Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
As long as a scheme works, the shysters will continue to use it.
Frogg
Clip Prince, Yes, I think HCPC's CEO's husband had an earlier conviction for stock fraud involving MERL. Maybe it was only a civil conviction - I forget right now - but that was a red flag with HCPC right from the beginning.
However, most folks chose to ignore the CEO's husband's previous transgressions, mainly because HCPC stated the CEO's husband had no role in HCPC, even though it was stated the CEO's husband had an office across the hall from the CEO.
Right from the get-go, that was too much for me to swallow but when folks want to believe - when they are on a holy quest to scoop up what they believe will be easy money - they will ignore almost anything.
Everybody knows there ain't no such thing as a "free lunch" but in the pennies, people ignore that adage all the time. With HCPC as well in many other pennies, folks have learned it's not easy to make large amounts of cash in the pennies.
Frogg
MB25, I agree. This was simpy a P&D all the way, from the opening bell. Folks can wait five years, ten years or until the cows come home but their money is gone. There won' be any profits made on this one. Heck, the R/S guarantees that. I have never seen a penny stock, especially one sitting at .0001, ever recover after a reverse split.
Chief63, interesting to learn that the Johnsons controlled Merl. I don't remember hearing that information before. Maybe I just didn't pay attention to it before though.
Frogg
Ah, thanks Brad for the info.
I knew the CEO hadn't reported yet but thought somebody might know where she's going.
Thanks again.
Frogg
Does anybody know what prisons the CEO and her husband are in? Just wondering if they got sent to country club prisons.
Yes, HCPC might be dead forever. It all depends on what the owners, whoever they may be, will want to do with the company in a year, or two or three years down the road, if the SEC doesn't step-in before and put the company out of its misery.
Lookingforhelp,
Yes, the SEC spends most of its time looking at big board stocks, so you don't have to worry about getting totally ripped-off if you're playing those stocks. However, I get the strong feeling the SEC cares little or nothing about the pennies. They step on a penny stock once in a while, just to make it look like they are diligent in enforcing the law, but so many pennies get away without ever getting caught, it's the investor that must protect himself against fraud. Most times in the pennies, there's no one to help you.
Compared to the big board and stocks on the other exchanges, the penny market is small. Not many folks play the pennies, despite what a lot of people believe. Therefore the SEC's attention is directed mostly at where the action is, where most of the money is traded. I know of one penny company that has run a pump and dump seven or eight times over the years and they have never been stopped by the SEC.
The Johnsons went to jail for defrauding customers who walked into their offices. As far as I know, the Feds haven't even looked at HCPC (PCSO) for the fraud they committed with the stock. Even if they have, they've taken no action to anyone's knowledge yet.
The problem with the pennies, especially the pinks, is that there is very little third-party information available. Most of the information comes frmm the company, so if they are running a pump and dump, it's difficult to tell. In fact, most of the time, you can't tell if a penny stock is a pump and dump until the pump and dump is over. Then of course it's too late if you're holding a large block of the stock, when the R/S is announced and the price of the stock drops like a rock.
Yes, HCPC (PCSO) is dead now. However, I think the current CEO is just a caretaker. The company will sit quietly for two years or so, then probably change the company's name and stock symbol again, with a possible move to another area of business and then start the scam all over again. In two years of so, it will be difficult to find much of the company's previous history and most of us will be gone, with an entirely new group of investors to be suckered.
That's the way the game is played in the pennies.
Frogg
Looking For Help, you're right.
I have two friends, now retired, who were previously CEO~s of moderately-sized companies. They both told me that stockholders are a pain in the wazoo; always calling, wanting something, submitting ideas, inquiring what the CEO and board of directors were doing to increase the stock price, etc, most of those which had no inkling about running companies.
My friends said stockholders were tolerated because they had no choice, since stockholders were part owners of the company.
That's been my experience in the pennies too. CEO~s of penny stocks are there to make money for themselves. They don't give a rat's patooey about stockholders. When CEO~s have personal contact with stockholders, they always talk a good game because it's possible a group of stockholders pumping the stock can influence sufficient folks to buy the stock, making the price increase.
I've seen CEO~s of pennies promise the moon to stockholders if they are gullible enough to believe such nonsense; and often they are.
Folks who engage in feel-good email messages and phone calls with the CEO~s of penny companies and then report those on message boards are doing nothing but pumping the stock, whether they realize it or not.
Frogg
Howard, what if the Johnsons are still OWNERS of the company. If they are, they are still calling the shots. You don't think that's relevant if they are still the owners?
Frogg
I disagree. If the Johnsons are still the owners of the company, then by all means, they are still part of it, whether they are involved in the daily functions of the company or not. If they are still the owners, then they still run the show and can call the shots. As I recall, there have been no news of the company being taken away from them, being put into receivership, or anything like that.
Maybe we need to ascertain whether they are still the owners or not. I bet they are.
If the Johnsons still own the company, then any discussions about them are NOT off-topic and should not be deleted, as long as the posts follow the board's rules.
I personally believe that since the Johnsons are responsible for the situation the company is in now, until it is confirmed they are no longer associated with the company in any way, discussions about them are still relevant.
Howard, just because a new CEO and/or president was/were appointed doesn't mean the Johnsons don't still own the company.
Have we heard anything about the Johnsons selling the company? I don't think so. I haven't seen or heard anything to that effect.
Yeah Newtrader, the Johnsons were the primary owners of the company before, I assume. Just because a new CEO was appointed doesn't mean the Johnsons aren't involved. If the Johnsons owned the company and didn't sell it, they are still the owners, which makes them still in the middle of things, whether they're in jail or not.
Val13, in 20 years in the markets, I've never seen a penny company ever give back anything to current stockholders.
BTW, with pennies, the statement, "the main goal is to restore shareholders confidence." means the company wants to restore faith in the company so folks will start buying the stock again."
I've also seen penny companies give the excuse "we want to attract more investors and the best way to do this is with a higher stock price." as a reason for the company pulling a reverse split. Sometimes you can make money if you jump in after a reverse split, but a reverse split screws current investors 99.99% of the time. The real reason for a reverse split in the pennies is to reduce the float where it's no longer in the billons.
And, regardless of an audit, I don't think PCSO has any cash to return to current investors.
MB25, you are absolutely correct. I don't think a legitimate audit will ever happen with PCSO. It's another typicl ploy of penny stocks, hinting that the company is legit. We know PCSO (HCPC) never made a penny with any legit business, so all an audit would do is show the company is broke. The CEO and everybody else already know that.
Given some more time however, hints of audits and future business opportunities and other nice-sounding PR~s will suck in new investors that are unaware of this company's history.
Howard, you are wrong on three counts.
First it was misleading on your part to say they "are filing". As I have explained twice before, they did not "file".
Secondly, it is NOT a standard process used by all Pink Sheet companies. Not ALL pink companies issue financial statements as you said in your post. Many don't issue financial statements in any shape or form; zilch, nadda, zero! They don't file with the SEC and they don't post them on websites.
Lastly, simply because they posted a financial statement on their website doesn't make the information in that statement fact.
Howard, I know that pinks don't have to file with the SEC. My point is that "filing" consist of sending their financial reports to the SEC. Simply posting them on web sites is not "filing". To say in your message, "At least they are filing and that's positive." is mis-leading at best and perhaps a deliberate attempt to do so at worse.
Of course the financial report originated with the company. Where else would it come from? Have you ever seen the Coca Cola Corporation file a financial report for General Motors?
Next, until a company actually files a financial report with the SEC, you can't hold their foot to the fire. If it's un-audited and they are caught with inaccurate or erroneous information in the financial report, they can always say they made a mistake.
Lastly, obviously a financial report doesn't have to be audited or filed with the SEC to be correct. The problem is with pinks, companies play fast and loose with the facts in financial reports for which they are mostly unaccountable. Those reports, like some HCPC posted, were very misleading and led some, if not a lot of folks, to buy the stock.
It was sheer folly to believe for example, as stated in one financial report and perpetuated in subsequent financial reports that HCPC had 700 million dollars or there abouts in assets from the sale of preferred stock. Yet many people fell for that ploy.
Howard, they are not "filing" financial reports. All they have ever done in the past (and present) is post financial statements on the pinksheets site or their own site. And if I remember correctly, at least some of those stated the statements were "unaudited." That means nobody checked them.
Unaudited and or unfiled financial statements can be nothing but fairy tales, as was the case with this company. Financial statements are meaningless unless they are audited and "Filed" with the SEC. Companies can slant information anyway they want, or even outright lie if there is no check on their financial statements.
"Filing" means sending their financial reports to the SEC, not posting them on other web sites.
Frogg
Tom, the new CEO is part of the old regime. PCSO is not gonna turn anything around and become a legitimate company. Besides, I'mn still waiting for the SEC to move against PCSO. The SEC is slow to move sometimes but I believe they will eventually get around to it.
As for debating the wisdom of your and Howard's efforts to now promote PCSO, I won't engage in that anymore. It's a waste of time. Both of you have your agenda and nobody will deter you two guys from it.
I would wish both of you good luck but that is a waste also. I have followed hundreds of pumps and dumps and they never become legitimate companies. The companies either die after the pump and dump is done, or some new CEO moves in, quitely waits a few months and then starts the pump and dump over again, often with a new wrinkle, or even moving into a new business area or lastly, at some point the SEC steps in and kills the company. I have never seen a pump and dump turn into a legitimate company, not even once.
It won't happen with PCSO either.
Frogg
Call it what you want Howard but the sky is blue (the color we see anyway) no matter what color you say it is.
Obviously you and I have a different definition of "promoting" a stock then.
Great post Texas4286. The HH we know has always pushed this stock. Now he has become a company mouthpiece.
Truly - and I say this with no malice toward HH - He doesn't know what he's saying and doing. He wouldn't recognize a pump and dump if it bit him in the wazoo.
Frogg
You are now being suckered by actively engaging in pushing or promoting this stock. You have jumped out of the frying pan and into the fire now, Howard. PCSO now has its own personal pumper (again) in this thread.
Ha ha. Dream on!!!!
Texas4286, there are some people with their heads in the sand and there is no way to reach them. They won't listen to logic and common sense and refuse to acknowledge and/or consider the history of a fradulent penny stock company. It's sad there are folks like that and it's even sadder you find them in almost every thread.
Frogg
Howard, keep believing those PR~s and you will lose even more money if you buy more stock.
what do you expect a new CEO to say, that the company sucks and there is no way to revive it? Of course he will say, "Everything will be coming up roses in the near future".
Get your head out of the sand Howard and look at reality. Your money is gone and you're not getting a cent of it back. No matter how hard or earnestly you believe, dream, hope or beg, it ain't gonna happen. You lost your cash and it's gone forever.
Gee Howard, don't you understand how pumps and dumps work? They made money by selling stock, something they first promised not to do and then later promised not to do anymore, but the A/S and O/S kept climbing and climbing as time passed.
What was the O/S at the time the company did the reverse split, somewhere around 16 billion shares?
Thndr65, you're correct. If PCSO had millions in assets, that alone would have been sufficient to put the stock in the 1-5 dollar a share range. They had no assets. They simply sold stock and pushed the price down to .0001 - under .0001 actually - with so many shares in the float, there was no way for the price to move upwards.
That's why they did the reverse split, to reduce the outstanding shares so the price might move in the future. I guess they hadn't counted on getting caught. What they did is typical of all pumps and dumps.
Collecting on loans??? Show me where they ever made any legitimate loans.
Did the Johnson's sell the company? If you think they don't have any connection to the company anymore, I got a bridge I want to sell you.
Texas4286, thanks!!
Frogg
No Howard, you aren't using common sense. Hoping the new CEO pulls a rabbit out of a hat is NOT common sense. I understand you would like to get some of your money back, but it isn't going to happen. Common sense is letting go of PCSO and moving on to other stocks.
All you are doing is making yourself look foolish here. PCSO is not gonna rise from the ashes. It was never a legitimate company and it won't turn into one in the future simply because a new CEO has been hired.
Who still owns the company, tell me that? If it is the previous CEO then nothing will happen with the company. Their business plan to the public was nothing but a loan company. What's so great about that?
All the old stuff should remain in the IBOX. What about new investors that come across PCSO? Six months to a year down the road most of the current investors may have moved on and there might not be many people to warn the new folks, and if the old info isn't in the IBOX, how will they learn about this company?
The best way to learn about penny companies where there isn't much evidence of business is to look at the company's history, to see what they have done in the past. You are preventing that.
Howard, by pushing or promoting the new company - or same company with a new CEO - you are only gonna get your heart broken again, plus hurt some new investors. I don't think you care a rat's patooey about new investors. You only want to recover as much money as you can. If other folks take it in the wazoo for you, you don't care.
How many times do you have to be burned before you pull your foot out of the fire?
Newtrader2007, I remember those days. I was suspended twice for being too vocal on this board. With the president and her husband now convicted, there is no way this company can be revived. I have been watching scams like this in the markets for about 15 years, and I have NEVER seen one case where investors got any of their money back.
We had promoters in this thread - every thread has them - whether they were working for themselves or the company. It's dismaying to find out that a few folks who you though were honest and trying to help folks were only out to rip everyone off.
Then we have folks who can't let go, who will be claiming the company can be revived five years from now. I know several companies like that, where there are some folks still thinking they will get some cash back. One of them has been dead for five years, but the dreamers fight on.
Howard, you won't get any money back. Whoever takes over will know of the company's history. Why should they take over PCSO with three strikes against them when, if they want to start a company like PCSO or similar to it, they can start a new company with no albatrosses around their necks?
Your money is gone Howard. Forget about it and move on to other stocks.
Won't happen. It was never a legitimate company in the first place and Carol and her husband have sucked out all the cash. There is no money to start over with. Their business model was nothing but a loan company anyway, nothing special about that.
Besides, nobody that knows about this company will touch it with ten-foot pole.
Heelsgo1, yeah, ha ha.
Am I a family member or friend of the Johnsons? Are you kidding? Obviously you never read any of my previous posts over the last two years.
Frogg
LookingforHelp, I disagree. You can not rely on penny stock companies telling the truth. There were 5-6 of us who warned and continue to warn folks here about HCPC. We were ignored at best, ridiculed at worse.
I posted my first warning here back in December 2007 I think it was, telling folks to use logic and common sense when evaluating penny stocks, and not to rely only on what the company was saying. I pointed out the red flags with HCPC as I encountered them and explained why they were red flags.
Most folks here ignored all the red flags, mostly because they were blinded by their greed. In short, anybody who used logic and common sense wouldn't have been caught by this scam.
Frogg
Looks like the lawyers playing games. Delay is a common defense tactic. I didn't think the trial would start on it's original trial date in July.