.18 ??? LOL!
If it ever gets valuable again, I have enough not that costly shares to enjoy a great return, if not ... so be it.
What I find interesting is to see that some are still buying shares. One has to wonder, as an example, why someone decided TODAY (almost one month after the last PR) to throw in $ 5,000.00 to buy shares in VLXC.
May be the defendant is still short of the shares he should need whenever the judge call them in again???
Otherwise who would buy and why'
'I don't worry about you calling me a basher '
Why should I care if you worry or not? LOL!
I assume that one of these days ... months oo years, you will endup getting over your frustration and start enjoying life away from that board.
First: I know Mush isn't posting anymore on any board and he did not for a long time. Therefore your guesses within the last months were all wrong.
Second, I will have thrown in the towel whenever I will have sold my shares or the company will fade away completely (BC). Till then, I do not hold my breath but the darn thing is still alive and, for as much as I know, the 'big investors' are still big and future will tell if they threw in the towel or not ... ???
Heck you must be seeing him in your dreams and even in other places I prefer not to identify herein ??? LOL!!!
My bet ... An issue with the BD ownership ... among other things.
Short of getting an audit, what I wonder about right now is:
- what did the recently involved large shareholders do, facing Matin's reluctance to give them appropriate informations?
- Where does the lawsuit stand?
Possibly ... as any other scenario!
With the recent 2 SEC filings, one would assume that our management has material justifying some kind of news release informing the market relative to the progress recently acheived and the plan of action for the next few months (BOD meeting, Potential for economy of scale, synergy potential in marketing activities, ...).
It's been more than 1 month since the company did inform us somewhat on what's going on. Would be time now, following recent filings to issue a NR or even bette hold a conference call for the shareholders.
Maybe so, maybe not!
Another scenario (assuming we at some point in time have a business worth mentionning out there) could be that the company gets privatized by someone (matin or a close friend) offering to buy all O/S.
At current PPS someone could buy all of them for something more than $5,000,000 (including buying Matin's shares ???).
Then Matin gets rid of us all for cheap and he doesn't have anymore to worry about audits and revelations of past sins which could get him in jail.
Not a very interesting scenario and obviously not one worth executing with current state of the business.
This scenario, an outright BC or some kind of low probality good turn of events, all are possible.
Unless one has a crystal ball, noone knows and any imaginable scenario can be outlined by anyone interested in doing it.
Nowadays, arguing seriously in here seems impossible.
In any case there is nothing to argue about since most of us know nothing at all about what is realy going.
Whoever thinks he knows something (me included) generally had it from good sources he know he can rely on. However these sources can also have been fooled by Matin even if they are close to him. I recently confirmed this myself.
The only people in here claiming they know for sure are bashers exteriorizing accumulated frustration.
One day, in whatever future, VLXC will become known for whatever it will then effectively be or will disappear once more with Matin leaving for BD (if he still is allowed to go there).
Current shareholders should sell right now or forget about it altogether or sit on their share just in case this speculation would turn out not having been a complete loss.
I for one am part of the second group having looked at that as a speculation instead of an investment.
Who knows, maybe (doubtful) traders and MM's will succeed one of these days in enginneering a PPS spike base on vaporware ???
LOL!
Whatever Matin did, was, is or was, ther is a pending situation in court, it's not yet been resolved and one has to assume that the judge expect further legal actions by all parties, him included.
I wonder if anyone knows where this thing now stands and if a schedule exist relative to the next step?
I prefer not to address such a childish inaccurate post.
I am sorry but as I said earlier, not being an Investors Hub Subscriber (user of the free services only) I can receive private messages but cannot answer them privately.
I therefore have 2 choices when someone communicates privately with me:
1- Be polite, answer on the public board and protect the ID of the person who wrote me privately.
2- Be gross, read the message, delete it and to bad for the writer.
I could also be impolite, answer on the public board and identify the person who wrote me privately. It's however definitely not an alternative I would consider.
You, following my effort to be polite and not to avoid answering you, decided to identify yourself and do it in a negative tone toward me.
Your choice.
Be assured that I look forward talking with you, whatever the topic.
Having nothing to hide and being very honest relative to my points of view, ideas and toughts, I do look forward to do it openly, letting everyone read whatever talking we may have together.
To whoever is interested, I hope you did notice that I said all along that ADVC's strategy and the quality of the past (recent) performance of our management team do make this stock very interesting to own long term.
This being said, it's right now a SPECULATIVE stock which is played with by traders. One should remember that and 'play' it accordingly whenever some do fabricate opportunities to exploit.
Some of my sources effectively now suggest that maybe Matin also manipulated them somewhat. Whatever Matin is, he seems totally unable to open his books seriously.
For as much as I am told, he effectively doesn't (as some would like us to beleive) entertain himself thru the proceeds of selling new shares and he works hard at doing something (presumably building something worth being owned ... LOL!).
However, he seems unable to give the auditor what he needs to sign an acceptable audited set of financials. What renders Matin unable to do so is pure speculation by everyone right now (but probably a few, very close to him ... maybe).
LOL! also.
'And you bought more shares after speculating that?'
20-20 insight it doesn't look great. However here is what I effectively did since I started wondering if BD was or not ours.
15/12/2006 - Achat 7,550 @ $0.20 = $1,605.00
22/12/2006 - Vente 3,500 @ $0.50 = $1,655.00-
25/06/2007 - Achat 6,000 @ $0.30 = $1,900.00
NET for that specific period:
10,050 shares bought at $1,850.00 ($0.184/share)
20-20 insight buying back in June wasn't a great SPECULATION as it now look but, even without anything out of NA (my BD hypothesis is the worst case), the question is: 'What would this company be worth?'
What kind of NA based operation would it take to justify a market value of more or less (30,000,000 X $0.184) $5,000,000?
Don't take me wrong, I do not suggest this speculation to look great right now but, a SPECULATION being what it is, this one doesn't yet seem to be a total loss and God and Matin only do seem to be knowing what this could be worth in whatever future.
This being said, I must say that whatever optimism I had, it's getting quite small right now. It however goes with the game... You win some. You loose some and ... You wait for the outcome of some other.
As we say in french: 'tant qu'il y a de la vie il y a de l'espoir' (For as long as there is life, there is hope).
For as much as I know, there is some life still ...
?????????? Do not see what you mean?
Interesting readings:
1- http://freerealtime.brand.edgar-online.com/fetchFilingFrameset.aspx?FilingID=5498784&Type=HTML
This one tells us that our management was (pre-acquisition) extremely well paid to manage such a small company and executives compensations will remain quite heavy in the future. Let's hope they put as much focus on sales and acquisition of new customers as they do on developping compensation schemes.
2- http://freerealtime.brand.edgar-online.com/fetchFilingFrameset.aspx?FilingID=5512168&Type=HTML
The new ADVC would have looked as follows as of JUNE 30, 2007 :
Total assets: $39,106,256
Total Liabilities: $31,360,087
Total Stockholders' Equity: $7,746,169
Accumulated deficit: ($35,276,062)
NET SALES: $59,076,737
COST OF SALES: $46,913,441
GROSS PROFIT: $12,163,296
NET LOSS AVAILABLE TO COMMON STOCKHOLDERS: ($1,784,525)
Weighted average number of O/S: 13,489,918,237 To reflect 'as of July 1, 2006' the automatic conversion of the Series A-2 Convertible Preferred Stock resulting in the issuance of an additional 8,492,206,667 shares of common stock.
The unaudited pro forma consolidated statement of operations gives effect to the acquisition and recapitalization as if such transactions had occurred on July 1, 2006.
The unaudited pro forma consolidated financial statements do not give effect to any cost savings or integration benefits which may result from the acquisition.
The unaudited pro forma consolidated financial statements are presented for illustrative purposes only and are not necessarily indicative of the operating results or financial position that would have been achieved if the Vance Baldwin acquisition had been consummated at the beginning of the period presented, nor are they necessarily indicative of our future operating results.
'I suggested (aren't you somewhat presumptuous???) that the "mystery" owner of part of the BD mills was Matin or members of Matin's family and that the trouble with the audit was due to Matin not being able to get the auditors to list Veltex as the sole owner of the mills.'
Honestly, this 'suggestion' is a very old one you just repeated ... once more herein. I for one, 'suggested' that many times during the last year and even before.
Just as an example supporting this claim, read hereafter (HISTORY), the exchange I had on this board 10 months ago.
I therefore doubt that 'your suggestion' had anything to do with 'company pumpers' disappearing as you suggest.Pumpers or bashers, what is there, worth discussing right now?
The only exception I can imagine is bashers manufacturing new unsupportable assumptions or repeating old ones to self satisfy their requirement to post negative messages.
HISTORY
1- Posted by: pual
In reply to: None Date:1/9/2007 9:51:30 AM
Post #of 15652
I often said that one possible hypothesis is that, after loosing control of Bengladesh (God and Matin know who to ???) and hiding this to the shareholders, Matin must grow a North American business big enough to be normalized as a stand alone profitable operation (He may on the way declare he sold the Bengladesh operation so he doesn't have to discuss it anymore).
2- Posted by: litebroker
In reply to:pual who wrote msg# 12504 Date:1/9/2007 1:26:32 PM
Post #of 15652
Why are you thinking Veltex lost bangladesh control? Who owns right now? And how Veltex lost it?
3- Posted by: pual
In reply to: litebroker who wrote msg# 12508 Date:1/9/2007 2:26:00 PM
Post #of 15652
The info behind my Hypothesis are that:
- In August 2004 if my recollection is right, Matin did try to have a resolution at the BOD, the objective of which was to "buy what we did not hold" in Bengladesh. This became know almost by accident, someone posting it on a message board.
- A bunch of shareholders went after Matin (up to then we tought we owned it all) and Matin pulled the resolution out (I beleive he anyhow kept including Bengladesh financials in his reports). He never mentionned this again thereafter (I suspect this is the reason we never can get credibly audited financials from the Bengladesh operation).
Some time later, someone told me that Matin had given this ownership as a garanty against a loan he badly needed (the transport disaster), he never was able to reimburse and he thereby lost the ownership of the Mills.
I also heard that the lowner could be someone related to Matin (This could mean that a relationship thereafter deteriorate or a plot is being covered up ???).
Obviously, all of the above (except for the resolution) cannot be verified and one should look at it in this context.
Thanks.
I however do not feel offended by the bashing I got. I do recognize that traders playing the technicals have their own agenda which is very different from the one of those analyzing fundamentals in a context of investment and or speculations. These 2 types of shareholders do not always respect the point of view of each other but ... that's life.
Nice to see that at least one other poster in here recognize the importance of looking at fundamentals.
Even at current PPS (if it's the one the company will endup using when conversion time arrives) we still will have more than 60,000,000,000 O/S out there (assuming no R/S).
For the fundamentals to justify a PPS of $0.01 (Market cap of 600,000,000) a bottom line of between + $30,000,000 (multiplier of 20) and + $60,000,000 (multiplier of 10) would be required.
THIS BEING SAID, WE MAY SEE THE PPS BE WHATEVER THE MARKET, THE TRADERS AND THE MM's DO WANT IT TO BE. LOGIC AND THE MARKET ARE NOT NECESSARELY ALWAYS IN LINE.
Even I does understand that and, even if it's not my game, I shall exploit whatever opportunities somme do offer me in time.
By the way, only able to send public message, I want to tell to whoever is interested that I only sold half my shares.
I intend to stay put till I can buy back at my target price or sold half of my remaining shares if the PPS does reach $0.0018 or so.
I however beleive in the long term future of this company but beleive that, short term, great buying opportunities will be available again.
O.T. Just for fun.
One week ago today I wrote (post 15609) that 'A few months ago I tought of buying a few (Google) shares at $475.00 but, ... , I chickenned out when I did look at the fundamentals. However, the stock did close at $630.00 yesterday (the 18th)'.
One week later the stock does trade at $675.00 (+ 7% within the week).
Some realy do have guts!
O.T. Just for fun.
One week ago today I wrote (post 1215) that 'A few months ago I tought of buying a few (Google) shares at $475.00 but, remembering the above, I chickenned out when I did look at the fundamentals. However, the stock did close at $630.00 yesterday (the 18th).
One week later the stock does trade at $675.00 (+ 7% within the week).
Some realy do have guts!
'Anyway I am/will be adding to my share count at what I feel to be a best chance range of not being able to be buying any lower.'
Just in case you care, nothing more than $0.0008 is what I do intend to pay to buy back the shares I just sold at $0.0013.
1- My posting wasn't one of someone generally 'trading stocks'
2- For the moment ADVC is still not an INVESTMENT of mine but a SPECULATION which was high risk, high reward potential up to recently and is now somewhat smaller risk and reward potential considering the recent acquisition.
3- You write: 'i guess no one really listened to your posts because there does not seem to be too many investors in on this, posting on public message boards'. You seem right, only some traders having short term objectives and looking at technicals seem involved in here.
4- Having already cashed in a lot of profit with this stock (the market kind of forcing me to trade a couple of times with this stock), I anyhow hope you guys do have fun and keep creating opportunities for me to keep trading ADVC out and in. I therefore wish you all a very good luck.
Sorry to have 'po'oed' you all.
I NEVER SAID THE COMPANY EVER MENTIONNED R/S as a matter of fact I wrote clearly that this was what I THOUGHT could be the way to go, the alternative being to ISSUE 100,000,000,000 NEW SHARES (assuming a PPS of $0.0007) AS MENTIONNED BY THE COMPANY.
I VERY WELL RESPECT THE OPINION OF THOSE NOT SHARING MINE on that or any othe topic.
Having given MY OPINION and seeing that participants to this board do prefer to not challenge the argumentation I did present (removed post) but to assumed I have a hidden agenda, I shall as said earlier, effectively stop discussing the topic of how to convert 'Series A and B Convertible Preferred Stock' till the company has done it.
Let's hope they will have a BOD meeting soon.
Considering people are not interested in discussing fundamentals, I from here on shall wait and
Honestly (as I mentionned earlier), till we get post acquisition consolidated financials and till the BOD has acted relative to the requirement of A/S, we will not know for sure what our shares are worth.
2 points however:
1- My so called 'BS analysises' are based on the FUNDAMENTALS we know or can foresee (I personally do not PLAY the market on technicals but react somewhat when opportunities do rise)
2- I beleive that LONG TERM, the ADVC strategy will be successful and our shares will be worth having.
Finally, putting my money where my mouth is, I sold half my (free) shares at $0.0013. If some PLAYING the stock on technical are kind enough to get the PPS at $0.0018, I shall also sell half of my remaining shares.