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The Raman spectrometer doesn't require a patent, just buy them from the manufacturer.
Combining the RS with the CDEx fluorimeter may be patentable, will see.
So CDEx has NO patent on the G4 and an expired patent on the photoemmission technology which they're attempting to integrate into the RS from what I read in the application.
That's it- no patent protection unless the manufacturer of the RS has a patent.
You're right John, if the G4 is a hit the PPS will head North.
Are you going to load up the truck?
I wonder what Baxa has to say about CDEx at the ASHP shows, or ASD, the company that charges CDEx royalty fees for using their patented technology?
How many times has Jeff announced the launch of the G4 now? Four times with nothing to show? I wonder what the market will think when it's released without the full capabilities that they have advertised for years.
Interesting times. No?
A historical event will happen within the next six (6) days, so sayeth Pennstreet, "The CDEx Inside Man".
He knoweth all.
Rather arrogant and boastful for my palate, but let's see if he's actually telling the truth for once.
Yep, without the cuvettes things get very difficult, more so for measuring molar concentration than drug ID.
Drug ID in containers using Raman spectroscopy is quite common.
Simutaneouly using Raman spectroscopy and fluoresences also creates interference issues since the Raman signal is relatively weak compared to the fluorescent signal. That could be a problem if that's what they're trying to do.
With the cuvettes, it allowed UV/IR absorption measurements which can determine molar concentration. That is how I suspect the older Valimeds worked, but you can't do that without a cuvette.
I believe that there's other issues with the drug containers too, some of which are just beginning to come to light.
Hopefully, we'll learn more about the capabilities of the G4 when it is finally "launched" sometime in the next ten (10) days.
It's clear it won't do everything that CDEx advertised (and even bragged about) since 2010. Why? Because they said so. Pennstreet has also been talking about things such as options which is now becoming clear exactly what they really are.
Will the release of the G4 be a historical event as Pennstreet claims? I don't think so.
There's more to the list than that!
Here's the latest:
'The VG4 system uses a patented detection process providing a real time (within seconds), quantitative (strength/concentration) as well as qualitative (identification of an unknown) analysis of high-risk single component compounded medications and treatment solutions.
In the near future, we expect the VG4 product line to address multi component compounded mixtures, such as total parenteral nutrition.
We expect to add oncology drugs to our formulary in 2013 as well. One of the most significant improvements with the VG4 is the capability of analyzing through most containers that are currently being used in pharmaceutical settings.'
I wonder if CDEx is referring to the expired patent (public domain) or the pending patent. I'm not aware of any current patent that covers this technology.
Again, as I correctly predicted earlier, I don't believe that anyone will be seeing the real-time measurement of multi component drug strengths anytime in the near future. Of course, pennstreet claims the company that was shipped a G4 well over a year ago is using it every day for exactly that purpose. Yeah right!
Also, CDEx now claims that the G4 can see through most containers which would explain why pennstreet says they draw a sample out of the bag or vial with a syringe as an option. WHY COMPROMISE STERILITY IF YOU DON'T HAVE TO?
The way I see it, it's an option if drawing a sample into a syringe is the only way to identify the drug!
Great! All honest shareholders should be aware of truth.
Why do you say "imo"? You are showing doubt. If anyone knows for sure, it should be Mr. R.S. Pennstreet. You aren't sure?
"Just throw the bag into the belly and it will identify the drug and measure concentration in real time"
Only the iG4 can do that! LOL
Folks, watch closely as the performance of the G4 continues to be downgraded as predicted. Totally, 100% predicted!
Does the iG4 simultaneously identify the drug and measure drug strength in real time?
Read the weasel words carefully.
That's how it's been on every single product they've ever produced- all two of them! LOL
Amanita, as I guaranteed, what the CDEx scam advertises and what they actually produce are to different things.
Still more to come.
"And oh yes, it can identify by looking through ther syringe, the vial or the iV bag. All OLD news.
It's the options dude, the options, da signatures, and maybe a few other things too."
There is no option, compromise sterility by puncturing the IV bag with a syringe, or simply place the bag in the unit to identify the content- Hummmm....
No brainer.
Thank goodness Dr. Stevenson isn't being associated with this totally stupidity!
I've been asking that question for MONTHS and I've never received and answer of any kind! Suddenly, you now know that it can read molar concentration? OMG, somebody has been feeding you a bunch of BS!!!
mg/ml, units/ml, mmoles/ml, LOL!
I know you have no idea what you're talking about, tell me who gave you that information so I can verify it or it is nothing more than worthless hearsay once again?
Poteet?
I'm referring to the ID2 Myth Gun. 89% is not good enough for commercial use, not to mention law enforcement use.
It's a shame uninformed people actually believe what CDEx advertises.
" No hype on bogus pr's, as was the norm from the loch days and first 9 years of Cdex."
Really pennstreet? No bogus PR's?
"The SCAM artists are getting desperate. LOL !!
CDEx had been saying the G4 was finished ... Ready for sale ... And even "SOLD" in those 2010, 2011, and 2012 PRs.
Now they say its not even finished ?
Now they say it doesn't even do what they stated it can do ?"
Evidently!
It as sounds good if one basis their comments on the CDEx advertisaments.
But is CDEx telling the truth?
I don't believe it's the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
Not even close.
As a shareholder, you are ignoring the important issues. Why are you doing that, it's detrimental to all shareholders.
You seem to 100% support this scam, no matter how vile (vial) the company performs.
Tells us what you really know.
Capnmike, you're doing it again...
As a CDEx promoter your job is to post current events, no PP investor took the bait on that old material and I don't believe they're going to bite NOW!
Tell shareholders what's happening with the G4 and what its actual (not advertisied) capabilities will be when released.
"One can take a syringe and draw any of the medications from a vial or IV bag, place the syringe in the G4, and it will be identified."
What happen to placing the IV bag in the G4 for identification?
Now, one has to compromise sterility in order to test? Sterility was a key advantage of not having to draw a sample.
What happen to "just toss it in the belly..."?
The ID2 meth scanner, pennstreeet's honest perspective:
"FirstDefender returned an 89% positive ID rate with no false positives. Contact us to obtain the full test report.
The above First Defender is in the arena with the Cdex ID2, not the G4, lol".
Gee, that is funny pennstreet, but is 89% good enougn to be considered reliable? I don't think so. It appears some end users have never actually tested it for accuracy.
Yes, there are several technologies that can do that, some which have been posted on this board. The Thermo Fisher products can all do that, as well as many other manufactures, including the one CDEx buys from!
Can it measure the concentration of the drug too? The only thing I keep reading from you is that "it can identify".
Have they shipped any iG4's yet? T-minus 17 days...
"The immediate future of Cdex is what shareholders are looking to, imo. And it is that future that will make history, imo."
CDEx is going to make history? LOL!
The G4 is the only thing on the table so you think the G4 will make history? LOL!
You can really sling the BS, but I guess you have to because if the G4 isn't an immediate winner this scam is over.
How many days left in the NEW "launch" period, 18?
Hints not required.
"...the G3 may require one to type in what you are suppose to be looking at, but the G4 needs no such hint."
Just toss the drug into the belly and it will tell you everything! Wild.
"Just tell the IG4 what it is you wanta see, and it will show it to you."
According to Dr. Pennstreet you do not have to tell thr iG4 anything. Just stick a med into the chamber and the iG4 will tell you everything.
I'm assuming that pennstreet means it will identify the drug and concentration, although he didn't specifically say it measured the drug concentration.
Of course as I have previously stated, my belief is that it won't be measuring drug concentration any time soon.
John, I believe JB stated that G4's would ship before the end of the second quarter. That is the last CDEx updated that I recall.
I'm backin' up the truck...
The official word by CDEx is that G4's will start shipping within 19 days!
And still no word on how many signatures the G4 will have.
"Still waiting on the answer to the question about the Cdex board date of September 2005 and May 2008???"
Why do you want to know?
"Which trade show did you attend that gave you such knowledge??? tia"
I've attended so many trade shows it would make your head spin.
Prove that you've attended even one ASHP show.
"I am always so impressed as to how you can state on a public board that the G4 is not working as advertised???"
Where else would I express my opinion but on a CDEx message board?
As I stated, I don't believe that the G4 will perform as advertised.
What you post is either hearsay or your opinion. You never show proof of anything that you claim as fact.
Pennstreet, anything you say is nothing more than hearsay- completely worthless.
Developing options for the G4- I don't thing so! Creating more signitures? I don't think so. LOL! There is no 'money pit' problem with getting the G4 to market, they just can't get the damn thing to work as they've advertised for 3 years- that's what I was told.
Without people buying into the G4, this scam is over. That's what I was told.
Still... I don't believe anything that you're claiming about the G4. You just don't make sense. You keep changing your story. You are frightened about the G4.
"Lets hope the Patent is VERY, and I do mean VERY VAGUE!"
A legitimate patent application must disclose the invention so that a person "knowledgable in the field" can reproduce it.
You're right, Poteet's application is vague and I do mean VERY vague! LOL
That I absolutely DO NOT BELIEVE IS TRUE!
Hum, the G3 may require one to type in what you are suppose to be looking at, but the G4 needs no such hint."
We'll see, sooner or later.
Pennstreet, you wrote, 'different technology'. But I suppose you aren't completely correct. The Raman Spectroscopy is a different technology (but certainly nothing new), but I believe that Poteet is attempting to include Valimed's fluorescent technology also- except without the use of a cuvette as the old Valimed utilized. I did read the pending patent- as vague as it was.
Identifying a drug is absolutely no big deal using Raman Spectroscopy. CDEx better be able to do that. The obstacle to overcome is measuring molar drug concentration without the use of a cuvette while the drug is contained in syringes, vial, IV bag... etc, and with a simultaneous RA reading.
I still haven't read where CDEx explicitly advertises that.
I won't even get into the CDEx advertisments of multi-component systems. LOL
Not bad for measuring completely unknown chemicals. It tests for over 20,000 chemical and combinations of those chemicals.
It's unlike a Valimed where you tell the machine what you're validating and looks up the signature and it either validates it or not. The FIRST DEFENDER scans COMPLETE UNKNOWS. It's in a league of its own.
But that's not the instrument that you shoulds be comparing with the G4. They have one for drugs. I forget the name, look it up.