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Dimon is a saint! PLEASE!
Bear Stearns Book value: 11.9B
JPM purchase for 3.44B
wamu book value 307B jpm paid 1.9B
how many times do i have to do this math!!!!!!!!!!!
case closed>
GO WAMU
yes of course....but just being realistic...hey more is better ...obviously
i think we all could. But remember settlements usually come with substatial discount. Hey I'd be happy wih 50B
although the EC motion maybe not be in the most eloquent english the point is....why fear an EC if there's no equity? There should be no worries a+B=C everyone's happy.....
these motions to disban only confirm equity is there and far beyond expectations.
PAY UP JPIG!
proof of substatial likelyhood for recovery vs hopelessly insolvent? are yu kidding me, that's there argument?
Please THJMW see thru tis bulls*it
all those case examples are BK because of insolvency not BK for protection.
indymac was woth 40B and received 13.9B in liquidation
Wamu was worth 307B and got 1.9B
case closed.
GLTA
go JOYCE
I'm to blame too. I was one those idiots that ran to Wamu and pulled out my money I had more than 100k at the time (the max amount FDIC insured) I live on the west coast and feared the indymac type lines to get my money. I was in the process of buying property. So in a way I fell for the scam too.
i think I can hear the shreader at the FDIC working really hard!
GO EC< GO JOYCE, GET EM' CROSS
Interesting how indymac was sold for 13.9B and the market value was: 32 Billion
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28472166/
Wamu's market value 307 Billion sold for 1.9B huh?
we're owed roughly 123 Billion using the same math! (not saying were gonna get that)
now that's the main focus! PAY US JAMIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
here here: if they have nothing to hide, why are there settlement talks....blacked out emails....and blunt evidence of media avoiding the mention of wamu
GO EC
cramer is frickin idiot: are you serious? what did JPM do? why don't you grow a pair and tell the truth: maybe this will refresh your memory Jon stewart interview
sorry you're right didnt notice the lack of signature
Law360 names Venable's Bankruptcy Practice among nation's top five: you hear that Dimon that was another door closing on you... no where to run, the tunels on your rat a** are slowly closing.
This was a basic permission to add Gregory A. Cross to the EC and as you can read further the permision was granted by THJMW.
Which leads me to beleive she will allow the Ec to continue and denie motion to disban by WMI
so why is this stock where it is....beats me the shorts seem to only move on actual 100% news now....
NEW CUssip please!
go joyce
what is up with all this silence on Wamu. Last night on the daily show they talked about Dimon but never once mentioned the wamu aquisition.
this drives me mad.
...btw cramer is an idiot
do you have alink realtime.?
EC ATTY - Somebody has got to be Nervous
FROM YAHOO BOARD WOTH LOOKING AT I know this information has been posted, but think it warrants another post. The following profile excerpt is my favorite:
http://www.venable.com/gregory-a-cross/
"Mr. Cross has defined the rights of CMBS Trusts and mortgage loan sellers. Has led several fraud investigations and conducted trials involving complex international transfers of assets. Created denial of discharge and fraudulent conveyance records which have led to criminal convictions for bankruptcy crimes."
You think the stakes just got raised? I do.
Thank you Joyce and Co. and thank you Ms. Deangeles/Mr. McMahon for choosing right over wrong.
Hey Weil/Rosen ...there's always someone better.......
I know we can't have our cake and eat it too....but a settlement would cause this all to go away and though I would happily run to the bank with a smile on my face ....
(in fact I would walk into a chase with my new found money and tell them I want to deposit it, I'll tell them this is wamu blood money, keep it in there a few days and withdrawl all but .16 cents and i'll keep it there for 1.5 years LOL)
...but a part of me wants this to get out in the open and burn all the crooks behind this...starting with Dimon.
ok I can agree with that. I don't think either one of them can make a ruling based on this evidence, and what's at stake. Especially whats coming down the road.....new discovery would burn many people.
I agree with the thoughts settlement talks are at hand, otherwise it makes no sense to delay. I wonder if these talks were hapening before Walwrath said ASAP or after? LOL
Sleet has yet to make a ruling? It's been 8 months....
she said ASAP....LMAO I rather her not state any time frame on rulings they seem to come quiker that way.
you won't feel small when it's $14.00 and big boys are buying at that range lol
we already knew that though... they should have asked...."when are you going to file a motion to dismiss the disbanding? "
I have a feeling the next Omnibus will produce more delays, if not re-scheduled. Not trying to be negative....Mary has a problem making decisions. She's got so much on her bench she's probably wondering why it wasn;t heard in the DC court instead.
GO Joyce/GO EC
poor Greedy Dimon> this all could have been avoided with a generous settlement 1 year ago. Now all these entities fear discovery, not just because of wamu, but who knows everthing they were involved in....LMAO
You know that at some point the rats start coming out. And they're never quite....
I wonder if the orange jumpsuits are one size fits all.......
nice rad. always is from bopfan
Thanks Ace! and to all the board> can't PM so just publicly saying thanks. I'm gonna go spend the day with my wife and kid....please email me if "mary" grows a pair this weekend.
NICE, I would love to get a b-day present from Walwrath.
Come On' MARY..DO IT! DO IT!
I've been off the board a couple days, anthing new and exciting. I did catch the ridculuos jpm motion...hey today's my b-day. Man i'm getting old.
GLTA
Chapter : Creditors' Committees US TRUSTEE website;
take the time to read this entire link I would say we have nothing to worry about.
http://www.justice.gov/ust/eo/ust_org/ustp_manual/volume3/vol3ch04.htm
Section 1102 of the Bankruptcy Code directs and authorizes the United States Trustee to appoint an official unsecured creditors' committee and provides the United States Trustee with the discretion to appoint additional committees, including equity security holders' committees. The United States Trustee must endeavor to appoint a committee of creditors holding unsecured claims "as soon as practicable after the order for relief. . . and may appoint additional committees of creditors or of equity security .......
The powers and duties of a creditors' committee are set forth in 11 U.S.C. § 1103(c). As part of those powers and duties, the committee may: (1) review and investigate the acts, conduct, and financial condition of the debtor; (2) consult with the debtor concerning the administration of the case; and (3) participate in the formulation of the plan of reorganization. 11 U.S.C. § 1103. As part of their obligation to represent creditor interests as a whole, members of a committee have fiduciary obligations. See Woods v. City Nat'l Bank & Trust Co., 312 U.S. 262, 268-269 (1941), reh'g denied, 312 U.S. 715 (1941).
read the whole thing. I can g to sleep now ...peacefully.
GO EC/JOYCE and all us shareholders!
Plan Formulation—Creditors' Committees
A reorganization plan must be formulated that will allow the DIP to run the business profitably. The DIP has an initial exclusive right for 120 days to file the plan, but the creditors get to vote on whether to accept or reject the plan. Hence, much of the initial stages of the bankruptcy require formulating a plan, negotiating with creditors to secure their votes, then getting the plan confirmed by the court. Sometimes, in what is called a prepackaged bankruptcy, the debtor will negotiate with its creditors before filing so that the debtor will already have an acceptable plan, allowing it to emerge from bankruptcy sooner. Once the plan is confirmed, then all parties in interest, including those who voted against the plan, are bound by it.
To facilitate the negotiation with creditors, a creditors' committee is formed by the United States Trustee that is composed of representatives of the business debtor's 7 largest creditors. The debtor must negotiate with the creditors' committee to arrive at a reorganization plan that will allow the debtor to survive at the least possible cost to the creditors. The plan will detail what assets to sell, which executory contracts will be rejected, and how creditors are classified and how much each class will be paid as a percentage of their claim.
The debtor is given 120 days to file a plan and 180 days to confirm it. If the debtor fails to either provide a plan or get a plan confirmed, then the creditors may submit a plan. The time limit motivates the DIP to formulate a desirable plan that will be acceptable to its creditors, because if it doesn't, the creditors will be allowed to submit a plan that may be less desirable for the DIP.
Creditors' committees are not usually formed for most small businesses and individual debtors filing under Chapter 11, since there is usually a lack of interest from creditors in participating in a committee. In these cases, the U.S. Trustee takes a more active role in shaping the plan.
Disclosure
The DIP must negotiate with the creditors' committee for an acceptable plan. Since the creditors vote on whether to accept the plan or not, the DIP must send the creditors a disclosure statement that is approved by the court, after notice and a hearing, which contains adequate information so that creditors can evaluate it and make an informed decision. For a big business, the disclosure statement is much like a prospectus for an investment, since the same types of information must be disclosed. Generally, the disclosure statement will provide a history of the business and its transactions, the details of its plan to emerge from bankruptcy, possible alternatives to the plan, and the financial information that creditors need to evaluate the probable success of the plan.
Solicitation and Voting
When the court approves of the disclosure statement, it also sets a time to collect all votes. Creditors receive ballots in which they choose to either accept or reject the plan. The ballots must be returned by the prescribed time, or their vote is not counted.
The Chapter 11 Code has specific rules about who can vote and how the votes are counted. Creditors and equity holders are placed in classes, according to the type of collateral or the priority of their claims. For instance, secured and unsecured creditors would be in separate classes, as would be preferred and common stockholders. Often, all unsecured claims of little value are also placed in a class separate from other unsecured creditors to reduce administration expenses.
Since creditors and equity holders vote as a class, how they are classified will affect their voting rights. Although the DIP classifies the creditors and equity holders, to prevent classification schemes designed to manipulate votes, the classification must have a reasonable basis and the court must approve of the classification.
The plan must describe how the creditors will be classified, particularly which classes will be impaired, since they will be the only ones voting on the plan. An impaired class is one whose rights are being altered under the plan from nonbankruptcy law, which, in most cases, means that they are getting less than the full amount of their claim.
Unimpaired classes are deemed to accept the plan, since their nonbankruptcy rights are not altered, except that the debtor has the right to cure defaults and to decelerate loans by compensating the class for the delay in payment. An impaired class who is getting nothing under the plan is deemed to reject the plan. Hence, only impaired classes who are getting something get to vote on the plan.
Although each member of an impaired class gets to vote, only the class vote matters. Under §1126(c) of the Bankruptcy Code, an entire class of claims is deemed to accept a plan if the plan is accepted by creditors that hold at least 2/3 in amount and more than ½ in number of the allowed claims in the class. Those creditors who rejected the plan are at least entitled to receive the present value of what they would have received under a Chapter 7 liquidation.
For those holding interests in the debtor, such as shareholders, a class of interests is deemed to have accepted the plan if at least 2/3 of the class voted in favor of the plan.
link to full BK codes
http://thismatter.com/money/credit/bankruptcy/chapter-11/chapter-11-overview.htm
ARTICLE: Looking Out For Shareholders: The Role of the Equity Committee in Chapter 11 Reorganization Cases of Large, Publicly Held Companies. *
Author
Thomas Henry Coleman and David E. Woodruff **
Excerpt
I. INTRODUCTION
At first glance, the lot of shareholders in chapter 11 reorganization cases of large, publicly held companies seems bleak. After investing millions or even billions of dollars in the company, these shareholders find their interests relegated to the financial cemetery under the regimen of the absolute priority rule. 1 Moreover, unlike the company's creditors, who are granted automatically a major role in the reorganization process through the official committee of unsecured creditors ("creditors' committee") and its professionals, the typical small shareholder lacks the resources to defend his or her interests. Fortunately, the Bankruptcy Code provides a champion for these shareholders-the official committee of equity security holders ("equity committee"). By collectively representing all shareholders, the equity committee and its professionals provide shareholders with meaningful access to the reorganization process, and an equal opportunity to preserve their financial interests. 2
Unlike creditors' committees, whose appointment the Code requires in every chapter 11 case, 3 equity committees are relatively rare. They are typically appointed only in the "mega-cases," involving large, publicly traded debtors, in which equity committees may represent large numbers of shareholders and huge collective interests.
The role of the equity committee in these cases is quite different from that of the creditors' committee, and warrants a separate discussion. This article examines the distinct role of the equity committee, and discusses issues relating to the formation, composition and dissolution of the equity committee, its employment and compensation of professionals, reimbursement of expenses of the committee and its members, the legal ...
I think this applies! and we are "MEGA CASE"
Equity committee on a different case: intresting for wamuq:
I had invested in Smurfit Stone when it was at .02 and sold anyway, they asked for an EC and were denied here's the article.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN1021858920091210
this is an interesting Excerpt from that same article
A committee would allow shareholders to hire lawyers and investment bankers, paid for by Smurfit Stone, to represent them in court and to conduct investigations. It would also imply there is substantial likelihood of recovery for shareholders.
(i like that part)
I also found this: EC had been denied before because lawsuits had not yet been file in the wamu vs JPM case. NICe
http://www.pressabout.com/washington-mutual-shareholder-18418/
not sure if this has been posted before.
WMI; Weil/Rosen's Plan in my eyes:
I beleive that a so called "settlement" that Rosen was referring to is not in fact a simple or cash settlement. I beleive that they were ready to submit a reorganization plan "liquidate the estate/equity" based on current A&L settle with creditors with cents on the dollar thus elimating the equity factor to JPM/FDIC, wipe out the commons along with the NSS.
WMI would exit BK with new stock proceed with litigations and settle JPIG/FDICK down the road. This leaving the Debtor/WMI in a great cash position/ and business as usual.
Of course I am not sure of the legalities (mordicai?)
Now with an EC this all changes.
below are links from the delware BK court regarding settlement proceedures:
http://www.deb.uscourts.gov/Chambers/settlement_agreement.pdf
I also added this on EC
http://www.uscourts.gov/bankruptcycourts/bankruptcybasics/chapter11.html#committee
GO EC/JOYCE
what kind of beer uzual, can i join> lol I can guarentee my best behavior having those 3 at the table.
FISH- let me start by saying I love your posts and respect your thoughts always. However I must disagree with you on this
First of all I have said all along 13 months ago (you can look at my posts) that I have always feared wmi, potentially cutting out commons and making other arrangements if they could legally get away with it.
In regards to lumping them all in the same field, i don't see why not, whatever weil and co's motive, it's clear they wanted to shaft the commons and maybe even all the securities.
As I always stated and will continue to state, wamu is not a saint, it was in the banking industry just like the other crooks up there. Many of their shady loans proved to be why they sought out the help of TPG or and prevoiusly were looking for potential mergers/buyers.
We all critisize weil/wamu/jpm/fdic as greedy bastards ...and by that same token aren't they? aren't we?: we boought into this stock many months ago in hopes to make a fortune...or are you here for pure justice...you would give you shares to the needy I presume.
That being said wamu was stolen and for that they should seek justice, and not for our sake; what the heck are we angry about. we invested in the penny range. I feel sorry for the poor souls that were really screwed when wamu was illegally seized.
So spare me your attempt to protect the reputation of Rosen/weil.
In the end we all look out for our best intrest and theirs is screwing us for their benefit. In their eyes they probably figure: why should we reward the speculative shareholders that bought on pennies on the dollar.
JMHO
go EC/JOYCE
have a great day people, hope we hear from EC soon. I'm going to work, yes I know could you imagine that, me, feed capitlism...."what is ths world coming to"
GLTYA
Go wamu
it's easy to do that.... 4b minus 1.5B he still has 2.5B to lend. Rat bastard
I beleive that there will be no mention of wamu until a settlement. The last thing Weil/JPM/FDIC want is attention brought to the heist. Part of the WMI reluctancy of an EC is just that, they will be scrutinized to no end.
Wamu will triumph, I beleive this whole heartedly, at this point even though I could use a settlement I want it to go to court, any idiot on a jury panel would se right through this.
btw: whats up with the p's if they are a no brainer, sure thing , at least 50% face value guarenteed....why are the trading at just under $80.00. Makes you wonder what was really being planned. (wipe out all equity?) BASTARDS. GO JOYCE AND EC. NAil those crooks...ALL OF THEM
why are we suprised with the pps.... It basically repeats itself every week or so. They force it down and make money on the way down...they accumulate and make money on the way up. classic mm
The mm's have made so much money on this stock they could probably seetle for JPM/FDIC lol
uzual: not a member so can't respond to pm's BUT NICE! :)