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Thanks Freedom43. Next time can you ask your friends to slap the ask?
Hey...... Looks like we got some movement today! Is anyone thinking that KK made a 1.6 million dollar payment to YAGI this week? Anyone?
Thanks.
Do you have a link?
EDIT: It is not listed on EDGAR.
At least they slapped the ask.
Because you are not joining in, I will refrain comment.
Petalman,
First of all, you are only responsible for your own posts.
Secondly, I am not angry about what another poster posts. Frustrated that someone can read the same exact words and come up with a different meaning. (Ha, I guess that is why there are so many different religions)
I think it stems from wanting the better news to be the truth, coupled with the way the statements are written. I too had to read and re-read the verbage to finally understand it. If I had any doubt about my understanding I would state it here on this forum.
EDIT: I also think that it is good to go through these somewhat painful exercises to really understand what is going on. Each time cropdoc posted, I was looking to find a better answer to my understanding of the situation. Hopefully he was doing the same when I posted. GLTA
cropdoc, the key word is "offset" to me that means equates, or balances, or makes up for, not surpasses. They were very careful not to state that this year will be better then last. They did go out of their way to say that litigation cost will increase this year through the second quarter. So if this year equals last year with the exception of increased litigation expense, and they could not service the note last year, how will they make multiple payments of 1.6 million this year? Please do not read in to the 10-K/A that does not exist.
If I am wrong it will be good news for all investors, we will see in a short couple of weeks.
This is a repost of my original post. It is not me stating that this year will be the same as last year, it is KK. That said, he also stated that the cost of litigation will increase this year through the second quarter. If they could not make 1.6 million dollar payments last year, how can the pay it this year?
This is quoted directly from the 10-K/A:
RESULTS OF OPERATIONS
Year Ended December 31, 2011 Compared to Year Ended December 31, 2010
Total revenues for the year ended December 31, 2011 were $20.0 million as compared to $7.7 million generated during the year ended December 31, 2010. The increase in revenue during the year was due to the impact of new licenses executed during 2011, increased corn oil production by our licensees, the increased market value of corn oil, and the sale of our remaining facilities to YA Corn Oil Systems, LLC. While revenue in future periods can be expected to decrease as a result of the non-recurring nature of the results recognized in connection with the YA Corn Oil Transaction, we expect that this decrease will be offset by the concomitant decrease in costs of sales associated with the transfer of those agreements, as well as increases in revenue generated by new license agreements executed during 2011 and 2010. Revenue growth moving forward will also be affected by fluctuation in the market price for corn oil since the royalty income we generate is tied to sales of corn oil extracted by our licensees with our technologies.
It basically states that this year will be relatively equal to last year. If they are telling the truth, then don't be surprised that they do not earn enough revenue to pay YAGI off, as you are insisting. Obviously, winning the infringement case, settling, or refinancing could change that.
I agree with the 1.6 million, but that is the total for the year. If the wanted us to know that they would be making a multiple of 1.6 million in payments, they would have communicated that. Obviously, Refinancing, settlements, or a new major customer could change all of that.
Well, I actually hope you are right! I guess it will be obvious in a couple of weeks. GLTU
Page 70 GERS 10-K/A
And I quote
"NOTE 20
SUBSEQUENT EVENTS
On January 17, 2012, the Company entered into an Amended Management Agreement in connection with the YA Corn Oil Transaction (see Note 11, Debt Obligations , above), pursuant to which the Company agreed to certain terms which reconciled the impact of about $1.9 million in indemnification expenses accrued by the Company during the year ended December 31, 2011.
On February 29, 2012, the Company entered into an Amended Global Forbearance Agreement pursuant to which the Company agreed to amend the terms of the A&R Debenture issued to YA Global (see Note 11, Debt Obligations , above), to provide for about $1.6 million in cash payments during 2012." GLTU
Payments yes. Payments of 1. 6 million no way!
Would it not make sense that they would quantify the number of multiple payments?
Wrong. Please read my previous post. It is a direct qoute from the 10-K/A as well, and is a little more telling.
Now we can make that 10 consecutive days trading below 200 shares.
cropdoc, GERS has stated in their 10-K/A that they will be paying 1.6 million to YAGI with cash, as I recently posted. The interest alone for 2012 is 1.8 million. I think it is dangerous to think that GERS is paying more then they stated they were going to. It has not been my experience that they under promise, and over deliver. GLTU
Agreed, as will Q2, Q3, and the 10-K 2012.
We have been 9 consecutive days trading at below 200 shares. If this trend continues we can proclaim that dilution has been reduced significantly.
Someone just slapped the ask for 23,000 shares. Must be from all the negative posts today.....
The verbage below helps explain the total of 1.6 million to be paid in 2012. If this does not help one understand that there will not be multiple payments of 1.6 million, then nothing ever will. Also, please note the definition of an Forbearance Agreement. I think that helps explain why the PPS is not skyrocketing at this time.
On February 29, 2012, the Company entered into an Amended Global Forbearance Agreement pursuant to which the Company agreed to amend the terms of the A&R Debenture issued to YA Global (see Note 11, Debt Obligations , above), to provide for about $1.6 million in cash payments during 2012.
Forbearance Agreement
An agreement by the lender not to exercise the legal right to foreclose in exchange for an agreement by the borrower to a payment plan that will cure the borrower's delinquency.
DHOLE, you are correct, the E15 is very significant. That will give GERS a 50% pay raise!
12thman, you are essentially correct. The one big difference this year has been the lack of a shareholders newsletter explaining the achievements of last years goals, and posting this years goals. It looks like .06's are still achievable, just not as plentiful. I look forward to any DD you may find.
Welcome back 12thman! Things are steadily creeping along. We learn each day about new technologies that GREENSHIFT has been developing. The latest is Flash Dessication. SkunK has good information about it on his blog. They have achieved their 5th patent on COES, and should see a sixth patent in short order. The have filed for a temporary injunction, with prayer for relief on patent infringement, which is why I think that the company has gone silent (other then legal requirements). This stock has a lot of great potential, and this year could very well be the starting point. GLTU
I never stated bankrupt, ever! Lie number 1. I copied proof from from investopedia. Lie number two. I am placing you on ignore, I refuse to read anymore of your posts.
You need to go back and read the thread. I copied and pasted a statement from investopedia. Total twisted it to say i got it from a safe harbour statement. Only you can lf you are stupid or not.
Indeed! A 50% boost for COES and Greenshift without adding new customers.
Total, I copied and pasted from Investopedia. Safe Harbor statements are included in sec filings. I trust the information from investopedia.
I am always willing to learn sir. Please point out the error of my ways. Please be very specific, I am a little slow.
Simple math
I will omit the millions and stay in the tens only.
Last years rev's 15
YAGI One time Bonus 5
Total Rev's last year 20
This years Rev's as a continuation of last year 15
This years new rev's 5
This years total rev's 20
Let's agree that 20 equals 20.
GERS eneded last year with 1 million in excess cash.
GERS did not service debt last year.
GERS stated that the litigation costs will increase this year.
If this years revenues match last years, including the addition of new revenues, how will they make multiple payments of 1.6 million?
It appears that even paying a total of 1.6 Million with multiple payments will be spreading it thin.
This is a repost of my original post. It is not me stating that this year will be the same as last year, it is KK. That said, he also stated that the cost of litigation will increase this year through the second quarter. If they could not make 1.6 million dollar payments last year, how can the pay it this year?
total, This is quoted directly from the 10-K/A:
RESULTS OF OPERATIONS
Year Ended December 31, 2011 Compared to Year Ended December 31, 2010
Total revenues for the year ended December 31, 2011 were $20.0 million as compared to $7.7 million generated during the year ended December 31, 2010. The increase in revenue during the year was due to the impact of new licenses executed during 2011, increased corn oil production by our licensees, the increased market value of corn oil, and the sale of our remaining facilities to YA Corn Oil Systems, LLC. While revenue in future periods can be expected to decrease as a result of the non-recurring nature of the results recognized in connection with the YA Corn Oil Transaction, we expect that this decrease will be offset by the concomitant decrease in costs of sales associated with the transfer of those agreements, as well as increases in revenue generated by new license agreements executed during 2011 and 2010. Revenue growth moving forward will also be affected by fluctuation in the market price for corn oil since the royalty income we generate is tied to sales of corn oil extracted by our licensees with our technologies.
It basically states that this year will be relatively equal to last year. If they are telling the truth, then don't be surprised that they do not earn enough revenue to pay YAGI off, as you are insisting. Obviously, winning the infringement case, settling, or refinancing could change that. GLTU
The survey does not ascertain how the debt will be paid down. It could be with financing, or even with settlements. The survey is skewed and now it's results are being twisted to fit your needs.
I have provided the math for you in the past. Your claims do not add up.
Let's put this one to bed, shall we? There are different types of loans:
Mortgages that typically require monthly payments of Principal and interest. This type of loan would require a monthly servicing of debt.
Notes that require full payment of principal and interest at the time the note matures. A one time servicing of debt.
Notes that require interest payments as they accrue (typically monthly, and full payment of the principal when the note matures. Monthly servicing of interest, and a one time servicing of principal.
Convertible debentures which is a loan that can be converted into stock. This debenture has a maturity date. This one can be converted completely into shares. Typically, YAGI has been taking shares for interest. I believe that KK has agreed to begin servicing the interest of 1.8 million using 1.6 million in cash. The remaining $200,000 will be converted into stock. When the note matures in December, the principal will be due in full.
Investopedia explains 'Debt Service'
For example, a property developer is said to be "servicing a lot of debt" when he or she has made a large investment in a property and has not yet sold many of the subdivided lots or individual units. The debt service is simply how much money is owed on a loan, including both the interest and the principal amounts. Individuals seeking loans from banks and other lenders are often required to list their entire debt service (the amount of all outstanding loans and financial obligations) on an income statement (a profit and loss statement).
Read more: http://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/debtservice.asp#ixzz1tAL5BlwN
Exactly, back to Petals original post: Not much dilution going on so far this quarter.
Thanks for answering for yourself. Good answers as always.
I guess that is why I should have let Freedom43 speak for himself.
So we need to know how long the temporary junction could last, how many gallons could be produced by all listed infringers, the sales price per gallon. We would also need to determine the cost of liability in bankrupting any of these companies during this process. The infringers legal costs, etc. I do not know how to put a price tag on this, but it must be pretty high. Greenshift also stated that their litigation costs would increase through Q2, I believe. Sounds like a lot of cash needed to me.
I should probably let Freedom43 speak for himself, but......
A recent post from Freedom43:
"By my calculations damages for pass due corn oil sales dating back to 2006 when the earliest plants began to extract is around 35-75 million total. If treble damages are awarded for willful infringement we’re talking 105-225 million. I don’t think that’s enough to bankrupt ICM."
Petal, I agree. If dilution was occurring at this time, the PPS would be dropping as large share quantities are traded. It has been a few days without obvious dilution. It is near end of month, and will be interesting to see if dilution returns.
Nobody, this is from Freedom43's last post. I find his posts very informative. I suspect he is in the lawyering business based on his knowledgeable posts.
"In addition, the cost of the surety bond cost could be in the 5 – 10 million dollar range and this is definitely a major consideration."
I think 5-10 million dollars is a pretty good explanation regarding the lack of YAGI principal payments. Can you explain where the cash is going other wise?