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Acting Without Idea Is the Way of Love
Thought must always be limited by the thinker who is conditioned; the thinker is always conditioned and is never free; if thought occurs, immediately idea follows. Idea in order to act is bound to create more confusion. Knowing all this, is it possible to act without idea? Yes, it is the way of love. Love is not an idea; it is not a sensation; it is not a memory; it is not a feeling of postponement, a self-protective device. We can only be aware of the way of love when we understand the whole process of idea. Now, is it possible to abandon the other ways and know the way of love, which is the only redemption? No other way, political or religious, will solve the problem. This is not a theory which you will have to think over and adopt in your life; it must be actual. When you love, is there idea? Do not accept it; just look at it, examine it, go into it profoundly; because every other way we have tried, and there is no answer to misery. Politicians may promise it; the so-called religious organizations may promise future happiness; but we have not got it now, and the future is relatively unimportant when I am hungry. We have tried every other way; and we can only know the way of love if we know the way of idea and abandon idea, which is to act.
J. Krishnamurti, The Book of Life
I did;) TY!
A very gifted and intelligent person. Finding form and purpose where most others saw none. A "secular saint" for sure. I do believe this path of inquiry he devoted himself to would lead to our richest and most fullest understanding of the concept of God as the quantum potential.
As with all truly great thinkers, David Bohm's philosophical ideas found expression in his character and way of life. His students and colleagues describe him as totally unselfish and non-competitive, always ready to share his latest thoughts with others, always open to fresh ideas, and single-mindedly devoted to a calm but passionate search into the nature of reality. In the words of one of his former students, "He can only be characterized as a secular saint." (B. Hiley & F. David Peat eds., Quantum Implications: Essays in Honour of David Bohm, Routledge & Kegan Paul, London, 1987, p. 48.)
Bohm believed that the general tendency for individuals, nations, races, social groups, etc., to see one another as fundamentally different and separate was a major source of conflict in the world. It was his hope that one day people would come to recognize the essential interrelatedness of all things and would join together to build a more holistic and harmonious world. What better tribute to David Bohm's life and work than to take this message to heart and make the ideal of universal brotherhood the keynote of our lives.
Yes, the experiment showed there is more in play than we consciously realize in exercising will.
Awareness, the Origin of Thought, and the Role of Conscious Self-Deception in Resistance and Repression.
one can be aware of and have knowledge of "things" prior to being conscious of them, it is possible to know, yet not know, or rather not think about certain objectionable feelings or tacit ideas.
http://brainmind.com/Awareness.html
You might like this............
David Bohm and the Implicate Order
http://www.theosophy-nw.org/theosnw/science/prat-boh.htm
The Conscious and the Unconscious Mind
J. Krishnamurti Talks in Europe 1967 1st Public Talk Paris 16th April 1967
http://www.jkrishnamurti.org/krishnamurti-teachings/view-text.php?tid=18&chid=591
So, freedom from authority, which means freedom from fear, from psychological fear, surely is the first requirement for order? Is it possible to be free, totally, from fear - both at the conscious as well as the unconscious level? And is there such a thing as the unconscious at all? We have accepted the idea of the unconscious as part of us - that has been the fashion - but is there such a thing? Because, enquiring now into this question of whether it is possible to be completely free from fear, one obviously has to go into this question of the unconscious.
Is there such a thing as the unconscious? I do not know what you think about it, what you discover. If there is the unconscious, how is the conscious mind going to uncover it? (The speaker is not accepting the unconscious, but we are examining what is said about the unconscious.) As it is said, the unconscious is the past, the racial inheritance, the storehouse of all human endeavour and so on; it is at a very deep level in each one of us. How is the conscious mind going to uncover that storehouse, all that hidden something which we have accepted? How are we going to examine with the conscious mind something which is unconscious? It is said that you examine it through analysis, going to an expert, an analyser that is, if you have the money and feel neurotic enough to go to him. Now, how are you as a human being going to examine something of which you know nothing, except verbally? Can the conscious mind look into the unconscious - or can it only discover through dreams, through intimations, an occasional glimpse of that thing called the unconscious? Can the observer, who is the analyser, who is part of and not separate from the structure, examine the other part of the structure? What it can examine is its own part and not the total structure. It can attempt to analyse the unconscious by watching every movement of thought, every motive, every dream. And to do that takes time. You can spend all your life analysing. And if in your analysis you are not extremely accurate, your next analysis will go wrong, will not be true. It takes time - and is time the instrument that will bring freedom, and there- fore order? - I hope I am making myself clear - time being the distance between the analyser, and the analysed, and the object which is going to be gained at the end of the analysis. To cover that interval between the observer and the ultimate end when he will be totally free - that distance is time. That interval, the gradual process, is time - will time bring freedom and order? If the unconscious cannot be examined so critically, so closely, so deeply by the conscious mind, then what is one to do? You understand the problem? Or, is there a totally different approach to this? - there must be. We have lived for thousands and thousands of years in this way and we have not escaped the trap. We get out of one trap, only to fall into another. One sees that as long as there is fear, at any level of consciousness, traps and authorities must invariably exist. And therefore the unconscious becomes immensely important - that is, when you say time is necessary to bring about change, then you have all these complicated problems, and therefore no ending to problems at all. But if you deny time - that is - no tomorrow at all, psychologically, which means really, no tomorrow as pleasure - there is no gradual unfolding of the conscious or the unconscious. If you deny time there is no acquiring of virtue, there is no achievement, there is no tomorrow. Which doesn't mean, if you say `There is no tomorrow', that one is in despair. But if you really understand this whole issue, then, when the mind frees itself from time the question of fear becomes something entirely different. Then the mind is in direct contact with that thing which is called fear - there is no interval of space between the observer and the observed, fear. One says, `I am afraid', afraid of my neighbour, afraid of death, afraid of not being a success - that is, I am different from that fear. And when there is a separation between the observer and the observed, then there is an action to do something about the observed. When I say, `I am afraid', then I want to do something about that fear, I want to control it,
I want to shape it, I want to get rid of it, I want to escape from it, which means I am different from that fear. But I am that fear, that fear and me are part of the whole structure of life.
So, when this interval of space, which is time, between the sayer, who says, `I am afraid', and the fear disappears, then one is directly in contact with the fact - there is only the fact, not you as the observer of the fact. There are several things that take place in this process: you eliminate conflict altogether when the observer is the observed - for the observer is fear itself - this means you have the energy, that energy which has the form of fear. Since there is no interval between yourself and the fact, since the energy is you and the fear, there is, as we said, no conflict at all - obviously - therefore there is no positive action with regard to fear. There is no positive action at all, but merely a state of observation, seeing the fact, seeing actually `what is' - because you have removed the image - you understand Sirs?
Thnx......I love this stuff
The Mirror of Relationship
Jiddu Krishnamurti
Ojai, California
6th Talk in the Oak Grove 10th May, 1936
Some of you may think that I am repetitive, and I may be so, for the questions that have been sent in, the interviews and general conversations I have had with people, have given me the impression that there is little understanding of what I have been saying; and so I have to repeat the same thing in different words. I hope those of you who have more or less grasped the fundamental ideas will have the patience to listen again to what I have to say.
There is so much suffering, in such a variety of ways, that one agonizes over it. This is not an empty phrase. One perceives so much exploitation and cruelty around one, that one is constantly asking oneself what is the cause of sorrow and by what means can it be dissipated.
There are some who firmly believe that the misery of the world is the result of some evil misfortune beyond the control of man, and that happiness and freedom from sorrow can exist only in another world, when man returns to God. This attitude towards life is completely erroneous, from my point of view, for this chaos is of man's own making.
To discern the process of suffering, each one must comprehend himself. To understand oneself is one of the most difficult tasks and demands the most strenuous effort and constant alertness, and very few have the inclination or the desire to comprehend deeply this process of suffering and sorrow. We have more opportunities to dissipate our energies through absurd amusements, futile conversations and vain pursuits, than to search out, to penetrate deeply into our own psychological demands, needs, beliefs and ideals. But this involves strenuous effort on our part, and as we do not wish to exert ourselves, we would rather escape into all manner of easy satisfactions.
If we do not escape through diversions, we escape through beliefs, through the activities of organizations with their loyalties and commitments. These beliefs become a shield, preventing us from comprehending ourselves. Religious societies promise to help us to understand ourselves, but unfortunately we are exploited and we merely repeat their phrases and succumb to the authority of their leaders. So these organizations, with their increasing restrictions and secret promises, lead us away into further complications which make us incapable of understanding ourselves. Once we have committed ourselves to a particular society, to its leaders and their friends, we begin to develop those loyalties and responsibilities which prevent us from being wholly honest with ourselves. There are of course other forms of escape, through various superficial activities.
To understand oneself profoundly, one needs balance. That is, one cannot abandon the world, hoping to understand oneself, or be so entangled in the world that there is no occasion to comprehend oneself. There must be balance, neither renunciation nor acquiescence. This demands alertness and deep awareness. We must learn to observe our actions, thoughts, ideals, beliefs, silently and without judgment, without interpreting them, so as to be able to discern their true significance. We must first be cognizant of our own ideals, pursuits, wants, without accepting or condemning them as being right or wrong. At present we cannot discern what is true and what is false, what is lasting and what is transient, because the mind is so crippled with its own self-created wants, ideals and escapes that it is incapable of true perception. So we must first learn to be silent and balanced observers of our limitations and frictions which cause sorrow.
If you begin to observe, you will see that you are seeking new explanations, definitions, satisfactions, ideals, graphic images and pictures, as substitutes for the old. You accepted the old beliefs, explanations and pictures because they satisfied you; and now, through friction with life, you are finding out that they no longer give you what you crave. So you seek new explanations, new hopes, new ideals and escapes, but with the same background of want and satisfaction. Then you begin to compare the old explanations with the new, and choose those which give you the greatest security and contentment. You think that by accepting these new explanations and ideals, you will find happiness and peace. As your demand is for contentment and satisfaction, you help to create and accept beliefs and explanations that fulfil your want, and then you begin to shape your thought and conduct according to these new moulds. If you observe, you will perceive that this is so. As there is so much suffering, both within and without, you desire to know the cause, but you are easily satisfied with explanations and you continue to suffer. Explanations are as so much dust to a discerning mind.
Some of you believe in the idea of reincarnation. You come and ask me what I believe, whether reincarnation is a fact or not, whether I remember my past lives, and so on. Now, why do you ask me? Why do you want to know what I think about it? You want a further confirmation of your own belief, which you call a fact, a law, because it gives you a hope, a purpose in life. Thus belief becomes to you a fact, a law, and you go about seeking confirmation of your hope. Even though I may confirm it, it cannot be of vital importance to you. Whatever it may be to me, real or false, what is important for you is that you should discern for yourself these conceptions, through action, through living, and not accept any assertions.
There are three conditions of mind: "I know", "I believe", and "I do not know." When you say, "I know", you mean you know through experience, and through that experience you become certain and convinced of an idea, a belief. But that certainty, that conviction may be based on imagination, on a wish-fulfilment, which to you gradually becomes a fact, and so you say, "I know." Some say reincarnation is a fact, and to them perhaps it is so, as they say they can see their past lives; but to you who crave for continuity, reincarnation gives hope and purpose, and so you cling to the idea, saying that it is your intuition that prompts you to accept it as a fact, as a law. You accept the idea of rebirth on the assertion of another, without ever questioning his knowledge, which may be imagination, hallucination, or the projection of a wish. Craving self-perpetuation, immortality, you become incapable of true discernment. If you do not say, "I know", you then say, "I believe in reincarnation because it explains the inequalities of life." Again, this belief, which you say is prompted by intuition, is the outcome of a hidden hope and craving for continuity.
Thus both the "I know" and "I believe" are insecure, uncertain and not to be relied on. But if you can say, "I do not know", fully comprehending its significance, then there is a possibility of perceiving that which is. To be in a state of not knowing demands great denudation and strenuous effort, but it is not a negative state; it is a most vital and earnest state for the mind-heart that does not grasp at explanations and assertions.
One can casually and easily say that one does not know, and most people say it. One hears and reads so much about the cause of suffering, that unconsciously one begins to accept this explanation and reject that, according to the dictates of satisfaction and hope. As most people have minds cluttered up with beliefs, prejudices, hidden hopes and demands, it is almost impossible for them to say, "I do not know." They are so bound to certain beliefs by their inner longings, that they are never in a state of complete bankruptcy. They are never in that state of utter denudation when all the supports, explanations, hopes, influences have completely ceased.
We begin to discern what is true only when all want has ceased, for want creates beliefs, ideals, hopes, which are mere escapes. When the mind is no longer seeking security in any form, or demanding explanations, or relying on subtle influences, then, in that state of nakedness, there is the real, the permanent. If the mind is able to discern that it is creating its own ignorance through craving and perpetuating itself through its own action of want, then consciousness changes to reality. Then there is permanency, then there is the ending of the transiency of consciousness. Consciousness is the action or friction between ignorance and the external provocations of life, of the world, and this consciousness, this strife and sorrow, is self-perpetuating through want, through craving, which creates its own ignorance.
K does a great job on ideology. "If only everyone"...but that's a fantasy.....there will never be a time when "everyone". In the meantime, the present and its opportunities slip by.
I remember a milestone in my life when I was still a Christian.....just barely...it dawned on me that others....Hindus, Muslims, etc.....believed they were right just as strongly as I did. To continue in that vain seemed pointless and also the height of arrogance.
STALEMATE......nothing but conflict could come out of that. There had to be another way.
"Consciously".....mmmm? Remember the test you posted?...the woman who had to press a key when she "consciously" decided to press the button? There was a lag....right?....between what the electrodes attached to her head said and when she "decided" to press the key?
A part of the brain had already sensed the command was coming and geared up for it. But is that "conscious"? In her case no. Many of us think of conscious as the moment we subvocalize something...whatever that may be. You can cut to the chase though as you train yourself to not subvocalize....it's an extra unecessary step.
To make the distinction clearer, I use the words "aware" and "conscious". A baby is aware of this duality, but not yet conscious of it. Sadly, by the time the child becomes conscious of it, the other side has been already pushed to the background.
I remember when I was about 6......I made a conscious decision....I chose the waking world over the other.
We sense, from the moment we are born, that there are two parts to us. At the time of birth, and for a while after, we are all nagual. We sense, then, that in order to function we need a counterpart to what we have. The tonal is missing and that gives us, from the very beginning, a feeling of incompleteness. Then the tonal starts to develop and it becomes utterly important to our functioning, so important that it opaques the shine of the nagual , it overwhelms it. From the moment we become all tonal we do nothing else but to increment that old feeling of incompleteness which accompanies us from the moment of our birth, and which tells us constantly that there is another part to give us completeness.
From the moment we become all tonal we begin making pairs. We sense our two sides, but we always represent them with items of the tonal. We say that the two parts of us are the soul and the body. Or mind and matter. Or good and evil. God and Satan. We never realize, however, that we are merely paring things on the island, very much like paring coffee and tea, or bread and tortillas, or chili and mustard. I tell you, we are weird animals. We get carried away and in our madness we believe ourselves to be making perfect sense.
What can one specifically find in that area beyond the island? There is no way of answering that. If I would say, Nothing, I would only make the nagual part of the tonal . All I can say is that there, beyond the island, one finds the nagual.
But then you say, when I call it the nagual , aren't I also placing it on the island? No. I named it only because I wanted to make you aware of it. I have named the tonal and the nagual as a true pair. That is all I have done.
Don Juan Matus....Tales of Power
Action Without Ideation
The idea is the result of the thought process, the thought process is the response of memory, and memory is always conditioned. Memory is always in the past, and that memory is given life in the present by a challenge. Memory has no life in itself; it comes to life in the present when confronted by a challenge. And all memory, whether dormant or active, is conditioned, is it not? Therefore there has to be quite a different approach. You have to find out for yourself, inwardly, whether you are acting on an idea, and if there can be action without ideation.
J. Krishnamurti, The Book of Life
Acts of Love
By Chris Hedges
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/acts_of_love_20120219/
February 20, 2012 "TruthDig" --- Love, the deepest human commitment, the force that defies empirical examination and yet is the defining and most glorious element in human life, the love between two people, between children and parents, between friends, between partners, reminds us of why we have been created for our brief sojourns on the planet. Those who cannot love—and I have seen these deformed human beings in the wars and conflicts I covered—are spiritually and emotionally dead. They affirm themselves through destruction, first of others and then, finally, of themselves. Those incapable of love never live.
“Hell,” Dostoevsky wrote, “is the inability to love.”
And yet, so much is written and said about love that at once diminishes its grandeur and trivializes its meaning. Dr. James Luther Adams, my ethics professor at Harvard Divinity School, cautioned all of us about preaching on love, reminding us that any examination of love had to include, as Erich Fromm pointed out in “Selfishness and Self-Love,” the unmasking of pseudo-love.
God is a verb rather than a noun. God is a process rather than an entity. There is some biblical justification for this. God, after all, answered Moses’ request for revelation with the words, “I AM WHO I AM.” This phrase is probably more accurately translated “I WILL BE WHAT I WILL BE.” God seems to be saying to Moses that the reality of the divine is an experience. God comes to us in the profound flashes of insight that cut through the darkness, in the hope that permits human beings to cope with inevitable despair and suffering, in the healing solidarity of kindness, compassion and self-sacrifice, especially when this compassion allows us to reach out to others, and not only others like us, but those defined by our communities as strangers, as outcasts. “I WILL BE WHAT I WILL BE.” This reality, the reality of the eternal, must be grounded in that which we cannot touch, see or define, in mystery, in a kind of faith in the ultimate worth of compassion, even when the reality of the world around us seems to belittle compassion as futile.
“The courage to be is rooted in the God who appears when God has disappeared in the anxiety of doubt,” wrote Paul Tillich.
Aristotle said that only two living entities are capable of solitude and complete separateness: God and beast. The most acute form of human suffering is loneliness. The isolated human individual can never be fully human. And for those cut off from others, for those alienated from the world around them, the false covenants of race, nationalism, the glorious cause, class and gender compete, with great seduction, against the covenant of love. These sham covenants—and we see them dangled before us daily—are based on exclusion and hatred rather than universality. These sham covenants do not call us to humility and compassion, to an acknowledgement of our own imperfections, but to a form of self-exaltation disguised as love. Those most able to defy these sham covenants are those who are grounded in love, those who find their meaning and worth in intimate relationships that cut through the loneliness and isolation of the human condition.
There are few sanctuaries in war. Couples in love provide one. And it was to such couples that I consistently retreated. These couples repeatedly acted to save those branded as the enemy—Muslims trapped in Serb enclaves in Bosnia or dissidents hunted by the death squads in El Salvador. These rescuers did not act as individuals. Nechama Tec documented this peculiar reality when she studied Polish rescuers of Jews during World War II. Tec did not find any particular character traits or histories that led people to risk their lives for others, often for people they did not know, but she did find they almost always acted because their relationship explained to them the world around them. Love kept them grounded. These couples were not able to halt the destruction and violence around them. They were powerless. They could and often did themselves become victims. But it was with them, seated in a concrete hovel in a refugee camp in Gaza or around a wood stove on a winter night in the hills outside Sarajevo, that I found sanity and peace, that I was reminded of what it means to be human. It seemed it was only in such homes that I ever truly slept during war.
Love, when it is deep and sustained by two individuals, includes self-giving—often tremendous self-sacrifice—as well as desire. For the covenant of love recognizes both the fragility and sanctity of all human beings. It recognizes itself in the other. And it alone can save us, especially from ourselves.
Sigmund Freud divided the forces in human nature between the Eros instinct, the impulse within us that propels us to become close to others, to preserve and conserve, and the Thanatos, or death instinct, the impulse that works toward the annihilation of all living things, including ourselves. For Freud these forces were in eternal conflict. All human history, he argued, is a tug of war between these two instincts.
“The meaning of the evolution of civilization is no longer obscure to us,” Freud wrote in “Civilization and Its Discontents.” “It must present the struggle between Eros and Death, between the instinct of life and instinct of destruction, as it works itself out in the human species. This struggle is what all life essentially consists of.”
We are tempted, indeed in a consumer culture encouraged, to reduce life to a simple search for happiness. Happiness, however, withers if there is no meaning. The other temptation is to disavow the search for happiness in order to be faithful to that which provides meaning. But to live only for meaning—indifferent to all happiness—makes us fanatic, self-righteous and cold. It leaves us cut off from our own humanity and the humanity of others. We must hope for grace, for our lives to be sustained by moments of meaning and happiness, both equally worthy of human communion. And it is this grace, this love, which in our darkest moments allows us to endure.
Viktor Frankl in “Man’s Search for Meaning” grappled with Eros and Thanatos in the Auschwitz death camp. He recalled being on a work detail, freezing in the blast of the Polish winter, when he began to think about his wife, who had already been gassed by the Nazis although he did not know it at the time.
“A thought transfixed me,” he wrote, “for the first time in my life I saw the truth as it is set down by so many poets, proclaimed as the final wisdom by so many thinkers. The truth—that love is the ultimate and the highest goal to which man can aspire. Then I grasped the meaning of the greatest secret that human poetry and human thought and belief have to impart. The salvation of man is through love and in love.”
Love is an action, a difference we try to make in the world.
“We love our enemy when we love his or her ultimate meaning,” professor Adams told us. “We may have to struggle against what the enemy stands for; we may not feel a personal affinity or passion for him. Yet we are commanded for this person’s sake and for our own and for the sake of the destiny of creation, to love that which should unite us.”
To love that which should unite us requires us to believe there is something that connects us all, to know that at some level all of us love and want to be loved, to base all our actions on the sacred covenant of love, to know that love is an act of will, to refuse to exclude others because of personal difference or race or language or ethnicity or religion. It is easier to be indifferent. It is tempting to hate. Hate propels us to the lust for power, for control, to the Hobbesian nightmare of an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. Hate is what people do when they are distressed, as many Americans are now, by uncertainty and fear. If you hate others they will soon hate or fear you. They will reject you. Your behavior assures it. And through hate you become sucked into the sham covenants of the nation, the tribe, and you begin to speak in the language of violence, the language of death.
Love is not selflessness. It is the giving of one’s best self, giving one’s highest self unto the world. It is finding true selfhood. Selflessness is martyrdom, dying for a cause. Selfhood is living for a cause. It is choosing to create good in the world. To love another as one loves oneself is to love the universal self that unites us all. If our body dies, it is the love that we have lived that will remain—what the religious understand as the soul—as the irreducible essence of life. It is the small, inconspicuous things we do that reveal the pity and beauty and ultimate power and mystery of human existence.
Vasily Grossman wrote in his masterpiece “Life and Fate”:
My faith has been tempered in Hell. My faith has emerged from the flames of the crematoria, from the concrete of the gas chamber. I have seen that it is not man who is impotent in the struggle against evil, but the power of evil that is impotent in the struggle against man. The powerlessness of kindness, of senseless kindness, is the secret of its immortality. It can never be conquered. The more stupid, the more senseless, the more helpless it may seem, the vaster it is. Evil is impotent before it. The prophets, religious leaders, reformers, social and political leaders are impotent before it. This dumb, blind love is man’s meaning. Human history is not the battle of good struggling to overcome evil. It is a battle fought by a great evil struggling to crush a small kernel of human kindness. But if what is human in human beings has not been destroyed even now, then evil will never conquer.
To survive as a human being is possible only through love. And, when Thanatos is ascendant, the instinct must be to reach out to those we love, to see in them all the divinity, pity and pathos of the human. And to recognize love in the lives of others, even those with whom we are in conflict—love that is like our own. It does not mean we will avoid suffering or death. It does not mean that we as distinct individuals will survive. But love, in its mystery, has its own power. It alone gives us meaning that endures. It alone allows us to embrace and cherish life. Love has the power both to resist in our nature what we know we must resist and to affirm what we know we must affirm.
There is a power so strong and so infinite that entire realities are created and fueled by it. This energy is so unconditional that it gives life to everything it touches. This energy flows non-stop through the world it creates. This energy is pure consciousness that seeks to became aware of itself through its creations.
http://www.whitefeatherforum.com/wfjarticle1.html
I remember reading about an experiment......
You hook up a green light bulb on one end of a 2' long board and put a red light bulb on the other end. The red bulb is set to go on a split second after the green bulb turns off. Take it into dark room and view the result.
it appears to the observer that the green light travels in the direction of the red bulb....turning neutral along the way.
So much for the conscious mind observing reality.
Excellent find Z
What, then, is the nagual ? The nagual is the part of us which we do not deal with at all. The nagual is the part of us for which there is no description--no words, no names, no feelings, no knowledge. It is not mind, it is not soul, it is not the thoughts of men, it is not a state of grace or Heaven or pure intellect, or psyche, or energy, or vital force, or immortality, or life principle, or the Supreme Being, the Almighty, God--all of these are items on the island of the tonal.
The tonal is, as I've already said, everything we think the world is composed of, including God, of course. God has no more importance other than being a part of the tonal of our time.
The nagual is at the service of the warrior. It can be witnessed, but it cannot be talked about. The nagual is there, surrounding the island of the tonal . There, where power hovers.
Don Juan Matus....Tales of Power
Ideology Prevents Action
The world is always close to catastrophe. But it seems to be closer now. Seeing this approaching catastrophe, most of us take shelter in idea. We think that this catastrophe, this crisis, can be solved by an ideology. Ideology is always an impediment to direct relationship, which prevents action. We want peace only as an idea, but not as an actuality. We want peace on the verbal level, which is only on the thinking level, though we proudly call it the intellectual level. But the word peace is not peace. Peace can only be when the confusion which you and another make ceases. We are attached to the world of ideas and not to peace. We search for new social and political patterns and not for peace; we are concerned with the reconciliation of effects and not in putting aside the cause of war. This search will bring only answers conditioned by the past. This conditioning is what we call knowledge, experience; and the new changing facts are translated, interpreted, according to this knowledge. So, there is conflict between what is and the experience that has been. The past, which is knowledge, must ever be in conflict with the fact, which is ever in the present. So, this will not solve the problem but will perpetuate the conditions that have created the problem.
J. Krishnamurti, The Book of Life
Unconscious intent?
Awareness of intention
Recent discoveries, however, raise questions about the degree to which intention is embedded in awareness vs. unconscious neural activity already underway.
http://www.scholarpedia.org/article/Awareness_of_intention
The tonal is like the top of a table--an island. And on this island we have everything. This island is, in fact, the world.
There is a personal tonal for every one of us, and there is a collective one for all of us at any given time, which we can call the tonal of the times. It's like the rows of tables in a restaurant, every table has the same configuration. Certain items are present on all of them. They are, however, individually different from each other; some tables are more crowded than others; they have different food on them, different plates, different atmosphere, yet we have to admit that all the tables are very alike. The same thing happens with the tonal . We can say that the tonal of the times is what makes us alike, in the same way it makes all the tables in a restaurant alike. Each table separately, nevertheless, is an individual case, just like the personal tonal of each of us. But the important factor to keep in mind is that everything we know about ourselves and about our world is on the island of the tonal .
Do Juan Matus.....Tales of Power
Do Ideas Limit Action?
Can ideas ever produce action, or do ideas merely mold thought and therefore limit action? When action is compelled by an idea, action can never liberate man. It is extraordinarily important for us to understand this point. If an idea shapes action, then action can never bring about the solution to our miseries because, before it can be put into action, we have first to discover how the idea comes into being.
J. Krishnamurti, The Book of Life
You might enjoy this link.
Intent and the Process of Becoming Conscious: A Phenomenological View
Ignored in classical science and without a place in cybernetic emitter/receptor descriptions of communication, the ubiquity of intent has been left unacknowledged and yet without it, no unit of meaning would enter our minds and we would be zombies in a world totally out of reach.
http://www.scientificexploration.org/talks/27th_annual/27th_annual_moddel_p_phenomenology_intent.html
Here's Castaneda's description.........
What's important to note, imo, is that silence takes intent and will into another dimension and magnitude. With no other thoughts in your mind, whatever you put there becomes a command.
The Conscious Army.
Each One Reach One - Each One Teach One
"On the surface of the world right now there is War and violence and things seem dark. But calmly and quietly, at the same time, Something else is happening underground. An inner revolution is taking place And certain individuals are being called to a higher light.
It is a silent revolution. From the inside out. From the ground up. This is a Global operation. A Spiritual Conspiracy. There are sleeper cells in every nation on the planet. You won't see us on the TV. You won't read about us in the newspaper. You won't hear about us on the radio. We don't seek any glory. We don't wear any uniform. We come in all shapes and sizes, colors and styles. Most of us work anonymously. We are quietly working behind the scenes In every country and culture of the world Cities big and small, mountains and valleys, In farms and villages, tribes and remote islands. You could pass by one of us on the street And not even notice. We go undercover. We remain behind the scenes. It is of no concern to us who takes the final credit But simply that the work gets done. Occasionally we spot each other in the street. We give a quiet nod and continue on our way.
During the day many of us pretend we have normal jobs But behind the false storefront at night Is where the real work takes place. Some call us the Conscious Army. We are slowly creating a new world With the power of our minds and hearts. We follow, with passion and joy Our orders come from the Central Spiritual Intelligence. We are dropping soft, secret love bombs when no one is looking Poems ~ Hugs ~ Music ~ Photography ~ Movies ~ Kind words ~ Smiles ~ Meditation and prayer ~ Dance ~ Social activism ~ Websites Blogs ~ Random acts of kindness...
We each express ourselves in our own unique ways With our own unique gifts and talents. Be the change you want to see in the world. That is the motto that fills our hearts. We know it is the only way real transformation takes place. We know that quietly and humbly we have the Power of all the oceans combined. Our work is slow and meticulous Like the formation of mountains. It is not even visible at first glance. And yet with it entire tectonic plates Shall be moved in the centuries to come. Love is the new religion of the 21st century. You don't have to be a highly educated person Or have any exceptional knowledge to understand it. It comes from the intelligence of the heart Embedded in the timeless evolutionary pulse of all human beings. Be the change you want to see in the world. Nobody else can do it for you.
We are now recruiting. Perhaps you will join us Or already have. All are welcome. The door is open." Author Unknown
The tonal is everything we are. Anything we have a word for is the tonal . Since the tonal is its own doings, everything, obviously, has to fall under its domain.
Remember, I've said that there is no world at large but only a description of the world which we have learned to visualize and take for granted. The tonal is everything we know. I think this in itself is enough reason for the tonal to be such an overpowering affair.
The tonal is everything we know, and that includes not only us, as persons, but everything in our world. It can be said that the tonal is everything that meets the eye.
We begin to groom it at the moment of birth. The moment we take the first gasp of air we also breathe in power for the tonal . So, it is proper to say that the tonal of a human being is intimately tied to his birth.
You must remember this point. It is of great importance in understanding all this. The tonal begins at birth and ends at death.
The tonal is what makes the world. However, the tonal makes the world only in a manner of speaking. It cannot create or change anything, and yet is makes the world because its function is to judge, and assess, and witness. I say that the tonal makes the world because it witnesses and assesses it according to tonal rules. In a very strange manner the tonal is a creator that doesn't create a thing. In other words, the tonal makes up the rules by which it apprehends the world. So, in a manner of speaking, it creates the world.
Do Juan Matus.....Tales of Power
Het Spark....good to hear from you.
Action Without the Process of Thought
What do we mean by idea? Surely idea is the process of thought. Is it not? Idea is a process of mentation, of thinking; and thinking is always a reaction either of the conscious or of the unconscious. Thinking is a process of verbalization, which is the result of memory; thinking is a process of time. So, when action is based on the process of thinking, such action must inevitably be conditioned, isolated. Idea must oppose idea, idea must be dominated by idea. There is a gap then between action and idea. What we are trying to find out is whether it is possible for action to be without idea. We see how idea separates people. As I have already explained, knowledge and belief are essentially separating qualities. Beliefs never bind people; they always separate people; when action is based on belief or an idea or an ideal, such an action must inevitably be isolated, fragmented. Is it possible to act without the process of thought, thought being a process of time, a process of calculation, a process of self-protection, a process of belief, denial, condemnation, justification. Surely, it must have occurred to you as it has to me, whether action is at all possible without idea.
J. Krishnamurti, The Book of Life
"A human being is a part of the whole, called by us, "Universe," a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest -- a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness.
This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security." - Albert Einstein
I'm going to tell you about the tonal (pronounced, toh-na'hl) and the nagual (pronounced, nah-wa'hl). Every human being has two sides, two separate entities, two counterparts which become operative at the moment of birth; one is called the "tonal" and the other the "nagual."
The tonal is the social person. The tonal is, rightfully so, a protector, a guardian--a guardian that most of the time turns into a guard.
The tonal is the organizer of the world. Perhaps the best way of describing its monumental work is to say that on its shoulders rests the task of setting the chaos of the world in order. It is not farfetched to maintain, as sorcerers do, that everything we know and do as men is the work of the tonal . At this moment, for instance, what is engaged in trying to make sense out of our conversation is your tonal ; without it there would be only weird sounds and grimaces and you wouldn't understand a thing of what I'm saying.
I would say then that the tonal is a guardian that protects something priceless, our very being. Therefore, an inherent quality of the tonal is to be cagey and jealous of its doings. And since its doings are by far the most important part of our lives, it is no wonder that it eventually changes, in every one of us, from a guardian into a guard. A guardian is broad-minded and understanding. A guard, on the other hand, is a vigilante, narrow-minded and most of the time despotic. I say, then, that the tonal in all of us has been made into a petty and despotic guard when it should be a broad-minded guardian.
Don Juan Matus......Tales of Power
Action Without Idea
It is only when the mind is free from idea that there can be experiencing. Ideas are not truth; and truth is something that must be experienced directly, from moment to moment. It is not an experience which you want, which is then merely sensation. Only when one can go beyond the bundle of ideas, which is the 'me', which is the mind, which has a partial or complete continuity, only when one can go beyond that, when thought is completely silent, is there a state of experiencing. Then one shall know what truth is.
J. Krishnamurti, The Book of Life
Only as a warrior can one withstand the path of knowledge. A warrior cannot complain about, or regret, anything. His life is an endless challenge, and challenges cannot possibly be good or bad. Challenges are simply challenges. As is always the case in the doings and not-doings of warriors, personal power is the only thing that matters. The basic difference between an ordinary man and a warrior is that a warrior takes everything as a challenge, while an ordinary man takes everything either as a blessing or as a curse.
Don Juan Matus.....Tales of Power
Direct Observation
Why do ideas take root in our minds? Why do not facts become all-important, not ideas? Why do theories, ideas, become so significant rather than the fact? Is it that we cannot understand the fact, or have not the capacity, or are afraid of facing the fact? Therefore, ideas, speculations, theories are a means of escaping away from the fact.You may run away, you may do all kinds of things; the facts are there the fact that one is angry, the fact that one is ambitious, the fact that one is sexual, a dozen things. You may suppress them, you may transmute them, which is another form of suppression; you may control them, but they are all suppressed, controlled, disciplined with ideas. Do not ideas waste our energy? Do not ideas dull the mind? You may be clever in speculation, in quotations; but it is obviously a dull mind that quotes, that has read a lot and quotes.You remove the conflict of the opposite at one stroke if you live with the fact and therefore liberate the energy to face the fact. For most of us, contradiction is an extraordinary field in which the mind is caught. I want to do this, and I do something entirely different; but if I face the fact of wanting to do this, there is no contradiction; and therefore, at one stroke I abolish altogether all sense of the opposite, and my mind then is completely concerned with what is, and with the understanding of what is.
J. Krishnamurti, The Book of Life
Intent and will are like this in relationship; if you intend to drive a nail, the hammer and your muscles are the vehicles of the intent, but how hard you hit the nail is a function of will. The decision to hit the nail is the intent, but the actual animation of the intent to strike it is the will. Without the will, nothing moves
http://www.shamanscave.com/articles/perception/intent_and_will
Using Intent is forming the unyielding intention of doing something. It has to be built up and energy applied to it. That applied energy is called Will.
http://www.shamanscave.com/articles/perception/intent_and_will
100% correcto mondo. We use the term "will power", but it's not quite the same....at least not to me. The current usage is connected with the mind....."I'm gonna quit smoking if I can work up the will power".
Will is a force. It's hard to talk about it. When you "channel it", you know instinctively what needs to be done.
Will is so important. In fact, I'm beginning to think that everything, good and bad, is an expression of will manifested.
We are the world. Whatever is going on "out there" starts "in here".
LOL! Yup, it's always the other guy's fault;)
"Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing himself." - Leo Tolstoy
"We think too much and feel too little. More than machinery, we need humanity. More than cleverness, we need kindness and gentleness." - Charlie Chaplin (1889-1977)
We are perceivers. The world that we perceive, though, was created by a description that was told to us since the moment we were born.
We, the luminous beings, are born with two rings of power, but we use only one to create the world. That ring, which is hooked very soon after we are born, is reason , and its companion is talking. Between the two they concoct and maintain the world. So, in essence, the world that your reason wants to sustain is the world created by a description and its dogmatic and inviolable rules, which the reason learns to accept and defend.
The secret of the luminous beings is that they have another ring of power which is never used, the will . The trick of the sorcerer is the same trick of the average man. Both have a description; one, the average man, upholds it with his reason ; the other, the sorcerer, upholds it with his will . Both descriptions have their rules and the rules are perceivable, but the advantage of the sorcerer is that will is more engulfing than reason . You must learn to let yourself perceive whether the description is upheld by your reason or by your will . That is the only way for you to use your daily world as a challenge and a vehicle to accumulate enough personal power in order to get to the totality of yourself.
Don Juan Matus.....Tales of Power
Belief Hinders True Understanding
If we had no belief, what would happen to us? Shouldn't we be very frightened of what might happen? If we had no pattern of action, based on a belief -either in God, or in communism, or in socialism, or in imperialism, or in some kind of religious formula, some dogma in which we are conditioned -we should feel utterly lost, shouldn't we? And is not this acceptance of a belief the covering up of that fear- the fear of being really nothing, of being empty? After all, a cup is useful only when it is empty; and a mind that is filled with beliefs, with dogmas, with assertions, with quotations, is really an uncreative mind; it is merely a repetitive mind. To escape from that fear - that fear of emptiness, that fear of loneliness, that fear of stagnation, of not arriving, not succeeding, not achieving, not being something, not becoming something - is surely one of the reasons, is it not, why we accept beliefs so eagerly and greedily? And, through acceptance of belief, do we understand ourselves? On the contrary. A belief, religious or political, obviously hinders the understanding of ourselves. It acts as a screen through which we look at ourselves. And can we look at ourselves without beliefs? If we remove these beliefs, the many beliefs that one has, is there anything left to look at? If we have no beliefs with which the mind has identified itself, then the mind, without identification, is capable of looking at itself as it is& - and then, surely there is the beginning of the understand of oneself.
J. Krishnamurti, The Book of Life
What is Intent? Intent consists of two things – will and purpose.
http://toltec-nagual.com/speed-up-your-spiritual-growth-through-intent
Within these premises, the only thing one can be is an impeccable mediator. One is not the player in this cosmic match of chess, one is simply a pawn on the chessboard. What decides everything is a conscious impersonal energy that sorcerers call intent or the Spirit.
Carlos Castaneda Quotes
"Truth is a Pathless Land".
"Take a ride to the land inside of your mind
Beyond the seas of thought Beyond the realm of what.
Across the streams of hopes and dreams where things are really not".
Is the thinker different from the thought?
"Is it possible to love without thinking? What do you mean by thinking? Thinking is a response to |
Before we can answer those questions, we need to understand the nature of the mind that is asking them.
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