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U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton publicly pressed Vietnam to further open its political system amid concerns about the Communist government's crackdown on democracy activists and the Internet. - Video: Clinton Meets Asean Leaders - Photos: Clinton Tours Asia - Clinton's Remarks Honoring Normalization - Opinion: Vietnam Rights and Wrongs
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703467304575382374165373024.html?mod=djemeasia_t
TAKE CARE of our VETERANS.......and then worry about the enemy !
Clinton pushes Vietnam on human rights progress
Jul 22, 6:03 AM (ET)
HANOI, Vietnam (AP) - U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton on Thursday urged Vietnam to improve its human rights record but also pledged greater cooperation in dealing with the lingering impact of Agent Orange from the Vietnam War.
In Hanoi to mark the 15th anniversary of normalized U.S.-Vietnam relations, Clinton praised her hosts for their "extraordinary, dynamic population" and said it "is on the path to becoming a great nation with an unlimited potential." To fulfill that promise, though, she said the communist government must ease curbs on free speech and political activity.
"That is among the reasons we expressed concern about arrest and conviction of people for peaceful dissent, attacks on religious groups and curbs on Internet freedom," she said in her opening comments at a joint news conference with Vietnamese Foreign Minister Pham Gia Khiem.
Ahead of her visit, human rights groups and U.S. lawmakers called on Clinton to raise the cases of jailed imprisoned dissidents, democratic and religious activists and bloggers with Vietnamese officials.
"The government of Vietnam's desire to reap the benefits of the global economy must be matched by efforts to respect comprehensive human rights," a bipartisan group of 19 members of Congress wrote to Clinton on July 15.
Clinton did not say if she had raised those cases but said the Obama administration wanted to work with Vietnam "to support efforts to pursue reforms and protect basic rights and freedoms."
But how much Vietnam is willing to cooperate on that was unclear as Khiem said he thought the subject is "a difference between Vietnam and the U.S."
"Human rights have common values but ... it depends a lot on the cultural and historical background," he said. He noted that President Barack Obama has said human rights values shouldn't be imposed from the outside.
Later, at a lunch hosted by the local American Chamber of Commerce, Clinton raised human rights again, calling it a "profound difference" between the U.S. and Vietnam even as trade and commerce have increased exponentially since relations were normalized in 1995, during her husband's administration.
"It is true that profound differences exist, particularly over the question of political freedoms," she told the audience. "The United States will continue to urge Vietnam to strengthen its commitment to human rights and give its people an even greater say over the direction of their own lives."
At the same time, Clinton said the U.S. does not see its relationship with Vietnam as rooted in differences or in memories of the past.
"We have learned to see each other not as former enemies but as actual and potential partners, colleagues and friends," she said. "We will continue to choose engagement and cooperation over escalation and division."
Clinton recalled her first visit to Vietnam in 2000, when she accompanied then-President Bill Clinton on a trip shortly before he left office. That trip was the first by a sitting U.S. president to Vietnam since the war ended in 1975.
She said they had not known what to expect but were overwhelmed by the friendly welcome they received from the Vietnamese people. "Everywhere we went we felt the warmth and hospitality of the Vietnamese people. For us, it had a profound impact," she said.
In her comments with Khiem, Clinton also promised to continue working with Vietnam on the consequences of Agent Orange. The U.S. military sprayed roughly 11 million gallons of the defoliant over large swaths of southern Vietnam between 1962 and 1971. Dioxin, a toxic chemical used in the herbicide, has been linked to cancers, birth defects and other ailments.
Vietnam says as many as 4 million of its citizens were exposed to the herbicide and as many as 3 million have suffered illnesses caused by it. A joint panel of U.S. and Vietnamese policymakers, citizens and scientists has urged Washington and other donors to provide $30 million annually over 10 years to clean up sites still contaminated by dioxin.
Clinton said she and Khiem had discussed "the concern that both Vietnam and the United States have about Agent Orange and the consequences it produced in the people here."
"We have been working with Vietnam for about nine years to try to remedy the effects of Agent Orange," Clinton said. She promised to "increase our cooperation and make even greater progress together."
Happy Fathers Day
And may Gods Blessing be on all our buddies, and their families, who stayed perpetually young and gave up up all their Fathers Day , and all their tomorrows, for this country.
Our Cause Was Just.
First some background:
All my life growing up I was constantly taught and reminded of the evils of communism from every sector of our society.
- Business: It was directly at odds with our free enterprise / capitalistic system.
- Government: It was a totalitarian government, the complete opposite of our Democratic Republic.
- Religion: It was pure evil: It was the actual "Tower of Babel" spoken of in the Bible. (An attempt by a people to build a tower so tall as to walk into heaven. (Heaven made attainable without God's assistance). An atheistic system attempting to establish heaven/(utopia) here on earth without God. As a Catholic, after every religious service, we said a prayer for the conversion of Russia.
When I returned from Vietnam I read everything I could find on communism starting with The Communist Manefesto by it's author Karl Marx. Karl Marx starts out on this relatively short thesis by defining "man" himself. As with any definition (Philosophy, Religion, etc) man is defined in relation to the animals and what makes him different from them. Most would say his possession of intelligence and free will. Marx says not so. What separates us from the animals is that which we need to subsist and thrive is not readily found in nature as with the animals. Man must hunt his food, build his shelters etc. Bottom line is: He Has to Work. And if he does not work he has lowered himself to the class of the animals and like with any animal, man can eliminate it. Most likely this is the justification of the "purgings" the communists have done throughout their history.
Nazi Germany or as it was better known then...The National Socialist Party: 8 million killed.
Communist Russia...15 million killed.
Communist China...Low estimates =20 million, upper estimates = 60 million
Cambodia...a full 1/3 of their population killed. The first to be eliminated were those that wore glasses. It was assumed that if you wore glasses you were probably educated and could read. Intellectuals were deemed an obstacle in building a people's agricultural society. 14 hour work days in the fields was standard and if you sat down you were executed by beheading with portable guillotine, as ammunition was needed to fight the resistance and later the Vietnamese. If you recall, Phenom Penn, the capital, was closed down, barbed wired off and the millions of citizens were sent to the fields to work.
Got your back, buddy!!
EZ
40 years later I am an old teacher at a high school in Texas...graduation last week...I started to think whether this generation could match ours...technically (IPOD, and all of that...they are surely way advanced in knowledge), but morally I wonder what went awry. The answer I keep mulling over was service. When a person serves his country, he will never feel the same about the country or the flag again. It has become special. In hindsight, I believe one of the gravest post-Vietnam mistakes we made was doing away will compulsary military service. The thought that the whole was more important than the component parts. I saw a Star Trek movie once, when Spock was dying of radiation sickness explain to Captain Kirk..that it was important to sacrifice one's life for the whole...we have lost that feeling...and that love of country. I can not see it improve as each generation becomes more separate from the last, more greedy, more prone for the easy answer, and less to sacrifice for the common good...
I believe our Vietnam generation was a good one, raised by the WW2 boys which has been descibed as our greatest generation. I see our present armed forces with that same thought of team work and selfless dedication. However I watch only a small percent enter the services, instead of the majority being offered as selective service did.
I just wish it was more of a higher number and more universal.
Just the ramblings of an old goat.
The birth certificate movie every American must see
'A Question of Eligibility' lays foundation
for understanding hot issue
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=114271
BORN IN THE USA? Poll shocker! Majority wants Obama records
Maintain president should be chased from office
if he doesn't come clean
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=159317
Army slams door on Obama details
Lt. Col. Lakin
hearing: 'Items pertaining to president's credentials
are not relevant'
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=161961
http://www.eutimes.net/?s=9%2F11
http://www.texemarrs.com/
American Patriot Foundation: FTC Terry Lakin Defense Fund
This is for everyone who forwarded a Memorial Day message of some sort. This is the one that broke my heart.
Some of you did not even know that one of my best H.S.
friend's name is on THIS WALL.
Ironically, unbeknownst to them at the time, his only son &
our oldest son became "next door neighbors" !
I don't know why I never heard this song before. Listen to this for Steve.
Listen to it for every name on the Wall. And never ever forget.
Click here _50,000_ (http://mywebpages.comcast.net/singingman7/TNOTW.htm)
Nothing I can say to that except..I wish I could have shared in the experience...Semper Fi...Thanks EZ
My Marine Buddy xxxxx xxxxxxx stopped by the Marine Memorial in Washington D.C. Yesterday. Here are his words....
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I just returned from my annual Memorial Day visit to the Marine Corps War Memorial, the Iwo Jima flag raising statue sculpted by Felix De Weldon. There was the usual big Memorial Day crowd, with vehicles parked all along the road into the memorial in the no parking areas. There were identical bouquets of flowers spread along the entire base of the statue.
As I walked around the statue, something caught my eye. There was a break in the row of flowers that marched evenly around the memorial. I approached the base of the statue to further investigate. What I found, interspersed between two of the identical bouquets, was an open bottle of Jack Daniel Single Barrel Tennessee whiskey. On a chain draped around the neck of the bottle was a small brass plate that simply said "United States Marine Corps". Beside the bottle were two shot glasses, each emblazoned with the Marine Corps emblem. One glass was empty, the other full. And there was a separate bouquet of flowers, unlike the ones ringing the memorial, laying on the ground beside the bottle. I was speechless and my eyes filled with tears. Some Marine from wars past, or from our current wars, had left a tribute to a fallen comrade. Words were not needed to convey this powerful Memorial Day message.
I led every person there who I could identify as a Marine to the tribute, and they all were deeply touched by it. I regret that I didn't have my camera along to record this for posterity. In all my visits to the War Memorial, on Memorial Day, the Marine Corps birthday, the Tuesday evening parades during the summer, or at any other time, I have never experienced anything like what I saw today. It is something that I will never forget.
Here's hoping that your Memorial Day is as momentous as mine.
Semper Fidelis,
xxxxx
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
That's ME!...))
ahhhh
You're too sneaky ole man
Hi TOP. I thought you'd like that site...
Thanks very much!
...and it was my pleasure to serve out country of 31 years.
You probably know me by my other alias as too: A1MP503.
Ron
))
I like that site
Thank you for your service to our wonderful country Sir!
God bless you
Vietnam War, the Virtual Wall...
This really is an amazing web site. Someone spent a lot of time and effort to create it.
The link below is a virtual wall of all those lost during the Vietnam war with the names, bio's and other information on our lost heroes. Those who remember that timeframe, or perhaps lost friends or family can look them up on this site. Pass the link on to others if you like.
http://www.virtualwall.org/iStates.htm
My buddys youngest brother gave HIS ALL, doing the Tet offensive of 2-'68.
That was the first time the NVA used their full Brigade troops.
He was a Marine Tanker!
I served in Korea.
503rd MP Co. Inchon.
Two tours of duty with the 716th MP Battlion in Nam.
http://www.militarypolicevietnam.com/main.html
Absolutely...and well put EZ..
For all of those that made the Sacrifice..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okNevEPb4YM
Right back at ya' Top !
Have a happy Memorial Day Brothers and sisters!
Everyday we lose some of this countrys greatest generation...the WW2 boys are leaving us...I saw this and thought of that fact...have a great weekend
A SOLDIER DIED TODAY
He was getting old and paunchy and his hair was falling fast,
And he sat around the Legion, telling stories of the past,
Of a war that he had fought in and the deeds that he had done,
In his exploits with his buddies; they were heroes, every one.
And tho’ sometimes, to his neighbors, his tales became a joke,
All his Legion buddies listened, for they knew whereof he spoke.
But we’ll hear his tales no longer for old Bill has passed away,
And the world’s a little poorer, for a soldier died today.
He will not be mourned by many, just his children and his wife,
For he lived an ordinary and quite uneventful life.
Held a job and raised a family, quietly going his own way,
And the world won’t note his passing, though a soldier died today.
When politicians leave this earth, their bodies lie in state,
While thousands note their passing and proclaim that they were great.
Papers tell their whole life stories, from the time that they were young,
But the passing of a soldier goes unnoticed and unsung.
Is the greatest contribution to the welfare of our land
A guy who breaks his promises and cons his fellow man?
Or the ordinary fellow who, in times of war and strife,
Goes off to serve his Country and offers up his life?
A politician’s stipend and the style in which he lives
Are sometimes disproportionate to the service that he gives.
While the ordinary soldier, who offered up his all,
Is paid off with a medal and, perhaps, a pension small.
It’s so easy to forget them for it was so long ago
That the old Bills of our Country went to battle, but we know
It was not the politicians, with their compromise and ploys,
Who won for us the freedom that our Country now enjoys.
Should you find yourself in danger, with your enemies at hand,
Would you want a politician with his ever-shifting stand?
Or would you prefer a soldier, who has sworn to defend
His home, his kin and Country and would fight until the end?
He was just a common soldier and his ranks are growing thin,
But his presence should remind us we may need his like again.
For when countries are in conflict, then we find the soldier’s part
Is to clean up all the troubles that the politicians start.
If we cannot do him honor while he’s here to hear the praise,
Then at least let’s give him homage at the ending of his days.
Perhaps just a simple headline in a paper that would say,
“OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, FOR A SOLDIER DIED TODAY”
* Copyright © 1985 by A. Lawrence Vaincourt. This poem and other works can be found in Mr. Vaincourt's book, Rhymes And Reflections (1991).
and following the snopes...maybe overquoted...was proposed but the quote is not verified
And for Memorial weekend....if you are WIA and go to a government hospital etc...you are selfish..according to our Commander-in-chief
I know some have seen before
>
> Bad press, including major mockery of the plan by
> comedian Jon Stewart, led to President Obama
> abandoning his proposal to require veterans carry
> private health insurance to cover the estimated
> $540 million annual cost to the federal
> government of treatment for injuries
> to military personnel received during their tours on active
> duty. The President admitted that he was puzzled
> by the magnitude of the opposition to his
> proposal.
>
>
> "Look, it's an all volunteer force," Obama
> complained. "Nobody made these guys go
> to war. They had to have known and
> accepted the risks. Now they whine about
> bearing the costs of their choice? It doesn't
> compute.." "I thought these were people who were
> proud to sacrifice for their country, "Obama
> continued. "I wasn't asking for blood, just
> money. With the country facing the worst financial
> crisis in its history, I'd have thought
> that the patriotic thing to do would be to try to
> help reduce the nation's deficit. I guess I
> underestimated the selfishness of some of my
> fellow Americans."
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/veteranshealth.asp" target="_blank">http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/veteranshealth.asp
>
It seems odd when a politician does it...it is called "mis speaks"...when the guy at the hall does it it is a bald faced lie...politicians do have a way with words
In the 60's no one wanted to be us...now we are a fashion statement lol....
That's the big thing about lies ----- hard to remember the "lie about the lie about the lie about the lie" !!
I work with a guy who has told so many lies over the years that he forgets I'm the wrong person to try it on.
I happen to know the man from several years back when he was a sergeant. He was put out because he met his service limitations without being promotion..... IE if you don't become a Staff Sergeant in so many years the Marine Corps Discharges you. Well, he was discharged and since he recieved VA benefits IE money he would tell people he's medically retired.....
What he didn't realize was all retirees have a retired ID card. I had to kill that stupid story the minute he came to me with it.
I've met a few at our local VFW that I've been suspect about....but, after a brewski or two......I tend to just
let it all go in one ear and out the other.
My first (one of) tip off is usually the guy who wants to
TALK ABOUT IT.....alot ~~ but, in generalities.
But, then again ----- at my (our) age ----- the memory 'can'
play tricks
We have a bunch of people around here (my state) who I have my doubts about.
Yup !
<< there is a BIG sad story there ---- and a bunch of smaller SAD stories too, Top ! >>
As you, I take the term Semper Fi very seriously ----- struggling with all of this !
And his son is a Marine?
Man I bet he's catching some hell for his father these days.
It gets even worse..this really makes me sick...
Phony Marine at Phony Vietnam Blumenthal's Presser
Clarice Feldman
Doug Ross spots a ringer. One of the merry band of brother "Marines" at the presser of Connecticut Democrat Senatorial candidate Blumenthal evidently is a phony soldier.
This is William Joseph Trumpower (AKA Eliot Storm), a man listed on POW Network's Phony Vets Database.
Trumpower, like Blumenthal, is a Connecticut resident and has made quite a name for himself hawking books on the Vietnam experience. The 'POW Networks Phony' database lists Trumpower's bogus credentials as follows:
CLAIMING BRONZE STAR w/VALOR device... Claims 2nd Lt, Claims... Wears 3 Purple Hearts, 2 Bronze Starsw/V. The jacket in EARLIER pictures boasted 8 ribbons. This NEW pic has more and includes V device on Bronze Star and 2nd Lt bars....
It's entirely fitting if the staged Blumenthal apology was, as our anonymous contributor asserts, accompanied by another puffed-up bloviator.
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2010/05/post_198.html
Colleague Says Blumenthal Claims Grew in Time
By MICHAEL BARBARO and DAVID M. HALBFINGER
Published: May 18, 2010
Former Representative Christopher Shays of Connecticut found it puzzling: over time, his friend Attorney General Richard Blumenthal kept revising how he talked about his military service during the Vietnam War. At first, in the 1980s, he was humble. He played it down, Mr. Shays recalled, characterizing it as humdrum desk work.
Over the last few years, however, more sweeping claims crept into Mr. Blumenthal’s descriptions, he said: that Mr. Blumenthal had served in Vietnam and had felt the sting of an ungrateful nation as he returned.
“He just kept adding to the story, the more he told it,” Mr. Shays said.
Mr. Shays said he became alarmed enough by the discrepancies that he at times considered mentioning the issue to Mr. Blumenthal, who on Tuesday said he took “full responsibility” for the occasions when he “misspoke” about his military history.
As it turned out, Mr. Blumenthal never served in Vietnam, but over time, his identification with veterans of war became so strong that some of those around him, like Mr. Shays, just assumed he had. He made it a point to attend the funeral of every active soldier from Connecticut killed in the line of duty, and he rearranges his schedule so he can speak at the ceremony for soldiers about to deploy to Iraq and Afghanistan.
As attorney general, he created a special division focused on veterans’ affairs and has become a national spokesman for veterans’ rights.
“Oh my God, this guy is relentless; he is nonstop when it comes to veterans,” said Michael Pizzuto, a veteran of the first Iraq war, who has spoken with Mr. Blumenthal at parades and news conferences for veterans in Connecticut.
Mr. Blumenthal discussed his past statements about his military service after The New York Times reported Monday night on its Web site that he had falsely said in March 2008 that he had served in Vietnam, and had repeatedly failed to correct media reports that perpetuated the claim.
At a news conference on Tuesday in West Hartford, where he was surrounded by veterans, Mr. Blumenthal, 64, a Democratic candidate for Senate, said he had never intended to mislead the public.
But in interviews, several military historians and social scientists said the Blumenthal story reflected the strained and unsettled relationship some men of his generation have with the Vietnam War. Some of them, driven by guilt or pride, begin to embellish their role, even if they did not serve in the war or played no heroic role, they said.
“There is a lot of anecdotal evidence of this phenomenon of exaggerating military service by people who feel nostalgic because they missed their war,” said Brian McAllister Linn, a professor at Texas A&M University who specializes in military history.
Mr. Shays, a conscientious objector who avoided the Vietnam War, has his own theory about Mr. Blumenthal’s evolving descriptions of his service: “I think that it was a way that he quickly bonded with people I am sure he admired and respected.”
“It’s very seductive,” he added, recalling his own visits with American service members in Iraq before he left Congress after losing re-election in 2008 as a Republican.
Although they are from different political parties, and Mr. Shays received campaign donations when in Congress from Linda McMahon, who is now seeking the Republican Senate nomination in the state, the two men enjoy a friendly relationship: Mr. Shays describes Mr. Blumenthal as a “straight shooter,” and Mr. Blumenthal has praised Mr. Shays’s work on behalf of veterans.
Politicians have always shown deference to veterans, but for Mr. Blumenthal, it seemed to be a calling. Colleagues said he relished marching in Veterans Day parades and visiting veterans halls, where he would chat about their tours of duty.
Far from hiding his military résumé, as some who did not see combat might do, he highlighted it. The biographical page of his Senate campaign Web site prominently displays a photo of a young Mr. Blumenthal, in his crisp blue and white uniform.
In Hartford and in Washington, Mr. Blumenthal’s advocacy for veterans’ rights is unyielding. He has lobbied the General Assembly to grant unemployment benefits to the spouses of military personnel, and advocated for the creation of a Hispanic affairs advocate within the Connecticut Department of Veterans Affairs.
The father of a Marine, he frequently speaks about the experience of attending the funerals of local service members who died in Iraq and Afghanistan. “The ceremonies are a powerful combination of wrenching grief and soaring pride,” he said in 2006.
In 2007, when he set up the veterans advocacy division of the attorney general’s office, he declared, “My office will fight for those who fought for us.”
In interviews, several veterans from around the state said the office had helped them penetrate the thick bureaucracy of the state’s benefits system, and applied a personal touch.
When Paul Kingman, a Navy veteran who lost feeling in his feet after chemotherapy, called Mr. Blumenthal’s office in 2007, he was trying to get a hearing for disability payments from the Social Security Administration. So it came as a surprise when Mr. Blumenthal himself got on the line.
“He’s a nice guy; he was cordial,” Mr. Kingman, 50, said from his home in Naugatuck. “Busy people like him, with all the rest going on in the state, I was surprised he’d have time for little old me.”
A week after his conversation with Mr. Blumenthal, Mr. Kingman learned that his hearing, which he had been trying to get for nearly four years, had been scheduled.
“I don’t know who he talked to, but next thing you know, I had a hearing,” said Mr. Kingman, who at the time was living on $200 a month and food stamps. “He stood up for me.”
Cecelia Louis had a similar story: after five years trying to obtain health care from the Connecticut Veterans Affairs Department for her 78-year-old husband, a Korean War veteran, she reached out to the attorney general’s office, which resolved the issue in a matter of weeks.
“He realizes, especially now with all the veterans coming home with great needs, how important this is,” she said.
Mr. Shays also spoke with affection and admiration for Mr. Blumenthal, whom he called “a person of high integrity.” That is why the former congressman regrets not speaking up before.
A few weeks ago, Mr. Shays attended a ceremony with Mr. Blumenthal in Bridgeport, to honor workers killed during an accident. When it was his turn to speak, Mr. Blumenthal at one point brought up the subject of his military service and lamented that when “we returned from Vietnam” Americans had spit on soldiers, Mr. Shays recalled.
“He is the kind of person I cared enough about that I wish I had nipped this in the bud when it was fomenting,” Mr. Shays said.
Michael M. Grynbaum contributed reporting.
When I was in country "fragging" was one of the choices !
It still is!!
I think pigs like that should be jailed!!!!!!!
My sentiments exactly!!!
nitetrak
It's probably best that I not expand on my own feelings ---- probably say something I'd regret.
Yes, how ironic that 40+ years later we're "IN VOGUE" !!
Semper fi, Eagle.
EZ: Yeppers, it's suddenly fashionable to be a Viet Nam vet and the ranks are miraculously expanding, sort of like those who saw Reggie's home run. Blumenthal is just another mouth looking for a parking place. He should dusting off his acceptance speech for prison captain.
Candidate’s Words on Vietnam Service Differ From History
At a ceremony honoring veterans and senior citizens who sent presents to soldiers overseas, Attorney General Richard Blumenthal of Connecticut rose and spoke of an earlier time in his life.
“We have learned something important since the days that I served in Vietnam,” Mr. Blumenthal said to the group gathered in Norwalk in March 2008. “And you exemplify it. Whatever we think about the war, whatever we call it — Afghanistan or Iraq — we owe our military men and women unconditional support.”
There was one problem: Mr. Blumenthal, a Democrat now running for the United States Senate, never served in Vietnam. He obtained at least five military deferments from 1965 to 1970 and took repeated steps that enabled him to avoid going to war, according to records.
The deferments allowed Mr. Blumenthal to complete his studies at Harvard; pursue a graduate fellowship in England; serve as a special assistant to The Washington Post’s publisher, Katharine Graham; and ultimately take a job in the Nixon White House.
In 1970, with his last deferment in jeopardy, he landed a coveted spot in the Marine Reserve, which virtually guaranteed that he would not be sent to Vietnam. He joined a unit in Washington that conducted drills and other exercises and focused on local projects, like fixing a campground and organizing a Toys for Tots drive.
Many politicians have faced questions over their decisions during the Vietnam War, and Mr. Blumenthal, who is seeking the seat being vacated by Senator Christopher J. Dodd, is not alone in staying out of the war.
But what is striking about Mr. Blumenthal’s record is the contrast between the many steps he took that allowed him to avoid Vietnam, and the misleading way he often speaks about that period of his life now, especially when he is speaking at veterans’ ceremonies or other patriotic events.
Sometimes his remarks have been plainly untrue, as in his speech to the group in Norwalk. At other times, he has used more ambiguous language, but the impression left on audiences can be similar.
In an interview on Monday, the attorney general said that he had misspoken about his service during the Norwalk event and might have misspoken on other occasions. “My intention has always been to be completely clear and accurate and straightforward, out of respect to the veterans who served in Vietnam,” he said.
But an examination of his remarks at the ceremonies shows that he does not volunteer that his service never took him overseas. And he describes the hostile reaction directed at veterans coming back from Vietnam, intimating that he was among them.
In 2003, he addressed a rally in Bridgeport, where about 100 military families gathered to express support for American troops overseas. “When we returned, we saw nothing like this,” Mr. Blumenthal said. “Let us do better by this generation of men and women.”
At a 2008 ceremony in front of the Veterans War Memorial Building in Shelton, he praised the audience for paying tribute to troops fighting abroad, noting that America had not always done so.
“I served during the Vietnam era,” he said. “I remember the taunts, the insults, sometimes even physical abuse.”
Mr. Blumenthal, 64, is known as a brilliant lawyer who likes to argue cases in court and uses language with power and precision. He is also savvy about the news media and attentive to how he is portrayed in the press.
But the way he speaks about his military service has led to confusion and frequent mischaracterizations of his biography in his home state newspapers. In at least eight newspaper articles published in Connecticut from 2003 to 2009, he is described as having served in Vietnam.
The New Haven Register on July 20, 2006, described him as “a veteran of the Vietnam War,” and on April 6, 2007, said that the attorney general had “served in the Marines in Vietnam.” On May 26, 2009, The Connecticut Post, a Bridgeport newspaper that is the state’s third-largest daily, described Mr. Blumenthal as “a Vietnam veteran.” The Shelton Weekly reported on May 23, 2008, that Mr. Blumenthal “was met with applause when he spoke about his experience as a Marine sergeant in Vietnam.”
And the idea that he served in Vietnam has become such an accepted part of his public biography that when a national outlet, Slate magazine, produced a profile of Mr. Blumenthal in 2000, it said he had “enlisted in the Marines rather than duck the Vietnam draft.”
It does not appear that Mr. Blumenthal ever sought to correct those mistakes.
In the interview, he said he was not certain whether he had seen the stories or whether any steps had been taken to point out the inaccuracies.
“I don’t know if we tried to do so or not,” he said. He added that he “can’t possibly know what is reported in all” the articles that are written about him, given the large number of appearances he makes at military-style events.
He said he had tried to stick to a consistent way of describing his military experience: that he served as a member of the United State Marine Corps Reserve during the Vietnam era.
Asked about the Bridgeport rally, when he told the crowd, “When we returned, we saw nothing like this,” Mr. Blumenthal said he did not recall the event.
An aide pointed out that in a different appearance this year, Mr. Blumenthal was forthright about not having gone to war. In a Senate debate in March, he responded to a question about Iran and the use of military force by saying, “Although I did not serve in Vietnam, I have seen firsthand the effects of military action, and no one wants it to be the first resort, nor do we want to mortgage the country’s future with a deficit that is ballooning out of control.”
On a less serious matter, another flattering but untrue description of Mr. Blumenthal’s history has appeared in profiles about him. In two largely favorable profiles, the Slate article and a magazine article in The Hartford Courant in 2004 with which he cooperated, Mr. Blumenthal is described prominently as having served as captain of the swim team at Harvard. Records at the college show that he was never on the team.
Mr. Blumenthal said he did not provide the information to reporters, was unsure how it got into circulation and was “astonished” when he saw it in print.
Mr. Blumenthal has made veterans’ issues a centerpiece of his public life and his Senate campaign, but even those who have worked closely with him have gotten the misimpression that he served in Vietnam.
In an interview, Jean Risley, the chairwoman of the Connecticut Vietnam Veterans Memorial Inc., recalled listening to an emotional Mr. Blumenthal offering remarks at the dedication of the memorial. She remembered him describing the indignities that he and other veterans faced when they returned from Vietnam.
“It was a sad moment,” she recalled. “He said, ‘When we came back, we were spat on; we couldn’t wear our uniforms.’ It looked like he was sad to me when he said it.”
Ms. Risley later telephoned the reporter to say she had checked into Mr. Blumenthal’s military background and learned that he had not, in fact, served in Vietnam.
The Vietnam chapter in Mr. Blumenthal’s biography has received little attention despite his nearly three decades in Connecticut politics.
But now, after repeatedly shunning opportunities for higher office, Mr. Blumenthal is the man Democrats nationally are depending on to retain the seat they controlled for 30 years under Mr. Dodd, and he is likely to face more intense scrutiny.
After obtaining Mr. Blumenthal’s Selective Service records through a Freedom of Information Act request, The New York Times asked David Curry, a professor at the University of Missouri-St. Louis and an expert on the Vietnam draft, to examine them.
Mr. Curry said the records showed that Mr. Blumenthal had received at least five deferments. Mr. Blumenthal did not dispute that but said he did not know how many deferments he had received.
Mr. Blumenthal grew up in New York City, the son of a successful businessman who ran an import-export company.
As a young man, he attended Riverdale Country School in the Bronx and showed great promise, along with an ability to ingratiate himself with powerful people.
In 1963, he entered Harvard College, where he met Daniel Patrick Moynihan, who served on the faculty there and guided Mr. Blumenthal’s senior thesis on the failure of government poverty programs.
He received two student deferments during his undergraduate years there, the records show.
After graduating from Harvard in 1967, military records show, Mr. Blumenthal obtained another educational deferment and headed to Britain, where he filed stories for The Washington Post and attended Trinity College, Cambridge, on a graduate fellowship.
But in early 1968, President Lyndon B. Johnson, under pressure over criticism that wealthier young men were avoiding the draft through graduate school, abolished nearly all graduate deferments and sharply increased the number of troops sent to Southeast Asia.
That summer, Mr. Blumenthal’s draft classification changed from 2-S, an educational deferment, to 2-A, an occupational deferment — a rare exemption from military service for men who contended that it was in the “national health, safety and interest” for them to remain in their civilian jobs. At the time, he was working as a special assistant to Ms. Graham, whose son Donald he had befriended at Harvard. Half a year later, after the election of President Richard M. Nixon, Mr. Blumenthal went to work in the White House as a senior staff assistant to Mr. Moynihan, who was Nixon’s urban affairs adviser.
But at the end of that year, he became eligible for induction after he drew a low number in a draft lottery held on Dec. 1, 1969. His number was 152, and people with numbers as high as 195 could be drafted, according to the Selective Service.
Two months after the lottery, in February 1970, Mr. Blumenthal obtained a second occupational deferment, according to the records. The status of people with occupational deferments, however, was growing shakier, with the war raging and the Nixon administration increasingly uncomfortable with them.
In April 1970, Mr. Blumenthal secured a spot in the Marine Corps Reserve, which was regarded as a safe harbor for those who did not want to go to war.
“The Reserves were not being activated for Vietnam and were seen as a shelter for young privileged men,” Mr. Curry said.
But Mr. Blumenthal’s campaign manager, Mindy Myers, said Monday that any suggestion that he was ducking the war was unfounded, saying he was engaged in important work. When he worked for Ms. Graham, for example, he helped teach children in a public school in the Anacostia section of Washington, for a project she had started there.
“It’s flat wrong to imply that Richard Blumenthal’s decisions to take a Fiske Fellowship, teach inner-city schoolchildren and work in the White House for Daniel Patrick Moynihan were decisions to avoid service when in fact, while still eligible for a deferment, he chose to enlist in the Marine Corps Reserves and completed six months of service at Parris Island, S.C., and then six years of service in the Reserves.”
Mr. Blumenthal landed in the Fourth Civil Affairs Group in Washington, whose members included the well-connected in Washington. At the time, the unit was not associated with the kind of hardship of traditional fighting units, according to Marine reports from the period and interviews with about a half-dozen men who served in the unit during the Vietnam years.
In the 1970s, the unit’s members were dispatched to undertake projects like refurbishing tent decks and showers at a campground for underprivileged Washington children, as well as collecting and distributing toys and games as part of regular Toys for Tots drives.
Robert Cole, a retired lieutenant colonel who did active duty overseas in the 1950s and later joined the unit as a reservist, recalled the young men who joined the unit in the late 1960s and early 1970s. “These kids we were getting in — a lot of them were worried about the draft,” he said.
After entering Yale Law School in the fall of 1970, Mr. Blumenthal transferred to a Marine Reserve unit in New Haven, Company C of the Sixth Motor Transport Battalion, Fourth Marine Division, which conducted occasional military drills, as well as participating in Christmas toy drives for children and recycling programs in neighboring communities, according to the unit’s command reports from the time.
In 1974, Mr. Blumenthal took a position as a law clerk for Justice Harry C. Blackmun of the United States Supreme Court and transferred back to a Washington unit, where he completed his service.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/18/nyregion/18blumenthal.html?pagewanted=print
Jane Fonda realy is lower than whale chit.
Why Ann Margret who regularly performed for the Vietnam troops with the Bob Hope show, I'll never know. Not to mention that she was a beauty beyond compare.
If any one needs any more Jane Fonda urinal targets....Just let me know.
nitetrak
SHE REALLY WAS A TRAITOR!!
And now OBAMA wants to honor her ......!!!!
In Memory of
My brother -in- law
LT. C.Thomsen Wieland
Who spent 100 days at the Hanoi Hilton
IF YOU NEVER FORWARDED
ANYTHING IN YOUR LIFE > FORWARD THIS SO THAT
EVERYONE WILL KNOW!!!!!!
She really is a traitor
A TRAITOR IS ABOUT TO BE HONORED
KEEP THIS MOVING ACROSS AMERICA
This is for all the kids born in the 70's who do
Not remember, and didn't have to bear the
Burden that our fathers, mothers and older
Brothers and sisters had to bear.
Jane Fonda is being honored as one of the
'100 Women of the Century.'
Unfortunately, many have forgotten and still
Countless others have never known how Ms.
Fonda betrayed not only the idea of our country,
But specific men who served and sacrificed
During Vietnam
The first part of this is from an F-4E pilot.
The pilot's name is Jerry Driscoll, River Rat.
In 1968, the former Commandant of the USAF
Survival School was a POW in Ho Lo Prison
The ' Hanoi Hilton.'
Dragged from a stinking cesspit of a cell,
Cleaned, fed, and dressed in clean PJ's, he was
Ordered to describe for a visiting American
'Peace Activist' the 'lenient and humane
Treatment he'd received.
He spat at Ms. Fonda, was clubbed, and was
Dragged away.
During the subsequent beating, he fell forward
On to the camp Commandant 's feet, which
Sent that officer berserk.
In 1978, the Air Force Colonel still suffered from
Double vision (which permanently ended his
Flying career) from the Commandant's frenzied
Application of a wooden baton.
From 1963-65, Col. Larry Carrigan was in the
47FW/DO (F-4E's). He spent 6 years in the
'Hanoi Hilton',,, the first three of which his
Family only knew he was 'missing in action'.
His wife lived on faith that he was still alive.
His group, too, got the cleaned-up, fed and
Clothed routine in preparation for a
'peace delegation' visit.
They, however, had time and devised a plan to
Get word to the world that they were alive
An d still survived. Each man secreted a tiny
Piece of paper, with his Social Security Number
On it , in the palm of his hand.
When paraded before Ms. Fonda and a
Cameraman, she walked the line, shaking each
man's hand and asking little encouraging
Snippets like: 'Aren't you sorry you bombed
Babies?' and 'Are you grateful for the humane
Treatment from your benevolent captors?'
Believing this HAD to be an act, they each
Palmed her their sliver of paper.
She took them all without missing a beat.. At the
End of the line and once the camera stopped
Rolling, to the shocked disbelief of the POWs,
She turned to the officer in charge and handed
Him all the little pieces of paper.
Three men died from the subsequent beatings.
Colonel Carrigan was almost number four
But he survived, which is the only reason we
Know of her actions that day.
I was an economic development advisor
In Vietnam , and was captured by the North
Vietnamese communists in South Vietnam in
1968, and held prisoner for over 5 years.
I spent 27 months in solitary confinement; one
Year in a cage in Cambodia ; and one year
In a 'black box' in Hanoi
My North Vietnamese captors deliberately
Poisoned and murdered a female missionary, a
Nurse in a leprosarium in Ban me Thuot, South
Vietnam , whom I buried in the jungle near the
Cambodian border.
At one time, I weighed only about 90 lbs.
(My normal weight is 170 lbs)
We were Jane Fonda's 'war criminals..'
When Jane Fonda was in Hanoi , I was asked by
The camp communist political officer if I would
Be willing to meet with her..
I said yes, for I wanted to tell her about the real
Treatment we POWs received... And how
Different it was from the treatment purported by
The North Vietnamese, and parroted by her as
'humane and lenient.'
Because of this, I spent three days on a rocky
Floor on my knees, with my arms outstretched
With a large steel weights placed on my hands,
And beaten with a bamboo cane.
I had the opportunity to meet with Jane Fonda
soon after I was released. I asked her
if she would be willing to debate me on TV.
She never did answer me.
These first-hand experiences do not exemplify
someone who should be honored as part
of '100 Years of Great Women.'
Lest we forget...' 100 Years of Great Women'
should never include a traitor whose hands are
covered with the blood of so many patriots.
There are few things I have strong visceral
reactions to, but Hanoi Jane's participation in
blatant treason, is one of them.
Please take the time to forward to as many
people as you possibly can.
It will eventually end up on her computer and
she needs to know that we will never forget.
RONALD D. SAMPSON, CMSgt, USAF
716 Maintenance Squadron, Chief of
Maintenance
DSN: 875-6431
COMM: 883-6343
PLEASE HELP BY
SENDING THIS
TO EVERYONE
IN YOUR ADDRESS
BOOK. IF ENOUGH
PEOPLE SEE THIS
MAYBE HER
STATUS WILL
CHANGE
Not a problem ~~ some things deserve repeating.....you've been a great supporter here ~~~ THANKS!!!!
Not at all...My bad.
Please delete my post Ez. I should have looked before I spoke.
Thx,
nitetrak
In fact delete all 3 posts concerning my boo-boo.
True! I've always felt that The Vietnam War was a poxy war against Russia. Some people were very surprised to hear me say that, but certainly no Vietnam Vet.
nitetrak
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Moderators chunga1 HoosierHoagie *MARINE 1* |
WELCOME ALL !!!
Never forget !!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgCVS2mHe0Q
In honor of all our lost family and friends and special recognition given to a really good friend ~~~
http://www.in.gov/iwm/historical/kmia-vietnam.html
================================================================
Vietnam Veteran's Terminology and Slang.
Quite a bookoo list. Many of these I've never seen in print before. Ought to bring back a memory or two. I hope most are good.
http://www.vietvet.org/glossary.htm
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