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We are about four months from the next election. Politics will likely be on your minds, and the desire to post your thoughts will intensify. It ain't gonna happen, 'cause I'll be watching like a hawk. This is Zeev'e thread, and it's a NO POLITICS thread. Let's honor Zeev's notion. If you don't I'll have Guido whack you. Thanks, Lee.
When the facts are on your side, pound the facts.
When the facts are not on your side, pound the table.
Fairly obvious where the facts are in this case gt!
Because I won't be held to a higher standard than the other person actually displays on a daily basis. Get it?
Now, if you REALLY want to know, simply Google what happened to health premiums in Mass. Pretty easy if you actually want to find out.
You know gt it was a legitimate request.
Why not just provide the link?
Of course you aren't pulling that stuff out of your ass!
What does the rising of the sun in the morning have to do with your demand to commit human sacrifice every afternoon?
The American economy grew at an even quicker pace in the century before the post-FDR mega-state.
National Socialists were the first ones who brought national healthcare to an industrialized country.
Fascism is the combining of government power and corporations. How does a government that requires you to buy an insurance policy from a pre-approved list of big corporations sound in that context?
Alex now wants to deal in facts. LMAO.
"what it basically comes down to is some people are very very selfish and ideological boneheads"
Speak of yourself and ZAB. When was the last time you volunteered at a hospital? heck, when was the last time you donated to either a hospital or a doctor/nurse/medical researcher's education?
Never. Yet you are screaming to press-gang other people into paying for the consequences of your own past actions. You guys are advocates for a new slave system.
yes, it's not perfect but it's the best that could get passed
Most intelligent and morally responsible people agree single payer was the best option, but it was politically not possible with the republican filibustering. Then the next best option was a "public option" which was not free healthcare but simply another option one could pay for... yet again it was sabotaged by the selfish obstructionist crowd... so at least we have some positive changes and hopefully we will work to improve it
what it basically comes down to is some people are very very selfish and ideological boneheads... and for some reason we keep electing these people... oh that's right, now that corporations are people all that counts is MONEY
With guaranteed issue requirement under ACA driving up insurance premium by 30-50% annually in the coming years, how many people will continue to carry insurance before they are sick? especially the penalty is lower than the cost of any insurance that would meet the legal mandate (as it is currently designed)
It's like if there were a legal requirement that a house already on fire or burned down has to be accepted for insurance underwriting as an undamaged house . . . many people would wait for the fire before buying insurance; then the insurance company would have to raise premium, making more and more people drop buying insurance until there is fire.
Soon enough, the mandate becomes a tax on the bulk of the population indeed, as most would choose to pay the tax most years and buy insurance only after they are sick. That's how the ACA is designed. It's a backdoor tax plan that will hit the typical middle class American family.
Would you have advocated "slavery now and slavery forever" after the Dredd Scott decision?
"most of the industrialized world already has"? Is that why so many Europeans and Canadians seek medical service abroad despite having to pay out of pocket?
The top destinations for American "medical tourists" are Mexico, Thailand and India, where the Americans seeking medical services on those trips would be paying cash.
People in those "socialistic" healthcare systems of Western Europe and Canada that you love so much constitute the majority of medical tourists visiting the US.
What Michael Moore did not tell you in his Potempkin Village documentary of the Cuban medical system is that the typical Cubans go to squalid local hospitals not shown in the movie. Since Moore's crew and patients were not paying the Cuban government for the medical services that they received, unlike the typical American medical tourists going to Mexico, Thailand and India (where the payment help the local economy even more than the service itself), what Moor was doing was something between Genocide and taking candy from the proverbial baby.
Pharmaceuticals are cheaper overseas only because drug research is subsidized by Americans. The hospital you are using overseas are located in areas where expats concentrate; i.e. the better parts of the country (like the equivalent of Upper East Side or Upper West Side of Manhatten). Of course they are better than the average hospital of the country. You were not experiencing the months of waiting that is typical of local hospitals in Western Europe and Canada. Why do you think so many Western Europeans and Canadians come to the US for medical services?
Since you are so worked up about medical industry seeking profit, when was the last time you volunteered at a hospital or a pharmaceutical company? What makes you think Europeans and Canadians are the Socialist Newman donating their lives to "the Greater Good"? Why do you think the typical biotech and pharma company in the US is full of young interns from Europe? Since you don't volunteer yourself, but demand others to provide voluntary service (using government coercion if necessary), you are essentially advocating slavery.
There were indeed many problems in the American medical system, most of which were the result of earlier government meddling, especially that of LBJ. Obamacare is a step in the wrong direction, and will make it even worse.
Amazed to keep reading this crap, the Affordable Health Care Act, was passed in 2010, and now the Supreme Court has concluded that it is the law of the land, and still the Republicans want to keep arguing about what to call it.
Its Healthcare, its about the average America finding a way to have something that most of the industrialized world already has.
The issue is in the history books, if you want to look ahead to the 2012 elections, thats fine, but I thought the Republicans cared about the economy and jobs for Americans.
I wish some on this board would put more of an effort into these issues.
To compare Healthcare to slavery, thats insane !!
Classy, as always.
Romneycare is hardly fiscally responsible. And you're rewriting history when you say it was pushed by Republicans. It was a Dem House that passed it in Mass.
Not that facts were ever important.
Of course, this is the essence of the whole thing isn't it? As Romney has said, it was right for Mass. and it should be up to the individual States to decide. Oh, except this is about power, and that's why Alex will march in lock-step.
RepubliCON, wingnut, brats, hissy fit, blah, blah, blah.......
Although I now live in Arizona, the Shenandoah Valley is where I was born & raised. It is a very special place. Just got back from 3 months in the motorhome there.
I'd like to recommend a song by The Seldom Scene called "Blue Ridge". It captures that feeling perfectly, IMO.
My folks are laid to rest in Thornrose Cemetary in Staunton, VA. A stroll through that Cemetary is fascinating ... A lot of Civil War soldiers were buried there.
Lots of crazy stuff on the airwaves re the SCOTUS’s upholding of the ACA.
http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/health-care-reform-leftovers/
The Inane “Is It a Tax?” Debate: R’s are viciously attacking the ruling because it introduces a new “tax” on people who don’t have coverage. As I and many others have stressed, this tax is a free-rider penalty. It is a PRF—a personal responsibility fee for not saddling the rest of us with your health care costs, thereby imposing an implicit tax on the rest of us. And it hits 1-2% of the population.
You thought personal responsibility was supposed to be a conservative value? Not, apparently, when the dreaded tax word is invoked.
I get it: silliness pervades in an election year…but really? Seriously?!? Taxes happen in societies— according to a Supreme Court justice from a saner time, they’re “the price we pay for a civilized society.” And in this case, they’re the price we pay to offset a negative externality by which the behavior of a small minority of citizens imposes a cost on everyone else.
To be ashamed to make that case is to cede the field to Norquist and co.
You just described Obamacare as well.
could be a headfake also, but Swenlin is always one to read and to be respected
here's Sy Harding's take on it, but only your hairdresser knows for sure ;^)
EU Rescues Markets Just in Time - Again!
BEING STREET SMART
by Sy Harding
June 29, 2012.
At their 19th summit meeting since the eurozone crisis began two years ago European officials once again demonstrated their willingness to take markets to the very brink before taking action.
And once again it worked, with markets rallying in hopes that the actions just announced will be more lasting and meaningful than the previous rescue efforts.
From the timing, one could get the impression EU officials spent much of their meeting on Thursday watching markets before feeling forced to reach an agreement. Markets in Europe had already closed down again on Thursday. Yields on Spanish and Italian bonds had risen to levels where bailouts of Greece, Portugal, and Ireland had previously become necessary. And in the U.S. on Thursday the Dow was down 175 points and looking like the bottom was about to drop out further, with an hour left to the close.
Out of the blue word suddenly crossed the tape that German Chancellor Merkel had cancelled her scheduled news conference, which was expected to report lack of progress, and word leaked that a major compromise and agreement had indeed been reached.
The U.S. market plunge reversed on a dime, and the Dow closed down only 24 points.
Then after an all-night EU session, a further announcement was made giving more information on the EU agreement just before European markets opened. And they surged up from the open, with the U.S. market also surging up on Friday.
The question now becomes whether the actions promised will be enough this time to finally contain the eurozone debt crisis. They seem to be significant. But then, each previous action had to be greater than the one before, as each failed to work.
Details are still missing, but the agreement being hammered out over the weekend is apparently one of immediate short-term actions, and an outline for a long-term plan that will be delayed until a study is completed for their October meeting. Short-term actions include allowing European banks to borrow money directly from the euro-zone bailout programs, rather than the funds going first to the country’s government and then to the banks, which was adding to government debts. And the bailout funds can also now be used to buy the bonds of individual euro-zone countries having difficulty selling their bonds, with the European Central Bank given more power to oversee the bailout funds.
Like the previous emergency actions of the last two years, this one seems to be another short-term fix that will hopefully buy enough time to come up with a longer-term solution.
The problem each time in the past has been that as soon as the markets seemed relieved by the short-term fix, officials returned to bickering and dysfunction that pushed off the formation of the promised long-term plans and allowed the crisis to come back in a more drastic form.
But we shall see. Maybe this time will be different.
Meanwhile, it does have a spooky similarity to last summer.
Last summer the market topped out on May 1, as it did this year. Last year the summer correction seemed to end at its low on June 29, when it spiked up in reaction to the euro-zone debt crisis easing overnight, accompanied by Fed Chairman Bernanke’s statement that the Fed was ready to act “if needed”.
But the rally early last July lasted only until July 7, when the market topped out into its much more severe second leg down to the October low. It had run into the reality that the easing of the eurozone debt crisis and Bernanke’s promise, did not change the fact that the U.S. economic slowdown was still worsening. And indeed the economy continued to deteriorate, as did the stock market, until the S&P 500 was down 21%, and the Fed did finally step in with ‘operation twist’.
And here we are with markets spiking on the same day this year as we end a dismal 2nd quarter and enter July, and on a similar catalyst of a promised easing of the eurozone crisis, and the U.S. Fed standing aside but promising to come to the rescue “if needed”.
And just as was the case with that one week spike-up from June 29 last year, the latest efforts to solve the eurozone debt crisis do not change the fact that the U.S. economic slowdown continues to worsen. And unlike last year, this year the worsening U.S. economy is accompanied by slowing economies around the world, with many major global markets in bear markets as a result.
Am I excited by the EU actions and the market’s sudden upside reversal? Not yet. Let’s wait and see what happens after the July 4th holiday when the next monthly jobs reports is released on July 6.
One thing we can be fairly sure of. The market’s recovery, even if it turns out to be only brief, and the actions being taken by European officials, will take the pressure off an already reluctant Fed and have it even more reluctant to come to the rescue anytime soon.
After friday's huge gain, todays activity is respectable, staying long.
New BUY Signal for S&P 500 Index
by Carl Swenlin
06/29/2012
Today our mechanical Thrust/Trend Model (T/TM) for the S&P 500 switched from NEUTRAL to BUY. For our purposes, the S&P 500 represents "the market."
(This is an excerpt from the June 29, 2012 blog
The signal was generated by the Thrust Component of the T/TM, which consists of the PMO (Price Momentum Oscillator) and the PBI (Percent Buy Index). Once both of these indicators have moved above their EMAs, a BUY signal is generated. You can see that the PMO crossover occurred earlier this month. The PBI crossover occurred today, which was more delayed than we normally see.
While the T/TM is intended for intermediate-term timing, the Thrust Component of the model is really more short-term oriented and its intended effect is an earlier entry than we would normally get from the Trend Component alone. This makes it vulnerable to whipsaw.
At this point we will wait for the Trend Component to confirm the signal, which will happen when the 20-EMA crosses up through the 50-EMA. This will take a while because there is still a lot of separation between the two. (See arrows on the thumbnail chart above.)
The timing model is far from perfect, but it has proven to be a fairly reliable tool for identifying changes in trend. At this point we have to assume that a new up leg is in progress. Our intermediate-term market posture is now bullish.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Technical analysis is a windsock, not a crystal ball.
http://blogs.decisionpoint.com/chart_spotlight/2012/06/20120629cs.html
Yeah zab, they're too sharp for me. Screw it, I say with respect.
Futures percolating. May want to enter via buy-stop above the market; "I'll play, but only if you drag me in."
Except I was referring to the much younger generation, the ones between 8-12, I am amazed on how well they handle the I-Phone and I-Pad.
I have tried the I-Pad a few times, and am so slow, then the child who it belonged to, showed me how easily it could be worked. Very frustrating when at that age they can use technology so quickly.
I asked about the TV, and he said he hardly watches it anymore, he would rather use his I-Pad.
Except I was referring to the much younger generation, the ones between 8-12, I am amazed on how well they handle the I-Phone and I-Pad.
I have tried the I-Pad a few times, and am so slow, then the child who it belonged to, showed me how easily it could be worked. Very frustrating when at that age they can use technology so quickly.
I asked about the TV, and he said he hardly watches it anymore, he would rather use his I-Pad.
Except I was referring to the much younger generation, the ones between 8-12, I am amazed on how well they handle the I-Phone and I-Pad.
I have tried the I-Pad a few times, and am so slow, then the child who it belonged to, showed me how easily it could be worked. Very frustrating when at that age they can use technology so quickly.
I asked about the TV, and he said he hardly watches it anymore, he would rather use his I-Pad.
Ain't it the truth! Grandson Richie came by with his new lady, "A keeper" I told him after talking with her a while. Ahhh, to be 19 again.
CVC, and SBGI been trying higher of late.
PETD also been moving higher.
The children will always figure things out, its been like that for centuries.
The rest of us get set in our ways, and forget about imagination, and the word, "no".
Children end up always doing things better.
Futures talking to me, but mostly mumbling. If they sport a move, I'll try to alert you.
Ihub keeps locking me out; but my grandson, Richie, came by and showed me a way around that silliness.
Only a couple of trading hours left. You are free to address me and my post. Who knows if you dumb it down I might be interested. If you blast through with a bunch of economic theory, references and buzz words, it might interest others.
Uh huh. You just described Obamacare as well.
You're dreaming if you think those groups would vote to destroy their jobs (or severely curtail their compensation). Personally I think a single payer is the only way we cut costs significantly, however I realize there are those opposed and they appear to weild a pretty big stick. For all we know, Roberts saved the law to protect big corporations, and chamber of commerce took no position on the litigation. Insurance Cos. can certainly use their influence and they have shown that they will, thus your "simple" solution is not so simple.
I'm sure you have seen what Medicare does to hospital and Doctor's fees-you think those groups would support a single payer system? Hardly and then throw in nurses and other workers and you have a pretty large voting block.
Good luck getting such a system past either of those groups.
There was quite a push from the "liberals" and the larger push to get a bill won out-such is the system we have of compromises sometimes necessary. There will be talk of improving the bill and it may be forced if there are not enough reductions in overall healthcare costs. May take years or lifetimes, but in the meantime a lot of new folks will be covered-we'll see about those reductions in costs!?
Utility stocks up on heat wave
BY MarketWatch Equity 11:02 AM ET 07/02/2012
NEW YORK (MarketWatch) -- Utility stocks rose Monday as hot weather gripped the eastern U.S. for the fourth day. The Philadelphia Utility Index rose 0.4%, despite losses in the broad equities market. Southern Co. (SO) rose 0.7%, Exelon Co. rose 0.1%, PPL Corp. (PPL) rose 0.8%, GenOn Energy rose 0.9%, Dominion Resources Inc. (D) gained 0.4%, and First Energy rose 0.7%. On the down side, Public Service Enterprise Group (PEG) fell 0.1% and NextEra Energy (NEE) moved down by 0.3%. The heat is driving up use of electric-powered air conditioners throughout the Northeast.
Every generation will have its issues, its not like the 1940s, 50s, or 60s, each of those decades had a host of problems to deal with, both here and all around the globe.
You can always find fault in anything that is new, but you at least start working on the problem, and eventually it gets solved.
Just look at how far the stock market has come these past 3 1/2 years, America has always reached higher, the only difference this time, is that the rest of the world is starting to come on board.
There might be problems, but thats why you wake up each day, you do so much, and then you do it all over again.
I am not optimistic that we will get very far in the right direction though ... not as long as insurance companies etc. are the ones controlling what can and can't get through Congress.
You forgot to mention the Doctors and Hospitals milking the Ins. companies who in turn pass the extra cost to the helpless patients.
In the mean time,the Population,each generation is born into more blatant corruption and more cynicism.The kids start their lives with a deficit in ethics and morals."Take care of #1" is the learned principle.
Many of those kids take,later on, high positions in our society...
The Healthcare system is only one of the symptoms of a sick society.
Market seems to be holding those gains of friday, housing stocks, natural gas stocks, KWK, XCO, MMR, catching a bid.
PHM, MAS new daily highs.
You should seriously consider becomig a writer. Many would be intriqued with your mastery of fiction. I bet yoou would make a good buck too ;)
Any one of those groups, given the abomination that is currently ready to be implemented, or expanding medicare, would choose the latter. Sure they would have fought expanding medicare, as it would also have been an encroachment of government authority. However, since it was a Dem Pres, Senate and Congress, it wouldn't have mattered. They could have easily found another Olympia Snow to displace Lieberman. No need to rewrite history in an absolute.
Where were you gt during the debates prior to Obamacare becoming law?
Progressives pushed hard for a single payer system similar to Medicare, and even basserdan posted a thing from "firedoglake" showing their opposition to what ended up passing. The thing about legislation is that a good majority needs to be on board and the health care providers and insurance cos. just couldn't accept a single payer system (surprise). Also, Democrats needed Leiberman on board and his constituents included Hartford that were not going to vote for something that would destroy their main industry.
So.................."simply expanding Medicare" just wasn't possible then and would be fought tooth and nail today.
Just some comments.
Our blue cross group plan rates increased by 38% with passage of obamacare (new preimiums that went into effect Jan. 2011). Paying the extra premium for myself/spouse didn't bother me so much. However, we also had to pay the 38% increase for our 150 staff, which really takes a bite out of our operating profit. We had to lay off many staff and only recently have begun some renewed hiring.
I expect another +65% in premiums for 2014 after the election. Just a guess. That number may be too low.
From personal experiences of coleagues, if you live in Germany, are retirement age and need cancer surgery, they send you home. I have heard also people who swear by German health care. Maybe it is a question of who you know.
In France, everyone buys a supplementary policy in addition to the govt provided health care.
In Canada, if you need a hip replacement, you wait 13 months. Maybe by then you no longer need a hip replacement.
So, I am not at all convinced about how good the medicine is abroad.
Prescriptions cost so much more in the US because foregin countries don't let the pharma companies leverage their patents. Basically, it is the US consumer that funds the research $ for new drug development for the entire world. We are the patsies. Don't know if that is good or bad.
If you want me to follow up with a rebuttal during trading hours, just say so. It would tear apart what you wish you had said. That's a promise.
There is. If this were NOT about expanding government power and authority over the peons government would have simply expanded Medicare and Medicaid to cover more people. Too easy however.
Absolutely Dead On. Wish I had said that, will settle on repeating it:
And where you can find high quality healthcare at an affordable price abroad will most likely be in one of those so called "socialistic" healthcare systems which you hate so much.
Ever wonder why our healthcare system ranks so low among modern industrialized countries, but at the same time costs more than anywhere else? It is because it's main purpose is not looking after the public's welfare. It has been designed to maximize profits for the healthcare industry (primarily the Pharmaceutical companies) while maintaining the illusion that it will provide good affordable healthcare for all. I live abroad now, and I use the healthcare system (what you might mistakenly call an "evil socialistic" one), and it is far more affordable and at least as good as what I've had in the US. At the same time, it is not as huge a drain on government finances as the healthcare system in the US is. There is also more emphasis on prevention, which saves health dollars. Prescription drugs cost much less.
I don't know if getting rid of Obamacare would be a step in the right direction or not, it all depends on what replaces it. What we had before was not working and pretty much everyone agrees changes must be made, but Obamacare is also flawed in many ways .... although perhaps it's a start in the right direction. I am not optimistic that we will get very far in the right direction though ... not as long as the Pharmaceutical companies, insurance companies etc. are the ones controlling what can and can't get through Congress.
It is just another example of what is bringing down our country ..... everything is done for the benefit of the special interests (who can buy off the Congress), with the welfare of the people taking on secondary (if that) importance. The government can't be everything for everybody, but it should at least be fair in how it goes about it. This problem with the system needs to be fixed first and foremost before tackling all the other big problems, or we wind up with a lot expensive programs which don't serve the people well (unless you think of Corporations as people, as the Supreme Court does).
‘Perfect Rally’ Eluded Bulls, Slaughtered Bears
By: Rick Ackerman
Rick's Picks
Monday, 2 July 2012
Explosive rallies like the one we saw on Friday are opportunistic, launched to milk the last ounce of buying power from ostensibly positive news – in this case, word that Europe had come up with yet another plan to deal with its financial crisis. Of course, the very word “milk” implies that there were agents working behind the scenes to stage-manage the rally. This is not exactly correct, although it is close enough to the truth to stand scrutiny. Here’s how it works. Although we all “know” that Europe cannot possibly grow its way out of its mess, and that sooner or later the euro currency system will unravel, the mere pretense of doing something about it will always be sufficient to buy more time, at least until the day arrives that the system actually does fail. This means that those who have bet on the collapse of the banking system will continue to lose money until the day they are right, but not before. And while that day may seem inevitable to many of us, betting on it – especially with put options whose value decays with each passing week — presupposes a gift for timing that few humans possess. Indeed, it’s possible that perfunctory bailouts of no real consequence could keep the markets afloat for yet more months or years, if not indefinitely. This prospect should not seem farfetched to anyone who has watched the cycles of feigned hopefulness alternate with periods of disappointment and despair. In the lingo of chartists, we might say that waves of mass psychology have been “trading in a range.”
Looking at it from the technical side, these spectacular rallies occur simply because those who make their living by taking the other side of them step away whenever a stampede of buyers, including bears desperate to meet margin calls, comes thundering their way. They have quite a bit of latitude to avoid getting trampled, and so, inundated by a tidal swell of market orders, they simply raise their offers as high as they feel necessary to temporarily satiate the demand. Of crazed buyers, the pros who fade them would say, “If you’re desperate enough not to care how much you pay for this stock, then I will sell it to you at a price that doesn’t leave me equally desperate to get it back.” That is why more than two-thirds of Friday’s rally occurred before anyone had actually bought or sold any stock. Although the Dow Industrials finished the day with a 277-point gain, 193 points of it occurred in the first minute or two of the session, on what is known as a “gap” opening. Almost no stock changed hands during this interval; the first time that was to occur was after the pros on the other side of the bet had opened the 30 Dow stocks substantially higher. The effect was that those who attempted to “act on the news” were a day late.
Traders are soon to discover, or perhaps relearn, that this game is played with stocks moving down as well as up. Thus, bears who have been waiting patiently for months or even years to “even the score” are destined to see the hoped-for opportunity come and go in mere minutes. To be on board, permabears will need to have been short the night before — except that previous day’s session will most likely have ended with a short-squeeze spike that few of them will have survived.
http://news.goldseek.com/RickAckerman/1341216888.php
CSV chart is interesting, but the volume is very thin.
% Losers
Symbol Price Change Volume
LQDT -8.32 (-16.26%) 1.0M
CORT -0.31 (-6.90%) 0.2M
GBX -1.21 (-6.88%) 88,035
OPEN -3.02 (-6.71%) 0.2M
HCKT -0.37 (-6.64%) 68,265
GRPN -0.66 (-6.21%) 1.1M
PVA -0.44 (-5.99%) 0.1M
LIVE -0.70 (-5.85%) 19,205
CJJD -0.08 (-5.85%) 39,847
SGMO -0.32 (-5.80%) 70,146
Newly-sounds wonderful. The trail is on my list of things to do. God's country it is.
pants
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