Thursday, November 26, 2009 9:09:59 PM
Turnbull rubbishes spill talk .. repeat again that Turnbull is too liberal for many of those in his party .. the battle goes on.
Insert: Kudos to Australia !!!! ... YES! .. ::)) ..
Opposition backs Australian carbon reduction bill .. .. yet, the battle against those who refute science rages ..
ENJOY THANKSGIVING! Be thankful for the miracle of life, for our simple existence on beautiful earth, in our wondrous universe.
By chief political correspondent Lyndal Curtis, staff
Wed Nov 25, 2009
Opposition leader Malcolm Turnbull
'I am the leader': But some say Malcolm Turnbull hijacked the outcome of last night's meeting (AAP : Alan Porritt)
A defiant Malcolm Turnbull has dismissed calls for a Liberal leadership spill tomorrow,
after a turbulent day in the party room yesterday left his leadership hanging by a thread.
Mr Turnbull refused to call a special party room meeting to hear the calls for a spill from back-
benchers Dennis Jensen and Wilson Tuckey, saying he was confident of staying on as leader, as his
most prominent would-be challenger, Tony Abbott, said he would not be throwing his hat into the ring.
Meetings that stretched over more than 12 hours yesterday ended with Mr Turnbull asserting over
and over again that his party had agreed to accept a government deal on the emissions trading scheme.
"There were many opportunities yesterday, and indeed several invitations for those
people who are complaining bitterly about this to move a spill," Mr Turnbull told AM.
"If they wanted to do that they could have done it. They chose not to and everyone was there.
"At this stage all we have is a letter signed by two backbenchers and no indication that there is any candidate
or or any credible level of support. You don't just call meetings when people write you letters like that."
Mr Tuckey hit back this morning, accusing Mr Turnbull of running away from a leadership spill.
"I know now that Malcolm Turnbull has dodged the spill he said we should call," he told ABC 2.
"The fact of life is a call has been made ... and Malcolm Turnbulll, as is his wont on such matters, has said 'Well, I'm not going'."
"That can only result in further disruption to the party."
Mr Turnbull said a "very substantial majority" of Liberals were in favour of his decision
to accept the Government deal but refused to elaborate on the exact numbers for and against.
"My decision is based on listening to every speaker and knowing the views of everybody in the room," he said.
Mr Turnbull was also adamant he would have the backing of enough
Liberal senators to pass the scheme in the upper house this week.
"There will be enough numbers to support the decision of the party room and the decision I've articulated as leader," he said.
"We cannot possibly go to the next election as the 'no action on climate change' party."
But he admitted that a dramatic intervention from former climate change spokesman Andrew Robb, who has been off with
depression but attended yesterday's party room meeting to speak against the deal, had come as a "complete surprise".
Mr Robb's comments had not been flagged in advance with Mr Turnbull or chief Opposition climate change negotiator Ian Macfarlane.
Mr Macfarlane has said he was "surprised" but would not comment on whether Mr Robb's actions were "treacherous".
Some of what Andrew said yesterday in the party room was not correct, and I'm not going to go into a debate with Andrew," he said.
The shadow cabinet will meet again this morning to discuss tactics in the upcoming Senate debate.
Marathon meeting
More than 70 MPs spoke in the party room yesterday, and all day there were leaks that the numbers were close.
Mr Turnbull declared he had the support he needed twice: the first time senators
were voting in the chamber and thus were missing from the meeting where he made the statement.
Some say their anger at coming back to an empty room not knowing what had happened forced the meeting to be reopened.
Those who opposed backing the government's deal dispute that Mr Turnbull had a clear majority
and say even on a best case scenario it was in Mr Turnbull's favour by just one vote.
Former frontbencher Kevin Andrews was one prepared to publicly dispute his leader's count.
"That was clearly in my view, a decision of the majority of the party room that they didn't want to proceed at this stage," he said.
The accounts of what happened in the last half hour of the meeting are at polar opposites - as the party appears to be.
Some sources say Senator Nick Minchin proposed a compromise that would see the deal sent to a
committee for consideration, reporting back in February after the Copenhagen climate change summit.
That suggestion is one Mr Turnbull has rejected; his supporters say the issue of an emissions scheme has to be decided.
Leadership on the line
His supporters believe the numbers were in Mr Turnbull's favour - narrowly - and
say Mr Turnbull put his leadership on the line on three occasions during the meeting.
Phillip Ruddock and Christopher Pyne said a spill of his leadership could have been moved then, and no one took the option.
But others emerged from the meetings saying Mr Turnbull's leadership was untenable.
Those opposed to the deal have described their leader's behaviour as extraordinary, audacious
and bizarre. They are furious, accusing him of manipulating the order of speakers and the numbers.
At a later news conference, Mr Turnbull dared his detractors to confront him
"I'm the leader, right, and if people are unhappy with the leader they can take whatever steps that they deem appropriate," he said.
"But I am the leader and I have made the call."
And Mr Turnbull's supporters were out in force.
"Malcolm has counted the numbers correctly; he had a majority in the party room and he called it," Ian Macfarlane said.
"He is someone who has stood up for what he believes in, he's argued his case, he's carried the day," Scott Morrison added.
But one source says some of Mr Turnbull's supporters have lost faith in him.
Queensland MP Michael Johnson turned up at his leader's press conference in a gaggle
of supporters but later put out a statement publicly declaring he had opposed the deal.
Possible meeting
Wilson Tuckey has given notice he wants to move a spill of Mr Turnbull's leadership position on Thursday but
there is confusion over who would call the meeting - whether it would be Mr Turnbull himself or the party whips.
Some say it is Mr Turnbull's decision and yesterday's meeting was the last one for the year.
George Brandis says a repeat of yesterday is the last thing the party wants.
"There isn't a scheduled meeting on Thursday and frankly I think yet
another meeting is the last thing that most of my colleagues want," he said.
A senior Coalition figure told AM before the meetings began that Mr
Turnbull was leader because there were no other viable candidates.
But those who had previously been thought not viable are now being
considered: Tony Abbott, Julie Bishop and Joe Hockey are among those being named.
Yesterday Mr Abbott argued against accepting the Government's deal but this morning he backed Mr Turnbull's decision
to declare Coalition support for the offer and said he would not be standing in any possible leadership challenge.
Mr Abbott told ABC2 News Breakfast that he expects Mr Turnbull to stay leader into the new year.
"That's my hope," he said.
"I thought yesterday's debate was about policy, not leadership.
"I think Malcolm is a good leader. I think he's a very substantial figure in our public life and I'd like him to stay as leader."
Final vote
This morning's shadow cabinet meeting this morning will consider the Senate tactics for the emissions trading debate and vote.
Mr Turnbull's supporters say he has the seven senators he needs to get the legislation through.
That is only the bare minimum, although his supporters think there
will be more. But others are raising doubts that the seven are there.
Mr Turnbull's decision to follow what he believes to be right may come at a very high cost.
Even if his leadership survives, as his supporters are adamant it will, his party
is deeply divided and a number are openly contemptuous of his leadership.
For a party that wanted to deal with the emissions trading scheme and
get it off the agenda, it has all gone badly wrong and it is not over yet.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/11/25/2752546.htm?section=justin
Aside, this kerfuffle is reminiscent o the battle in the Senate to introduce universal
healthcare. Yet, it was successful, in the end. No one would dare to try to abolish it now.
Insert: Kudos to Australia !!!! ... YES! .. ::)) ..
Opposition backs Australian carbon reduction bill .. .. yet, the battle against those who refute science rages ..
ENJOY THANKSGIVING! Be thankful for the miracle of life, for our simple existence on beautiful earth, in our wondrous universe.
By chief political correspondent Lyndal Curtis, staff
Wed Nov 25, 2009
Opposition leader Malcolm Turnbull
'I am the leader': But some say Malcolm Turnbull hijacked the outcome of last night's meeting (AAP : Alan Porritt)
A defiant Malcolm Turnbull has dismissed calls for a Liberal leadership spill tomorrow,
after a turbulent day in the party room yesterday left his leadership hanging by a thread.
Mr Turnbull refused to call a special party room meeting to hear the calls for a spill from back-
benchers Dennis Jensen and Wilson Tuckey, saying he was confident of staying on as leader, as his
most prominent would-be challenger, Tony Abbott, said he would not be throwing his hat into the ring.
Meetings that stretched over more than 12 hours yesterday ended with Mr Turnbull asserting over
and over again that his party had agreed to accept a government deal on the emissions trading scheme.
"There were many opportunities yesterday, and indeed several invitations for those
people who are complaining bitterly about this to move a spill," Mr Turnbull told AM.
"If they wanted to do that they could have done it. They chose not to and everyone was there.
"At this stage all we have is a letter signed by two backbenchers and no indication that there is any candidate
or or any credible level of support. You don't just call meetings when people write you letters like that."
Mr Tuckey hit back this morning, accusing Mr Turnbull of running away from a leadership spill.
"I know now that Malcolm Turnbull has dodged the spill he said we should call," he told ABC 2.
"The fact of life is a call has been made ... and Malcolm Turnbulll, as is his wont on such matters, has said 'Well, I'm not going'."
"That can only result in further disruption to the party."
Mr Turnbull said a "very substantial majority" of Liberals were in favour of his decision
to accept the Government deal but refused to elaborate on the exact numbers for and against.
"My decision is based on listening to every speaker and knowing the views of everybody in the room," he said.
Mr Turnbull was also adamant he would have the backing of enough
Liberal senators to pass the scheme in the upper house this week.
"There will be enough numbers to support the decision of the party room and the decision I've articulated as leader," he said.
"We cannot possibly go to the next election as the 'no action on climate change' party."
But he admitted that a dramatic intervention from former climate change spokesman Andrew Robb, who has been off with
depression but attended yesterday's party room meeting to speak against the deal, had come as a "complete surprise".
Mr Robb's comments had not been flagged in advance with Mr Turnbull or chief Opposition climate change negotiator Ian Macfarlane.
Mr Macfarlane has said he was "surprised" but would not comment on whether Mr Robb's actions were "treacherous".
Some of what Andrew said yesterday in the party room was not correct, and I'm not going to go into a debate with Andrew," he said.
The shadow cabinet will meet again this morning to discuss tactics in the upcoming Senate debate.
Marathon meeting
More than 70 MPs spoke in the party room yesterday, and all day there were leaks that the numbers were close.
Mr Turnbull declared he had the support he needed twice: the first time senators
were voting in the chamber and thus were missing from the meeting where he made the statement.
Some say their anger at coming back to an empty room not knowing what had happened forced the meeting to be reopened.
Those who opposed backing the government's deal dispute that Mr Turnbull had a clear majority
and say even on a best case scenario it was in Mr Turnbull's favour by just one vote.
Former frontbencher Kevin Andrews was one prepared to publicly dispute his leader's count.
"That was clearly in my view, a decision of the majority of the party room that they didn't want to proceed at this stage," he said.
The accounts of what happened in the last half hour of the meeting are at polar opposites - as the party appears to be.
Some sources say Senator Nick Minchin proposed a compromise that would see the deal sent to a
committee for consideration, reporting back in February after the Copenhagen climate change summit.
That suggestion is one Mr Turnbull has rejected; his supporters say the issue of an emissions scheme has to be decided.
Leadership on the line
His supporters believe the numbers were in Mr Turnbull's favour - narrowly - and
say Mr Turnbull put his leadership on the line on three occasions during the meeting.
Phillip Ruddock and Christopher Pyne said a spill of his leadership could have been moved then, and no one took the option.
But others emerged from the meetings saying Mr Turnbull's leadership was untenable.
Those opposed to the deal have described their leader's behaviour as extraordinary, audacious
and bizarre. They are furious, accusing him of manipulating the order of speakers and the numbers.
At a later news conference, Mr Turnbull dared his detractors to confront him
"I'm the leader, right, and if people are unhappy with the leader they can take whatever steps that they deem appropriate," he said.
"But I am the leader and I have made the call."
And Mr Turnbull's supporters were out in force.
"Malcolm has counted the numbers correctly; he had a majority in the party room and he called it," Ian Macfarlane said.
"He is someone who has stood up for what he believes in, he's argued his case, he's carried the day," Scott Morrison added.
But one source says some of Mr Turnbull's supporters have lost faith in him.
Queensland MP Michael Johnson turned up at his leader's press conference in a gaggle
of supporters but later put out a statement publicly declaring he had opposed the deal.
Possible meeting
Wilson Tuckey has given notice he wants to move a spill of Mr Turnbull's leadership position on Thursday but
there is confusion over who would call the meeting - whether it would be Mr Turnbull himself or the party whips.
Some say it is Mr Turnbull's decision and yesterday's meeting was the last one for the year.
George Brandis says a repeat of yesterday is the last thing the party wants.
"There isn't a scheduled meeting on Thursday and frankly I think yet
another meeting is the last thing that most of my colleagues want," he said.
A senior Coalition figure told AM before the meetings began that Mr
Turnbull was leader because there were no other viable candidates.
But those who had previously been thought not viable are now being
considered: Tony Abbott, Julie Bishop and Joe Hockey are among those being named.
Yesterday Mr Abbott argued against accepting the Government's deal but this morning he backed Mr Turnbull's decision
to declare Coalition support for the offer and said he would not be standing in any possible leadership challenge.
Mr Abbott told ABC2 News Breakfast that he expects Mr Turnbull to stay leader into the new year.
"That's my hope," he said.
"I thought yesterday's debate was about policy, not leadership.
"I think Malcolm is a good leader. I think he's a very substantial figure in our public life and I'd like him to stay as leader."
Final vote
This morning's shadow cabinet meeting this morning will consider the Senate tactics for the emissions trading debate and vote.
Mr Turnbull's supporters say he has the seven senators he needs to get the legislation through.
That is only the bare minimum, although his supporters think there
will be more. But others are raising doubts that the seven are there.
Mr Turnbull's decision to follow what he believes to be right may come at a very high cost.
Even if his leadership survives, as his supporters are adamant it will, his party
is deeply divided and a number are openly contemptuous of his leadership.
For a party that wanted to deal with the emissions trading scheme and
get it off the agenda, it has all gone badly wrong and it is not over yet.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/11/25/2752546.htm?section=justin
Aside, this kerfuffle is reminiscent o the battle in the Senate to introduce universal
healthcare. Yet, it was successful, in the end. No one would dare to try to abolish it now.
Jonathan Swift said, "May you live all the days of your life!"
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